ROP or 2C 5761?

SuRgE

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I'm a newbie to Mag Mods and have recently purchased a few fine examples from FiveMega (12AA running Osram 62138, FM85 WA1185, and the 8AA running the WA1164). I have put together my own high powered 5C Mag WA1185 based on what I have been learning from these awesome CPF threads. Now, I have built a smaller "sleeper" version using a 2C host.

My question is; How come there is such a huge following for the "ROP" when it appears that a 2C using 2xC li-ons powering a Philips 5761 is smaller , more powerful, and easier to build? Mine seems to me to be more powerful than my M*g 85!

I am not trying to knock the ROP. When I was searching CPF for info to build one of the smallest brightest Mags; the Philips 5761 2C appeared to be the way to go. But there is way more talk of the ROP and I was curious why.

I am now thinking of putting together a ROP but will I be disapointed when comparing it to my 5761?

Also, is there a nickname for a 2C 5761?

You all have been an invaluable source for me and have allowed me to now own some of the brightest and nicest looking M*gs around.:twothumbs

THanks All
 

eshishlo

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There is a LE ROP which uses the 2c mag format as well as Lithium Ion batteries. I think that the reason that the ROP was so popular in the first place, is because the Pelican bulb fit into the stock holder. I belive that the Philips 5761 is a bi-pin bulb and requires a special holder. These are now easier to obtain than before. Therefore, we may see a shift in the bulb choices soon.
 

Pokerstud

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I'm a newbie to Mag Mods and have recently purchased a few fine examples from FiveMega (12AA running Osram 62138, FM85 WA1185, and the 8AA running the WA1164). I have put together my own high powered 5C Mag WA1185 based on what I have been learning from these awesome CPF threads. Now, I have built a smaller "sleeper" version using a 2C host.

My question is; How come there is such a huge following for the "ROP" when it appears that a 2C using 2xC li-ons powering a Philips 5761 is smaller , more powerful, and easier to build? Mine seems to me to be more powerful than my M*g 85!

I am not trying to knock the ROP. When I was searching CPF for info to build one of the smallest brightest Mags; the Philips 5761 2C appeared to be the way to go. But there is way more talk of the ROP and I was curious why.

I am now thinking of putting together a ROP but will I be disapointed when comparing it to my 5761?

Also, is there a nickname for a 2C 5761?

You all have been an invaluable source for me and have allowed me to now own some of the brightest and nicest looking M*gs around.:twothumbs

THanks All


The ROP has such a big following, IMHO, because it is the "grandfather" of the incan Mag mod, using the Pelican 3854 lamp, ( Roar Of the Pelican )especially the HOLA, which is 6V-24W, at about 600 lumens ( lumen claims have varied ). The original ROP used a 4D Mag with 6 sub C batts. The bulb is a standard PR based lamp, just like the stock Mag bulbs, therefore it was easy to drop in and go, and still is. It is, and has been, the stepping stone to the evolution of what we see today.

Increased interest for more and more horsepower has led to the bi-pin to PR socket (FM ), total switch replacements (KIU ), resistance fixes, battery configurations, Mag body ID boring, scientific bulb testing, etc. etc.

You have a fine collection of horsepower already. The ROP would be the "dimmest" of them all in your listed collection, but I know a lot of people with dozens of lights 8-10x brighter, and they still carry a ROP in their collection.

LuxLuthor's most powerful Mag mod list:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/177171
 

KevinL

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Little bit of history.. :)

The ROP was an answer to a problem of converting bipin bulbs to standard holders. We had a supply shortage of 'potted' bulbs, which were bipins potted in high temp ceramic and inserted into a standard PR base.

Bi-pin conversion options were few, rare and far between.

I would also like to think that the ROP lithium edition (2x18650 in 2C Mag) was either directly or indirectly responsible for creating a market for C-sized lithium ions: which simply did not exist at all at the time the ROP was created.

It grew in popularity because it was also one of the easiest (at the time) options to build for serious lumens at reasonable cost. It has never been the brightest, in fact when it was concieved, the WA1185 was already brighter and readily available. I had my 3D Mag with 1185 before the ROP. But as many have called it, it is the gateway to something brighter. :D

We have come a long way since 2005. Today bipin options are easily and readily available. My preference is for AW's softstart/variable brightness PWM dimmer integrated with a bipin base for the bulb. Today we have far more options than we used to have. And that's a Good Thing(tm)! No offence taken. The ROP has outlasted the problems it was designed to solve.

Users who want a bit more brightness would indeed be better served by the Philips bulb. It's a good bulb, but only discovered recently. It is also more demanding on the batteries. If yours can keep up, then go for it by all means. When my life settles down I will have a chance to try this bulb too and I'm looking forward to it :)
 
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jimjones3630

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As mentioned ease of application. Add bulb turning The ROP into a quick mod with more noticable lumen output. The 5761 a bi-pin bulb can almost be just as quikly pressed into service by dropping in a bi-pin adaptor, aluminum reflector, glass lens. Differences in opinon widespread and not withstanding I have used plastic reflectors with glass lens for ROPs to my satisfaction.

A 5761 mated to the circuit with optimal power regulation, I like NTC's for this job, output more lumens is brighter side by side than ROP or 1185 some folks think by several 100 lumens.
 

jimjones3630

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With the dawning of light, recognition higher amp cells, emoli and A123 battery are slowly coming into use with flashlight mods. Since AW's protected Li c cells would trip at 5.5A or so and given the 5761 current popularity lead to AW's driver creation. Providing a soft start solution with some voltage regulation enough so to work with the 5761

A popular NTC and AW's driver with 2xemoli cells, open volt of 8.4, both have about the same percent of limiting voltage to 6.9-7.1v underload of the 5761 making it a viable option again with ease of mod.
 
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My 6D ROP will soon be a 6D 5761. I'm worried that the smaller batteries can't hang for more than short periods of time when powering the 5761. Then its back to the charger again...
 

SuRgE

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My 6D ROP will soon be a 6D 5761. I'm worried that the smaller batteries can't hang for more than short periods of time when powering the 5761. Then its back to the charger again...

Great!:twothumbs Another 5761 user. I love mine and can't wait to create more C & D Mags using this bulb. Draws more amps than a WA1185, but its a brighter setup to my eyes.
 

SuRgE

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I haven't had any problems; but I'm not running the light no more than 5-10 minutes at a time. Sorry, I'm a newbie to Mag mods. But, this light is awesome. Guys at my work love it and want one too. I think its the ultimate sleeper. Maybe call it the US61 (Utilmate Sleeper 5761):naughty:

According to LuxLuthor's graphs; its putting out 1500-1900 Lumens at 7.6-7.9 volts. :twothumbs
 

jimjones3630

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That is an old debate how many amps can mag switch tolerate before melting or something bad happening. Recall the discussion during the USL project.

One of my 5761 had only bi-pin drop in adaptor and worked great. What can happen is like any bulb all bubs have their maximun operating specs. Going over those specs will can a flashed bulb. Have had sereral that started life as 5761 but due to over moding, decreasing too much resistance they instan-flashed.

Getting back to topic, up to and including 10A and some oldtimers here say even over 10A a "stock switch" can handle. I know stock switch can do 5.7A no problem. The issue with amps is really not amps but resistance in your curcit. the less resistance, the less heat created.

Mods with 100w bulbs I have had to use kiu socket because bi=pin Gy6.35 were not available unless you made them yourself. That is about to change in the near, have heard, future. And the developer of them has tested them in conjunction with "stock" mag switchs and the reports are very favorable. NO melting of switch.

Want a step forward having the ability to use 100w bulbs with a drop in bipin adaptor.

jim

Is the 5.5A draw on the 5761 is a bit taxing for a stock Mag switch? I use a stock switch on a ROP, at 4.1A.
 

SuRgE

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Mods with 100w bulbs I have had to use kiu socket because bi=pin Gy6.35 were not available unless you made them yourself. That is about to change in the near, have heard, future. And the developer of them has tested them in conjunction with "stock" mag switchs and the reports are very favorable. NO melting of switch.

Want a step forward having the ability to use 100w bulbs with a drop in bipin adaptor.

jim

Ohhhhh can't wait!:thumbsup: Been wondering why I haven't seen the easily available 100 watt sockets!

I do notice that many times I have to soft press the switch twice to get the light on. Anyone have a comment on that? I would think its the amp draw of the 5761. Again, newbie learning as I go!
 
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jimjones3630

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Previously mentioned if using AW C cells might be the protection circuit kicking in. You wrote have a 2C host are you using protected
cells. My first 5761 used unprotected 2600mah 18650, with no problems.

Think someone already answered your question will you be disapointed with ROP vs 5761. 5761 when properly moded output more than 1185, 1166 which you already have.

Unless you have a certain application in mind, why not step up to 50-100w mods? the way I learn most times is by doing and figuring out mistakes latter. My last 250wer fried the reflector and now have rediscovered all the reasearch that has already been done here on high end reflector coating.
jim

Ohhhhh can't wait!:thumbsup: Been wondering why I haven't seen the easily available 100 watt sockets!

I do notice that many times I have to soft press the switch twice to get the light on. Anyone have a comment on that? I would think its the amp draw of the 5761. Again, newbie learning as I go!
 

SuRgE

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JimJones,

Yes, I'm using protected AW Cs. I believe your right about the protection circuit. I read somewhere about having to double switch but can't find the thread. Its not that big of a deal to me I was just wondering why it was doing it.

I actually already have a 100 watter in my 12AA Osram 62138. But that light is quite a bit larger than my 2C. Maybe I'll try some unprotected cells to see if that changes it. I have a nice charger, so I can preset the voltage I need.

250W, whooaaa! I suppose that will probally be around the corner for me.

Thanks for the info.
 
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jimjones3630

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Your welcome,

62138 is a very beautiful white white light at 13vbulb. Even at 12v I like it over anyother 100w bulb. Plus get to run 64610 50w as the LOLA. I run mine with 3x emoli for 12.6vbat, and 12vbulb. Think my next will be 4xA123=14.4vbat to get the 62138 to shine.

jim

JimJones,

Yes, I'm using protected AW Cs. I believe your right about the protection circuit. I read somewhere about having to double switch but can't find the thread. Its not that big of a deal to me I was just wondering why it was doing it.

I actually already have a 100 watter in my 12AA Osram 62138. But that light is quite a bit larger than my 2C. Maybe I'll try some unprotected cells to see if that changes it. I have a nice charger, so I can preset the voltage I need.

250W, whooaaa! I suppose that will probally be around the corner for me.

Thanks for the info.
 

SuRgE

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My 5761 5c is up and running; Sweet with no double clicking!:thumbsup:

FM's 10.5mm cammed relfector, Boro lens, FM brass bi-pin socket,and 5x1.2v Tenergy 5000 mah C cells ( charged to no more than 7.9 volts to prevent flashing.)

No problem running either of my 5761 with the stock switch assemblies but I do not run the lights for more than 2-3 minutes at a time. I only use them to spot things in the backyard or to light my path to the mailbox.

Both are brighter than my two Mag85s but not by much. I started with the WA1185s but I am now learning that the 5761 is more ideal for the C cell lights; especially if you cherrish the 5-6 cell dual function lights(torch/baton):devil:
 

Pokerstud

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My 5761 5c is up and running; Sweet with no double clicking!:thumbsup:

FM's 10.5mm cammed relfector, Boro lens, FM brass bi-pin socket,and 5x1.2v Tenergy 5000 mah C cells ( charged to no more than 7.9 volts to prevent flashing.)

No problem running either of my 5761 with the stock switch assemblies but I do not run the lights for more than 2-3 minutes at a time. I only use them to spot things in the backyard or to light my path to the mailbox.

Both are brighter than my two Mag85s but not by much. I started with the WA1185s but I am now learning that the 5761 is more ideal for the C cell lights; especially if you cherrish the 5-6 cell dual function lights(torch/baton):devil:

Very nice. I'd like to see how long the stock switch holds out with the 5.5A lamp, then of course, at only 2-3 minutes a pop, it might be ok.
 
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