Tweeking the "55W" Ballast to get an extra 18W @ Bulb

[Flashanator]

MOREPOWER IS KING!!!!!!!


those 60w output ballasts in my VT are friggen smoking tree lines 500meters away. Its amazing what that extra diff does. ITS NUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!


NOW MY THOR X10 has been heavily dethrowned in (throw) by my VT . By a huge margin. And my Ti mega is a joke compared to my VT.


Ill post beamshots another night, as its a little hazzy & cloudy ATM.




Thanks MorePower

forgot to add, when i first fired it up & took the beast outside, being the Columbo of Flashlights. I noticed the huge difference straight away. I got a good sight for lumens. This mod is just jaw dropping.

[Morepower!]

Thanks MorePower

No problem Flash, glad to hear it is working so well. Now you can boast a genuine ~120W power house. It's just a shame that in that configuration it is limited to a runtime.

As far as the "how to" on the latest mod, you guys will have to bear with me as it will have to be a fairly extensive post. It also requires replacing the original FETS that comes with the ballast unless you have access to a Mill.

@ liveforphysics, first off I have to tell you I'm jealous of your aquarium set up. I've been trying to convince myself for a number of years now to go with a Marine aquarium. Also, knowing what you have in mind for the ballasts I did a continuous 2hr heat test for you.

Ambient = 19C
1.5hrs = 52C
1.75hrs = 53C
2hrs = 53C

Needless to say I am VERY happy with those figures, to make sure the thermocouple wasn't lying I made sure I was able to keep my finger on the heatsink for quite a while at the 2hr mark and did so without a problem, I found it wasn't possible at 61C. The first couple of tests I did and got 61C @ 1hr I had the ballast laying on it's side, in the test above it was standing upright. To explain the differences in temp. the only thing I can think of is in the upright position the fins on the heatsink where able to take more advantage of convection ? I didn't, however, think it would have made that much difference !!

[Morepower!]

Ok, here it is. Firstly cut out the part of the casing that the 2 FETS are up against(see pic below). It has to be done with the PCB in place as it is just too difficult to remove it IMO. I didn't cut all the way through, but very close, then just broke the piece out with pliers. Obviously great care needs to be taken not to cut into the PCB, also blow out any alluminium dust from the circuit when your finished.




There are 2 ways to go from here, 1 is to cut the FETS out and replace them with some new ones as the legs arn't long enough to be able to attach them to the heatstink. The second is to remove some of the material of base plate of the heatstink with a mill, either side of the gap, so it will sit down into it allowing for proper attachment of the original FETS. If you opt for buying new ones you will need to match up their values as best you can. Here are the links for the specs of the original FETS, Q3 and Q1. Though it would pay to check the numbers on the FETS that came with your ballast just incase they changed something at some point. With the second option you will also have to overcome the problems that might arise when trying to refit the case cover, also I don't know how much it would affect the heatsink's performance. BTW the base plate of the heatsink I used is 1/4" or 6mm thick, so it's pretty heavy duty.


The Gap





Before cutting the FETS out, if you choose this option(which I did), take all measurements for drilling the holes in the heatsink. You will have to drill(I recomend using a drill-press so when the bit breaks through you don't destroy the components on the other side) and tap 2 holes to attach the heatsink to the ballast casing as one of the holes has to be a blind hole, so a nut and bolt is not possible. You may however be able to adhere the heatsink, instead of bolting it, with some of that silicone heat type paste that sets like silicone sealant. But if you want to remove the sink later it could be a problem. I used a nut and bolt and a TO-220 heatsink kit(has insulating washers/bushes) to secure the FETS to the heatsink. I didn't use the heat pads that came with the kit, I just used heatpaste. The pads may be better, I don't know.

Heatsink drilled, casing drilled, tapped and filed flat



Once that is done and everything bolts together the way it should, loosely bolt the FETS to the heatsink(no paste at this stage), bend and put the legs through the holes in the PCB, bolt the heatsink to the casing and solder them in place on the backside of the PCB. All anti-static and proper soldering techniques need to be used, obviously. Once they have cooled down remove the heatsink and solder them to the topside of the PCB and that part is done. I used heat paste between the FETS and between the heatsink and ballast casing.

The next thing you need to do is solder 3 or 4 0.1Ohm resistors accross the resistor bank as pictured below(BTW that is your ballast below Flash). This is to stop the existing resistors from getting too hot.

0.1Ohm resistor bank





And that is pretty much it. I think the info above is pretty clear, but if your not sure about something just ask. Have fun !!!!


.

[Patriot]

Great post and pics Morepower! Very detailed.

Thanks

[Morepower!]

Thanks Patriot36, and no problem.

I knew I would forget something.

You will also need to use heavier cable for the input power because the STD harness gets fairly warm if run for longer than say 30mins. The input "run power" is now 7 Amps @ 11.1V.



Heavier harness cable






What the finished mod should look like





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[Flashanator]

Hi Morepower!

As you mention the high current for my input cables. At 14.8v do you think I should bother doing something about it?

thanks.

[Morepower!]

Hi Morepower!

As you mention the high current for my input cables. At 14.8v do you think I should bother doing something about it?

thanks.

The ballast is very well regulated so voltage dosn't make any difference, the input power(Watts) will be the same. I wouldn't worry about using heavier wire in your situation as you won't be running them for long enough. The power figures on the back of your ballasts were achieved with the STD wiring harness.

[SafetyBob]

Thanks so much for posting all the stuff to do this. This will be on the project list for sure.

Did you use the same bulbs that came with the kit or something else?

Bob E.

[Morepower!]

For any Aussies considering this Mod. the links below are for the heatsink, resistors and FETS I used. Note that the heatsink needs to be cut in half, so it will do 2 ballasts.

HEATSINK

Q3 FET from RS Components

Q1 FET from RS Components

0.1Ohm resistors from RS Components

And just for fun a pic of a test that went wrong. I thought the hook up wire I had would be good enough for a quick test to see if the new FETS were going to work correctly. The lamp lit, just started to ramp up then there was much smoke which resulted in a mad scramble for the off switch on the PSU.

FAIL, LOL !!!





Important Note: The cheap bulbs that come with the ballasts are not designed to handle anywhere near the ~60W this mod will deliver. While I have not had one fail yet I believe it is really only a matter of time. I would NOT be a happy camper if one of them failed catastrophically in one of my lights and damaged the reflector and/or lens. So if you are seriously thinking about performing this Mod. I strongly recommend you participate in the GB for the Fatboy DL-50 bulbs, more info on them HERE. I've put my hand up for 3 bulbs, and am considering going for 4. These bulbs are no longer made, so when stocks run out that's it.


.

[Flashanator]

do you think the bulbs would really go or just stop working?

i cant use fat boys on my vt, as there too long. the cheap h7 bulbs are already very close to the ballast. But ive stocked up on 4300K bulbs.



EDIT:morepower, when you posted...

Making an extra 6,900Lux above factory settings.

what was the total lux? And does anyone think they can work the estimated bulb lumens of 60w output overdriven?

thanks.

[Morepower!]

do you think the bulbs would really go or just stop working?

i cant use fat boys on my vt, as there too long. the cheap h7 bulbs are already very close to the ballast. But ive stocked up on 4300K bulbs.



EDIT:morepower, when you posted...



what was the total lux? And does anyone think they can work the estimated bulb lumens of 60w output overdriven?

thanks.

You are really testing my memory here Flash, which is not good at the best of times. What I do remember is the Lux readings were taken at a distance of ~150mm from the bare bulb and the readings were in the 200,000 range. As far as the cheap bulbs blowing up, from what I've read the more you overdrive a bulb the higher the pressure is in the arc chamber. And I do remember someone saying they had one blow up on them. Hopefully someone more knowledgable will chime in and give some more info on this. I just know I'm not prepared to take the risk, and I think someone said you get more Lumens from the Fatboy ???


.

[BVH]

Flash, I forget, is your "VT" a Vector 192?

[XeRay]

And does anyone think they can work the estimated bulb lumens of 60w output overdriven?

thanks.

using quality ~4000K bulbs should get about 6000+ lumens with 60 watts to the bulb.

[Morepower!]

I found a way to get even more power from these ballasts, 91.44W !!! The lowest setting on the pot now is 60W Input was 11.8A @ 11.1V. But so far it is not sustainable, it will run at that power level for about 6mins after which the square waves are no longer square. I don't know this for a fact, it is purely a guess based on the sound the ballast makes, at the 6min mark it starts to sound a bit off(dirty power ?). I've had no prior experience with ballasts of any type before this(I didn't even know what they did except that fluro's had them) but I did use to build HI-FI power amps as a hobby. If this was an amp I'd say it was starting to "clip" as I don't think the step-up transformer can supply enough power. If it wasn't a constant load I could just add more capacitance. I'm also wondering if some of the tracks on the PCB are big enough now. Does anyone have any idea what too hot is for a transformer ? I've seen some specs that vary wildly, from 65C(max) to 225C(max). Any help, ideas, thoughts, theories or flat out guesses would be much appreciated. Something is falling over I just don't know what yet.

[Morepower!]

I've had a bit of time(first day off in 2 weeks) to play with the ballast's further. I have just cracked the 100W mark, 105.2W to be exact. It is still capable of more, when I gave the pot a quick spin to the highest setting I saw 12.7A @ 14.8V input, but quickly turned it back down. At 105W the input power is 14.8V @ 10A. I havn't done any run times at this power level but I have gotten 40mins, so far, runtime at ~92W by beefing up(jumping with heavy wire or thickening them with solder) some of the higher current tracks on the PCB. By doing this I was able to lower the temp. of the AC step up transformer, because one of the tracks that run under the trans. was heating up. Also I wired the transformer from the ballast I blew up in parallel with the existing trans. and got it to run cooler again. I solved the distortion problem which was as simple as increasing the input voltage from 11.1V to 14.8V. I like easy fixes. The circuit was just suffering from too low a voltage. The ballast pictured below, that I'm getting 105W out of, hasn't had the transformer mod yet, but I used some newer FETS with even higher current and voltage capabilities. The light being produced at this power level is totally insane !!! The pic is not even close to doing it justice(camera set to auto).



Newest Modded Ballast(105W)





First Ballast with Transformer Mod.(92W)





First Ballast with Transformer Mod.(92W)




.

[Flashanator]

good lord man, can you plz make this for my Ti Mega,

that would be insane.

I pay anything dude

[Morepower!]

HOLY CRAP !!!!! I made a mistake when I said I saw 12.7A when turning the pot up and back down quickly. After running it a bit more I turned the pot up slower and saw 20.7A !!! However at that level the nice, crisp tone of the ballast turned into something that can only be described as severe static. The light output was crazy. I was using a new 4300K bulb, one of the one's that came with the kit. I didn't want to risk my new Fatboys. I've got to say for cheap ballasts these are very robust. I'm very impressed so far, I will definately be ordering and building more of these for a few future projects I have in mind. Now I'm wondering whether the Fatboys are going to last.

[Morepower!]

good lord man, can you plz make this for my Ti Mega,

that would be insane.

I pay anything dude

You must have just snuck that post in before me. If I get time I will build one for you, but I have no idea when due to the lack of time I have to play at this time of year.

[Flashanator]

fair enough,

I just go nuts over 90+w HID in my Ti Mega. Think of the godly throw?

Morepower this Monday or Tuesday ill send you that housing.

[Charon]

I have been following this thread for some time now, and I love the work you have been doing on the ballasts.

I am now looking into duplicating your work on some of my ballasts and get my twin vector to another level.

I think what would help is a summary of each mod and its benefit and or cons and perhaps any insight or thoughts on specific mod. I will try to put a list together just let me know if I miss anything

• Turn the pot up: Extra 8.8W
• .5W 1.19K resistor soldered to jump pot: 15.09 W with pot turned up
• Jumping resistor bank with resistors: Increases startup current
• External pot: control pot resistance outside the ballast
• External Heat Sink: Help cool the FETs
• Jump 3-4 .10 Ohm resistors to the resistor bank : prevent the existing resistors from getting too hot
• Beef up high current tracks on PCB
• Wire transformer in parallel with existing trans: cool trans down
• Increase input voltage: Solves distortion problem

Let me know what I am missing or any thoughts on which combination of mods you are using on the current testbed. Are all of the mods being used at once right now ? Or are some of these dated and you would not recommend some of the earlier ones ?

Love the mod(s).

[Morepower!]

I have been following this thread for some time now, and I love the work you have been doing on the ballasts.

I am now looking into duplicating your work on some of my ballasts and get my twin vector to another level.

I think what would help is a summary of each mod and its benefit and or cons and perhaps any insight or thoughts on specific mod. I will try to put a list together just let me know if I miss anything

· Turn the pot up: Extra 8.8W
· .5W 1.19K resistor soldered to jump pot: 15.09 W with pot turned up
· Jumping resistor bank with resistors: Increases startup current
· External pot: control pot resistance outside the ballast
· External Heat Sink: Help cool the FETs
· Jump 3-4 .10 Ohm resistors to the resistor bank : prevent the existing resistors from getting too hot
· Beef up high current tracks on PCB
· Wire transformer in parallel with existing trans: cool trans down
· Increase input voltage: Solves distortion problem
Let me know what I am missing or any thoughts on which combination of mods you are using on the current testbed. Are all of the mods being used at once right now ? Or are some of these dated and you would not recommend some of the earlier ones ?

Love the mod(s).

Hey Charon, you've pretty much got it down pat. And I'm glad someone is going to have a go, however I just hope you have the ballasts already as they seem to have changed them a little from the one's pictured in my post. Instead of having the other 4 FETS they now use a "stepping IC", and at this stage I don't know if it is a good thing or a bad thing. Also for now I wouldn't recommend going over 90-95W as I have damaged a two of the three ballasts I have modded by pushing them up to 190+W. Of course I am not surprised by that but the surprising thing was the damage didn't show up untill a couple of hours use later. There are a few other things you need to know that I havn't put up yet so when I get a chance(I'm really busy from now till Febuary) I'll add some more pics and explanation.

[M@elstrom]

Morepower just a quick question, these ballasts appear to be of a higher standard than those I encounter in Chinese HID kits... have you had to remove any thermal (rubbery/silicone) compound to conduct these modifications OR are the ballasts you choose simply laid out in a manner suitable for such tinkering?

I must say the ability to vary the output (and ultimately runtime) is more than appealing!

[Morepower!]

Morepower just a quick question, these ballasts appear to be of a higher standard than those I encounter in Chinese HID kits... have you had to remove any thermal (rubbery/silicone) compound to conduct these modifications OR are the ballasts you choose simply laid out in a manner suitable for such tinkering?

I must say the ability to vary the output (and ultimately runtime) is more than appealing!

The ones I buy do have potting mix but not much so the mods can be made without removing much, if any. I'm just starting to play around with the newer style ballasts from "HID World". So far I got 117W to the bulb but I doubt very much that will be sustainable at this point. I will be shooting for ~90W and see if it can be sustained. I'm also going to try actively cool them with a little 40mm fan. I'm hoping to have one up and running before our fishing trip 1-6-09. Just by turning up the pot you can get an extra 8-10W to the bulb.

[Flashanator]

Go MP!!

Lets hope you get something around the 100w working...

[Mettee]

any new updates morepower?

[Isthereanybodyoutthere]

Ok the modding of the resistor bank with resistors:= Increases startup current

Did this result in a fast start up ,kind like the stanley ??

i want to mod a ballast ,not for more power ,only for faster start up


ok ok maybe later i HAVE to try for more power

[Illum]

ohh man, this thread deserves to be subscribed

[danjoo]

HI CPF

My first posting with some content.

Please excuse my bad englisch,sorry.


I want to add this in this tread because is more or less the same ballast i think.

I also look to mod my HID Ballast to more power.

There are some things they look like this FETs maybe adjustable voltage regulaters. In there neigbourhood i check the resitors if they are the adjustors for the regulators. And with some luck i find them.

I post a pic for the cheap china 35 and the 55 Watt i Have.

All measurement are bevor the ballast, bulb power can be 80% from what i read in this forum.
Power is from 4s2p LiIon pack, luckily i harvest this cells for free, In my light they run with this cells. I now its overkill for this cell config.
I try to put more cells into the light in parallel.

At the 55 watt ballast is the "Morepower Mod" allready includet in the "bevor" readings.
In the upper right corner of the 55 watt is some other modding done, not from me. Maybe anybody an idea, i buy this as new from ebay.


I did no runtime heat test or something else, in my light is active air cooling. The 55 watt runs without the covers to get air into the electronic.

Till now the stock china bulbs take this power.

Best regards

Daniel

[Mettee]

I would like to get more info on the pot you guys are using here...I tried this mod with one I picked up. I chose a pot that was the best match to the "470R" since the one more power used in not mentioned in depth.

danjoo seems to be onto something with the resistor specifically in control of the FET's. I didnt pick up on that from what more power did in his mods.

[danjoo]

I also dont know what exactly morepower is doing there.

This must be the original power setup pot.
Maybe after the production ther is a set pot needed to even out tolerances in the stock parts?


btw
till now i dont have seen all mods toghether, the second trafo, the morpower poti plus resistor mod, and my pink resistor mod.

I dont have a bulb to use this power.

But i look around to get one, and the next HID kit...

to see how far we can drive this ballasts...


daniel