Philips MPXL-DL50 on eBay for cheap

That_Guy

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(If you don't want to read an overview of the advantages of the DL50 skip to the bottom for the eBay seller and the price).

The Philips DL50 is a "premium" D2S bulb with longer life, better performance, and higher maximum wattage compared to standard D2S bulbs (Philips 85122, Osram, GE). To see how it compares to the GE bulb at 50W look at the pictures by Mr. Ted Bear in the barn burner thread. It puts out more lumens, has more throw, lights up a larger area, has a more uniform hotspot, and has a more neutral colour than the GE bulb (GE bulb has a slight pinkish tint). XeVision says it can't be used at 35W, so it can only be used as an upgrade for 50W systems such as the XeVision 50W, and it is the only bulb that can be driven at 75W as with the XeVision barn burner.

In the barn burner thread mtbkndad said: "On another note there was more of a difference between the three configurations in the park then the pictures can show. The difference was pretty evenly stepped from a 50Xe/GE to 50Xe/DL50 to 75Xe/DL50. All three were quite bright so the difference is really between three different levels of enough light to see across that part of the park."

There is a comparison at http://nuconverter.de/spectraldatapage.html that says: "Comparison of a DL50 with an overpowered D2S from GE: The GE bulb has less blue spectral intensive lines than the DL50. The typical xenon look of the GE is lost and there's less light output as well. As a conclusion a 50W Xenon system requires a 50W bulb."

While everyone in the barn burner thread agrees that the DL50 is better than the GE bulb, most don't think that it's worth 3x the price of the GE bulb, and I'm inclined to agree. XeVision charges $85 for the GE bulb which puts the DL50 at around the $250 mark.

On eBay the DL50 is available from the seller "beamer-online" here for only $99! It's not exactly cheap, but it's only 17% more than the GE bulb, which is well worth it in my opinion. I emailed the seller and he said that he has hundreds of them and they are all new and unused. For 10 or more the price is only $85, or the same price as the GE bulb! So if someone wants to do a group buy for these we can all get the DL50s for the same price as the GE bulb! There is no point in running the group buy myself because I live in Australia.

The seller also mentions a 70W ballast, but it's 80 – 260VAC so it's useless for portable spotlights, although it could be used for home lighting if anyone's interested.
 

Lando

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if we could get enough people for this group buy I would be in for 1 bulb, having a spare is always good :popcorn:
 

markdi

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I would love a spare



I can not reply to private messages

cpf locks up on me when I hit the reply button.

I have not read the whole barn burner post
but I knew a dl50 was involved

I want a 75 watt ballast
 

XeVision

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QUOTE=RalphRussell XeVision in Blue

Apparently, some DL50 bulbs are available on eBay. Dan, can you clarify a few things for us? Based on all that I have read and on our phone discussions, I believe the following to be true.



1) You will NOT offer the DL50 with the XeRay 50w. Even though it works well, you don't want to deplete your limited supply at this time by offering it with the 50w. Yes, that is my preference.



2) The DL50 will NOT work correctly in the XeRay 35w. It will not function long term with any 35 watt ballast. 45 watt is the minimum.



3) The DL50 is REQUIRED for the XeRay 75w and will be included in the upgrade to 75w when it becomes available to those of us in the first group buy. Yes that is true. In the upgrade price to 75 watt I am including one for about $100 of the total upgrade price.



If all of the above are true, the only reason any of us would want the eBay bulbs would be as an upgrade to the GE bulb in the 50w units. Could you please comment on this? Thanks, Ralph. Yes, I will also consider selling individual bulbs to those interested even though I don't really prefer to. I don't want to loose the buisness to e-bay. Don't forget customs, shipping cost, insurance etc in the total final cost through e-bay. It is probably closer to $95 to $100 for 10 units when this is all added in. If you really search the internet those bulbs sell for $250-$300.

If someone else wants to manage a group buy I will consider offering a similar price including those extra costs. shipped from Ogden Utah. No e-bay, no risk, no customs, no etc.


by the way guys, I am pretty sure a standard D2S (P32d) based bulb will not fit in the Polarion units. I believe their bulb has a custom base.
 
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RalphRussell

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Thanks for the fast response Dan. I will wait. I'd much rather get an extra DL50 from you than an unknown eBay seller in Germany. Once those of us in the group buy get our 50w units, perhaps you could offer us an "mini" upgrade consisting of a DL50 at a price close to what this eBay seller is asking. Of course I'll want the "maxi" upgrade to 75w too!
 

markdi

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I have a xenlight 25/50 watt ballast that I use with my dl50

xenlight insisted that I use their 50 watt ballast with a dl50 bulb and that the dl50 would be fine at 25 watts.

I have operated the dl50 at 25 watts with no problems at all. - so far any way.

the ballast will even start the dl50 in 25 watt mode every time.
90% of the time I run the dl50 at full power.

I may have 30 hours run time on the bulb

the xenlight balast operates at 4khz not 400hz like most ballasts.

maybe 4khz is better for bulb life.
 
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XeVision

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QUOTE=markdi XeVision in Blue

I have a xenlight 25/50 watt ballast that I use with my dl50

xenlight insisted that I use their 50 watt ballast with a dl50 bulb and that the dl50 would be fine at 25 watts. The bulb life will be shortened if you run mostly at 25 watt. The electrodes will erode more rapidly because of "cathode fall". Maybe you will get only 500 hours at 25 watts.

I have operated the dl50 at 25 watts with no problems at all. - so far any way. You answered many of your own questions. With 30 hours on the bulb no problems will occur.

the ballast will even start the dl50 in 25 watt mode every time.
90% of the time I run the dl50 at full power.

I may have 30 hours run time on the bulb

the xenlight balast operates at 4khz not 400hz like most ballasts.

maybe 4khz is better for bulb life. No, but they can probably get more reliable starting below 28 watts using 4Khz. Traditionally anything below 28 watts is bad for a standard D2S 35 watt bulb, more so for DL-50. Once your electrodes get a little shorter you wont be able to keep it lit at 25 watts.

We tend to be purist's at XeVision, some things can be done but we want long life and happy customers.
 
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LuxLuthor

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I'm appreciating XeVision's reputation and feedback a lot more every day !!!

Also, the person who can't post with PM's, if you remove the QUOTE brackets, it should work. From time to time the quote function locks up the browser.
 

XeVision

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LuxLuthor said:
XeVision, have you had a chance to look at the replacement Philips bulb (XL50) for the discontinued DL50?

Yes, I know about that bulb I have looked at it, Philips has offered it to me. It is not a true replacement for DL50 it does have some performance enhancements over std Philips D2S. It looks identical to a standard D2S from Philips only the part number is different and the fill of halides is slightly changed. It is no way in the same league as the old DL50, it is a "souped" up D2S. If this is the choice then I prefer GE D2S performance data. I have the non public data comparing GE to Philips. Independent Certified Lab results from GE. Lumens mainenance and color maintenance are better using GE D2S.
 

markdi

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there is one thing I do not like about xenlights ballast
is that it is very noisy - loud

even when the bulb is warmed up

not too bad once you mount the ballast inside a light.

I would also prefer 35/50 watt.

I wonder why they made it 25/50 watt ?

it is a nucon ballast and nucon seems like they know a thing or two about hid.

http://www.nuconverter.de/ehid.html

500 hours at 25 watts is a long time when you consider the 15 mcp thor I use it in came with a 100 hour bulb.

still I will not use it much at 25 watts.
 
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XeVision

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I have very little knowledge about 4000Hz ballast/bulb operation. It is interesting to note that no other ballast mfg. uses 4KHz frequency, especially considering their claimed advantages. All others are 300-500 Hz. They do have some patents but that does not stop others from using 4KHz, just from copying their circuit design.

I wonder why they made it 25/50 watt ?
Good question, why not 35-50 insead of 25-50 especially with DL50, with D2S less of an issue.
 

That_Guy

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I emailed Nucon earlier asking how much they charge for the DL50. They've just replied and the cost of a pair of DL50s is 130 EUR which is around $160US or $80US each. I was under the impression that DL50s cost around $250US each which is why I thought $99 on eBay was such a great deal, but now it looks like ~$100US is the norm.

Regarding driving the DL50 at 35W, I've emailed a few people to try and get a definitive answer. It's not that I don't trust XeVision, it's just that I want a definitive answer based on actual testing rather than just an educated guess. Markdi posted his reply above which says he hasn't encountered any problems so far, but he has only operated it for ~30 hours so it's not yet possible to tell if it will be OK in the long term. I also received replies from Marc at AE Light and Nucon. Unfortunately both were nothing more than educated guesses, so I'm no better off than when I started.

Marc said that life should be the same at 35W as long as the ballast supplies a stable current. Nucon said that at 4.5kHz as with their ballast cathode fall is minimized when dimmed and therefore spluttering isn't an issue. With a normal ballast he only said that running at 35W is dumb because it isn't as bright as a standard D2S at 35W, he didn't say if it was actually bad to run at 35W.

So from all this it looks like 35W might be OK for the DL50 with the 4.5kHz ballast, but will most likely not be OK with a normal lower frequency ballast, although this is all based on educated guesses rather than actual testing. I had really hoped that 35W would be OK because a 35/75W mode is much more useful than just 35/50 or 50/75 because the runtime difference between 35/50 or 50/75 isn't great enough to really be worth it IMO.
 

XeVision

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That_Guy said:
So from all this it looks like 35W might be OK for the DL50 with the 4.5kHz ballast, but will most likely not be OK with a normal lower frequency ballast, although this is all based on educated guesses rather than actual testing. I had really hoped that 35W would be OK because a 35/75W mode is much more useful than just 35/50 or 50/75 because the runtime difference between 35/50 or 50/75 isn't great enough to really be worth it IMO.

We would not offer 35/75 anyway, too much trouble to make a ballast with that much range. Starting requirements are much different at 35 watt than at 50 watt much less 75 watt. So we will most likely do 35/50 and maybe also 50/75.

No offence taken, I already admitted limited knowledge about that ballast system. There was a time that we considered using it (Nucon/Xenlight). 1.5 years ago. After testing we decided NO. This ballast cannot be pulsed or restarted frequently. It protects itself and shuts down, must wait like a minute to restart. Also, none of the connectors to the ballast are water tight.
 

markdi

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well a 4khz ballsst is smaller - lighter and more efficient and may be better for bulb output and bulb life.

25 watts at 4khz may be just fine for all d2s based hid bulbs including the dl50.
 

XeVision

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QUOTE=markdi XeVision in blue.
Well a 4khz ballsst is smaller - lighter and more efficient and may be better for bulb output and bulb life. In general, definitly not better overall but it may be less harmful at very non typical low power settings. All of this is speculation though by all of us. Our new ballast which we will unveil to our markets in 2-4 months is both smaller and lighter than Xenlight and better than 90% efficient.

25 watts at 4khz may be just fine for all d2s based hid bulbs including the dl50. That is possible, but I am quite confident the normal life will be reduced. The bulb never reaches the designed for normal steady state operating temperature. In a practical way will that mater, in your case probably not at the rate of hours per year you will run it. In industrial applications I'd bet money the life is significantly reduced to less than 1/2 of normal if it is run at even 35 watts for an extended percentage of total use.
 

XeVision

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markdi said:
I could be wrong but a dl50 is a d2s bulb

The DL50 IS NOT a D2S bulb. It is a P32d socket compatable bulb. This is a significant difference. This bulb was origially designed by Philips for projection screen units (like for projection TV) This bulb never found much acceptance in that market so they ceased production, it was not powerful enough.

The D2S, D2R and D1S/R bulbs were designed for automotive headlighting from the start with this application the designed for purpose. The fact that it has been found suitable for other applications is a side benefit for the big makers.
The fact that Philips chose to make the DL50 using a P32d socket style was a manufacturing convenience. The engineering was done and it was easy to implement using existing receiver socket stocks. The D2S came before the DL50 bulb.
 

That_Guy

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XeVision said:
Our new ballast which we will unveil to our markets in 2-4 months is both smaller and lighter than Xenlight and better than 90% efficient.
Is this the 35/50W and 50/75W ballast that you've mentioned earlier?
 
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