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Thread: Some questions about the Shark driver

  1. #361
    Flashaholic
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldigger View Post
    Hi Steve,
    Sorry im confused.. How do i get the 14-16volts output i require?
    Is is depentdant on Vin and current that is set by the trimpot?
    Hi,
    it's a little confusing at first. You don't need to worry about the output voltage of 14-16v except when you are choosing which driver and batteries you use. When you are working out how to drive led's it's the current that you need to control. Current = brightness. You are choosing a drive current of 1 amp. So you set the driver to always supply 1 amp by adjusting the trimpot (this adjusts the output current).
    The driver will then always supply 1 amp. So, in your example you'd wire the Ostar up to the driver and it will supply 1 amp which means that it will be giving a supply voltage of whatever the led need in order to draw one amp - say 15 volts (which reduces as the led warms up). If you then wired another Ostar in series with the one you've already got, the driver will still try to supply 1 amp to both, which would mean it will automatically up the output voltage to c. 30 volts.
    If you then hooked it up instead to 5 led's that needed 18 volts to draw 1 amp, it would give them 18 volts. It will give the led's exactly the voltage they need in order to draw 1 amp. This is very important because as led's heat up, the voltage they "drop" reduces for the same current. eg I have a Cree MC-E. If I drive it at 1 amp it will "drop" around 14 volts at first, but as it gets hotter it only needs around 13.2 volts to draw 1 amp. So, if I feed it a constant 14 volts, it will start off drawing 1 amp but as it gets warmer it will be receiving more voltage than it needs so it will draw more current, probably enough to burn it out because it will continue to get hotter and hotter.
    You need to consider your battery voltage also because a boost driver needs an input supply voltage that is less than the voltage it is churning out. In your example the Ostar needs 14 - 16v so you must keep your battery voltage below 14v. You'll need to attach your Shark to a heatsink to get rid of the heat that it will produce. The lower your battery voltage drops, the harder the Shark will have to work to supply the 14-16v, so the more current it will draw from the battery, and the hotter it will get.
    It sounds very complicated - probably because of my crap explanation. I'll PM you my email address and we can go through it all offline if you like. All the info is on here in various places if you do a search anyway.

    cheers

    steve

  2. #362
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Thanks Steve,
    Thats a lot clearer now..

  3. #363
    Flashaholic beetleguise's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    I am just going to convert to a maxflex. Never had a problem with mine. I have already spend close to 100 bucks in sharks and a remora and my shark just failed again. Pretty expensive lesson learned.
    Tool " I don't want it, I just need it!"

  4. #364

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Does anyone have a wiring diagram for attaching a remora. I have found the resistor part, but have seen different information on what you are supposed to jumper when the trim pot is removed. Also what kind of switch is used and where is it connected on the Remora, or on the shark?

    Above is referring to the shark buck.

    Thanks

  5. #365

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    The remora product page should have the information you are looking for.

    http://theledguy.chainreactionweb.co...roducts_id=988

  6. #366

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Thanks, looked through the forums, but not your site. I am assuming then that a spst or a momentary NC switch is required between Vin and Vout then and not anywhere on the remora with a momentary switch

    Correct?

    Thanks

  7. #367

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Correct,

    Cycling the Power is how the UI works.

    You can also wire up discrete resistors and a rotary switch in place of the trim pot if you want true power level control without any UI.

    Wayne

  8. #368

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    I am trying to find a driver that will fit inside 3/4" id tubing. Can one of the edges be filed to allow the led wires to pass by?

    Also, I was thinking of wiring a on/off/on switch with resistors instead of the trimpot to allow for 1000ma high/off/250ma low. Is this feasible?

  9. #369

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    There are bald spots around the edge of the board and if you are careful should be able to make access for wires to pass through. I haven't tried it so I don't know for sure.

    Wayne

  10. #370

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Thanks Wayne,

    Will my switch idea work instead of the onboard trimpot?

    Regards,
    Bryce

  11. #371

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Yes, the resistors and switches are a great way to set the brightness levels. It is simplier than the uP version and is more direct where you can know in advance (physical) what brightness level you will have before you turn on the power.

    Wayne

  12. #372
    Flashaholic* Icarus's Avatar
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    Default Jumpering Blue Shark



    When jumpering J1 on my blue shark the soldering pad close to the edge of the board came off. Where else can I attach the wire to get J1 jumpered (can’t see it anymore because the picture at the shoppe isn’t sharp enough and I don’t have another blue shark anymore to compare). Thanks.

  13. #373

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    J1 serves no purpose no more. Jumpering doesn't affect anything. J1 only had effect on very old Sharks. Blue Sharks do not use J1. They are pre-configured for the higher output voltage.

    Wayne

  14. #374
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Got one.

    The blue shark says it's rated to about 32V. What would happen if, for example, I connected 12 LED's to it for a draw easily in excess of 40V? Would something go pop or would the board voltage regulate to about 32V? What I want to do is connect 2x MC-E's in series which will be getting perilously close to 32V. No problems with supply voltage and current (12V automotive, less than 2A), just wondering what will happen if load exceeds max. voltage.

  15. #375

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarl View Post
    Got one.

    The blue shark says it's rated to about 32V. What would happen if, for example, I connected 12 LED's to it for a draw easily in excess of 40V? Would something go pop or would the board voltage regulate to about 32V? What I want to do is connect 2x MC-E's in series which will be getting perilously close to 32V. No problems with supply voltage and current (12V automotive, less than 2A), just wondering what will happen if load exceeds max. voltage.

    The blue Shark will limit the output to 32V.

  16. #376
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Excellent, thanks

  17. #377
    Flashaholic* Icarus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by dat2zip View Post
    J1 serves no purpose no more. Jumpering doesn't affect anything. J1 only had effect on very old Sharks. Blue Sharks do not use J1. They are pre-configured for the higher output voltage.

    Wayne
    Thanks Wayne! It's 'in use' already and does a great job in my SF M6 7x Cree R2.

  18. #378

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Testing the Blue Shark or Shark Buck.


    The technique I use to test the converter board safely should be done prior to any hookup to ensure the converter is fully functional. Most boards shipped mid this year or so have been pre-tested. Still, pre-tested or not I would still test it before using it.

    The ideal method for the Shark buck is the use a power supply set at 6V with the current limiting set to 150mA or so. At this current there is little risk in damaging the converter board even if there is a problem.

    Wire the converter board to the power supply and an LED. Any standard 1W,3W LED with Vf around 3.2V will be fine for this test. Apply power. If the LED lights and the power supply current limits turn the trim pot till the power supply comes out of current limit. Verify the trim pot adjusts from near zero LED brightness to something brighter until current limiting is reached. If there is control over this range the converter is fully functional.

    The same test setup can be used to safely test the Blue Shark except the LED load needs to be three LEDs in series. Again after power is applied the LEDs should light up and you should be able to turn the trim pot to get the LEDs to goto near zero light output and have some brightness control range up to the point the power supply current limits. If this work you can raise the current limit to 300mA and verify control over a larger range.

    If you don't have a power supply the next best thing is to use something like a 10-20 ohm 2W power resistor in series with a 6V battery pack. The 40 ohm resistor should provide enough protection even if the converter is shorted.

    Wayne

  19. #379

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Wayne,

    I followed the test instructions for the Blue Shark, and I can't seem to get more than 150mA to the emitter (Ostar 4 die).

    I'm using a power supply, and reading current to LED with a clamp meter.

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks,
    TB




    That is .280 mA on the lower display (camera fired as the display was toggling between .280 ~ .300mA)



    If the voltage is increased, the amperage drops.


    If the power supply is turned off, and turned back to on, the display reads different (all settings unchanged)???
    Last edited by TranquillityBase; 02-07-2010 at 02:20 PM.

  20. #380

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    [QUOTE=LED Zeppelin;2705368]Mike, the A123s are capable of lots of current.
    This is an excerpt from another thread post I made some time ago that might help with a pot/Shark mod:
    How to wire multiple Sharks to one dimming control:

    Hi LED Zeppelin and others,

    I have built a underwater fluorescence lamp with blue OSTARs and 2 Blue Sharks http://www.uni-due.de/zoophysiologie/Seiten/GRUNZScuba2.HTM
    see also my homepage http://www.uni-due.de/zoophysiologie/ Some people asked me if the lamp could be provided with an external dimming control. The problem is that I don't like to accept an additional hole in the body of the lamp. Some commercial lamps work with an external magnetic switch, which triggers a dimmer inside the lamp. In my case this dimmer (Poti) circut should be connected with the Shark instead of the Poti. One possibilty would be to use this sort of dimmer https://www1.elfa.se/data1/wwwroot/w...A/07377443.pdf A switch in form of a REED contact (inside) connected with the dimmer could be operated from the outside with a magnetic switch (no hole necessary).
    Do you have further comments if my suggestions are realistic. Would be glad to hear other and better solutions. with best regards Horst

  21. #381

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Hopefully Wayne will view my post before I head out to the PO

  22. #382

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    TB,

    All of the Blue sharks and Shark Bucks are all pre-tested by Wayne prior shipping.
    All are functioning units.

    Something in your set-up must be amiss.

    Are you using a metal vise to hold the converter? You may have shorted it out.

    Please measure your input and output.

    Cindy
    Last edited by Ms_SS; 02-08-2010 at 04:20 PM.

  23. #383

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Too late, it's in the mail with the other item.

    What is in the photo is exactly how it was set up...

    The driver is floating between the four pins, how can it short out?
    Last edited by TranquillityBase; 02-08-2010 at 04:55 PM.

  24. #384

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    I will comment on one thing for sure. A power when turned on rises from zero to the target voltage. This slow rise in the supply voltage will turn on the converter around 2.8V or so and the converter will try to ramp up the output to the LEDs very quickly. This will in almost all cases trip the overcurrent on the power supply and in many cases cause it to remain in this faulted condition. My supplies do this all the time and I use an external push button switch in series with the supply to power the converter boards. This will apply the power supply at full voltage and not ramp up the input to the converter board.

    Wayne

  25. #385

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by dat2zip View Post
    I will comment on one thing for sure. A power when turned on rises from zero to the target voltage. This slow rise in the supply voltage will turn on the converter around 2.8V or so and the converter will try to ramp up the output to the LEDs very quickly. This will in almost all cases trip the overcurrent on the power supply and in many cases cause it to remain in this faulted condition. My supplies do this all the time and I use an external push button switch in series with the supply to power the converter boards. This will apply the power supply at full voltage and not ramp up the input to the converter board.

    Wayne
    I'm confused about the metal vise comment in Cindy's post. Do you have any thoughts about that Wayne? There isn't anything conductive on or near the edge of the board that I could see.

  26. #386
    Unenlightened
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    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Hi TB,

    I have got the same problem with Blue Shark like you. In January I had bought 10 pcs of Blue Shark and every single one donīt work.
    My testing circuit consist of Lion 11,1V battery and modul with 4 x Cree XRE-R2. Ledīs light very poor. Input current is about 150mA and trimpot has no influence to light. I think that Blue Shark run only as direct drive.

    Sleza

  27. #387

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    There is a problem with this batch.

    Resistor R4 is the wrong value and sets the max output voltage limit to 11.4V. My functional test fixture only has 3 LEDs on it and everything works fine since 3 LEDs Vf is less than 11.4V so the functional test did not catch this.

    We will start the process of changing R4 on all Blue Sharks built in Jan 2010 and we apologize for this error.

    If you have a blue shark shipped in the last month we need you to contact the shop so we can work out getting this corrected.



    Wayne

  28. #388

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Here is a picture of the fixture I use to test the Blue shark and the Shark Buck.

    It's hard to make out. The little gold pins are pogo pins. The group on the right are for the Blue Shark and the group on the left on the PCB are for the Shark Buck.



    Wayne

  29. #389

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by Sleza View Post
    Hi TB,

    I have got the same problem with Blue Shark like you. In January I had bought 10 pcs of Blue Shark and every single one donīt work.
    My testing circuit consist of Lion 11,1V battery and modul with 4 x Cree XRE-R2. Ledīs light very poor. Input current is about 150mA and trimpot has no influence to light. I think that Blue Shark run only as direct drive.

    Sleza
    Bummer

    The trim pot on my Blue Shark would dim the LED down to the off state, however 140mA ~ 150mA was all I could get out of the driver.

    Did you use a metal vise too?

  30. #390

    Default Re: Some questions about the Shark driver

    Quote Originally Posted by dat2zip View Post
    There is a problem with this batch.

    Resistor R4 is the wrong value and sets the max output voltage limit to 11.4V. My functional test fixture only has 3 LEDs on it and everything works fine since 3 LEDs Vf is less than 11.4V so the functional test did not catch this.

    We will start the process of changing R4 on all Blue Sharks built in Jan 2010 and we apologize for this error.

    If you have a blue shark shipped in the last month we need you to contact the shop so we can work out getting this corrected.



    Wayne
    Wayne, I received an email from Cindy and she told me my metal pin vise probably shorted the board and it would not be covered under warranty. Has this changed?

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