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Thread: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

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    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Just over four years ago now I posted a thread titled How long before LED light is really good?, where I asked the question:

    How long, do you think, before the quality of light from LED's starts to rival the light from a good incandescent? I'm guessing three to five years, but does anyone have a more informed estimate? What's on the horizon for LED technology? Will there soon be another high quality/power LED besides the Luxeon? What advances are in sight?
    Well, as it turns out my estimate of three to five years was just about right! With McGizmo's introduction of Nichia 083 High CRI LED's to our humble online community, the highest quality light I have ever dreamed of from an LED is now available! The light from these 083's does indeed rival the light from even a high CCT incandescent. Or surpasses it. I'm amazed at how wonderful it is; at how well it renders colors; at how bright and sunny it is while totally lacking the yellowiness of incans. It is the best of both worlds.

    My experience with the 083's is due to a single light: McGizmo's SunDrop. Don suggests in the thread that the name "SunDrop" might possibly be a bit too ambitious, but I don't think so. It is my considered opinion, after living with this amazing little light for going on two months now, that the Sundrop does indeed fulfill the destiny of its name, and does in actual fact, in reality, put a goddamned drop of SUNLIGHT on whatever you shine it on! Does my amazement come across here? Because, it is amazing! I'm amazed. It's an amazing light. I was stunned when I first experienced it, and still today, I like to just shine the light into my hand and admire the bit of sun held there, and always use it around the house when I need or want the highest quality light. The SunDrop is magic. I know, I'm being very hyperbolic here. I'm sorry. But those of us who have experienced this light will attest to the fact that the reality deserves some hyperbole. paulr says in one of his posts that:

    The Sundrop has almost killed my interest in other lights, I like it so much. I've been carrying mine every day for months, where I always used to switch from one light to another.
    This is what I'm taking about. And, of course, being a McGizmo light, the SunDrop is impressive not only because of its light engine and high CRI light output, but also because of it's design and build quality. It is based upon one of Don's clickie C packs, which has the nicest clickie switch and silicon rubber boot I have ever used, and which features the trade-mark McGizmo ergonomic titanium body design with the flared end and grippy concentric rings. Two fingers fit very nicely in between the tail flare and the head of the light, making switch activation a joy. The lens, which is not flat, but which is in fact a focusing lens specially designed by Don, is sapphire crystal, and the o-rings are high quality EPDM. It's a real beauty of a light—very charming and endearing. Oh, and best of all, the silicon rubber switch boot is easily and separately user replaceable, so for those of us who dislike the feel of smooth slick squishy rubber, we can economically and conveniently change out the switch bootie as often as we like to keep it feeling crisp and new.

    One drawback of the 083's is their lower efficiency compared to Crees and Seouls. This is the cost of very high CRI, unfortunately. However, it is still plenty bright for most uses—about 40 lumens—and has a good runtime on a single 123. (There is also a SunDrop XP which gets extended runtime from two 123's in a longer clickie pack, and of course the currently offered Sundrop 3S)

    The other draw back of the SunDrop is that the beam, like the beam from the Mule, is a total flood, and really doesn't throw at all. This is not a problem for indoor use, and for near-field outdoor use, of course, and for many of us, throw isn't really absolutely necessary, or we carry more than one light anyway (those real flashaholics out there, right brightnorm!?!). For myself, for better or worse, I find that I absolutely do need throw in my EDC, and I refuse to EDC two lights, as I have other important things I want to EDC besides lights, like my Sebenza, for example. Nonetheless, for me, the Sundrop is the single best around-the-house-and-yard light I have yet had the fortune to use, and for most people, I suspect that the Sundrop's lack of throw would not be an obstacle even for use as an EDC light.

    There are plenty of good photos in the SunDrop thread, but I wanted to take some of my own that would capture just how good the light is from this thing. I tried a number of different setups in about a freaking dozen locations around my house, but when I framed it up and went back and forth, I just didn't feel satisfied that they captured the full amazingness of the Sundrop. In a number of cases, this was partly due to whites in the pictures being turned into even more whiter whites by the Cree LED in the Mule head, which frankly, looked pretty good, even though it was an artificial coloration, not a faithful rendering like the Nichia 083 in the sundrop. Further, nothing I came up with bettered (or even added anything to) the pictures in the Sundrop thread. Not surprising, I suppose, but frustrating nontheless.

    Then this evening, I started "thinking outside the box" as it were and figured that I needed two main things: RED and a PERSON (a woman, in point of fact)—and in addition, also wanted a background that wasn't white: no white walls, no white backsplash, no white period. And, for good measure, wanted some other colors besides red. Well, it's maybe a little unconventional, and not as sophisticated as the amazing outdoor pictures Don took, but I do think it captures very well the superior color-rendering of the Sundrop. Plus, honestly, how can you go wrong with a beautiful woman in a bikini? So here they are: (oh, and I threw in the X-Rite ColorChecker chart, which sadly, is *cough* upside down—must have been distracted by the GQ cover, I guess)





    You can clearly see the difference in skin tone, and the dramatic difference in the red cover. Also, notice the light golden, honey wood-color of the chest in the sundrop picture. That's how it really looks during the day, whereas the Mule light really skews it to a kind of pale greenish cool cast. And the Mule head also unnaturally amps up the blue border and Megan's eyes, although it's not a huge difference. More precisely, you can clearly see the superior color-rendering in the ColorChecker chart part of the pictures. Notice in particular the purple (3 over, 3 down from top-left), and the three redish/pinkish squares touching the purple. Sunlight itself wouldn't really do much better than the sundrop, in all honesty.

    Also, let me reiterate about the neatness of this light. It's just a charming, wonderful little light that fits in the hand very well. It's a pleasure to use and look at, and the clip is, of course, the McGizmo titanium clip, the single best clip in all of flashlight-dom. No matter how you grab this light, the clip won't get in your way or annoy you. On the contrary, it even feels better in some grips precisely because of the clip. The clip does it's job very well on top of this, and is positioned properly at the very rear of the light for correct, bezel-down carry. If you clip this to the inside of your pants pocket, the head won't be sticking up a full inch like a SureFire light. Or you can just drop this little guy right into a pants pocket for very comfortable carry. On top of all this, the Titanium body feels really, really good to the touch, and the concentric rings don't get in the way of that, while at the same time providing a nice grippiness. It's a very well designed and thought-out light.

    I highly recommend it for those people who, when it comes to light (and flashlights), are more interested in quality, than quantity. This is one for the flashlight Hall of Fame. Or my flashlight hall of fame, for whatever that's worth.

    Thank you, Don. You've created yet another truly extraordinary light.
    Last edited by js; 07-29-2014 at 01:24 AM. Reason: fix image links
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Wow she is..... and the tint looks good too. The biggest issue I have with most LEDs are for night trail hikes as often tree liken under most LEDs look very much like the blue blaze state trails or white makers on the AT. A few times I followed the patches of liken/tree moss and had to back track to aviod getting turned around. No big deal as a few times I just setup camp and found my way in the AM however for the longer dayhikes that move into dusk/night it is more of an issue. Also the warmer tints help with mist and fog as it seems to reflect back less into my eyes if that is even possible.

    I should take some photos of this liken/trail marker Phenomena. I think most people would be suprised just how near the liken which often grows in small patches the size of trailmarkers tooks to the man made markers under most common LED tints.
    Last edited by Woods Walker; 12-04-2008 at 07:50 PM. Reason: spelling

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Woods Walker,

    Yes. I know just what you're talking about, I think. This sort of thing is exactly why I have always championed the usefulness of incans--not that they are better than LED's, or anything like that--but just that in some situations, they do have their advantages over LED's. But then, I like to walk in the woods. A lot. It's a main preoccupation of mine, and I see from your screen name that you are a kindred spirit. So, yes, the Sundrop would have no trouble allowing you to distinguish between lichen and trail markers. Good story, BTW!
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Good post, and so true.

    The SD really is a charming little light. You just have to love it and play with it. Touvh the fat sapphire lens and all.
    And it is very useful, too.

    bernie
    There is a type of perfection that transcends the quest for lumens. Buying a $250 1-cell light for "lum factor" is like buying a $250 single malt Scotch for the alcohol content.
    - paulr


    It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black.
    My shoes are too tight. But it doesn't matter, because I have forgotten how to dance.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    I see the light is 40 lumens but funny thing is that 40 lumens in the woods seems to equal 100 in the city.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Bernie,

    Yes, it really is surprisingly useful. That high CRI LED isn't just for looks! hehe. For so many tasks, the Sundrop is just plain highly effective and practical. Whether it's finding an item in a deep floor-level kitchen cupboard, or getting the mail at night, or evaluating two sheets of chiyogami paper for a craft project, the Sundrop is unsurpassed and unquestionably useful.
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by Woods Walker View Post
    I see the light is 40 lumens but funny thing is that 40 lumens in the woods seems to equal 100 in the city.
    Yes. And, further, as you noted in your first post, light that has a lot of blue-ish frequencies in it is a detriment in foggy conditions, as the blue light scatters a lot more in the fog than red light. So, yes, those 40 lumens have significantly more punch than you might think just from the numerical value.
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    The SD is very comparable to the Zabralight H30, except for the gorgeous colors and the construction, of course.

    Here's a beam comparison of the SD-3S, the current model with 3 speeds, and the H30, both on high. First on a white wall, then in practical use.

    The pics are taken from my upcomig "low level" evaluation thread.








    bernie
    There is a type of perfection that transcends the quest for lumens. Buying a $250 1-cell light for "lum factor" is like buying a $250 single malt Scotch for the alcohol content.
    - paulr


    It's always darkest just before it goes pitch black.
    My shoes are too tight. But it doesn't matter, because I have forgotten how to dance.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by js View Post
    Yes. And, further, as you noted in your first post, light that has a lot of blue-ish frequencies in it is a detriment in foggy conditions, as the blue light scatters a lot more in the fog than red light. So, yes, those 40 lumens have significantly more punch than you might think just from the numerical value.
    Yea the LED light just kinda goes belly up. Fun times in the freezing rain too. I never understood the reasons for this only that it was real enough to me.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    I just want to say if you're gonna post beam shots comparing tint, CRI or CCT PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE use a custom white balance because cool whites come out too blue and warm and neutral whites come out too pink or yellow.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiessling View Post



    Sorry to stray off topic, but that's one heck of a record collection...or a hell of a lot of laser discs.

    Interesting photos. Especially in the above two examples, I would rather have the white/blue than the incan color. Personal preference though...

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    Help Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    JS,

    I read all 7 pages of McGizmo's thread "High CRI and its significance".
    http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...ght=nichia+083

    What informative stuff! You guys are to be loved for pushing these High CRI led's and McGizmo's Sundrop to the forefront of CPS! From a photographer and videographers point of view, this could be revolutionary.

    How bout a "GROUP BUY" of the Nichia 083's? I already emailed McGizmo, asking to buy one.

    ME WANTS!
    Brian

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    tebore,

    I don't know whether you were referring to me or bernie, but I can assure you that the pictures posted above in my first post very accurately capture and characterize the color rendering differences between the two light sources. The differences you see in the pictures were not the result of incorrect camera settings or automatic program algorithms like Auto-White-Balance.
    Last edited by js; 12-04-2008 at 09:08 PM. Reason: typo
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    carnal,

    Yeah. Don is awesome! too true. That High CRUI thread was a really great thread and it was a lot of fun to be a small part of it. I hope you have fun with your Nichia 083's!
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by wacbzz View Post
    Sorry to stray off topic, but that's one heck of a record collection...or a hell of a lot of laser discs.

    Interesting photos. Especially in the above two examples, I would rather have the white/blue than the incan color. Personal preference though...
    The conditions I am thinking about are a world away from looking at someones record collection. With the holidays I am a bit overworked however after that I really should do a thread of just how most LEDs look on the trail and though various weather conditions in the field and compare that with incans and warmer tint LEDs. Maybe I will get a warm tint dropin for the G2Z and use the warmer Rebel EOS and mix it up with a Incan G2. Toss in a Inova T3, PT APEX and L2D Q5 for the cooler tint LED side. But don't know if my camera skills are up to the test or if anyone is interested. I am going to use the search to see if this has been done before.

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    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by wacbzz View Post
    Interesting photos. Especially in the above two examples, I would rather have the white/blue than the incan color. Personal preference though...
    You know, that was actually part of what I was talking about when I was recounting why it was so difficult to get a satisfying set of pictures contrasting the Cree with the 083: even though the Cree was clearly skewing the colors, the skew was actually pleasing in some ways, and certainly not a problem. This is why I have always preferred LED lights indoors, for the most part, but have nonetheless insisted that incans have their place, mainly in outdoors usage. Anyway, the point is just that I was looking for a set of pictures that would both capture the difference, and show a situation where the poorer color rendering was objectionable--obviously, immediately, clearly, not in any way a positive skew from reality. Low CRI, yellowy incans are both skewing things and objectionable in most situations. Most LEDs are skewing things but are at the same time not objectionable in most situations. This is why the skin-tone and red colors were so important in the success of the final pictures: there's nothing positive about skewing those things towards the cool blue end of things, nor of messing with their color balance. We all know what skin tone should be and what bright red should be!

    But, keep in mind that the Sundrop pictures in bernies post are NOT the "incan color"! They are sunlight color--true color, or fairly close to it. The Sundrop isn't an incan and isn't yellowy. It's balanced.
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    *Flashaholic* Sgt. LED's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    I would join you if I could afford one!

    Ah maybe I could snag a beater late next year!

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    JS, this you wrote a wonderful review. Being an owner of a SunDrop myself, I can attest to everything you said in your review. You have captured its real essence, and it is difficult for me to add much to what you have so eloquently written.

    However, it should be stated that in some situations, correct color rendition is not just a nicety; it is a necessity. Many months ago, as a pediatrician trying to use an ordinary LED flashlight to look at throats, I was quickly frustrated that I couldn't tell a normal throat, from a pink throat, or from a red throat. They often looked nearly the same. One afternoon using a Fenix L2D, I missed what later I saw looked like an obvious strep throat. The throat looked normal, but the rapid strep test was postive. Since the patient hadn't left the office, I went back and looked at her again with an incadescent light and couldn't believe that I missed seeing strep with the Fenix Q5. I was about to give up on using LED's when I started a thread on the forum, asking for suggestions for better color rendering LED flashlights that could be used in a medical setting. Most people couldn't appreciate my problem, but Don did. He sent me a PM and asked if I would like to try out a light he was thinking of marketing down the road. And of course, I did. He sent me a a Mule with the Nichia 083 HIGH CRI installed. He rigged an acrylic hemisphere for a lens on the front of the light. Anyway, it was love at first try. Partly because of my feedback and encouragement, Don went ahead with the SunDrop production. Of course when the first wave of the production SunDrops became available, I just had to buy one. I believe I received the first one in the wave. Anyway, I have been using and loving the SunDRop ever since. In case you wonder why I just didn't stick with the incadescent, there are several reasons. The SunDrop provides brighter, more even illumination over a longer time, than any incandescent could. Now that I have used the Sundrop for several months, incadescents while fine with reds and pink, make flesh tones look too yellow. While I still carry other lights, (how many flashaholics carry just one?), the SunDrop stays at work in my lab coat pocket and is used several times a day. The Mule prototype still sees professional service, but now at home with people stopping in on occasion for free medical advice.
    Last edited by BabyDoc; 12-05-2008 at 09:52 AM.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    How does the 083 compare to Seoul's high-CRI P4?

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    BabyDoc,

    I just love real world examples like that! Great post! And I totally agree that good CRI isn't just a nicety. In some situations it is a necessity. I have heard this time and again from various professionals: sometimes you really do need good color rendering. Until recently, that meant an incandescent, but now, with the Nichia 083 and the SunDrop, that has all changed, and as I pointed out, the Sundrop has as good a CRI as most if not all incans, while at the same time having a pleasing, non-"yellowy", light on a white wall. It's got beauty and brawn. Personally, I never found the yellowy light from a good incan to be objectionable, but I know I am in the minority on that. But, in any case, I totally love the 083 light. It's really great. An incan may still be better in fog due to it's lack of the upper range of colors and prominence of the lower end, but the Sundrop would be close. If only it threw . . .

    Ah well, we can dream, and judging by McGizmo's past performance, those dreams just might come true in the form of a McGimo light . . .
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by TigerhawkT3 View Post
    How does the 083 compare to Seoul's high-CRI P4?
    I have no idea, but perhaps someone else might chime in.
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Couldn't one put a very carefully designed filter in front of a cree to cut out the blue spike? I am thinking somethink like a photography filter in front of the led (Skylight). I know this would significantly cut output but with Q5 lights running on one CR123 producing around 180 lumen, some could easily be sacraficed. Just because, this SunDrop is a $500 light after all...

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    http://www.pssl.com/Rosco-Roscolux-Gel-Sampler

    If there is one that will do it - it's in that pack.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by TigerhawkT3 View Post
    How does the 083 compare to Seoul's high-CRI P4?
    I have both the 3000K and 4000K versions of the Seoul LEDs, and I took some pics comparing the 4000k against the 083. I didn't bother with the 3000K version because it was so yellow. Here is a link to my thread with the pics.

    Subjectively IMHO, the 083 gives a more accurate rendering of objects the way they appear in sunlight. The Seoul LED emphasizes yellows, oranges, and reds more than the 083 and also more than sunlight. The 083 also seems a bit better at rendering certain shades of green and brown, where 'better' means more like sunlight.

    The best way I can succinctly describe the Seoul LED is that it looks more like incandescent than any other LED I have ever seen. And you guessed it, the 083 looks more like sunlight.


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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by nars42 View Post
    Couldn't one put a very carefully designed filter in front of a cree to cut out the blue spike? I am thinking somethink like a photography filter in front of the led (Skylight). I know this would significantly cut output but with Q5 lights running on one CR123 producing around 180 lumen, some could easily be sacraficed. Just because, this SunDrop is a $500 light after all...
    Yes, you can do this. Check out the High CRI thread in McGizmo's forum (first link in my first post) for a discussion of why you might prefer to use the 083. But, I mean, go for it! CPFers could then experiment first hand with the differences and come to some kind of consensus on it. The thing that I would say might be a problem is that if there is a severe lack of a certain frequency of light, a filter can't do anything about that, and that might be the case here with the low reds. But check out the High CRI thread for more discussion on this. I can't honestly remember where that was left in the course of the discussion. That was what I took out it, but I won't vouch for the accuracy of my memory on this particular point.
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

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    Thread Killer Illum's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    I find it sort of odd that something like this has not been used before, in addition to the fact that there isn't one bit of hinting on Nichias website concerning this "Nichia 083" high CRI LED.

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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by Illum_the_nation View Post
    I find it sort of odd that something like this has not been used before, in addition to the fact that there isn't one bit of hinting on Nichias website concerning this "Nichia 083" high CRI LED.
    As Don explained it to me, the Nichia 083 high CRI LED had been used previously in residential lighting applications, but never before in flashlights. Because of its low output, relative to the popular Crees, most manufacturss hadn't considered using this LED in a flashlight. Except for a small niche of users who require high color resolution, more lumens is what sells flashlights, not higher CRI with fewer lumens. That's why Don told me he had reservations about marketing this light and why he made it available in only such a small limited edition run, to see what kind of response there would be. He was rather surprised that the first SunDrop wave sold out so quickly but not how thrilled people were with this light.
    We knew it was that good and different, that seeing was believing.

    Unfortunately, with the down-turn in the economy and the report of a few defective light engines, the second wave hasn't moved out the door as quickly, even though it offers 3 different light levels, rather than just the one level of the first wave SunDrops. Nevertheless, the holidays are approaching and I am optimistic that Don will have soon have many more happy SunDrop customers.

  28. #28
    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by Woods Walker View Post
    The conditions I am thinking about are a world away from looking at someones record collection. With the holidays I am a bit overworked however after that I really should do a thread of just how most LEDs look on the trail and though various weather conditions in the field and compare that with incans and warmer tint LEDs. Maybe I will get a warm tint dropin for the G2Z and use the warmer Rebel EOS and mix it up with a Incan G2. Toss in a Inova T3, PT APEX and L2D Q5 for the cooler tint LED side. But don't know if my camera skills are up to the test or if anyone is interested. I am going to use the search to see if this has been done before.
    Woods Walker,

    I'm pretty sure that nothing exactly like what you want to do has been done before (although I could be wrong), but I can definitely tell you that I would be interested, along with a good many others. Capturing the superior out-door color rendering and throw and discrimination of incan (or Sundrop) light isn't so much about superior camera skills as about lots of trial and error and good intuition. If you want it badly enough, you will succeed for sure, even if you have only basic camera skills. I say GO FOR IT!
    -Jim Sexton, creator of the M6-R, the TigerLight Upgrades, Fixture-ring lamp potting, the SL60, co-designer of the B90 Upgrade, and proponent of the SF A2, the SF M6 X-LOLA, Titanium, the Haiku, and the LunaSol 20

  29. #29
    Flashaholic* divine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    Quote Originally Posted by Illum_the_nation View Post
    I find it sort of odd that something like this has not been used before, in addition to the fact that there isn't one bit of hinting on Nichias website concerning this "Nichia 083" high CRI LED.
    I don't think the 083 is a retail product at all.

    At work, I meet with some representatives of (commercial) lighting manufacturers. There are some lights, like home lighting or commercial lighting, that you can buy (pretty expensive, though) with Nichia 083 led's in them.

    The one company I most recently met with is teaming up with this Italian company who does some amazing things! They had this strip light that can be recessed into concrete with these small RGB leds that looked smaller than a cree and put out about half the light of a cree in red, green, or blue. I didn't get to see it output white (all colors on), but I was curious to see how bright it would have been.

    There's this great company, Renaissance that makes a downlight that outputs practically any color you want it to. They aim about 30 or so red, green, and blue Cree's up at a white dome, the color mixes together, and outputs the exact color you want it to. Warm white, cool white, green, orange... It can fade from red to green. Oh yeah, I almost forgot. They have to use more red led's than green or blue, because "the led's are weak at the red." lol

    I think the lighting industry is starting to, and will continue to push some nice light emitters our way.
    "For every good deed, there is an equal an opposite bad deed."

  30. #30
    Flashaholic* divine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finally, an LED light that rivals an incan's color rendering

    js, I have a question for you. I got a poorman's sundrop from mudman. Is it just me, or... say different colored words or backgrounds lit by the nichia led or by another led. Do you think it is more difficult to focus your eyes with a lower CRI led?
    "For every good deed, there is an equal an opposite bad deed."

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