Just saw these: Powerizer Lithium 2900 mAh Battery

Has anyone else seen these:

Powerizer Lithium 2900 mAh Battery.

Lithium Iron, 1.5 volts, a little over $2 ea, plus shipping.

On Onlybatteries.com

http://www.onlybatteries.com/showitem.asp?ItemID=16529.101&cat1=51&uid=1660&sid=mailer

Frankly, I can't see any reason to use these over the proven Energizer Lithium e2 L91 batteries, at that price.

I can have a 4 pack of Energizer L92 sent to my house for $9.49, including shipping, making them actually CHEAPER than buying these 'Powerizers' Lithium cells.

But if one company is making them, will there be more and more lithium AA batteries on the market, finally driving down prices, and ending Energizer's monopoly on AA lithium primary cells?

I certainly hope so.

goldenlight said:

Has anyone else seen these:

Powerizer Lithium 2900 mAh Battery.

Lithium Iron, 1.5 volts, a little over $2 ea, plus shipping.

On Onlybatteries.com

http://www.onlybatteries.com/showitem.asp?ItemID=16529.101&cat1=51&uid=1660&sid=mailer

Frankly, I can't see any reason to use these over the proven Energizer Lithium e2 L91 batteries, at that price.

I can have a 4 pack of Energizer L92 sent to my house for $9.49, including shipping, making them actually CHEAPER than buying these 'Powerizers' Lithium cells.

But if one company is making them, will there be more and more lithium AA batteries on the market, finally driving down prices, and ending Energizer's monopoly on AA lithium primary cells?

I certainly hope so.

Click to expand...

Rarely do I say this about any battery, but in this case I feel that I must speak out.

Firstly, these are not legal to sell in North America. Like it or not, Energizer has a lock on the lithium-FeS2 market over here as a result of their patents on this technology.

Secondly, I know for a fact that these "Powerizer Lithium Iron" cells are known to occasionally explode and/or catch on fire during discharge. I have personally witnessed these cell catch on fire during a normal continuous current discharge, and I have seen the aftermath of several of these cells after they failed with extensive heat and flame.

These are extremely poorly made cells. Do not buy them. If you are thinking that you might want to give them a try, think again. They ain't worth it. Period. End of story. Dangerous. Stay away. The way is shut. None may pass.

Cheers,
BG

Battery Guy said:

Rarely do I say this about any battery, but in this case I feel that I must speak out.

Firstly, these are not legal to sell in North America. Like it or not, Energizer has a lock on the lithium-FeS2 market over here as a result of their patents on this technology.

Secondly, I know for a fact that these "Powerizer Lithium Iron" cells are known to occasionally explode and/or catch on fire during discharge. I have personally witnessed these cell catch on fire during a normal continuous current discharge, and I have seen the aftermath of several of these cells after they failed with extensive heat and flame.

These are extremely poorly made cells. Do not buy them. If you are thinking that you might want to give them a try, think again. They ain't worth it. Period. End of story. Dangerous. Stay away. The way is shut. None may pass.

Cheers,
BG

Click to expand...

Well, I wasn't planning to buy any of them. I was mostly curious about them, and I did do a search, and found no mention of them. Perhaps going back a month was not long enough, though.

If I happen to see one, say, sitting on a park bench, I'm heading the OTHER way, and FAST!

It's hard to argue with first hand accounts of mayhem and destruction!

I was hoping this was marking the end of the Energizer patent, and NOT patent infringement, which I loathe.

Look at how the Chinese are producing white LED's by the millions....despite the international patents. And, flashlights containing them are being sold in every WalMart in the USA. But I digress....

Thanks for the warning, though. I'd be really PISSED if my house burned down because of illegal (and VERY unsafe) batteries!

When i saw This Blurb in the advertisement, it was all i needed to know:


Saves you hundreds of dollars compared to AA Alkaline batteries








BTW, to Battery Guy --

Thank you for your contributions here.
I always appreciate yer' knowledge and technical expertise.

:goodjob::thanks:
_

The Energizer E2 L91 were 12 for $19.98 (or $19.88 online) at Sam's Club Saturday.
http://www.samsclub.com/sams/shop/product.jsp?productId=prod1500218&navAction=

To be frank, I don't know why you guys pay the same price for Energizer Lithium's as you can pay for a 4 pack of Eneloops. Drives me nuts!

3000mA vs 2000mA (and you can recharge up to 1500 times).

Sure there are some applications where the energizer Lithium may be a good choice (ie emergency kit etc) but in 99% of cases, its just a plane waste of money, and hurts the environment...

jasonck08 said:

To be frank, I don't know why you guys pay the same price for Energizer Lithium's as you can pay for a 4 pack of Eneloops. Drives me nuts!

3000mA vs 2000mA (and you can recharge up to 1500 times).

Sure there are some applications where the energizer Lithium may be a good choice (ie emergency kit etc) but in 99% of cases, its just a plane waste of money, and hurts the environment...

Click to expand...

Here are a few things that the Energizer e2 has over the eneloop:

1.) Essentially zero self-discharge for more than 10 years.
2.) Outstanding capacity retention at very high temperature.
3.) Excellent low temperature performance.
4.) Nearly 1.7X energy (4.4 Wh compared to 2.5 Wh).

So the Energizer e2 lithium is still the best choice for emergency kits, flashlights and other devices kept in the car and garage. It is also a good choice for devices that it is inconvenient to change the batteries in. They are also lightweight, which is a bonus for handheld devices that take a large number of cells.

All that being said, the eneloop has substantially closed the gap on this technology. I buy far fewer Energizer lithiums than I did a few years ago, having switched most of my AA devices to eneloops now.

Cheers!
BG

Battery Guy said:

Rarely do I say this about any battery, but in this case I feel that I must speak out.

Firstly, these are not legal to sell in North America. Like it or not, Energizer has a lock on the lithium-FeS2 market over here as a result of their patents on this technology.

Secondly, I know for a fact that these "Powerizer Lithium Iron" cells are known to occasionally explode and/or catch on fire during discharge. I have personally witnessed these cell catch on fire during a normal continuous current discharge, and I have seen the aftermath of several of these cells after they failed with extensive heat and flame.

These are extremely poorly made cells. Do not buy them. If you are thinking that you might want to give them a try, think again. They ain't worth it. Period. End of story. Dangerous. Stay away. The way is shut. None may pass.

Cheers,
BG

Click to expand...

This addresses a few questions that arose for me recently when browsing the Only Batteries site. I was surprised to see multiple "off-brand" lithium-FeS2 primary AA & AAA cells, given what I've read about the patent situation.

My initial assumption was that these were being sold in spite of the patent, and very likely had notably poorer performance and safety characteristics.

I note that Battery Junction also sells a non-Energizer AAA cell, marketed as a high-drain capable direct replacement for the e92.

Given the world-wide audience on CPF, what brands of AA and AAA Lithium-FeS2 cells, other than Energizer, are recognized as being of excellent quality? Conversely, what brands are known to be poor performers, or otherwise suspect? The assumption here is that the Energizer patent is not enforced everywhere.

I'm also curious about the patent, but I'll do some searching before posing any specific questions. I've seen that it's been contested, but I'm not sure of the current status.


- Syncytial.


P.S. - I use lithium primaries in specific applications where they are warranted, mostly in long term standby/emergency systems and when operating at temperature extremes (e.g. -40 C).

syncytial said:

Given the world-wide audience here, what brands of AA and AAA Lithium-FeS2 cells, other than Energizer, are recognized as being of excellent quality? Conversely, what brands are known to be poor performers, or otherwise suspect? The assumption here is that the Energizer patent is not enforced everywhere.

Click to expand...

My understanding is that Energizer has a patent space tied up in North America. In Europe, you can purchase Energizer, Philips and Duracell AA lithium-FeS2 cells. I have tested the Duracell AA lithium-FeS2 and they perform very well. They have a bit better power than the Energizer, but a bit less total energy. Results can be seen in my AA Ragone Plot thread here. I have yet to get my hands on a Philips lithium-FeS2.

Those are the only brands with this chemistry that I would trust.

Cheers,
BG

Also:
5.) Faster-charging camera flash.
6.) More hours of use from your lasting digital camera, because of the higher voltage.
7.) Brighter output from many flashlights, regulated or not.

Battery Guy said:

Here are a few things that the Energizer e2 has over the eneloop:

1.) Essentially zero self-discharge for more than 10 years.
2.) Outstanding capacity retention at very high temperature.
3.) Excellent low temperature performance.
4.) Nearly 1.7X energy (4.4 Wh compared to 2.5 Wh).

Click to expand...

Battery Guy said:

My understanding is that Energizer has a patent space tied up in North America. In Europe, you can purchase Energizer, Philips and Duracell AA lithium-FeS2 cells. I have tested the Duracell AA lithium-FeS2 and they perform very well. They have a bit better power than the Energizer, but a bit less total energy. Results can be seen in my AA Ragone Plot thread here. I have yet to get my hands on a Philips lithium-FeS2.

Those are the only brands with this chemistry that I would trust.

Cheers,
BG

Click to expand...

To the best of my knowledge, Duracell and Philips use the same source for the Li-FeS2 cells they sell in Europe.

syncytial said:

P.S. - I use lithium primaries in specific applications where they are warranted, mostly in long term standby/emergency systems and when operating at temperature extremes (e.g. -40 C).

Click to expand...

Same here.

Lithium primaries are pretty much the only option for outdoor usage when winter arrives in the northern parts of the continents.

A search for "Battery" + "FeS2" yeilded the following:

http://www.copquest.com/27-3115.htm
http://www.fortebattery.com/sdp/456404/4/pl-2518810/0-1263260.html
http://www.himfr.com/d-p11282964544399500-1_5v_Li_Fes2_Lithium_Battery_AA_And_AAA_5_Times_Than/
http://www.diytrade.com/china/4/pro...A_Battery_2900mAh_Ultra_Capacity_L91_FR6.html
http://www.fuzing.com/vli/001916616...AA-size-FR6|FR03-Li_FeS2-Lithium-Battery-1.5V

This will be an interesting thread to watch.

Paul_in_Maryland said:

5.) Faster-charging camera flash.

Click to expand...

Nikon says the opposite. Nikon SB-800 manual, page 19, says to expect for full power flash:


Lithium, 5 AA cells, recycle 7.5 seconds, 190 flashes.

Alkaline, 5 AA cells, recycle 5 seconds, 130 flashes.

2000 mah NiMh, 5 AA cells, recycle 2.9 seconds, 150 flashes.

Lithium internal resistance is high, or at least, a few times higher than NiMh.