Ferei W150

[globalmark]

Hi

I was just reading your Modd on the Ferei W150 torch from Last year -
i want also to Modd one of these with a New XT-E Royal Blue (+ new driver which I had Advice on Already a 3xAMC7135 seems Best Bet) - However I Did not receive my torch yet and wanted to Know about the Bulb/Module
Does it take a Drop-In module ? or are the driver/Led connected to the torch ?
I want to make a Drop-In for the Torch so I want to Buy a new Empty Reflector Drop-in Kit from Deal extreme like this :-
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/26-5mm-...t-emitter-5955

But I have no Idea the Size of the One in the Torch Now - Could you please let me know the Size of the Reflector/Module/drop-in so I can order the Correct Kit.

Thanks Mark

[arek98]

Hi Mark (Hector, sorry for stepping in)

It does not take drop-in. It has its own heatsink insert with driver, reed switch and LED mounted to it.
See my post here and below is couple additional pictures of tube and heatsink.

As you see there is not a lot of space inside.
Also driver needs to be turned on/off by reed.
Driver is 17mm in diameter. One in disassembled picture is not from this light.

You wrote that you thinking about 3 AMC chips. This is about 1A output which is what original driver does. Original driver also does not have an inductor which means it is linear as AMC.

I would keep original driver and replace just LED with blue one (royal blue for bioluminescence?). Original LED board is about 16mm but you can go up to 18mm (diameter or aluminum heatsink).

Click on picture for bigger version.


Original heatsink with driver, read switch (on side inside black shrink tube). XR-E LED, o-ring acts as insulation and






Other heatsink inside, not much space here. Driver in picture is different used just as contact board.



Tube where whole above assembly goes.





BTW, Ferei is a VERY well build (body I mean, hard to tell about electronics).

Arek

[globalmark]

Hi Arek

Wow thanks for Great Info and all the details - Sounds like I can just Put the royal Blue straight in the head is is same 1amp - and sounds like you are doing same thing as me - I am a Diving Instructor and want to Play around with a Fluorescence - Corals - and from What I have read everywhere that most people use a Royal Blue 455nm Wavelength torch (nightsea and glowdive, etc) and this new Cree LED is the correct Wave-lenght - so Thought i would give it a Try and see how it go's .
the Guy on the GLOWDIVE site obviously used this Flashlight with a different Bulb so looked like a Good starting point.
http://reefphoto.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=95_19&produ cts_id=5379

Have you seen anywhere that sells spare light heads - as would love to keep one white light and have a Spare head I can MOD and keep as a Blue One (or would that not be possible as hard to remove light Bulb/head ) ??

Any other info or useful advice you have on this topic would also be helpful
I will post my Modd when i get all the bits

Thanks Mark

[arek98]

Yes, get 10mm round or square board from Cutter and it should be just simple board replacement. Only thing is that because of thru hole in top of the heatsink small board will have less contact. Unfortunaltelly they don't have 16mm board. Filing sides of 20mm star may be an option too (need to be careful not to short contacts to the board). Given 3.45 USD price it may be worth a try.

Light is easy to disassemble. Heatsink just sits in the tube (with little thermal compound). After unscrewing head you can push it from other side and it goes out. You could have second one and replace them as needed. Unfortunatelly I don't think you can buy separate parts.

I see the light itself sells for about $80-$90 on-line now. I guess I was lucky when I bough it when it showed up first. I paid 90 USD for two.

I believe you will need yelow filter to see bioluminescence with blue LED.

Good luck with you project.

[arek98]

Wow, $275 for this UV Glow Dive comparing to about $80 for white LED Ferei. I wonder what they did with original light.

On one hand it would look like simple board swap with UV LED. Ledengin LZ1 would work, even one sold on star, about 30USD retail, not that much power as Nichia but easier to install in this light and would fit a reflector, 400nm can go to 1A according to spec. 365nm has 700mA peak but I believe if cooled properly it could do 1A.

On the other hand problem with UV is that it has high Vf (about 3.9-4.1V) and linear driver with one Li-Ion will not be very good match. It will regulate only on very top of battery charge and only when load is relatively low (on high load battery voltage will sag and go below LED Vf much sooner, for some "ebay batteries" 1A may be already high load). This is assuming you will not get very high Vf LED, then it will not regulate at all. This is why I replaced driver in GD500 in my light (it is boost-buck regulator).

If they worked with Ferei to get host only and redesigned driver for UV LED and one Li-Ion (basically using boost-buck is needed) then nice. Price is still little high, but well, this is a niche product and volumes are low). However if they just swapped emitter then this is not a good light IMO.

[globalmark]

Hi arek98

Sorry i am a Bit of a Novice so I did not understand all you said But got the Gist of it - I just got the Lamp of Ebay (chargerstore) for $45us - I tried to get a Buy it now or make a Offer on other ones of there Ferei W150 but they would not go that Low. So had to wait until Auction finished But they had 5 and keep re-listing and no one else Bit so got that price (and now with Australian Dollar great only $39 aus dollars .

I have ordered 3 of these :- https://illuminationsupply.com/cree-...0dd08f3f2ed92a

I tried to Order stuff from Cutter but he wanted $16 postage for 1hr away when i know Local post Charges only $1.20 so I ordered from the USA and he only charges $3.65 shipping

I have already Ordered a Large Sheet of yellow Barrier Filter 12"X9" from Nightsea for $65 and a Couple of Blue Excitation Filters 2-3/4" round at $50 each - as I also want to try this underwater Photography and you can use the Excition (blue) filters on your Strobes and yellow on your Lens - I bought a Large sheet of yellow as cheapest way and will cut out a Couple of Camera lens filters and mask Covers - is a Acrylic material so easy to cut with a Fret saw or similar (Blue Excitation Filters are Glass)

The UV glow light - I know Nightsea did not use cree led but thought i would give it a Try with this new XT-E it's the right wavelength 455nm so fingers crossed and much cheaper .

Whats a Liner Driver ? compared to other drivers ??
What size is Original Board - you say can File 20mm down ? as I have ordered the LED on 10mm Boards at the moment
Not sure I understand the Last couple of bits in Last post sorry

Thanks For Help Mark

p.s Spare Light Head - I have just emailed Ferei and let you know what they say , Charger store said they would sell me one for $28 (bit to much as torch only cost $45) - but after i get torch I will ask Local engineering company How much to Make ( as only a need solid Alu and drill a Couple Holes and Thread at Bottom probably can Skip as can be soldered on for Cheaper .. Don't think Necessary to have tabs on the top so easier to make ..
Also sure a Few people on this site with Lathes can Machine a Few for a Price..

[arek98]

Original board is a hair bigger than 16mm. Heatsink diameter (on this end it has little lip) is little more than 18mm. So, filing 20mm star may work.

On the other hand if you already ordered 10mm round boards you may try to find some cooper sheet 0.5-1mm thick and insert it between board and heatsink. Just an idea to improve heat transfer.


Linear driver works kind as a resistor. It will keep given current on output and any excess voltage will be dropped on the driver. Let say you have 1A LED current, you have 4V input (fresh Li-Ion under load) and LED with 3.5V Vf at that current (1A). It means that driver needs to “loose” somewhere 0.5V and it will do that and will dissipate corresponding power (0.5W in that case 0.5V*1A).

Because of how it works it is good only when input voltage is little bigger than output voltage. Otherwise power that needs to be dissipated is too high. Even if driver cooling is adequate, efficiency goes down.

With linear driver when input voltage goes below required output voltage, driver will usually go into direct drive, meaning that it will dissipate nothing (minus some always present loses) and all input voltage will go to LED. It means that after it happens driver efficiency is almost 100%. Of course it no longer supplies required current. Current is lower and correlates to voltage applied to LED.

Other types of drivers are switching ones, where inductor acts as energy reservoir and allows voltage conversion. They may be configured as buck (lower output voltage than input), boost (higher output V than input, or boost-buck (output voltage may be higher or lower than input). Boost-buck are not that common since they are usually more complex and expensive (often they require two inductors that are probably most expensive part of a driver and also the biggest one which is a big factor as well).
Efficiency of switching drivers can be very high, some go above 95% but low quality driver can be really bad (like 50%).

In Ferei case I think they went with linear because of size. Inductor needed for that driver would not fit it heatsink they use. But then I don’t see a problem with designing this light pretty much the same but with heatsink that would accommodate switching driver.

If you are ever looking for LED driver and would not mind spending more than few $ for eBay stuff, than IMO George at TaskLed makes best drivers available, check them out.

[globalmark]

Thanks for the Info Mate
I Had a Reply from Ferei but they said I have to contact the dealer here in Australia- and maybe they can sell me one from a Broken returned torch or something (there english was not great so hard to understand completely) - I will Let you know what they tell me about replacement heads.
Cheers Mark

[arek98]

When you asking them about heads make sure that you will get heatsink assembly (at least aluminum part and brass part that screws on it). Best would be whole piece with working driver. This is not a part of head, so they may send you a head itself and you still won't have needed piece.

This is all you need if you need replacable "light engines". It goes inside a tube and head (with reflector mounted in it) screws on.
You can send them this picture and tell that this is what you need.

[globalmark]

Hi akrek98

Cheers for that - i did try and explain and actually did send them the link from this picture on last post (hope you don't mind) - but not sure what it was called so Thanks again
Mark

[Doc Ed]

Bringing back this thread because I've got a renewed interest in this light. My current primary light is a modified bicycle light, and I was thinking of converting this "proper" dive light into a sturdier version that what I'm currently using.

As mentioned previously, the construction of the light itself is rather good. Here's a side-by-side with my current back-up, a Trustfire TR-J1:



The battery tube and switch assembly of the light can be easily removed from the head. At the tail cap are some square cut threads, and both ends are protected by double O-rings.



The "light engine" as mentioned by Arek98 seems to feature 3 7135 chips (not too sure on this though), giving about almost 1A of current at the tailcap (single 18650 around 4.01v only though)





The magnetic switch can be disconnected from the rest of the battery tube. This is what I intend to do when I convert the head to an XML for can-light purposes:





The head itself is pretty robust. There are several O rings on the front part alone: In front of the lens, behind the lens, around the edge of the reflector, the base of the bezel, and even around the base of the emitter.



Considering its diameter, I think the lens is more than adequate to do its job



So here's my question now: I purchased some proper Agro cable glands courtesy of 350xfire, and some proper cable as well. Likewise ordered a latching hallswitch made by Taskled. I was thinking of enlarging the space in the "light engine" and slipping in the switch over there so the original magnet can still actuate the light. Also got some 8x7135 drivers to drive the XML I have to almost 3A. Considering the dimensions of all of the above, and with the caveat that this light will definitely be only for underwater use, do I have to worry about overheating the components with these specs?

[arek98]

Ed, you will easily cool one XM-L underwater.
Instead of 8 AMC drivers and hallswitch I would try to fit LFlex inside. It is 19.8mm diameter but without batteries and needed contact you can play with heatsink and probably make it fit.
With LFlex you can use reed switch to control it (original one or molded version for extra ruggedness), it may be tricky with rotating ring but probably doable (and only programming is hard, you could use external magnet for it if needed). With LFlex you get levels control, thermal protection and battery protection.

Remember that for one XM-L and either AMC or LFlex you should use only one Li-Ion as power source (of course you can connect couple cells in parallel).

[Doc Ed]

Thanks for the reassurance re the cooling I figured if it was only used in water, that it would pretty much survive. My current pack is all in parallel, so voltage is 4.2v. Considering that the driver and switch are already en route from 350, I'll try doing that mod first. I'm actually only after one mode, or at most 2 to conserve power, and the KD driver I got can be programmed to do Hi and Med via current modulation and not PWM, so there won't be any problems when taking video.

[Doc Ed]

Finally finished my mods to the W150. After getting the parts from Hector, I managed to cobble together the W150 into a compact light head. I had to modify the pill to accept the taskled hall toggle switch, but with some creative wiring, I was able to fit the KD 3A driver (programmed for 2 hi-med), the switch and an XML star. The original magnet still actuates the switch.



The head is bigger and more robust than my previous ferei build:



(I had plans to make a handle from some bits of aluminum, but ended up doing the lazy thing and cut up an old chopping board I had)

While I was modding the head, I decided to update my battery pack. I purchased some proper 18650 battery holders, as well as a digital LED voltmeter and the small USB CC/CV linear charger:



At least now I'm able to remove the individual cells of the pack. The voltmeter is activated by a reed switch, so it isn't constantly on, but bringing a magnet close to it allows you to see the charge state of the pack. (here it is charging)



The use of a clear canister (an idea from 350xfire) allows the charge state to be seen anytime even during a dive (as well as check for leaks ). This is with my old OMS canister. Though discontinued, I believe new ones are available from 350.

[wquiles]

That charging "window" is totally cool!

[350xfire]

Yeah, that is awesome!

[Doc Ed]

That charging "window" is totally cool!

Yeah, its great that I can see the state of charge of the light... or at least my buddies can, and then tell me what it is



One quirk I've encountered with this set-up however is when I switch to medium mode - done by flicking the switch several times quickly to toggle the modes. On medium, sometimes the hall switch subsequently fails to react to the magnet, thus necessitating me to slightly unscrew the canister to switch off the light. If I just stay on "high" mode, there seems to be no issue with the switch. Any ideas? Personally, I'm quite content with just "high", but it bugs me that one mode has a quirk I can't figure out.

[lucca brassi]

maybe is 3,9 V little low for hall switch , what say datasheet?

[Doc Ed]

Spec sheet say its good from 3V to 25V. Actually, voltage sag is less in medium mode than in high mode, so its probably not that.

[350xfire]

Bigger magnet??

[Doc Ed]

I've got a big magnet inside my canister as well (as back-up, and to actuate the reed of the LED). Tried moving the head near that. No effect. Its seems that on medium mode, the switch doesn't want to unlatch.

Here in this video, you can see what happens. Voltage starts out at 3.9 and sags to around 3.76 on high. Cycled twice on high - no problem. Was able to do one mode toggle to medium, but subsequently, the light refused to toggle off from medium (3.88v).

[Tryger]

I'm owner of a Ferei W150 as backup diving torch, and it don't works.

The two wires of the magnetic switch are desoldered, has anybody info about where to solder it again??



Any help will be appreciated!!

[DIWdiver]

It doesn't look like they are unsoldered, it looks like they broke from being bent back and forth for some reason. There should be the remains of the wires still in the solder at the points where they originally attached, and you should be able to see them. A stranded wire broken at a solder point is a very distinct and unmistakable pattern. Usually.

[Tryger]

It doesn't look like they are unsoldered, it looks like they broke from being bent back and forth for some reason. There should be the remains of the wires still in the solder at the points where they originally attached, and you should be able to see them. A stranded wire broken at a solder point is a very distinct and unmistakable pattern. Usually.

Thanks DIWdiver I have very little experience in electronics and can't see where the wires were attached. I have taken two macro pics with the SubSee lens, maybe can help.

[DIWdiver]

Well, one point is clear as day, on the right hand side of the small black component just to the right of the two "K" shaped symbols in the upper picture. I can even make out strands of wire left there.

The other point though, eludes me. It could be the very uppermost feature in the first picture, or the mess between the two diode ("K") symbols, or maybe something else.

Perhaps some other kindly F150 owner will post a pic.

[Tryger]

Then the first point is this?

[lucca brassi]

some fast diode between supply and capacitor

[Tryger]

some fast diode between supply and capacitor

Is that for upgrading the driver?

[lucca brassi]

probably not . I have just looked this combination PIC12F629& AMC 71350 and it is similar to yours . Picture is not so good to made some conclusions.

[DIWdiver]

Then the first point is this?

Yes.