SureFire Inflation

[l2icel3all]

Nope! And I never will.

(Just the way my brain is hardwired).

BTW, I came in to pick up a Surefire M6 that time. Don't own an E1B Backup.... Maybe if they had some checkering on their slippery barrels.

Heck, I might stop by this weekend. Got a bit of spare cash to toss around. If you still have E1Bs at $110, I might buy one and then sell it for under $149 on B/S/T; when the price goes up.... Oh wait, I'm a nice guy.

Meh, might still drop by, see what you guys got.

Lets keep that our little secret. The E1B is still $110. We have 101 of them in stock so buy as many as you want and then drop em off at B/S/T LOL

[l2icel3all]

When did you come in to pick up the m6? Just curious...........

[SureAddicted]

As was pointed out read post 13 in this one:
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sho....php?p=2168938

OpticsHQ is a big Surefire dealer and respected member here. If he says they are going up that's good enough for me.

I guess we will only have proof when they are up and we go to order something and get disappointed at the price. I guess no one has to believe this if they don't want but I appreciate the heads up

Like I said before, If you hear it from the horses mouth, fair enough. My SF dealer doesn't know anything about a price increase, sf should start communicating with their distributors, he still doesn't have any E1B's, or E2DL's. September huh...lol.

EDIT I apologize if it sounded like an allegation, it wasn't my intention.

[DM51]

SureAddicted, that is uncomfortably close to an allegation of sharp/dishonest practice by a respected dealer. Please edit that part of your post to remove the offending imputation.

Edit: Thanks for doing that.

[TJx]

Just for fun I calculated the percent of retail I had for my SF's.
(Easy to do with a Mac outliner program I've got)
24 SureFires either bought new or in mint condition, I paid 58% of retail.
Good deals can be found!

[Monocrom]

Lets keep that our little secret.

Got my M6 back in January.

[Black Rose]

I'd like a 6PL, but even at it's current price it's a bit rich for me.

Sucks to be a frugal flashaholic

[Badbeams3]

Well...look at the bright side...folks who own Surfires an sell them for more. And buy Fenix`s

I guess Surfire sales are down...so they need to up the price per unit to keep the ship running smooth. Maybe the new ones will have brighter bulbs...35% brighter When are those new model Surefires going to hit the stores

[LED-holic]

I'm sure SureFire consulted with economists to ensure the increased prices won't decrease demand too much.

Unfortunately for those who have limited budgets, this will be a hard increase to absorb. Unless this is for a critical need like a LEO job or security job, a SureFire purchase would be a luxury that some could not afford.

It will be interesting to see the elasticity of demand based upon the price increase.

This is a very interesting case study because consumers are pulling back spending, except for essential needs like food, gas, clothing, etc. I wonder if this price increase over the long term will hold, in the face of reduced consumer spending, increased competition from other light manufacturers, etc...

[Illum]

I would love to reveal how I am able to obtain this information but I really appreciate having a job so I'd rather not.

I understand
Thanks for risking your neck to inform us

[ozner1991]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

i just wanted to start buying surefire lights just my luck

[mega_lumens]

Rules of demand under price increase may not apply to SF if their main chunk of income comes from government sales and not from the average Joe consumer; especially when our military is fighting two fronts, I'm sure the DOD won't even feel the pinch. I don't think SF had a large market in law enforcement agencies to begin with, but with like specialized units, since they are small the budget can cover the needed goodies. (just my opinion)

[l2icel3all]

I like the interesting responses on this thread so far. Carry on!

[hokoman]

what's funny, and i'm surprised that no one has mentioned is... is that most people who buy a surefire (like me recently - 2 actually, one l1 and waiting for milky to send me an l1 modified) didn't know what the prices were for them a year ago... only if you're a flash-a-holic would you know the price increases.

very similar to retail... how many of you knew that the heart tag bracelet from tiffany and company retailed for $115 in 2003? it's $195 now. a louis vuitton cabas piano handbag was $525 in 2005, now it's $1040. if you were shopping for your significant other, would you realize that you paid a premium?

[l2icel3all]

I understand
Thanks for risking your neck to inform us

No problem! Always willing to help out fellow CPFers

[Badbeams3]

Well...the question is...are we going to do anything about it...Is this why the Chinese are taking over...American companies raise thier prices to the point of breaking us...American greed. I say we ban Surefire from these threads...no mention of thier name shall be posted. When their willing to bring the prices back down we will talk about them again.

Yea...like thats going to happen...but they are going to loose at least a few sales from the poorer of our members...like me...

[bullfrog]

Actually, some companies are starting to relocate production facilities back to the US because prices overseas are getting too competitive and the cost of shipping is horrible.

Further, in all honestly us private citizens are a drop in the bucket for Surefire - if I understand correctly the gross majority of their business is police and military.

Also, I personally don't mind paying the extra $$ - I honestly feel that many of their lights are UNDERPRICED ($110 for an E1B is a steal) when you take into consideration their build quality, but even more so, their engineering, research and development - this is where the profit goes. This is why the UB2 and UB2 are taking forever - they wont release them until they are perfect and $ is needed to recoup this effort.

Just a noobs perspective (who thoroughly enjoys surefire).

[Greggles]

Rules of demand under price increase may not apply to SF if their main chunk of income comes from government sales and not from the average Joe consumer; especially when our military is fighting two fronts, I'm sure the DOD won't even feel the pinch. (just my opinion)

I thought for some time that Surefire brought most of their income in from military sales, and that civilian sales and marketing were more brand awareness efforts. More recently, I've noticed them branch out into more traditional retailers like Lowes and REI, where such price increases should result in more obvious demand elasticity (I think).

Does anyone have any ideas as to what percentage Surefire sells to gov't vs. Joe Consumer?

My father has owned and operated a small machine shop for the past 35 years, specializing in oil field and hydraulic small parts, much of which is aluminum. I showed him a 6P a few years ago and asked him how much he could machine one for. I was shocked at the actual pricing he came up with when dealing in large batches (of course he couldn't price the lense or lamp module).

Of course prices are going up for barstock, cutting tools, lubricants, etc... But if these rumored price increases come to fruition, I suspect they will be driven by increases in the soft costs. Advertising, warranty costs, insurance, regulatory costs, legal costs, etc, etc, etc. There is so much extra cost being layered into american businesses that it's surprising that we can compete at all. The only way my father has stayed in business has been to stay small and flexible, and located convenient to the businesses buying his product.

Of course, I've never opened Surefire's books and done a case study on their finances, so I could be completely wrong.

[cfromc]

Riceball, do you know what the 6PD and 6PDL are going to be priced? TIA

[Federal LG]

Anyway, does someone mention REAL reasons for the price inflation ?

I mean... they´re already expensive as hell (but they are good lights), but now they´re going to be more expensive ??

Oh, c´mon!! That´s not reasonable!

Maybe SF can open a small factory in China... and move the E2DL, the E1B and the Invictus line of production for China.

[Badbeams3]

Anyway, does someone mention REAL reasons for the price inflation ?

I mean... they´re already expensive as hell (but they are good lights), but now they´re going to be more expensive ??

Oh, c´mon!! That´s not reasonable!

I`m sure every one here feels the same...I know I couldn`t agree with you more. But in the end...who really cares...so many other great manufactures and lights...plenty other choices. Many of them brighter.

As far as why...lot`s of guesses could be made. My guess...already said...is that sales are way down. A lot of other choices today that were not there even a year ago. Pro-departments are feeling money pinches just like every State...don`t really know how many sales they accounted for anyway...

In all the years I`ve belonged to CPF I`ve never seen a link to anything credible that said "XYZ dept purchases 1000 Surefires for thier Troops, officers...swat...nothing. Just assumed...that they have goobs of contracts.

Or we might prefer to guess that Surefire just wants to give thier employees some nice big 35% raises cause they love them. I`m sure the guy`s at the top already make plenty...so they would pass it up to help the poorer ones beneath them.

Or...sales are so good that they need to raise the price...supply/demand...bring the demand down by raising the price...so the workers can go home on time...spend time with the family.

Folks might want think that they just cost way more because...materials have gone up...I doubt thats quite the case...but it does make me feel better about buying one in the future.

I didn`t buy a $2500 vacumm from that Kirby salesman...I`m sure there nice...worth every penny. But my $129 one does just fine for me.

But then again...I`m not vacohalic either. Oh oh

[Shawn L]

Saw this in LED area.

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sho...&postcount=225

[l2icel3all]

Saw this in LED area.

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/sho...&postcount=225

I think that someone owes me an apology......

[Mercaptan]

I like how items not even out in retail are being marked up...

Curse you X400!!!

Also interesting to see the T1A's price. Never knew that before.

[rtt]

Here’s a thought (not even an opinion). It has been stated many times that Surefire’s largest customer is the military and other government agencies. If this is true, what better way to charge them more than to create a new increased pricing structure across the board for all consumers, civilian and military? SF may not care if they lose sales to the general public as the sales may not be that large. This could be a way of increasing the cost to the government agencies without much push back. The large increase could just be a marketing tool as they may offer the government quantity discounts of lets say 20 percent and still make an additional 15 percent.

The sad part is we the American public actually pay for all the SF products that the government agencies procure! If we purchase a SF product we get to pay additional increases twice!

[cfromc]

I`m sure every one here feels the same...I know I couldn`t agree with you more. But in the end...who really cares...so many other great manufactures and lights...plenty other choices. Many of them brighter.

I sure the Hell don't agree or feel the same. Its bad enough already that half the things (or more it seems) for sale in the US are made somewhere else. I'd rather pay more to get something that supports my fellow Americans when an American item is available that fits my needs. The job I save could be my own. I'm not trying to disparage anyone, I'm just saying that given a comparable product I'll generally go with the one made in my country. Unfortunately, many of my fellow Americans only see the price tag and have no concept of what they are doing to the country. Brightness isn't everything either and how bright do you really need the light? I have a ROP that I rarely use, most often just to play around with. My most often used lights are my C3 with a P60L and my Novatac 120P. I rarely need more than the 80 or 120 lumens they put out.

Off soapbox

[rtt]

Unfortunately, many of my fellow Americans only see the price tag and have no concept of what they are doing to the country.

Unfortunately, many of my fellow Americans jobs have been lost due to their job being off shored to other countries by the Companies they worked for!

[cfromc]

Unfortunately, many of my fellow Americans jobs have been lost due to their job being off shored to other countries by the Companies they worked for!

Exactly! People only looking at the bottom line, not the consequences.
How much money can we save so we have more money to spend on stuff we don't need. How much can business offshore until there is no one left that can afford to buy their products? A lot of us want that quick fix with no long-term thought behind it. Someday the SWHTF.

[bigfoot]

After looking at that chart it appears that the items with the largest price increases are going to be the E1L ($99 to $129), E1B ($110 to $149), P60L module ($39 to $49), and KX1 & KX2 heads ($66 to $109).

Interesting... so it's not really the upper-end lights with a sharp increase, but rather the lower-end lights and LED conversions.

When you stop and think about it, SureFire is probably realizing less and less income as the incandescent lights are being phased out to make room for LED models, resulting in fewer purchases of incandescent assemblies. And not only that, but the LEDs are now more efficient and require fewer battery feedings, resulting in less money made on batteries by SureFire.

So instead of a cheaper price for a light up front, with money collected over the life of the product for replacement assemblies & lots of batteries, you are paying more up front for a light that will require less money paid out over time. Same amount spent -- different way of getting there.

[Badbeams3]

Exactly! People only looking at the bottom line, not the consequences.
How much money can we save so we have more money to spend on stuff we don't need. How much can business offshore until there is no one left that can afford to buy their products? A lot of us want that quick fix with no long-term thought behind it. Someday the SWHTF.

You have a great veiwpoint. I can`t say your wrong at all. Perhaps Surefire is running into some troubles and has to raise prices...as I suggested. But often companies raise prices just for extra profit...greed. Their sense of loyalty to the American public...in terms of keeping their product affordable...is abstract...concerned in reality with their own personal goals...for wealth...for example. Who is not being loyal to who?

I don`t know. I don`t know whats in the minds of the Surefire executives.