cernobila
Flashlight Enthusiast
Just a quick one.........what is the standard head/bezel on the above lights called? Is it a KT4 or something else?.......I need one of these!
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M3T, M4, M6
- Thread starter cernobila
- Start date
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ttran97
Flashlight Enthusiast
mdocod
Flashaholic
Surefire Police will be here soon to point out that it is called the millennium turbo head (or something like that). And that the term KT4 only applies to the kit that is sold with the MN15 and MN16 for use with the M3.
However, Surefire also calls the Millennium turbo head a KT4 on their website, so I wouldn't worry too much about the specifics here because sometimes the police are wrong.
However, Surefire also calls the Millennium turbo head a KT4 on their website, so I wouldn't worry too much about the specifics here because sometimes the police are wrong.
Brozneo
Enlightened
Haha! The Surefire Police! Its the KT4 turbohead - what else are you gonna call it???
cernobila
Flashlight Enthusiast
Thanks, I am planning on making a 9V light based on the 2x C size Li-ion cells, Leef parts for the body and switch and a LF M series EO-M3T lamp. Should be a beautiful looking light when put together. Its just a matter of getting one of these KT4 heads from somewhere.......
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Size15's
Flashaholic
I'm not wrong in this case. :devil:
The KT4 is the No.4 TurboHead Kit.
It is wrong to state that the M4 or M6 has the KT4.
I doubt that SureFire state this on their website.
The Kit comprises of the 'Millennium TurboHead', the MN15 and the MN16 Lamp Assembles.
The Millennium TurboHead is the same as used by all Millennium TurboHead Modules (such as the M3T, M4, M6, M97, M98, M900AB, M500B etc etc)
The MN15 and MN16 Lamp Assemblies are powered by three SF123A batteries (such as the M3T, M900AB, M500AB, M97 etc)
The KT4 kit converts a standard Millennium model into the TurboHead version.
For example:
M3 + KT4 = M3T
M96 + KT4 = M97
M900A + KT4 = M900AB
M510A + KT4 = M510AB
Al :nana:
Brozneo
Enlightened
EVERYONE RUN!!!! It's the Police!!! :lolsign:
Size15's
Flashaholic
I prefer 'Community Support Officer'...
DaFABRICATA
Flashlight Enthusiast
Brozneo
Enlightened
I know - it's great to have Al who knows so much about Surefire's - it's great that he has a lot of historical SF knowledge also! I wasn't trying to put him down - just have a bit of a laugh! We all know Al is a good guy!:thumbsup:
Size15's
Flashaholic
Well one has to laugh because I'm such a pedant when it comes to SureFire terminology. I can't hardly help myself.
Al :green:
Al :green:
DM51
Flashaholic
Lol Brozneo, you will REALLY need to watch out for Size15s if you ever dare to refer to Nitrolon as "plastic"!!
mdocod
Flashaholic
Direct from the SF website:
it's called the KT4 Turbohead twice in that description. It later goes on to list the lamps it comes with in the features list. But the fact that SF is comfortable simply saying "KT4 TurboHead" implies to me that it is considered correct by SF to use the term "KT4" semi-interchangeably with "TurboHead."
Interestingly enough, NOWHERE in the description for the Kit No. 4 does Surefire Mention the word "Millennium"
My point is not to say that you are wrong (as I am quite confident that you have the specifics 100% correct), but my point is to point out that I think you care more about the specifics than even SF does. As evidence by their own wording.
it's called the KT4 Turbohead twice in that description. It later goes on to list the lamps it comes with in the features list. But the fact that SF is comfortable simply saying "KT4 TurboHead" implies to me that it is considered correct by SF to use the term "KT4" semi-interchangeably with "TurboHead."
Interestingly enough, NOWHERE in the description for the Kit No. 4 does Surefire Mention the word "Millennium"
My point is not to say that you are wrong (as I am quite confident that you have the specifics 100% correct), but my point is to point out that I think you care more about the specifics than even SF does. As evidence by their own wording.
Size15's
Flashaholic
mdocod,
SureFire uses the same wording for all it's TurboHead Kits, for example the KT1 description:
You are right that one can refer to the TurboHead by the Kit number but that it only makes sense to do so when referring to the TurboHead Kit that fits and functions correctly on all the lights in question.
When it is necessary to refer to a TurboHead Bezel by itself, such as when the same TurboHead bezel is used by several different kits, and/or by several different products [that use different lamps] - this is when things come unstuck. Few TurboHead bezels have specific names. They are known by Series they form part of.
There are five main types of TurboHead bezel:
T-Series TurboHead (T1, T2, [T3], T4, T5)
T-62 aka "TRTH" Threaded-Rimmed TurboHead - for the 12PM/12ZM/LeopardLights
SRTH TurboHead (Short-Rimmed TurboHead) - Only sold through SureFire Dealer LPS
KT TurboHead (KT1, KT2, [KT3], KT5)
Millennium TurboHead (for Millennium Series body threads)
These TurboHead bezel name are not widely used outside SureFire geek circles because SureFire only supplies TurboHeads as part of kits or whole products and people don't tend to need to know the name. You get the TurboHead along with the rest of the Kit for the model you need such as appropriate adapter collar and lamp assembly(ies)
The M3T and M900AB use the KT4.
The M3T, M4 and the M6 use the Millennium TurboHead.
The 6P and G2 use the KT1.
The 9P and G3 use the KT2.
The 8AX and 8NX use the KT5.
The 6P, 9P and 8AX (etc) use the 'KT' TurboHead.
Use of 'KT' without a kit number refers to the TurboHead supplied with the KT kits [rather than to the TurboHead supplied with the T-Series kits]
Note the T3 and KT3 are exceptions to this because they are of the same style but have unique threads.
The KT4 was an empty slot for quite a while because SureFire did not update the T4 to KT status.
SureFire used the empty slot and thus added a second exception to the KT-Series.
Now that the 'Millennium' has been and gone SureFire are tending not to use "Millennium" in any description for the Millennium Series products preferring the term 'Special Operations Lights' for the flashlights even though they are still laser etched with "Millennium Series".
Two exceptions to the Millennium Series handheld lights are the M1 and the M2. The M1 does not share any bezel interchangeability with any other product - the bezel is sealed and should not be removed. The M2 uses standard [aka 6P] body bezel threads. This was done for two main reasons: 1) because using the "Millennium bezel threads" and "M3" bezel made the M2 too thick and too long, and 2) because new Lamp Assemblies would be required and there was less scope for improving the P60/P61 as there was the P90/P91 in terms of what SureFire wanted to achieve.
I must remember that SureFire make products to be used, not products so that they can be correctly named. I climbed the walls in frustration when SureFire called the L4 the L4 as the KL-Series was born and developed!
Al
SureFire uses the same wording for all it's TurboHead Kits, for example the KT1 description:
So your implication does not really hold up because SureFire uses the same wording for all of it's TurboHead Kits.
You are right that one can refer to the TurboHead by the Kit number but that it only makes sense to do so when referring to the TurboHead Kit that fits and functions correctly on all the lights in question.
When it is necessary to refer to a TurboHead Bezel by itself, such as when the same TurboHead bezel is used by several different kits, and/or by several different products [that use different lamps] - this is when things come unstuck. Few TurboHead bezels have specific names. They are known by Series they form part of.
There are five main types of TurboHead bezel:
T-Series TurboHead (T1, T2, [T3], T4, T5)
T-62 aka "TRTH" Threaded-Rimmed TurboHead - for the 12PM/12ZM/LeopardLights
SRTH TurboHead (Short-Rimmed TurboHead) - Only sold through SureFire Dealer LPS
KT TurboHead (KT1, KT2, [KT3], KT5)
Millennium TurboHead (for Millennium Series body threads)
These TurboHead bezel name are not widely used outside SureFire geek circles because SureFire only supplies TurboHeads as part of kits or whole products and people don't tend to need to know the name. You get the TurboHead along with the rest of the Kit for the model you need such as appropriate adapter collar and lamp assembly(ies)
The M3T and M900AB use the KT4.
The M3T, M4 and the M6 use the Millennium TurboHead.
The 6P and G2 use the KT1.
The 9P and G3 use the KT2.
The 8AX and 8NX use the KT5.
The 6P, 9P and 8AX (etc) use the 'KT' TurboHead.
Use of 'KT' without a kit number refers to the TurboHead supplied with the KT kits [rather than to the TurboHead supplied with the T-Series kits]
Note the T3 and KT3 are exceptions to this because they are of the same style but have unique threads.
The KT4 was an empty slot for quite a while because SureFire did not update the T4 to KT status.
SureFire used the empty slot and thus added a second exception to the KT-Series.
Now that the 'Millennium' has been and gone SureFire are tending not to use "Millennium" in any description for the Millennium Series products preferring the term 'Special Operations Lights' for the flashlights even though they are still laser etched with "Millennium Series".
Two exceptions to the Millennium Series handheld lights are the M1 and the M2. The M1 does not share any bezel interchangeability with any other product - the bezel is sealed and should not be removed. The M2 uses standard [aka 6P] body bezel threads. This was done for two main reasons: 1) because using the "Millennium bezel threads" and "M3" bezel made the M2 too thick and too long, and 2) because new Lamp Assemblies would be required and there was less scope for improving the P60/P61 as there was the P90/P91 in terms of what SureFire wanted to achieve.
Without a doubt I am! SureFire's wording evolves along a different path to the products and I feel it fair to say that whilst it will never and can never be as pedantic as people like me would prefer, SureFire's Marketing Team have made fantastic efforts to make the wording more accurate and consistent.
I must remember that SureFire make products to be used, not products so that they can be correctly named. I climbed the walls in frustration when SureFire called the L4 the L4 as the KL-Series was born and developed!
Al
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ttran97
Flashlight Enthusiast
All I know is that if you suggest using a KL6 on an M6, the Surefire Police...err, Community Support Officer...will say that it's a waste. So just keep the Millennium TurboHead on it. (KT4 
)
)
Size15's
Flashaholic
I'm interested to learn whether the M6+KL6 is a waste or not because I don't recall the basis for why I think it is. There's another thread on this topic btw.All I know is that if you suggest using a KL6 on an M6, the Surefire Police...err, Community Support Officer...will say that it's a waste. So just keep the Millennium TurboHead on it. (KT4
mdocod
Flashaholic
I noticed that, but don't feel that it changes anything or causes any argument to gain or loose water. Just shows me that they are comfortable calling the turbohead by the kit number.
I entirely agree that it is appropriate to call it what it is, a Millennium Turbohead, but also feel that this can generate more confusion than just calling it by the Kit number so people know what they need to order to get the right bezel.
cernobila
Flashlight Enthusiast
......just as well that this was a quick one.....
......but has generated another question......what is the smallest head/bezel that will fit the SF "M" series fitting just like the KT4, I would like something smaller with more flood than throw being able to use SF and LF lamps.
Size15's
Flashaholic
SureFire do not refer the M4 or M6 TurboHead as the KT4.
To do so suggests that one can use the KT4 TurboHead Kit on the M4 or M6 and that suggests that the lamp assemblies supplied as part of the KT4 TurboHead Kit can also be used on the M4 or M6. SureFire are very clear about which lamp assemblies are designed and intended for each flashlight.
The KT4 is not a TurboHead. It is a conversion kit.
People do not routinely need to order the Millennium TurboHead. It is not sold as an individual bezel. There are no products that could use the Millennium TurboHead but don't come with one as standard, and that need different lamps to the MN15/MN16.
All products that can be converted to use the Millennium TurboHead can be converted using the KT4 TurboHead Conversion Kit. In this instance one could use KT4 to refer to the Millennium TurboHead within the context of the conversion and use.
If you need a replacement bezel for an M4 or M6 then you should contact SureFire. You can take matters into your own hands by purchasing a KT4 kit, removing the Millennium TurboHead from the conversion kit and using the appropriate lamp assemblies for your flashlight.
Al
