Self-cut Mag 1C SSR-50, 2x25500 with 10Amp tail cap switch, Fully Driven to 5-6A mod.

[ma_sha1]

This mod will may take me a while, I am dividing the mod into 3 sections:

Section 1. Mag cut down:
Silver mag 2C cut down to 1C size, Runs on 2x25500 Li-ion using ModaMag
McClicky Tail Switch. This will provide enough juice to drive SSR-50 to or over spec with long run time.

Section 2. Low cost 5-6A Driver build:
Not the twin shark driver that cost >$50, the goal is to make 5-6A driver for under $10

Section 3.
Add copper heat sink/Aluminum reflector, then finish up with beam shots to compare with Mag85 for throw.


Starting with Section 1. Mag cut down:

Mag 2C tube cut with a table saw, you can cut it with other type of saw, as aluminum cutting is fairly easy to do: Cut right above the switch hole:


The tube will go into the head only a little bit, need to go in all the way:

Top view, you can see that the tube is stopped by the threads,
I need to grind off the threads.


This is what I use to grind off the threads:


Now you can push the tube all the way in, 2 C li-ion will reach right under the switch hole. The tube will be JB welded with the head later when everything is done, for now, I just leave it here.


Both C li-ion are Dx 25500, one is protected, then other is not.
I am not sure if this is a good idea. I got 2 protected C li-ion but one is DOA, perhaps, running with one being protected is better than both non protected? Would like to know if anyone else have run 2 Li-ion with only one has protective circuit like this?

Size cmparasion, left to right:
Mag 2C, Mag 1.25D, Mag 1C size + tail switch w/2 C li-ion, Mag 1C stock switch w/1 C li-ion. You can see that this mod wil give you a host of Mag 1C in size but 2x mAh capacity & allow Buck driver to drive SST-50 to full spec. You can not drive SST-50 to spec (5-6A) with a single Li-ion. DX Li-ion states 5000MAh but is actually ~3000mAH, this will give you
about one hour run time Driving SST-50 at 6A or 1.2 hour if drive it at 5A.



To be continued...

[ma_sha1]

Reserved for Section 2. Building 5-6A buck driver...

Six 8.4V Buck Driver wired in parallel ( (Dx SKU 3256, 6x0.8A = ~5A.)

[ma_sha1]

Reserved for section 3. & beam shots

[bluecrow76]

Both C li-ion are Dx 25500, one is protected, then other is not.
I am not sure if this is a good idea. I got 2 protected C li-ion but one is DOA, perhaps, running with one being protected is better than both non protected? Would like to know if anyone else have run 2 Li-ion with only one has protective circuit like this?

You need a protection circuit on each battery. The circuit keeps the individual cell from discharging below or charging above specific voltage levels. If you run with one unprotected cell you run the risk of that cell getting out of tolerance and going .

[ma_sha1]

I am looking for a relative answer, Obviously, running 2 both protected is safest, but that's not the question here.
I was running 2 Un protected C Li-ions before,
wouldn't be replacing one with protected cell is still safer than running both unprotected?

Another way to ask the same question:

Given 3 batteries: 2 Un Protected & 1 Protected & Runs two in the light,

There's only two options:

Option A: Run 2 Unprotected
Option B: Run 1 Un protected + 1 Protected

Which option is safer? A or B?

[tx101]

Cool project


Cant wait to see how you build a low cost 5-6A buck driver


Hmmm ..... will the Modamag tail clicky handle 5-6A ?

[maxspeeds]

This is an awesome project! I can't wait to see the progress

[ma_sha1]

Cool project


Cant wait to see how you build a low cost 5-6A buck driver

Hmmm ..... will the Modamag tail clicky handle 5-6A ?

I am putting Six Dx Buck Driver in parallel
According to a post by Modoo, He has run McClicky to 6A.

[tx101]

Dude ..... looking at all those wires gives me a headache

Wouldnt wiring two DX P7/MCE buck boards (DX SKU 20330)
in parallel be easier ?

[ma_sha1]

Dude ..... looking at all those wires gives me a headache

Wouldnt wiring two DX P7/MCE buck boards (DX SKU 20330)
in parallel be easier ?

Dude, Give you a headache?

Imagine my headache after soldering all day to get 6 of them all connected together & hooked up & jammed into the tube, hook up my test SSR-50 & no light?

I can't imagine trouble shooting this mess.

I was thinking about 2xP7 driver in parallel, but didn't know any that works in parallel. I thought that not all driver work in parallel?

Do you know if the DX P7 Driver SKU 20330 works in parallel?

Thanks

[tx101]

I could be wrong but I dont see why not.
I'll order a couple and see if it does work

[darkzero]

WOW! You cut down a silver Mag2C! Those are pretty hard to find!

[zelda]

I made also a sst50 Mag "C", but with 3 sub-c SCHR Ni-Mh.
A build with dual shark buck works, but it was for this experiement too expensive.

After full charge, 3 - 5 min discharge with 5A and im getting 6.5A to 4.5A with 30min total runtime. When the pipe is getting warm, its pushes also a little bit the voltage from the batteries.

Of course after 10 -15 min you have to shutdown, because its getting too hot for the hand

Back to your driver,

maybe its possible to wire the pwm-pin parallel to the other drivers?

zelda

[ma_sha1]

WOW! You cut down a silver Mag2C! Those are pretty hard to find!

Well, that'll make the Silver 1C even harder to find

I made also a sst50 Mag "C", but with 3 sub-c SCHR Ni-Mh.

Back to your driver,

maybe its possible to wire the pwm-pin parallel to the other drivers?

zelda

Can you explain that? How would that work?

[zelda]

I'm thinking with the pin from the IC to the FET, who is the clock. One stock driver with a wire to the other 5 slave driver. Cut on the 5 slave drivers the connection "clock" between IC and feet and solder them from master to slave drivers to FET. I haven't tried this yet but it would a expensive expierement if it fails! An uncontrolled driver can probaly easly destroy the ssr-50! solder some older leds in parallel to test them first. An inductive device for test don't work on a switching-driver.

[darkzero]

I thought that not all driver work in parallel?

Most drivers will work fine in parallel, it's in series where most will not work. Wiring multimode drivers in parallel will usually have problems as the procesors tend to conflict with each other, not always but they can get out of sync very easily.

I agree with zelda, proper way to do it is to only use one processor to control all the drivers. However there may be limitations on the processor's output current being able to control a certain amount of fets.

An uncontrolled driver can probaly easly destroy the ssr-50!

Should be ok if all those drivers will deliver 6.5A max. I've shot 9-10 to an SST-50 without killing it, just turned it angry blue after a few seconds. I'm not saying 6.5A is safe for the SST-50, just saying that it may not likely fry the emitter for a quick burst (I'm not liable for any mishaps or spikes though).

[ma_sha1]

Thanks, I ordered two to test it out.

Dx reviews saying it only gives 2.3A to 2.5A, so should be 5A
max with two in parallel.

I'll test with my SSR-50, If it goes , consider it as I am taking one for the team, it won't be the first time I pooed SST/SSR

[Slickseth]

Impressive work considering that you're using hand tools.

If you want to save yourself the trouble (and time) of trying to shorten the body, I can cut and rethread a mag body for you for about $40. Not trying to advertise my services or anything, just thought your project might benefit from it. PM me if your interested.

[ma_sha1]

While waiting for the new drivers to come,
I decided to get off my lazy butt & build a real man's beefy switch to handle the
big current at ease.

I used Judico 10A Switch as seen in the photo, First saw on Plasmanan's
Mag 1D P7 Shorty, I bought a few but didn't really need it until now, it was a over kill for 3A applications such as P7/MCE etc. But its perfect for SST/SSR 50 & 90. You'll be surprised how beefy the switch is. It fits in Mag C tail cap with only slight grinding.



You just need to jam it in, hold it in place with a round disk (make one from any IC board material, press fit
in place either glue it shut or use a split ring washer) & connect one wire to the wall & the other to
a center spring:


I like it better as the Modamag tailswitch has a high guard, which make one handed operantion difficult, my thumb is too short. I even like the look of this DIY 10A switch better.

[Hill]

Ma sha1,

Very nice build. You beat me to the punch man...I'm doing pretty much the identical build in a 1C mag except I'm driving the ssr-50 direct drive. I only get ~3A max on full charger which comes out to about 800 lumens off one 26650 cell. That's good enough for me since driving to to 5A generates tons more heat with just a little more output.

I also used the judco 10A switch but accidently broke the leads while modding to fit into the tailswitch.

I'll post photos when done.

Thanks for sharing!

Hill

[Hill]

Ma Sha,

I was looking at the guts of your build and notices that with 6 boards, there's not much space left for a sizable heat sink down the tube. I finished my 1C sst-50 yesterday, and running DD from 1 x 26650 measuring 3.9v, I was getting up to 2.5 amps (~600 - 700 lumens) which, not surpisingly, generated a substantial amount of heat. A 4.2V IMR 26500 got me up to 3.5 amps. And just for fun, I tried 4 x C NiMh for just a second and got 7.5 amps!! (~1200 lumens, yikes!)

I have not run the light for more than a few minutes so don't know how long it will be before the light gets too hot to hold.

Do your 6 drivers allow you to throttle back? Keep us updated!

[ma_sha1]

The 6 boards are not working & too many soldering point to trouble shoot,
I went temp. insane there for a moment

I just got two P7 driver, so I am going to wire them up in parallel,
hopefully it'll work to pull 4-5A for me.

[Conte]

I am not sure if this is a good idea. I got 2 protected C li-ion but one is DOA, perhaps, running with one being protected is better than both non protected? Would like to know if anyone else have run 2 Li-ion with only one has protective circuit like this

I've done this quite extensively. Obviously, I won't recommend it for liability or safety reasons.

But, I made up some 2x18650 Li-Ion battery packs years ago for my hotwires. I'd use them in my Fultons which were jsut long enough.

When I made the packs, I was using brand new 2400mAh cells but only had single cell protection PCBs to work with. So I hooked the PCB up to the one cell. Obviously, if to much current was drawn from the pack or the pack ran out of juice and reached cut off, when it "protected" the one cell it would shut down the whole pack, effectively protecting all the cells.

I've had those packs about 4 years now, still kicking, have given me no problems.

Now, bear in mind the conditions. Brand new, debatably matched cells, which have been joined together in such a way that they are ALWAYs drained at the same time, at the same rate, charged at the same time, at the same rate, never abused, and have never really been asked for more then 1 amp of current their whole life.

Under those conditions you should be ok.

Am I correct in understanding you will be drawing 3 amps from these cells? Based on your 1 hour expected runtime.
If you are continuously running them down to cutoff, while using your light regularly, slowly causing them to loose their capacity, and bring out any uneven aging, you could be asking for trouble.

If it's just a shock and awe light, you occasionally bust out to impress your buddies while allowing you the ability to top them off as soon as your done, never expecting them to give you 100%. I'd feel safe. (I have an arsenal of unprotected cells I use under those conditions.)

But yeah, if this light is a "user" get those ducks in a row.

[ma_sha1]

Thanks, That's what I thought, one protection is better than no protection.

[Hill]

I just got two P7 driver, so I am going to wire them up in parallel,
hopefully it'll work to pull 4-5A for me.

Good idea. Much fewer soldering points and better chance of success.

Which P7 drivers did you go with?

[Moddoo]

to the folks in this thread building direct drive with IMR 26500 or 26650...

Be careful how you test these loads.

These cells are capable of driving the SST50 to a full 5+ amps.

the leads to your meter, and the meter itself can cause incorrect readings.

of course, there are possible resistance problems with any build.

I wanted to make sure that you know these cells are not a limitation when direct driving the sst50.

have fun modding!

[Moddoo]

repost

[ma_sha1]

Good idea. Much fewer soldering points and better chance of success.

Which P7 drivers did you go with?

The one suggested by TX101 on post #9 above.

[ma_sha1]

to the folks in this thread building direct drive with IMR 26500 or 26650...

Be careful how you test these loads.
These cells are capable of driving the SST50 to a full 5+ amps.
the leads to your meter, and the meter itself can cause incorrect readings.
of course, there are possible resistance problems with any build.
I wanted to make sure that you know these cells are not a limitation when direct driving the sst50.
have fun modding!

Moddoo,

I build & sold a SSR-50 (Extreme top bin) with IMR 26650 Direct Drive
here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...d.php?t=252555

It wasn't much brighter than P7 DD with non IMR Li-ion. I don't have a meter that could measure the current, but judging by the brightness,
I think it's 3-3.5Amp tops. That's why I am trying 2xLi-ion with 2xP7 Driver.

In a different test, I run IMR 26650 on a P7 (CSXOI bin) light, & the P7 looks brighter. So I think that SSR-50 vf. may be higher than Vf of P7 "I bin". Too bad that they don't group the SSR/SST by vf.

IMR Direct Drive will not reliably consistent in terms out put. If you get lucky & land a super low vf one, may be possible for 5A, but so far I've done 3-4 SST/SSR builds, on 3 separate order of LEDs, I haven't seen a low vf SST/SSR yet.

So far, I think the only sure way to get 5A for sure to use multiple batteries & buck regulate it.

[darkzero]

Moddoo,
I haven't seen a low vf SST/SSR yet.

What were the vfs you were getting?

So far, I think the only sure way to get 5A for sure to use multiple batteries & buck regulate it.

I did a KL6 SST-50 build where I was using a heavily modded Tri-FLuPIC. I exceeded the processor's capabilities & when the processor started to act funny the SST-50 would get 9.5A. Of course it tint shifted right away. This was with a IMR18650, the FLuPIC is not a boost driver so over 5A with a IMR is possible.