"2009" CandlePower Knife ??????

[Outdoors Fanatic]

I am in on a fixed. A2? BRKT has that covered. D2? Dozier. INFI? Busse. S7? Scrap Yard. 3V? Fehrman. 440? Common and boring. The steel I would love to handle is M4. An satin M4 fixed with a dropping sharpened swedge, an integral guard and a convex zero edge is what I would like to see.

I agree 100% with you. But I'd take anything that's not made with 420J or 440C stainless steel. CPM-M4 would be awesome indeed.

[aj1985]

I am in on a fixed. A2? BRKT has that covered. D2? Dozier. INFI? Busse. S7? Scrap Yard. 3V? Fehrman. 440? Common and boring. The steel I would love to handle is M4. An satin M4 fixed with a dropping sharpened swedge, an integral guard and a convex zero edge is what I would like to see.

Hey bro hope all is well

You know as well as I do your beating on a deadhorse. I realize you want M4 and keep asking, but really how many people would be able to afford M4 and at this point in my life I have never even heard of a custom maker taking orders for M4. There might be custom makers out there, but it sure isn't well known which ones.


take care
aj

[Robocop]

I like the idea of a neck knife with a wrapped handle as it allows so many different variations while keeping the base product the same. Buyers could use camo cord or tan or even glow in the dark cord if they wished and different wrap styles really can look very nice if done correctly.

I am not even sure what M4 is or why it sounds so costly however is something like that really necessary for an average user neck knife? I again know nothing about metals so all I can give on this is from the type knives I have used.

I have an old Benchmade that is ATS-34 and it has done me well with heavy use so far. I also have several that are AUS-8 and even a few folders with AUS-6 that also all do pretty well. Honestly I do not know the difference between any of them and they all just seem to perform about the same. I do sharpen them regularly and they all seem to take the same edge or at least to me.

What about D2 tool steel?....I see some makers use this and it is usually thick and tough but again I dont know about cost or trouble to work with any of these steels.

I also like the stone wash finish and it seems as if this would be an easy to produce feature that would allow a rugged easy to care for look. One of my most favorite folders (Paragee) has this blade style and it has held up great and just looks really nice in my opinion. We could determine the finish and styles first that would allow for the maker to keep it simple yet deserving of their name and then work out the material.

[Unforgiven]

Email received. Thanks Carol


My interest is still the same. A heavy duty camping/hiking user. I can't say that I have much interest in a neck knife though and wouldn't want a camping knife to have holes in the handle. The handle needs to be big enough for fairly heavy usage with a nice thick blade. The actual materials don't really matter to me as long as it will hold up, hold a decent edge and the steel is corrosion resistant. The same metal used on the 2008 CPF blade would work fine for me.

[FlashBanger]

A larger camping knife would be more my style.

[Monocrom]

Email received as well. Thanks Carol.

I think Robo has come up with an excellent idea. A neck knife sounds great. Since it'll be worn close to the body, 440C would be ideal. (Sweat can ruin an excellent blade made from more exotic steels with less rust-resistence).

[george tichbourne]

I like the neck knife idea myself from both a cost viewpoint and easy access.

I checked out M4 today and since it is not a stainless steel I would not suggest using it for a neck knife.

Will work on this idea a little more in about a week or so, things are very hectic around here right now with Christmas coming.

Take care
George

[Robocop]

George enjoy your holidays and think this idea over for a while.....something tells me we will be here when you have time to check in.

Basically I thought this may be a design you could try as it seems a little different than your normal designs. It may be exciting for you to ponder this for a while and maybe you could add your own personal flair to make something unique. I do like the idea of offering a few accessories to go along with the final product. The combinations could be many as far as lanyard style and choice of wrapping material and style.

[george tichbourne]

No holiday planned around here Robo, not until the Christmas/New Years week at least.

I am just finishing up an order for 50 knives for Carol to put into some gift baskets and these are taking all of my time and attention to get them done in time.

George

[LEDad]

George, I would be interested in a CPF neck knife. I would really like to see some designs. Especially if we can keep the blade small enough so that it could be an EDC pocket knife as well as a neck knife.

[Youfoundnemo]

A CPF neck knife would be great, could I suggest that the handle have two cutouts so that paracord could be wrapped in a variety of ways, it would be very simple for the end user to use change wrap styles for diffrent applicatons or even change them with the seasons...a diffrent wrap everytime...thats just my 2 cents hope its worth something

[Kiessling]

Although I do understand the need to cut down costs, a neck knife would not be a knife for me, sorry.
bernie

[Robocop]

Depending on blade material maybe a larger size camping knife could be condidered as well while keeping the handle as a user wrapped design. Is a para-cord wrapped handle possible on a larger knife and if so maybe this would sale better than a smaller kneck knife.....or maybe more people would show an interest in a larger knife.

Maybe offer two similiar designs with a larger camp type knife as well as a smaller neck style. If you are commited to a fixed blade seems like offering 2 sizes should be simple but again I know nothing of business nor knife making so what are the options here??

[PhantomPhoton]

I like the idea of a smaller knife. 2008 was kind of a camping knife so I wouldn't mind something different for 2009. Paracord handle-wrap doesn't matter one way or the other to me. Making a slim, tough, tool knife seems like one possible way to go this year.
But I'm open to all sorts of ideas. A big and little knife sound interesting as well. Little brother/ big brother come to mind when I think of it. Both knives with essentially the same basic style/ design. One thicker, bigger, beefier with more work into the handle; one slim, more compact neck knife like with a paracord friendly tang/ handle. Buy either depending on tastes; or both .
Sort of similar to the initial idea with the folder and fixed blade I guess. Hey maybe all 3 ...
We may just work poor George for all he's worth this year too!

[Outdoors Fanatic]

Although I do understand the need to cut down costs, a neck knife would not be a knife for me, sorry.
bernie

I agree. I have no interest in a neck knife, nor in the use of cheaper materials. (440C steel? Paracord wrap? Please...)

[Robocop]

I have no idea as to the quality of 440 or any other steel however my suggestion for a knife with a wrapped type handle was made in order to allow the maker to offer a better material for the blade. From what I gathered much of the cost and frustration comes from choosing, shaping and attatching the handle material so the wrap option would simplify this and allow the user to decide their own style.....it would also allow us to get a knife with better steel for less cost due to the handle design.

Is a knife with a cord wrapped handle frowned upon in the knife world? I really do not know if this is considered to be a poor design however I know many who use a wrapped type design and have had no problems (myself included)

[Kiessling]

Hey Robo ... nothing wrong with that at all. Just not my style and thing to have, that's all.

[Monocrom]

Nothing wrong with a paracord wrapped handle. Mick Strider's fixed-blade tanto design features a very elaborately wrapped handle.

Nothing wrong with 440C either. (Keep in mind that there are more than one type of 440 steel. With 440C being the best out of them).

O.F. is right, 440C is cheaper.... compared to the price of most of the exotic steels out there. But 440C is ideal for use on a neck knife, not just because of a lower price tag. The exotics are generally more prone to developing rust spots than 440C. (Since neck knives are worn so close to the body, you're going to be sweating on your knife. Even with the blade enclosed in a kydex neck sheath, you'll want a quality steel known for extreme rust-resistence). Also, assuming that all are properly heat-treated 440C can easily keep up with the exotics currently in use today.

[Robocop]

From looking over the makers web site it seems that almost all of their products are made with 440 steel. I was a little confused about the different metals and cost however found that even some of their more costly items were also made with 440....seems like it must be a decent steel at least for the maker to put so much faith in it thus far.

If nothing else it would seem that Mr. Tichbourne likes 440 for various reasons and feels most comfortable using this steel for whatever design this next project is to be. I know zero of modern or even older steels so maybe the maker can fill us in on why he feels this metal is such a good choice for his designs?

I do not wish to take this thread off track discussing better or lesser steels however as a group effort I guess there is still a need to determine what steel would be more popular for the majority of people who wish to purchase another design from Mr. Tichbourne.

[Robocop]

I just finished reading various many articles on knife steels in the hopes I would better understand a little about this topic. I never realized there were so many different variations as well as opinions as to better or lesser steels.

I read one website thread from bladeforums that spoke of 440C and said many people are leery of this simply because they are used to seeing 440 stamped on cheap knives. The page went on to state that these cheaper knives all use a different 440 than the 440C and as far as toughness and actual usage goes 440C is an excellent choice if treated correctly.....just most people assume the "440" means lesser quality when in fact it is 440A or B used in the lesser quality knives and not the C version.

Again not trying to throw this off track however at least I now see one reason Mr. Tichbourne uses this steel so much and I am also a little more up to date on other steels as well. Of all the threads I studied there was one common denominator all agreed on and that was heat treating of any steel.....they say this makes all the difference. very interesting read none the less and personally I would carry a knife made of this steel from an established maker.

[Monocrom]

I read one website thread from bladeforums that spoke of 440C and said many people are leery of this simply because they are used to seeing 440 stamped on cheap knives. The page went on to state that these cheaper knives all use a different 440 than the 440C and as far as toughness and actual usage goes 440C is an excellent choice if treated correctly.....just most people assume the "440" means lesser quality when in fact it is 440A or B used in the lesser quality knives and not the C version.

Safe bet that if you find a knife stamped with "440," it's 440A. Depending on the Brand and the price, sometimes it's also a safe bet that it hasn't been properly heat-treated. Companies that use 440C, they'll make sure to stamp the "C" part onto the blade. They want to make damn sure that their customers know they are getting a better quality knife.

With individual custom knifemakers, it's their reputation that counts. They'll either stamp their knives with the blade steel used, or just tell you the blade steel; and leave it at that.

[george tichbourne]

We had a fellow recently that saw an add in a magazine and wanted to buy a Moose hunter to go hunting with but was not certain about the edge holding. I sort of convinced him the 440C would be just fine.

He took that knife out moose hunting, got a medium sized moose, about 800 lb. dressed, skinned and quartered the thing and called me as soon as he got back. He said that the knife performed perfectly and in fact it seemed to get sharper as he went along and when it was finished he could still shave with it.

Fot those of you who have never seen a moose close up they are about the size of a quarter horse.

George
PS he ordered another knife

[VillageIdiot]

How about Ti? =D

[tensixteen]

Personally i would prefer a more modern steel, though 440C is ok with me too.

Initially for the 2008 knife, when i came up with the design, i had designed it to be one in which i wanted the scales to be removable, and the user have the option as to whether to have it as a bare-skeletal frame neck knife or have the handle slabs on for a more full grip.

For a skeletal frame neck knife, i think somewhere around the thickness of 1 eighth of an inch would be good..last year's CPF fixed blade was too thick for neck carry in my opinion...

For blade materials, i think the following would be good to use: ATS-34; 440C; 154-CM; or maybe even Stellite 6K since George has used it before.

here's a blade shape i just drew up...what do u guys think?



Cheers and Regards,
Nick

[Monocrom]

For blade materials, i think the following would be good to use: ATS-34; 440C; 154-CM; or maybe even Stellite 6K since George has used it before.

Speaking from experience, ATS-34 will develop tiny rust spots after carrying it close to the body for a typical 8-hour work-shift. Since 154CM is ATS-34's American twin, I don't believe it would be a good blade choice for a neck knife either. After a few days of always having to clean the surface of the knife when getting home, George's creation would likely end up in a drawer. A kydex neck sheath will help in reducing that particular issue, but won't make it go away entirely.

here's a blade shape I just drew up...what do you guys think?

Handle looks a bit long. I was thinking perhaps a tear-drop shaped handle made to accomidate the thumb on top, and the first two fingers on the bottom. Perhaps something similar to Perrin's La Griffe?

[Monocrom]

Had to bump the thread. My curiosity got the better of me. Would really like to know if George is considering the neck knife idea for the 2009 CPF model.

And if so, does he have any ideas for a basic shape?

[Unforgiven]

I'm not interested in a neck knife at this time but I will keep an eye on the thread in case ideas swing in a different direction.

[DArklite]

Something along the lines of the Spyderco Scorpius would be nice; 100% VG-10, and compact enough to stay out of the way clipped to a jeans coin pocket. It'll be interesting to see how this ends up.

[george tichbourne]

Would really like to know if George is considering the neck knife idea for the 2009 CPF model.

And if so, does he have any ideas for a basic shape?

Hi Monocrom,

Our apologies for being absent for so long,

YES, George thinks a neck knife would be an interesting little knife to make up and with Robo's suggestion of a personally wrapped handle. 440C would be our knife steel of choice for the various reasons already given by others.

YES, I believe he does have some ideas but with the recent panic to complete a large order has had little time to do anything else but concentrate on getting it out the door.

While the neck knife may not be the choice of some I personally do not see why there could not be the option of running with TWO (2) styles for this year. One a neck knife and the second for those who prefer something else. Does anyone have a problem with that solution ??

Robocop was correct a few posts back when he indicated that George & I were going to be busy We have just completed a corporate holiday gifting order consisting of over 50 kitchen knives and the quality control person from what I understand is a bit of a pain I won't elaborate as to the identity of this nuisance but one day I expect to find a life size picture of me in the shop with a dart board attached to it

Look forward to picking this up and seeing what we can decide upon for the 2009 project.

Cheers, Carol

[Monocrom]

Look forward to picking this up and seeing what we can decide upon for the 2009 project.

Cheers, Carol

Thanks for the response, Carol.

With Christmas & New Year's fast approaching, I figured you and George would be very busy.

Any thoughts on the tear-drop shaped handle I mentioned in an earlier post?