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Thread: Wicked Lasers 445nm <1W Spyder III Pro Arctic Series

  1. #91
    Flashaholic* Raccoon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Considering that I've been using green lasers to point out stars since 2003, and have bought several for our campus astronomy club, I vehemently despise any exaggerated report that demonizes personal laser use.

    Interestingly, nobody has ever bothered us, and I know at least a few students have nailed a plane now and then ("i think that's a satellite!").

    It would really suck if false reports about sizzling eyeballs would cause judges to start convicting good natured back-yard astronomers with felonious acts of terrorism.

    Seen the CSI episode from 2004/2005? The pilot's corneas were melted from a pointer! The public believes this shit!
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    Flashaholic* TorchBoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    There are some posts in this thread that are a bit worrisome, including talk of pointing lasers at planes not being dangerous. Yes, we can quibble over the details about how intense the light is when a plane is however far away, but careless use of lasers can have permanent consequences - in the case of this blue laser, even from diffuse light reflected from objects with no specular reflection. Also, there's an ad on CPF that points out that aiming a laser at a plane is a felony.
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
    Seen the CSI episode from 2004/2005? The pilot's corneas were melted from a pointer!

    Where can I get these gigawatt pointers?

  4. #94
    *Flashaholic* StarHalo's Avatar
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    Default Re: News Flash (for Newbies)

    Quote Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
    People are asking if this 1W blue laser will be good for pointing at stars. It is about as bright as a 333 mW green laser.
    And Wicked's cheapest 300mW green unit is $1,300; to edge that out for only $200 could be one of the greatest bang-for-the-buck deals of all time..

  5. #95
    Flashaholic* Juggernaut's Avatar
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    Arrow Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    I think most of those incidents happened during landing/takeoff. During that time they are manually flying the airplane and I think they turn off the light in the cockpit to see the landing strip better (at night).
    Anyway, I just think pointing lasers at aircraft is a really bad idea (even if the danger should turn out to be blown way out of proportion).

    Commercial airliners are not the only thing to worry about. Around were I live “it’s very rural, and there is a small airport near by”. Small planes are constantly flying around, none going much more then 2,000 feet up “I know I’ve been in them before”. At this height I could potentially strike them with some of my more high power flashlights, let alone lasers, I have to be very careful at night. Though to be fair, I don’t exactly think there is exactly a lot of laser collectors out here….
    Last edited by Juggernaut; 06-19-2010 at 10:53 AM.
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    Flashaholic* Juggernaut's Avatar
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    Arrow Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by was.lost.but.now.found View Post
    Wicked Lasers' website has been updated with new warnings and requirements for purchase. I wouldn't be surprised if they are worried about the fallout.




    Wicked Lasers Supplementary Class 4 Buyer Requirements
    • Customers of Class 4 lasers are required to digitally sign a Laser Hazard Acknowledgment form stating they understand the proper handling, use and risks associated with such products
    • Customers of Class 4 lasers are required to provide government-issued photo ID for age verification purposes
    • Customers of Class 4 lasers are required to completely read and electronically acknowledge nine disclaimer passages
    • Customers of Class 4 lasers are required to be shipped at least one pair of certified laser safety goggles that meets minimum O.D. required for safe operation
    What kind of ID card do they want? I was thinking about giving them my FID, I figure they would understand someone who can handle a firearm can hopefully handle a Laser.
    Last edited by Juggernaut; 06-20-2010 at 11:19 AM.
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    Flashaholic* Paul_in_Maryland's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    CNET columnist Chris Matyszczyk published a column today, damning this laser and the company that makes it: Working 'lightsaber' can set fire to your skin'.
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  8. #98
    Flashaholic* was.lost.but.now.found's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    That was my point, the weapons you mentioned aren't illegal in most US states, they're just usually subject to an additional tax stamp.

    That's about as accurate as saying any Joe Blow off the street can shoot fireworks in excess of 500G simply by paying extra taxes. If you actually do your research, you'd see that both examples require special permission from the ATF. This is pretty much what I said about needing permits. Permits nor licenses are automatically awarded. You apply for them and you may or may not get it. After an individual goes to the effort to be granted one, they're not likely to do something stupid to get it revoked, which cannot be said about the public at large.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    Switchblades aren't in my state. I can legally own a switchblade without any special tax or permit as long as I avoid the ridiculous interstate commerce restrictions. That makes sense because there's nothing about a switchblade that makes it any more dangerous than any other knife and they are ponderously slow compared to any fixed blade knife and a few folding knife designs.

    While I may have used a poor example as you are somewhat correct and I was mistaken that there are no complete bans on then, they are still heavily regulated as a whole with outright bans in many states. If they are such a poor choice for a weapon, than why were they historically a popular choice for street criminals?
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    Sure, and the laser can't burn through steel like a hot knife through butter. We may as well be scared of 5 gallon buckets. Do you have any idea how many children drown in buckets each year? 200m? Ha! Buckets are everywhere and anyone can buy them, even in huge quantities, with no government oversight at all. No permits required for filling them with water either.

    Wat does this have anything to do with my statement, which is confirmed directly from Wicked Lasers' technical specification on this device, that the laser can cause eye damage from 200 meters away?
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    These hyped up articles are playing to fears of this product being misused. If they would have left it alone it would have been a much smaller group of mostly enthusiasts who were even aware the product exists.

    If you read the news you can easily find daily occurrences of people misusing lasers and directing them at airplanes and helicopters.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    That is just an example of poor judgment on the journalists' part if they were really concerned about the public safety angle but what's worse is the hype is wildly inaccurate and they attribute things to the laser that it just can't do.

    Very interesting you say that since much of what the journalists in question were quoting was from this very thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    The other thing you said, about what right we risk losing, well that shows me you have a misunderstanding of how freedom works in the US. Our heritage of freedom flows from, among other things, our Constitution that acts as a white list on government powers. By default its our birthright as Americans to do what we please as long as it doesn't harm others unless for some exceptional reason legal restrictions have been put in place through specific due process. Yes, we do have a right to own powerful lasers and it would fall under not only this general principle but also the Tenth Amendment which reads,

    No disrespect, but I have actually studied Constitutional law as well as Supreme Court case law and it is you who are mistaken about "how freedom works in the US". Our "rights" are those and only those which are enumerated in the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and other Amendments. Your quote of the 10th Amendment, without getting into a history lesson, comes from two concepts: establishing the limited power of the federal government, and second, specifying in no uncertain terms that for something to be criminal it must be spelled out (this was obviosuly a problem with British rule which they were trying to correct). There is nothing which say states cannot nor should not create new laws when applicable to meet the evolving needs of society.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    The federal government hasn't been given any legitimate special powers to control access to lasers and wisely so.

    When did I ever say lasers should be controlled by the Federal Government?
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    An argument could be made that a given state or community could examine the issue and choose to restrict access to lasers. A total ban would go right out the window as soon as we're talking about a weapons grade laser which would be protected under the Second Amendment in the Bill of Rights.

    Ahh, so by that rationale weapons grade plutonium is covered under Second Amendment protection (I think not).
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    The military and law enforcement community have shown interest in lasers as weapons which according to supreme court case law strengthens the claim of lasers as protected arms and if this particular laser is actually as capable of blinding as the hype suggests than it would seem that it could indeed fall into the category of arms. Not exactly my top pick in personal armament but the more powerful and portable the laser gets the more likely possession is a protected right under our highest law.

    Sorry you are just flat out wrong. You can read literally dozens of US Supreme Court cases (which I actually have done) which clearly limit the power of the Second Amendment to personal firearms, here's one example:
    'We think that limitation is fairly supported by the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of "dangerous and unusual weapons." '

    Nowhere will you find the discussion of lasers because they quite simply are not protected by the 2nd Amendment. Arms = Firearms.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    It is your right under the First Amendment to loudly and publicly object to the availability of these lasers. While I disagree with your position I do believe it is important for you to exercise your right if for no other reason than all angles on any subject should be considered if we're going to have our society operate on any principle resembling reason. It's even your right to pursue a change in the law to prohibit the laser but it will have to be done in good faith through due process to be legitimate as the United States of America is a Republic and therefore our law is not subject to mob rule. That's also a good thing as it protects the little guys from the whims of the big guys.

    I completely agree with you; never did I assert that I thought these were illegal at the current time. Quite to the contrary, my concern is rooted in the fact that they are legal.

  9. #99
    Flashaholic* gorn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by was.lost.but.now.found View Post
    While I may have used a poor example as you are somewhat correct and I was mistaken that there are no complete bans on then, they are still heavily regulated as a whole with outright bans in many states. If they are such a poor choice for a weapon, than why were they historically a popular choice for street criminals?
    Switchblades have never been a popular choice for street criminals. Although some have used them. The anti switchblade laws came into effect as a result of idiot elected officials watching West Side Story and assuming that they were a common choice. Much like the freak out over martial arts weapons in the 70's when the Kung Fu movies were popular. I have never heard of a crime being committed by a shuriken wielding punk.

  10. #100
    Flashaholic* RyanA's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Is there a course that English majors take that teaches them why it's O.K. to cite out of context if its for the sake of sensationalism? It seems that most articles that I read now are just a jumbled pile of quotes from disparate sources arranged in such a way to insinuate some kind of sensational idea. Every where else this kind of thing is considered a non sequitur, but in journalism, it's brilliant!

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  11. #101

    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by RyanA View Post
    Is there a course that English majors take that teaches them why it's O.K. to cite out of context if its for the sake of sensationalism? It seems that most articles that I read now are just a jumbled pile of quotes from disparate sources arranged in such a way to insinuate some kind of sensational idea. Every where else this kind of thing is considered a non sequitur, but in journalism, it's brilliant!

    "Sum guy on teh interenetz sez dis will shoot down teh space station" "Therefore it must be true!" "The world must know!"
    Journalism is on a slippery slope headed for disaster. They will all soon be replaced by web-bots which can scan Google for quotes at much faster rates.

  12. #102

    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by was.lost.but.now.found View Post
    That's about as accurate as saying any Joe Blow off the street can shoot fireworks in excess of 500G simply by paying extra taxes. If you actually do your research, you'd see that both examples require special permission from the ATF. This is pretty much what I said about needing permits. Permits nor licenses are automatically awarded. You apply for them and you may or may not get it. After an individual goes to the effort to be granted one, they're not likely to do something stupid to get it revoked, which cannot be said about the public at large.
    Fireworks are not arms. Grenades, bombs, missiles and other such weapons are classified as destructive devices under NFA. State and perhaps even local rules in some jurisdictions may change the picture somewhat but the only significant difference between buying a conventional firearm through an FFL and buying an NFA weapon is the $200 tax stamp. Yes, a transfer in the NFA registry has to be recorded but that isn't a significant barrier to lawful purchase as compared to common firearms. Buying a non-NFA firearm through an FFL still requires a background check and in many areas there is a waiting period. The law was designed to harass and tax, not ban. Congress did not even feel it had the power to ban anything at the time. Even the Prohibition required an amendment to the Constitution.

    Your last sentence there is exactly why these laws are ineffective at preventing crime. Criminals don't buy NFA weapons. Criminals get their machineguns from the same people who smuggle in billions of dollars of illegal drugs, they make their own, steal them from military arsenals or similar. Criminals still have inexpensive access to machineguns, it's law abiding shooters who pay tens of thousands of dollars and a $200 tax stamp for a legal example. Similarly there have been laws against murder since the dawn of history yet this outright ban has never been successful in stopping murders. Criminals don't obey the law by definition.

    While I may have used a poor example as you are somewhat correct and I was mistaken that there are no complete bans on then, they are still heavily regulated as a whole with outright bans in many states. If they are such a poor choice for a weapon, than why were they historically a popular choice for street criminals?
    The only restrictions that affect switchblades "as a whole" are on the federal level and they deal with who can make, sell, transport and buy from who... through a wacky interpretation of the so-called commerce clause as so many other federal level laws attempt to use to find validity.

    Gorn got it right, they never were an especially popular weapon for street criminals. Just like the dreaded "assault weapons" the criminals who used them were far and away most commonly fictional characters on tv or in movies. We all heard the dire predictions of "blood in the streets!" when the AWB sunset more than half a decade ago and it simply never happened. Shall-issue concealed carry laws prompted similar cries of "blood in the streets" almost two decades prior, yet it never happened. Similarly my state's legislators recently clarified the legality of making and owning switchblades after a period of time when judges were trying to "legislate from the bench" by citing a law pertaining to so-called "ballistic knives." Despite the clarified legality of switchblades once again there has been no "blood in the streets!" I sincerely doubt we will now be faced with "melted retinas in the streets!"

    Historically speaking the switchblade style of lockwork was popular among common pocket knives, though not as common as slipjoint folders. There are examples of switchblades that are a couple hundred years old. As far as their suitability as weapons, criminal or otherwise, there is nothing especially deadly about them. The only difference between a switchblade and any other pocketknife is that the switchblade opens when you push a button or lever. While a neat gimmick there are currently many other gimmicks that can open a blade one handed as fast or faster that don't even rely on a spring to drive the blade. The balisong can do that as well and most balisongs have no springs at all. Slightly less well known is just about any pocketknife regardless of lockwork can be opened one handed as fast or faster than a switchblade via the inertia method.

    Wat does this have anything to do with my statement, which is confirmed directly from Wicked Lasers' technical specification on this device, that the laser can cause eye damage from 200 meters away?
    It seems you're trying to sell the idea that the laser is especially dangerous. A great multitude of mundane objects do far more real damage. Perhaps in your ideal world everybody would live in a padded rubber room and be fed applesauce through a crack in the door but it just doesn't make sense to freak out about lasers when there are so many other much more dangerous items that go completely unregulated.

    If you read the news you can easily find daily occurrences of people misusing lasers and directing them at airplanes and helicopters.
    I hear about it from time to time. I hear about vehicular manslaughter a lot more often. Are pilots more valuable than pedestrians?

    Very interesting you say that since much of what the journalists in question were quoting was from this very thread.
    As others have pointed out they tend to take things way out of context.

    No disrespect, but I have actually studied Constitutional law as well as Supreme Court case law and it is you who are mistaken about "how freedom works in the US". Our "rights" are those and only those which are enumerated in the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and other Amendments. Your quote of the 10th Amendment, without getting into a history lesson, comes from two concepts: establishing the limited power of the federal government, and second, specifying in no uncertain terms that for something to be criminal it must be spelled out (this was obviosuly a problem with British rule which they were trying to correct). There is nothing which say states cannot nor should not create new laws when applicable to meet the evolving needs of society.
    No disrespect intended either, I bear you no ill will and I don't think badly of you, but if that's the impression you got you had a poor teacher. That wouldn't be surprising though since many universities these days teach an agenda rather than the facts. We both agree that the Constitution places limitations on government power, that is an explicitly stated purpose within the Constitution itself. The rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights are super-extra-especially protected but they aren't the only 10 rights Americans have. The Ninth Amendment explicitly states that.

    The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
    You may have merely forgotten this, it may have slipped the mind of your teacher, but it seems to me that a constitutional scholar should at the very least be familiar with the Bill of Rights. I believe all Americans ought to be able to recite the Bill of Rights from memory but that's another story.

    Ahh, so by that rationale weapons grade plutonium is covered under Second Amendment protection (I think not).
    A gun owner using the nuclear strawman???


    Sorry you are just flat out wrong. You can read literally dozens of US Supreme Court cases (which I actually have done) which clearly limit the power of the Second Amendment to personal firearms, here's one example:
    'We think that limitation is fairly supported by the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of "dangerous and unusual weapons." '
    Define "dangerous and unusual." You also left out something very important, the preceding sentence.

    Miller said, as we have explained, that the sorts of weapons protected were those "in common use at the time."
    This is interesting because in relation to lasers we will eventually be entering an era when directed energy weapons are "in common use at the time." Miller does seem to acknowledge that technology marches on as the chief objection in that case was that the weapon in question had a short barrel, not that it fired metallic cartridge ammunition. Miller is simultaneously ridiculous because there is no "common use" clause in the Second Amendment.

    Nowhere will you find the discussion of lasers because they quite simply are not protected by the 2nd Amendment. Arms = Firearms.
    Oh boy. I defy you to demonstrate that only firearms are arms. That goes against the entire etymology of the word "arms."

  13. #103
    Flashaholic Shiftlock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by GreyShark View Post
    Oh boy. I defy you to demonstrate that only firearms are arms. That goes against the entire etymology of the word "arms."
    arm
    –noun
    1. Usually, arms. weapons, esp. firearms.

    It's usually used when referring to firearms, but not exclusively so, and exactly what the framers meant when they used the term "arms" is a topic that has been debated for ages, and probably always will be. The same goes for the terms "people,” and “militia” as they're applied in the 2nd amendment. There's no easy answer. It's possible that they left these terms purposely vague in order so that they may be applied in ways they knew they couldn't yet imagine.

  14. #104
    Flashaholic Per-Sev's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Its only a hot beam of light that will burn you if you get it to close to your skin now you are comparing it to guns and switchblades whats next RPG's.
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  15. #105
    Flashaholic* Stillphoto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Ooh, here's one that does long distance damage...Plenty of good articles on it, chose this to show the scale. ABL
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  16. #106

    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiftlock View Post
    arm
    –noun
    1. Usually, arms. weapons, esp. firearms.

    It's usually used when referring to firearms, but not exclusively so, and exactly what the framers meant when they used the term "arms" is a topic that has been debated for ages, and probably always will be. The same goes for the terms "people,” and “militia” as they're applied in the 2nd amendment. There's no easy answer. It's possible that they left these terms purposely vague in order so that they may be applied in ways they knew they couldn't yet imagine.
    Among other non-firearm weapons polearms were still in use at the close of the 18th century and were in fact used by American forces during the revolution. I really don't see how anyone could argue that "arms" applies only to firearms.

    "Militia" isn't really so vaguely defined. Like many others, my state's constitution explicitly defines who and what the militia are and it isn't the National Guard or any other force under federal control. In fact since the National Guard was federalized and is frequently deployed overseas nowadays quite a few states have created state defense forces that are not under federal control. There are people who wish that weren't so because they'd like to advance the idea that the Second Amendment does not grant an individual right but that matter has been laid to rest by the Supreme Court of the United States. The debate over the definition of "militia" is old news. Nowadays we're hashing out what "infringed' means.

    Quote Originally Posted by Per-Sev View Post
    Its only a hot beam of light that will burn you if you get it to close to your skin now you are comparing it to guns and switchblades whats next RPG's.


    It does sound ridiculous if you put it that way. I think we all recognize this laser can be potentially dangerous but isn't really anywhere near the same league as an RPG or even a switchblade. The point we're discussing, at least my point, is whether or not the right to possess a laser powerful enough to be dangerous could be protected under existing law, specifically the Second Amendment.

    Another aspect of the discussion is whether or not public availability will prove to be a serious public safety issue. My point of view is people can't be hurt by what doesn't exist. Lasers do and will continue to exist so the potential is there for someone to be injured. Taken on the whole though I don't see how a laser ban would be any more effective than a murder or assault ban, things we already have. Even though the individual cases of injuries are/will be regrettable I don't believe there is a large enough or valid enough threat to warrant an extreme response to lasers. Five gallon buckets and swimming pools have done far more real damage than lasers ever have and I suspect that will remain the case even with the advent of this one watt blue laser. As is the case for buckets and swimming pools the dangers are outweighed by the utilitarian and recreational uses of lasers. At some point you just have to trust that everybody isn't out to get you.

  17. #107
    Flashaholic* TorchBoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by Per-Sev View Post
    whats next RPG's.
    Hey, you leave my role playing games alone!

    And lay off the guns, huh guys? If you have a burning need to discuss second amendments take it to the Underground.
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  18. #108

    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    We're discussing the legal status of lasers in the US.

  19. #109
    Flashaholic* Juggernaut's Avatar
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    Christo Pull Hair Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by ejot View Post
    Showed one of my colleagues this morning and he immediately ordered two.

    I *think* I just ordered one but no email confirmation. Tried calling them to check on the order and, after 45min on hold, finally got to talk to someone who was able to tell me....




    wait for it ....


    " We're swamped. Our system is down. Can't tell you anything. Sorry. "
    Did this ever get resolved? I just ordered one too, and I didn’t get a E-mail confirmation either? They also didn’t ask me for that digital signature, or age ID thing either, but everything else worked. Did you have to re-order? Or what?

    [Oh, wait, the E-mail just came through, however it says it’s just a confirmation, and that Wicked Lasers has not officially accepted my order yet? Do I have to wait for another one of those E-mails too?]
    Last edited by Juggernaut; 06-20-2010 at 10:53 AM.
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  20. #110
    Flashaholic ejot's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    I received both order confirmation and payment confirmation emails later that night. They came at the same time. How did you pay?

    Starting to think: Best case, it's a long time before anyone sees these. Worst case.........
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  21. #111
    Flashaholic* 65535's Avatar
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    Default Re: News Flash (for Newbies)

    Quote Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
    Power over Distance - a primer on "burning things at miles away".

    Now read this.

    You cannot burn objects at miles away, or even hundreds of meters away, with any hand-held laser module; including any laser pointer from Wicked Lasers.

    Here's why.

    Specifications:

    Beam Diameter: 1.5mm @ aperture
    Beam Divergence: <1.5mRad

    These are pretty typical values for any hand held laser module or pointer. Some may claim as low as 1.2 or 0.9 mRad, but this is typically a lie.

    mRad? you ask.

    Your beam starts off as 1.5 millimeters "thick" (diameter) when it exits the business end. However, as soon as you start walking even a short distance away from the laser, your target will notice that the beam gets much much wider and subsequently much less powerful. If you're the one holding the laser, you really can't tell the beam (dot) is growing in size.

    After each meter, your beam at 1.5 mRad will expand another 1.5 mm in diameter. So after 1 meter distance, your beam is now 3mm thick... after 2 meters, 4.5mm thick... after 100 meters, 151.5mm thick (that is 1/2 foot)... after 200 meters it will become a full 12 inches. Airplanes fly at a cruising altitude of 30,000 ft, or about 9000 meters. By the time your beam reaches an airplane, it is 44 feet or 13.5 meters in diameter.

    Naturally, the strength of the beam is much weaker when it's spread out over such a great area.

    After 1 meter beam density is only 1/2 as powerful. after 2 meters the beam density is 1/3 as powerful... after 99 meters it's 1/100th as powerful... after 9000 meters, it's 1/9001th as powerful.

    1 Watt of energy over 1.5 mm might burn the skin at a close distance, but after 100 meters that same 1.5 mm area is only as strong as a 10 mW laser. After 1000 meters, it's barely 1 mW, and after 9000 it's about 1/10th as powerful as a dollar store laser.

    The only thing you're going to burn from 100 meters away is your popularity.

    BTW. compared to the visibility of a 532nm green laser for a Dark Adapt eye, a 445nm blue laser is almost exactly 1/3 apparent brightness.

    People are asking if this 1W blue laser will be good for pointing at stars. It is about as bright as a 333 mW green laser.
    I believe those numbers may be a bit off, using your figure of .1515mØ at 100m is a beam divergence of .0859rad (85.94mRad).

    By my calculations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beam_divergence) at 100m the beam gains .0026mØ, so the beam should be .0041mØ or 4.1mm.

    I feel that's correct, though I would like someone to double check my work. It seems unlikely that at 100m the beam would be 150mm.


    My calculations are in error, I was using degrees and not radians, always check your calculators mode people.
    Last edited by 65535; 06-21-2010 at 05:25 PM.
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    Default Re: News Flash (for Newbies)

    Quote Originally Posted by 65535 View Post
    I believe those numbers may be a bit off, using your figure of .1515mØ at 100m is a beam divergence of .0859rad (85.94mRad).

    By my calculations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beam_divergence) at 100m the beam gains .0026mØ, so the beam should be .0041mØ or 4.1mm.

    I feel that's correct, though I would like someone to double check my work. It seems unlikely that at 100m the beam would be 150mm.
    Are you saying that the beam will be 4.1mm at 100m distance? No way. It seems A LOT more likely to me that it would be 150mm. This is easy enough to check with any laser. From the perspective of the person operating the laser, the beam looks like it's very tiny, but that's because you're 100m away. Have someone else operate the laser, and look at the beam size from that distance. I bet you'll find it's close to 150mm.

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    Default Re: News Flash (for Newbies)

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiftlock View Post
    It seems A LOT more likely to me that it would be 150mm.
    So at the range of just over a football field, the spot is half a foot across? You sure?

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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by 65535 View Post
    I believe those numbers may be a bit off, using your figure of .1515mØ at 100m is a beam divergence of .0859rad (85.94mRad).

    By my calculations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beam_divergence) at 100m the beam gains .0026mØ, so the beam should be .0041mØ or 4.1mm.

    I feel that's correct, though I would like someone to double check my work. It seems unlikely that at 100m the beam would be 150mm.
    They post this information: Beam diameters at distances.

    "Obviously beam diameter is just the diameter of a laser beam, measured in millimeters. Beam divergence measures how much the laser beam expands per meter. For example, a laser with a beam divergence of 1.0mRad will have a beam that expands 1.0mm per meter."

    Using the beam divergence from wikipedia, I get:


    Laser Beam Divergence = 2 arctan ( (D(f) - D(i)) / 2 L)
    D(i) = Diameter at aperture, 1.5mm.
    D(f) = final diameter, x mm.
    L = distance between initial and final, assume 50 cm.
    Beam Divergence is given, assume 1.5 mRad

    1.5 mRad = 2* arctan((Xmm-1.5mm)/2L)
    1.5 mRad = 2*arctan((Xmm-1.5mm)/1m)
    .0015 Radians = 2*arctan((X-.0015)/1)
    According to Wolfram Alpha (My calculator's 180 miles away)
    x=3/2000+tan(3/4000) = .00225m or 2.25 mm at 50cm
    That's almost what they state, with "1 milliradian of divergence equals one millimeter per meter of expansion."

    So at 100 meters, it would be 1.5 mm + 100m*(1.5 mRad * 1 mm per millirad*meter) = 1.5+100*1.5 mm = 151.5 mm. Your answer is wrong, and maybe you made the same mistake I did. Let's try:

    200 miles in meters is 321868.8. The beam would be, assuming no atmospheric disturbances, 1.5mm + 321868.8*1.5 mm in diameter, or482804.7mm = 1584 feet. I forget what I calculated earlier for a diameter, I'll edit this once I go check.

    Edit: I was pretty close with my answer, where I treated it as a diverging angle. I'm not sure where your math went wrong. I converted milliradiants to degrees, halved that angle and did the cosine (200 miles times cosine of the angle) to get the radius, and then that's the beam size.
    Last edited by AnAppleSnail; 06-20-2010 at 10:20 PM.
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Hm, that seems pretty broad.. I wonder if Nova's model will be able to do their usual <1.0mm beam/<1.2mm mRad..

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    Default Re: News Flash (for Newbies)

    Quote Originally Posted by StarHalo View Post
    So at the range of just over a football field, the spot is half a foot across? You sure?
    Yes, that sounds about right, even though it doesn't look it from the perspective of the person holding the laser. Try it for yourself, then come back and tell us what you've found. That goes for anyone reading this. Pace off the distance, lock your laser on, walk back, and measure the dot. I think you'll be surprised. What you thought was a small dot, I think you'll find is actually many inches across. Similarly, when you shine your laser at the side of a building a mile away, what you think is a small dot is actually many feet across. I've seen this by looking at the dot through a telescope.

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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Quote Originally Posted by AnAppleSnail View Post
    So at 100 meters, it would be 1.5 mm + 100m*(1.5 mRad * 1 mm per millirad*meter) = 1.5+100*1.5 mm = 151.5 mm. Your answer is wrong, and maybe you made the same mistake I did.
    All the math is correct. The reason you're getting 151.5mm instead of 150.0mm is the original 1.5mm diameter of the beam leaving the aperture.
    The expansion due to divergence is 150.0mm, and add the original diameter gives you 151.5mm. Simple "off by one" error.

    Quote Originally Posted by StarHalo View Post
    So at the range of just over a football field, the spot is half a foot across? You sure?
    Few people think of lasers as anything but 1 dimensional rays of light, so the public believes they retain their strength even over several miles.
    Which is all the more reason why we need to discredit pilot reports of "laser beams dancing around the cockpit".

    Lets not blow up the moon, either. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8iKRTGNUts#t=2m25s (big bang theory episode)
    Last edited by Raccoon; 06-21-2010 at 02:05 AM.
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    Reading through the last couple of days' contributions, I was about to close this, following a series of posts that dragged the thread way off topic with spurious discussion of switchblades, firearms etc.

    However, with the last few posts it now seems to be about back on track. If it fails to remain there, it will be closed.
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  29. #119
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    Default Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    That's what I get for leaving my calculator in degrees. Though that does seem like a pretty poor divergence, very disappointing in terms of laser power, but in terms of having these things in the public hand, a very good "safety net" so to speak.

    I now concur with the 151.5mm at 100m.

    Pretty disappointing IMO, but much much much much safer.
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    Arrow Re: Wicked Lasers 445nm 1W(!) portable deathray

    To be fair 1.5 mRad isn’t that big in fact from what I’ve seen most lasers are all about the same via what I’ve seen on Wicked lasers and Nova web sites. Think even the low powered 5mw Core is 1.2 mRad. From use I’ve never seen the beam open up like most people are thinking. Sure it happens but compared to things like flashlights beams, well laser’s beams are well….like lasers!
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