Foxfury Breakthrough
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 42

Thread: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

  1. #1
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Will we ever see these again?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    ill take the first one!
    - JF

  3. #3
    * The Arctic Moderator * Sigman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    "The 49th State"
    Posts
    10,123

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Indeed a CLASSIC!!!
    -"Must control self"-
    ....

  4. #4
    nfetterly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati area, but lots of travel
    Posts
    2,396

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    My favorite, picked up on in March that had a P4 just installed in it. I did a search a few days ago and it looked like it was the only one sold in the last six months, the other two were withdrawn when they didn't get what they wanted for it (~$275 - $290). I picked up mine for $220.

    I got mine from Lumafist (I believe) - it is a real user with some of the Slate ano on the tail worn off. I plan on sending it to modomag for his exotic coating and getting it redone in "Audi A4 Grey/Silver" HAIII.


  5. #5
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    One reason I'm looking at the Arc6 is that I can't afford a ti McGizmo (even used) - I'd be in line for one but I have gotten the distinct sense that Don really loves titanium so I'm not sure how much interest he'd have in a wave of aluminum PDs...

    Still one with a high CRI emitter .... mmmm....

    I'll say this much - I think he could sell just about as many as he'd have any interest in making - I bet a wave of 50 would sell out very, very quickly.
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  6. #6
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Maybe someone should buy the design and the rights to produce it from him, and start cranking them out at $50 apiece.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    If you want an Aluminum PD, you can always pick up an Arc 6. Don helped design it. AFAIK, Don has no plans to make anymore Ti-PD or Al-PD lights due to the lack of availability of certain components. He has also moved on to other newer designs, like the Haiku and the Sundrop XR-U.
    Have a tritium vial to install? See my sales thread for Norland 61 optical adhesive.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gatsby View Post
    One reason I'm looking at the Arc6 is that I can't afford a ti McGizmo (even used) - ...
    Ti McGizmos are usually cheaper when bought new then used, with some exceptions.
    Have a tritium vial to install? See my sales thread for Norland 61 optical adhesive.

  9. #9
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    You can get anything made if you can place a big enough order. I'm sure it would be possible to sell 1000 of these at $50-100 apiece, with updated emitters and maybe an adjustable resistor on the voltage-control circuit.

  10. #10
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    At $100 a piece you could sell as many as you can make. But I doubt they could be made and sold for that price ... just a gut thought since I have no idea what machining costs are, etc... But something like the Bitz which was a custom production light was still north of $100 in al and $200 in titanium...

    And the Arc6 does look like the most viable option these days in the less than $300 category - and I have noticed that the ti McGizmos don't depreciate very much after the initial sale... (understatement...)

    I think Don mentioned on another thread something along the lines of him being able (having the luxury) to work on what he had an interest in, rather than what could sell.

    If there is enough demand then I suspect someone will fill in the niche in the market - but just about everyone seems titanium crazy these days ... and most of those lights just aren't in the budget.
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  11. #11
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    A large portion of the cost of the Arc6 is the driver board, which is far more complex than what has gone into any of the McGizmo lights. I have an Arc6, and it's nice to have that kind of flexibility, but it's not essential to its daily operation, or else McGizmos would not sell nearly as well as they do. Considering the Nitecore EX10 sells for ~$65, I'd say it's definitely doable to reproduce a similar light with a "dumb" (memoryless) two-mode driver board under $100, once economies of scale kick in.

    Assuming Don were willing to let his work be reproduced by another company, I'd even consider doing it myself if I weren't >$100,000 in debt on a house I can't sell.

  12. #12
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    It makes me wonder if someone like TNC custom could produce an updated version ... it would be more expensive than a Nitecore but better built - part of the appeal of the McLux lights (from what I understand - I've only personally handled a ti Lunsol 27 but have to presume much of the same quality is in the mix with a McLux PD) is their substantial build quality.

    I hear what you're saying regarding the EX10 and Peter's multi year odyssey developing the Arc6 driver and software - somewhere in between those two ought to be a point at which you could machine a light with a straightforward driver and the same level of substantial build quality. I may be leaning in that direction since I'd pay more than the cost of an EX10 to have that level of quality, I just can't swing the $500-$600-$700 price of entry for a ti McGizmo...
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  13. #13
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Don't tell Peter I said this, but the EX10 is both easier to hold onto and easier to operate than the Arc6, though the surface treatment isn't as hard; if I had substantial limits on my spending and I really wanted a PD light, I'd get the EX10, no contest.

  14. #14
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    I won't tell Peter! I had an EX10 and the UI drove me batty - it was a nice form factor no question and once I got the lube right the piston worked just fine (that contact ring is another story - that took some adjusting to get it right).

    My interest in a PD light is less for the piston per se (I'm pretty happy with my Novatac and Liteflux LF3XT) but for the extra level of build quality and modularity and the reliability of the design. I'm OK with complicated UI's as I was pretty happy with my Arc4+ back in the day until the switch got a mind of its own ... so the programming on the Arc6 is attractive and I do like a three mode light. I suppose the one issue with the PD design is you do have to get the springs right and it appears to be a delicate balance. The Lunasol 27 I handled was exquisitely built but you'd better have done your grip exercises as the piston required quite a lot of pressure to activate it on high...

    Oh well - it is an interesting discussion but likely only theoretical...
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Hi guys,

    I simply can't compete in the aluminum based flashlights anymore. The economies of scale are such that I would have to commit to and then assemble a whole bunch of these lights to be able to offer them at a reasonable market price. I am not willing to devote that much labor time at a minimum wage as would be required nor could I afford to. An aluminum PD would need to be made by some sort of factory at this point, to be viable. I had that perception back when I switched to the small numbers and niche of titanium a few years back. I also thought Arc would essentially carry the baton forward with the ARC 6. IMHO, the converter in the ARC 6 is overkill and Peter's desire to make the ARC6 smaller than the aluminum PD required additional expense in machining. The ARC6 is significantly more sophisticated than the PD and the value in this is up to the user to decide. Ironically the smaller light which is easier in the pocket is not so ergonomic when in hand; as commented on by fyrstormer.

    Back when Peter took on the PD platform to be integrated into the ARC 6, J.B. Sydney also expressed a desire to take on the aluminum PD itself. His plan was to go into a more conventional production mode with the light and I gave him the go ahead. Well that never came to pass.

    At this point in time, I think a three speed is justified by the flux available from the LED's and I think the design in my Haiku has more merit than the PD platform. Even in titanium, I left the two speed, two level afforded by the PD platform behind and went to the LunaSol concept with two speed/ two sources of light.

    It was before many of you were members but the final 50 or so aluminum PD's sat on my shelf for quite a while. I was eventually able to get them out by converting them from luxeon based to Seoul based lights.

    Even though the PD has been around for a number of years now and there is justification for more than two levels, I too believe it still has its place and merits. However I can only do so much as an individual and I have to be selective in what projects I take on. If I had a factory to make these lights, it would be a different story.
    Build Prices .... some mods and builds (not 4 sale) "Nature can be cruel- but we don't have to be."~ Temple Grandin

  16. #16
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Don - as always many thanks for your comments and insight, and quite frankly for all you've done to advance the cause in our flashaholic world!

    I've enjoyed and read with interest your comments on the various Arc6 threads - I haven't handled one and have been considering one for some time but admit that the ergonomics issue, at least in the absence of soft springs, is concerning despite my smaller hands. And Peter certainly travelled a good distance with that project at least in terms of miles travelled if not necessarily the distance from point A to point B - the propriety of that I leave to those much more knowledgeable than myself.

    And I have to admit that one aspect of the Arc6 I found appealing is three modes - which for my normal every day uses is much more practical... maybe I just need to keep saving for a Haiku!
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  17. #17
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Gatsby, despite what I said about the grip on the Arc6, I did manage to solve the problem to my satisfaction as shown in this thread: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...d.php?t=240960. It doesn't slip at all now.

    Regarding the soft springs, if you ask Don REALLY nice (and maybe pay him, too), he might send you a soft spring to put in you Arc6. It's a direct fit, needing only a little stretching if you think it's too soft.

  18. #18
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    I was hoping not to go back to Arc for personal reasons, but that seems to be the only way. Thanks

  19. #19
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    What, did he sleep with your girlfriend or something?









  20. #20
    Flashaholic* London Lad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Suffolk U.K.
    Posts
    1,754

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Quote Originally Posted by McGizmo View Post
    snip..

    At this point in time, I think a three speed is justified by the flux available from the LED's and I think the design in my Haiku has more merit than the PD platform. Even in titanium, I left the two speed, two level afforded by the PD platform behind and went to the LunaSol concept with two speed/ two sources of light.......snip
    Although the 3 speed set-up is technically an improvement over the PD eliminating the moving piston and flexing kilroy etc and probably being better sealed too, I still love something about the PD system.

    I think its like mechanical verses electronic watches, I just like the idea that all that piston stuff is going on in there!

    Maybe the PD is the new Rolex ? Oh no, that's another thread
    Last edited by London Lad; 10-03-2009 at 11:20 AM.


  21. #21
    *Flashaholic* carrot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    8,963

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    I would like a return of the PD, no matter what material. What I did not like about the Lunasols was that while they are awesome and very useful, there was no Mizer option, and that's a real deal killer for me. I do have a LS27 on my shelf and take it out from time to time (it's a great light) but non-Mizer keeps it from getting real pocket time
    [gearcarrot.com] Collector and distributor of (mis)information.
    The Guide to High-End Lights | Flashlight Story Collection updated Sept 28
    CPF Specials | 4sevens | LED Testing | EDCF | #cpf

  22. #22
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    The only thing I don't like about the 3 speed is the User Interface. Plenty of lights with the soft click to select level option. Theres only a hand ful with push and push harder

  23. #23
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    What is interesting is that should someone be willing to take up the torch Don is seemingly willing to let another maker, ideally one with a factory, make an aluminum PD, since Don has given others the go ahead (one who did not move forward).

    There does seem to be a fair amount of demand for two stage lights which, Arc6 virtual stages aside, is the PD forte, but with so many 3 stage options it does make me wonder if the day of the two stage is waning?

    I used to hound Peak about a two stage switch or light and basically they don't feel they can realistically compete with the Fenix, Nitecore, Litefluxes (and myriad others, Jetbeams, Eagletac, etc..) with digital drivers and low cost production. So they've focused on the LEO and super bright, super tough construction market.

    McGizmo lights have a niche but I do wonder if a two stage PD light were back on the market, even in aluminum and sold at roughly $150ish how many would sell... there would be a few folks who would like them but an awful lot of CPFers seem to have gone toward digital lights. I was convinced last week but I'm starting to question my initial thoughts.

    At $250, in a smaller but still interchangeable package, with a very advanced driver (perhaps too advanced), Arc6s don't seem to be flying off shelves... Maybe it is purely cost in that case but that is still roughly 50% of a ti McGizmo with the same lineage as the McLux PD ...
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  24. #24
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    My Arc6 is S/N 4610, so for a niche light it seems to be selling pretty well. I'd prefer a triple-kilroy switch instead of the virtual 3rd stage it has, but to be honest on all my multi stage lights I only ever use Low and High anyway.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Quote Originally Posted by fyrstormer View Post
    My Arc6 is S/N 4610, so for a niche light it seems to be selling pretty well. I'd prefer a triple-kilroy switch instead of the virtual 3rd stage it has, but to be honest on all my multi stage lights I only ever use Low and High anyway.

    I believe the Arc 6 serial numbers are randomly picked.
    Have a tritium vial to install? See my sales thread for Norland 61 optical adhesive.

  26. #26
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northern VA, USA
    Posts
    5,793

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Maybe they are randomly picked for shipping, but I doubt they're randomly picked for manufacturing.

  27. #27
    Flashaholic*
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    977

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    I'm not dogging the Arc6 - I've been going back and forth on buying one now for about two months ... I THINK it has about all I want in an EDC light ... I keep getting derailed by thoughts of a real high power flamethrower as well and there is budget for one...

    I do think the serial numbers for manufacture are not sequential, however, and are based on a random program Peter created ...

    How many have sold is somewhat irrelevant really - they are a sweet light with a lot of features. They just don't have much buzz around CPF - a fickle crowd at times (and yes I am one of them!).
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers.

  28. #28
    *Flashaholic* carrot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    8,963

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gatsby View Post
    What is interesting is that should someone be willing to take up the torch Don is seemingly willing to let another maker, ideally one with a factory, make an aluminum PD, since Don has given others the go ahead (one who did not move forward).

    There does seem to be a fair amount of demand for two stage lights which, Arc6 virtual stages aside, is the PD forte, but with so many 3 stage options it does make me wonder if the day of the two stage is waning?

    I used to hound Peak about a two stage switch or light and basically they don't feel they can realistically compete with the Fenix, Nitecore, Litefluxes (and myriad others, Jetbeams, Eagletac, etc..) with digital drivers and low cost production. So they've focused on the LEO and super bright, super tough construction market.

    McGizmo lights have a niche but I do wonder if a two stage PD light were back on the market, even in aluminum and sold at roughly $150ish how many would sell... there would be a few folks who would like them but an awful lot of CPFers seem to have gone toward digital lights. I was convinced last week but I'm starting to question my initial thoughts.

    At $250, in a smaller but still interchangeable package, with a very advanced driver (perhaps too advanced), Arc6s don't seem to be flying off shelves... Maybe it is purely cost in that case but that is still roughly 50% of a ti McGizmo with the same lineage as the McLux PD ...
    Not for me. The PD is the only light I carry. I'm still all about the 2-stage.
    [gearcarrot.com] Collector and distributor of (mis)information.
    The Guide to High-End Lights | Flashlight Story Collection updated Sept 28
    CPF Specials | 4sevens | LED Testing | EDCF | #cpf

  29. #29

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by McGizmo View Post
    Hi guys,

    I simply can't compete in the aluminum based flashlights anymore.
    Don, CPF member Arc_mania seems to do very well with small quantity runs of aluminum based lights, why do you feel you can't compete in the aluminum based flashlight arena? You have a proven and desirable product, in the McLux PD. I would think the aluminum McLux PD is worthy of an updated price point

  30. #30

    Default Re: Return of the McLuxPD in Aluminum?

    [QUOTE=TranquillityBase;3116040]


    Don, CPF member Arc_mania seems to do very well with small quantity runs of aluminum based lights, why do you feel you can't compete in the aluminum based flashlight arena? You have a proven and desirable product, in the McLux PD. I would think the aluminum McLux PD is worthy of an updated price point
    I have no real knowledge of anyone else's business or level of success. I do have a feel for what has worked for me, what quantities of components I need to purchase and the time required to assemble them into lights. I have to set priorities based on these understandings. There are also component considerations and availabilities that I don't consider appropriate to share publicly but have significant impact on what I can do.
    Build Prices .... some mods and builds (not 4 sale) "Nature can be cruel- but we don't have to be."~ Temple Grandin

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •