Is this a tattoo era?

[js]

OK. You know, my response to jtr actually suffers from a lack of imagination! LOL! I, like jtr, tend to be very intellectual, very deliberate, about my life--too much so, really--so it's my natural tendency to see things from that perspective.

Let's imagine the person who gets her hair dyed red just for the fun of it, for no "deep" reason. Or who gets a tattoo just for the fun of it, with a design that tickles her fancy at the moment, chosen on a whim.

Ah yes, I hear the deep stentorian voice of conservative reason: that to get such a permanent thing as a tattoo on a whim is perverse, especially if it isn't something deeply meaningful. And to that voice, I say "ah stuff a sock in it--you aren't the only citizen in this country." I mean, seriously, so someone gets a tattoo for fun? So what? It might well tell you that that person is impulsive and not much concerned with long term consequences. What's so wrong with that? Why do we have to judge it categorically? Why do we have to come down for or against in this way, when the reasons behind the act could be so various and different?

I say that we don't. I say there's nothing categorically wrong with wanting to look pretty or attractive or distinctive. In some people, in some particular instances, I find this to be distasteful and off-putting. But in others, I find it to be charming and pleasing.

So, once more I say that to insist, as jtr does, that we must all avoid outer expression, or be crass, is in itself to make a crass judgment. Is it so hard to be a bit more discerning than that? A bit more broad minded than that?

[js]

. . .

Ok now THIS is funny!! What makes you think that women who get breast implants are doing it for some GUY? Please don't flatter yourselves, gentlemen... Most women that I know who have had such surgery did it 100% for themselves so they could feel better about themselves, wear nicer clothes, undo the effects of gravity & stretchmarks after having children, corrective surgery after more radical surgery such as a mastectomy, etc. Not one of them did it for a man or men... trust me!! ... and sorry guys... it ain't always all about you...

You know what makes it even funnier? Is that guys assume that women do all this sort of stuff just for them, then believe they are "shallow" for doing it.

[jtr1962]

js,

I read your post but I'm too tired to write a detailed response now (up all night working and I'm actually into my fourth week without a day off). I'll say for now I agree our world views are different. Most of my aversion to decorating one's body has to do with my viewpoint that the body is a temple. In my mind doing things to stop the advance of aging, or to restore what once was (hair transplants, breast reconstruction), are fine, even desireable. Doing things which permanently change the body, such as tattooing, or even worse scarification, aren't. Don't even get me started on things like those basketball-sized breast implants which IMO make the wearer look like a caricature. It's one thing to get normal size implants to fix sagging or surgery. It's quite another to walk around with watermelons. A grey area for me is some types of cosmetic surgery. I can definitely understand why some people might want to have their features altered if they're not happy with them. I just can't understand altering your body to the point where the end result doesn't resemble something naturally occurring.

I'll grant that some people who do these things have deep and personal reasons for doing so. Greta certainly appears to be one. What alarms me is when something like this starts becoming a trend, as in I see a lot more tattoos and especially body piercing compared to a generation ago. When a few people do something for special reasons it's one thing. I see what's happening now more as a fad. But then it always goes that way. Look at every time period and there was always one primary way people tried to express themselves. Sometimes it was with clothing, other times with jewelry. Now it's with tattooing and/or piercing.

Now here's the parts I just don't get about these newest forms of expression. First off, many of them cost money, lots of money. Now we all spend some money on frivolous, unnecessary things but in some cases here we're not talking a few tens or hundreds of dollars. We're talking huge sums of money, amounts an average person might need to work months or longer to make. I could personally think of far better things to do with that kind of money, like maybe retire a few years earlier by just investing it. Second, a lot of these cosmetic procedures are not only costly, but PAINFUL and sometimes DANGEROUS. Life already contains enough pain and danger, at least mine does. And I'm going to subject myself to more? And actually pay good money for the "privilege"??? Third, in many cases the procedures are not entirely reversible, or very costly to do so. I may love this tattoo today, but what happens if I don't next month? Fourth, there are going to be, shall we say, unexpected consequences, as in reactions to our new appearance which may not always be to our liking. While we can both agree stereotying is not a desireable behavoir, it exists and likely always will, at least until we evolve out of it. Fifth, a lot of these decorations are uncomfortable, especially the aforementioned watermelon-sized breasts.

So in the end a lot of my objections also have a practical basis. Whatever the wearer's motivations, whether it they be deeply personal or just following a trend, to me anyway the drawbacks seem like an awfully steep price to pay. And I'm sure my list above is by no means comprehensive. Even nonpermanent adornments are a nuisance in that it's yet another thing you must do each day. Maybe it all comes down to that I just couldn't imagine people other than those wealthy enough not to work having the time or money to worry to that extent about their appearance. I know I don't. Never had the time. There are always things to do even when there's not paid work. Shopping, cleaning, home repairs, gardening, etc. On a good day I might get a compliment on my hair because I actually remembered to comb it. Most days there's barely enough time to shower and shave (and I usually shave while I'm doing something else, like maybe posting on CPF). No sense trying to make myself look too nice anyway as I'll look like crap again once I've been working for 12 or 15 or 18 hours, especially if it's physical stuff. My mom's the same way. 70 years old, no job, yet busy from the minute she wakes up until late night. Then she watches TV (and usually quickly falls asleep). Every single day.

Oh, and why didn't your mother just ask Matt why he changed his appearance? I know I have when friends suddenly do that, even things as minor as wearing a new type of clothing. Most of the time I find they're not offended by my question. In fact, they're even happy to talk about it. Yeah, people love talking about themselves. I guess that includes myself.

And BTW, your mom and mine are from an older generation where norms were more strictly defined. I don't think her reaction was that different than my mom's would have been. My mom is actually somewhat tolerant for her generation but even she has her limits. Her sister is way worse. Had it worked out that I married that Chinese girl from high school I really would have dreaded the reaction of our relatives from BOTH sides. Outside of my parents, most were really old school as in marry into your race and religion. But even they would have accepted her eventually I'm sure. And if they didn't, I couldn't have cared less.

And that's the "short" version of my reply. Maybe more later or tomorrow as I'm really tired. Time to grab a few hours of z's and then it's back to work for me. Busy month.

[js]

jtr,

Thank you so much for your eloquent and thoughtful post.

Please accept my apologies for my less than excellent posts above. Being on this danged graveyard shift really does have an effect on my verbal centers and on my inhibitions, it seems.

So, listen, actually you and I have very similar views on this stuff, personally. i.e. I don't have tattoos and probably won't get any for the same reasons as you. And when it comes to clothes and grooming and those things, I pretty much follow your approach. So, we're not so different after all, I don't think.

Well, we are (and that's a good thing--I always enjoy talking with you) but not as much as I was saying.

Anyway, I understand your concerns, and I do think that tattoos are definitely a fad right now, at least to some degree, and it may be that many who get them now will regret them later, and your post would be excellent reading for someone considering a tattoo. No question.

So . . . before I get myself into trouble again by trying to reason on 3 hours of sleep, I'm going to shut up, and just say

SORRY, JTR!

I was out of line. You make some very good points.

[McGizmo]

"Is this a tattoo era?"

I would guess the consensus is that yes, it is. I believe there are TV series now about ink? Don't remember anything like that back when "Leave it to Beaver" aired.

I remember the worse job I ever had and one that lasted all of one day. Late '60's I got a summer job working at a place called H&H Graphics in Capistrano Beach. It was a sweat shop where we all worked at screening T-shirts with logos and graphics and then laid them on a conveyor that took them through an oven to bake the ink onto the fabric. This was the start of a new era where people were getting into clothing that not only followed a current style or trend but also sported graphics in terms of images, text and identifications of unrelated products or concepts. People were starting to make statements with their dress attire, literally in some cases and figuratively or artistically in others.

In many ways, I view the present interest and activities of tattooing and body mutilation as a next step and of a more personal and permanent form of similar expressions and statements. I don't know how widespread or popular it might be but there is also the body painting and henna (sp) tattoos where one can sport a temporary graphic.

I would also guess that technology has enhanced the range, quality and detail that can now be inked, implanted, scarred and so on, as compared to in the years past and this likely has had a favorable impact on the various practices. Some of the colors I am seeing now are really amazing and I assume they are reasonably color fast.

Personally, I have never cared for makeup, painted nails or any of a number of physical alterations people have taken upon themselves to make. I guess I too am a proponent for au natural. My litmus test in terms of viewing a girl or young woman back then was how would they look and appear stepping out of a shower or coming out of the ocean. Lose the clothes, loose the face paint, lose the hair style and let me see what's there behind and under those things. I suspect I am and was not alone in this but by the same token I certainly could be in a minority in holding these values.

For what ever reason, if one knew they would be spending the rest of their life in solitude, how would that effect their desire for and nature of any ink or other body alteration they might wish to have? Perhaps such a consideration helps identify that which is truely and purely personal. Beyond this, I believe any ink or physical alteration is intended as some form of communication to, or wish for perception from, others. This may be in a public arena or more limited and even private.

To a great extent, I think this tattoo era is a new form of means of communication and identification. As to how effective one is in identifying themsleves or communicating to others, I would guess it ranges from right on the money to a bunny with a pancake on its head (has anyone done such a tattoo? )

[StarHalo]

I would guess it ranges from right on the money to a bunny with a pancake on its head (has anyone done such a tattoo? )

[Greta]

... a bunny with a pancake on its head (has anyone done such a tattoo? )

Hmm... I was trying to think of just the right design for my 13th tat... we might just have a winner here!!

"Is this a tattoo era?"

I also think the answer is yes... but only because getting inked is not the taboo that it used to be. Contrary to what some in this thread might think, tattoos really are more widely accepted and mainstream now thus removing the stigma and stereotyping attached to them. No one really bats an eye at tats anymore... (at least not in the world I live in)... unless it is something offensive (gang related, racial, X-rated, etc)... or you're an ex-heavyweight boxing champion...

I remember back when I owned my travel agency. I had an employee who really was the cutest little thing and a great employee. But we had a problem with how she dressed. She wore these tank tops and shirts where you could see her bra straps. This was not acceptable! I mean... c'mon! Buy a bra that has convertible straps or a strapless bra for heaven's sake! Well... lo and behold... just a year or two later, Victoria's Secret was selling bras with changable bra straps that were MEANT to be seen!! Some with pretty little hearts and flowers and skulls, etc. What had this world come to?!?!? Women exposing their undergarments like that!! EGAD!! ....

Damn but I'd love to go back to the day when all you could see was a bra strap...

[McGizmo]

In regards to current trends and ultimately related to this thread, I offer up a little story in regards to swim wear. Function has always been of primary importance to me and surfing trunks evolved from goofy cotton "jams" in the early '60's to good functional nylon shorts that gave you the room you needed and dried reasonably quick without holding pounds of water. If I was going to do much swimming, the hell with it, I wore Speedos. Well I have been shamed away from them and more in consideration of not offending anyone else more than giving a hoot what someone might think of me.

The whole "jailin" trend with crotch down or back to somewhere previously visited and shorts perhaps 4" shorter than long pants in length, for some reason has become the standard for men's swimming and boardshorts. Functional? Well yeah but so is a sea anchor. Women's swimwear on the other hand has reached new minimums in terms of yardage and yet even considering the need for waxing, their garments are required to cover more real estate than mens and they can do it fashionbly as well as functionally with a fraction of the material used in men's swimwear. Yeah, maybe now with all of the length and girth enhancements, the typical male needs shorts well past his knees to insure that his "johnson" doesn't peek out at the bottom.

So I see this guy I know at the beach one day who usually just wears Speedos (he was mad at me when I hung mine up) and he is sporting some short legged, reasonable looking swim trunks. They even have cargo pockets. I asked him where he got ths shorts and he told me from a catalog company who is also on the internet. I asked for the name and he gave it to me but he warned me that I might find the catalog as well as most of the clothing in it not of my interest, at all!

Well he was right!! It would seem that this company caters to a certain type of man that simply isn't me in any shape, form or interest. I did buy some shorts from them and now I get catalogs from them in the mail that are frankly a bit embarrassing (as would be a subscription to any of the glamor magazines). To each his own. Different strokes for different folks and these folks and likely their strokes are not me or mine.

The shorts I did buy from them were subsequently discontinued and I looked once to see if they had something new that might be a viable alternative which they didn't and at this point, I have no interest in checking further or receiving their catalog!!

What prompted this story is the fact that I just got another catalog in the mail from them today and at least when I went for the link, their online images include the same picture of a man with hands on head and the tat "mother" prominantly displayed on his upper arm. It is the cover image on the catalog. Granted, this is not a mainstream catalog but it is in keeping with a new era, I would propose.

[Greta]

Um... hey Don... um... you can forward those catalogs to me if you want. Um... I'll uh... recycle them! Yeah... that's it... I'll recycle them for you! Out in the recycle bin every week! Yep... that's where they'll go!



Yowza!!

[MarNav1]

Starhalo, I want a tat of your avatar.

[Monocrom]

Um... hey Don... um... you can forward those catalogs to me if you want. Um... I'll uh... recycle them! Yeah... that's it... I'll recycle them for you! Out in the recycle bin every week! Yep... that's where they'll go!

Ah yes, recycling old catalogs.

Would make a very interesting topic on CPF Green.

[StarHalo]

Starhalo, I want a tat of your avatar.

[MarNav1]

!@#$%^&*_()+!

[McGizmo]

Um... hey Don... um... you can forward those catalogs to me if you want. Um... I'll uh... recycle them! Yeah... that's it... I'll recycle them for you! Out in the recycle bin every week! Yep... that's where they'll go!



Yowza!!

Greta,
Just buy something special for that hunk of yours and you will get your own catalogs!!

I find it illuminating that you have commented on a men's fashion line but none of the guys here have.

I think there is a lot of underlying meat here for a Mars/ Venus type discussion and yet many of the trends and now accepted cosmetic activities seem to be on a merge of the male/ female boundaries.

[Greta]

I find it illuminating that you have commented on a men's fashion line but none of the guys here have.

Uh... it's not the fashion line I'm interested in looking at...

... and yes, I can simply turn my head to the right and look at the hunk sitting at the desk next to mine. But how would I know what a fine hunk he is if I didn't have something else to compare him to?

[TKC]

I have 5 tats and always want another.

[js]

Uh... it's not the fashion line I'm interested in looking at...

... and yes, I can simply turn my head to the right and look at the hunk sitting at the desk next to mine. But how would I know what a fine hunk he is if I didn't have something else to compare him to?

Greta,

You are too cool! I love this bit. I think I may steal it from you.

[StarHalo]

But how would I know what a fine hunk he is if I didn't have something else to compare him to?

This is excellent news. I am providing the following so that fellow CPFers' wives may do the same.

[McGizmo]

Good one Starhalo. Now if the gent had a tat on one inner thigh with the script: "your sister" and on the other thigh, "your mama" ......

[Greta]

Good one Starhalo. Now if the gent had a tat on one inner thigh with the script: "your sister" and on the other thigh, "your mama" ......

Ok... no lie... I know a chick who has an American Express card tattoo'd on her upper inner thigh. And yes, you can correctly assume whatever you want with that one. I'd say that some of the more "rude" stereotypes mentioned in this thread would most definately be appropriate.

[saabgoblin]

I know of a guy who has two hinges tattooed on his inner arms at his elbows, while funny it may not be as priceless as Greta's acquaintance and as with American Express, there is no spending limit!

[chmsam]

I'm way too old and too cheap for good ink (and quality does make a huge difference doesn't it? -- ain't nothin' worse than bad ink) but here's my thoughts.

1). I once stole a line from an old sitcom and told a kid that his Chinese tattoo really said, "Of the couple of men who live together, this one is the woman." Of course he had no clue of what his tattoo really said so it worked perfectly. How can someone permanently brand their body and not take the time to find out what the image means?

2). This country prides itself on the thought of being a "rugged individual" (both genders most of the time) but most people get tat's that are way too close to everyone else -- no originality 90+% of the time. How can they say they want to look different when they end up looking like everyone else?

3). If the tattoos really are different then most of the time the person is looked at as being too weird and they're shocked by that. If you get your face tattooed and are surprised that people look at you differently you're in for a lot of other shocks in life.

I figure that you should either have the stones to be actually be an individual and at the same time have the brains to see people for who they are no matter what they look like, or you might as well just sit on the porch and bark at the parade of life as it passes you on by.

[McGizmo]

My "niece" told me that one of the boys in her high school would make the rounds to the girls, pull them aside and tell the that " I have your face tattooed on my butt". He would then proceed to drop his drawers and they would see the words: "Your Face" tattooed on his bottom.

A guy walked by me at the beach yesterday and I couldn't make out all of the words tattooed around his waist but on his back was something like "and your real friends will be there for you".

To each, his or her own....

I wonder if there are any spelling errors out there in the land of skin...

[gswitter]

I wonder if there are any spelling errors out there in the land of skin...

They show up occasionally on the FailBlog.

At least with misspellings, you can usually blame someone else. The ones that give me the biggest chuckle are the unfinished or aborted tattoos that look unexpectedly funny. In his youth, my cousin wanted a large eagle on his back. He had it started, but for some reason never finished it, and he walked around for twenty years with what looked like a plucked chicken.

[Benson]

I wonder if there are any spelling errors out there in the land of skin...

Of course. Googling tattoo spelling fail hit this right off, and I'm sure there are endless more...

Not sure about credibly blaming someone else for a misspelling - if I ever got a tattoo, I would insist on checking the text as stenciled/drawn before it was inked.

[StarHalo]

In the news:

An 18 year old girl in Belgium is claiming that during a visit to a tattoo parlor, she requested three stars be tattooed on her face - but then fell asleep not long after the procedure began and awoke much later to this:

[Monocrom]

In the news:

An 18 year old girl in Belgium is claiming that during a visit to a tattoo parlor, she requested three stars be tattooed on her face - but then fell asleep not long after the procedure began and awoke much later to this: ...

Maybe that's what she requested, and then realized what she had done.

[Scottiver]

In the news:

An 18 year old girl in Belgium is claiming that during a visit to a tattoo parlor, she requested three stars be tattooed on her face - but then fell asleep not long after the procedure began and awoke much later to this:

Really! she calmly slept while some guy engraved 50 stars in her face? She must not have a central nervous system.

[paxxus]

Poor insecure fool - obviously she requested the stars and then regretted. But I gotta admit, that tattoo actually marks her out as an unique individual, as in "look at me, I'm an idiot"

This sort of self mutilation should be illegal, without multiple written consents and a waiting period.

[Monocrom]

Poor insecure fool - obviously she requested the stars and then regretted.

This sort of self mutilation should be illegal, without multiple written consents and a waiting period.

No need for that. Folks quickly realize that other than working in a tattoo parlor or a cult, no one will hire someone with a big @$$ facial tattoo.

She probably came home, mom took one look at her, and the fireworks started flying!