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Thread: What should we do with this forum?

  1. #31

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Leave it open! You never know what positive could happen!

  2. #32

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by boss429 View Post
    Leave it open! You never know what positive could happen!
    I vote to leave it open too. Something positive could happen as stated above. Also, it will be a place for people to post that they do or do not receive orders and how long it took. That way maybe we can see if Rob is tending to get orders out sooner or if things remain unchanged.

    After reading quite a bit about Lummi yesterday I decided to email him and ask what he had in stock right now. I stated that I didn't want to order if there was no stock because I didn't want to wait many months as others had. He replied back very quickly that he would have available Friday (tomorrow): Wee in NS/SS/Ti and Raw in NS/SS/Ti without locators. Problem is, I wonder if this is true? Doesn't he still have folks waiting for these very lights? If orders are not caught up, why would he sell one to me before shipping lights owed to others??? So sad because they are quite beautiful lights.

  3. #33

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by thebeans View Post
    I vote to leave it open too. Something positive could happen as stated above. Also, it will be a place for people to post that they do or do not receive orders and how long it took. That way maybe we can see if Rob is tending to get orders out sooner or if things remain unchanged.

    After reading quite a bit about Lummi yesterday I decided to email him and ask what he had in stock right now. I stated that I didn't want to order if there was no stock because I didn't want to wait many months as others had. He replied back very quickly that he would have available Friday (tomorrow): Wee in NS/SS/Ti and Raw in NS/SS/Ti without locators. Problem is, I wonder if this is true? Doesn't he still have folks waiting for these very lights? If orders are not caught up, why would he sell one to me before shipping lights owed to others??? So sad because they are quite beautiful lights.
    IMHO-It may be easier to get a Paypal payment/address/label/ship from a new order than to go back through numerous disgruntled order's emails and hunt up their info.

  4. #34
    Flashaholic* Nyctophiliac's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Yeah, after careful consideration, I think we should leave this forum open. For all of the reasons stated either for a source of information on the lights and the supply and demand (!), or a place to inform others of tales of woe or joy, as they happen.

    It would be a shame for all these threads to sink without trace.

    And I hold out some hope that the only English bespoke torch manufacturer may yet confound his critics and leave all his customers ultimately satisfied!

  5. #35
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Leave it open if for no other reason that to give those of us with outstanding orders a place to commiserate with each other!

  6. #36
    Flashaholic* Nyctophiliac's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ways View Post
    Leave it open if for no other reason that to give those of us with outstanding orders a place to commiserate with each other!
    You should put what you are owed in the outstanding order thread.

  7. #37
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    With regards to Rob, don't ban him. Here's why . . .

    Although Rob is the entire operation at Lummi, and he's done an excellent job of pissing away his good name and reputation. In case he develops a conscience and finally decides to do the right thing by his customers who gave him their trust, loyalty, and hard-earned money; he should have that one last opportunity.

    Also, if Rob cares to respond to many of his former customers or the claims against him; he should be able to do so. If he continues to come up with one sad excuse after another instead of some real answers, then his status could be re-considered.

    I do think it would be best to close this sub-forum to any new topics and archive many of the older ones.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  8. #38
    *Flashaholic* nbp's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    I have no horse in this race other than being disgusted by Rob's business practices and treatment of customers and members. That said, I have some thoughts.*

    As Rob still has business with members, I don't think he should be banned. He may yet come to his senses.*

    However, by his own admission and his actions he shows he doesn't want to be a part if this community anymore, and therefore should not have his own subforum. I realize though that there is useful discussion and information here, so that stuff should still be available to members.*

    What I would propose is that the one "Still Waiting" thread would be moved to the Custom B/S/T forum and stickied like the Arc Mania thread. All discussion of those waiting for orders could be done there. *Other stickied warnings/complaints threads could be linked for reference but closed for discussion with the exception of the Jeers thread in the MP where members can go for all venting and fuming, leaving the CPF thread solely for business.*

    All other Lummi threads of value could simply be moved into the LED Lights forum like the Arc threads were for research/discussion purposes.*

    Once empty the Lummi forum could be deleted.*

    That's my idea. Whether the admin likes it or any part of it is up to them I suppose.*

  9. #39

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    The ARC forum was closed after Peter was no longer part of the
    ARC management team. I have mixed feelings about that as we
    made all of the mechanical parts for most of his lights. He made
    some mistakes that cost him dearly. Rob might have gotten himself
    into a situation that may have limited his ability to acquire parts or
    electronics. This can be a tough business in a bad economic time
    with the rise of the China cheepies. Rob should have communicated
    his problems to his customers before it got out of hand. We have
    also had problems delivering specials due to the revamping of the
    entire pocket line to use the QTC variable output 'pill'. Our web site
    is three years out of date, and that is a concern, but our distributor
    handles current inventory.

    I hope that what I have just written is not out of line with the rules
    of CPF. But things can happen beyond our control, and that is one
    example of what could happen. There may be others, but Rob may
    have been embarrassed to tell. I do not know Rob, but I do know
    Peter and some of the background of what happened that others do
    not.

    Rob may have let frustrations get the best of him, that can happen
    to anyone, especially if they are fundamentally honest to begin with.

    Curt
    I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me a PEAK flashlight, or give me the dark.

  10. #40
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Problems arise. That's obvious. It's how you handle those problems that really counts. Rob handled them in a very poor manner. (To put it mildly.) It's the things he did have control over that's the issue. For example, having several lights ready to go. Rather than deliver them to his customers who had already paid for them, he decided to sell them off to others in order to make more money. He had control over that.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  11. #41

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Apart from the money, he has been ignoring emails from many of us as well as releasing new products and reply other threads while he was ignoring the ones with complaints about him. Furthermore, at first he replied us but only to tell us lies. In my opinion, a person who has been doing this doesn't deserve to get what he wants (he wants to close the forum).

  12. #42

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    I think the forum should be left open. I bet Rob comes here alot to read only, maybe some of this will sink into his skull.
    Last edited by DM51; 08-06-2011 at 08:40 AM.

  13. #43
    *Flashaholic* LuxLuthor's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Greta, whatever you want to do will work out however it does....people move on after seeing the train wrecks.

    Consider one thing though, similar to the AWR debacle (and other scenarios), this section/topics is a growing cesspool magnet. You designed the Jeers/Hall of Shame to intentionally contain situations exactly like this.

    It seems that this section and series of threads/posts is having a polluting effect on the noble and genteel environment of CPF proper.

    LOL! It reminds me of Ghostbusters-II with Vigo's ever-growing rivers of psychoactive ectoplasm invading our CPF city; fueled by, and engulfing the tumultuous emotions of otherwise tranquil members.

  14. #44

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Just wanted to chime in here ... I absolutely think it was the correct decision to leave this forum open with a huge warning on the top.

    I've been reading up on Rob's behaviour and extremely poor business practices.

    CPF and this forum has done what Rob does not want it to do - allow the consumer to access honest and factual information about Rob and Lummi in order to regulate their buying practice.

    If Rob got his way he would be able to operate much lower under the radar and allow him to continue to take other people's money.

    After all, it's not CPF that has ultimately torpedoed Rob's "reputation" but Rob (Lummi) himself.

  15. #45
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    A timely bump from a fellow CPFer.

    Just yesterday, over on EDCF, I was thanked by a new member who found Rob's site and was very excited at what he saw. I warned him about what he could expect if he dealt with Rob. He thanked me for helping him not get screwed over. Especially this close to Christmas.

    One less notch on Rob's belt.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  16. #46

    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by Monocrom View Post
    A timely bump from a fellow CPFer.
    Just yesterday, over on EDCF, I was thanked by a new member who found Rob's site and was very excited at what he saw. I warned him about what he could expect if he dealt with Rob. He thanked me for helping him not get screwed over. Especially this close to Christmas. One less notch on Rob's belt.
    as much as I like my Raws and the work Rob has done in the past, sad to say but you did the right thing warning the uninformed about a disappointment waiting to happen. I only say this because if an order was placed in November as an example, it probably would not have arrived by Dec 25.
    all this being said Rob has made some wonderful lights I use and admire daily. I hope he gets back on track asap. this thread should IMHO remain open.

  17. #47
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    It should be left open, some of us are still waiting on our lights

  18. #48
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    An e-mail to the address below might help. It will at least make you feel better.Devon Trading Standards:customer@devon.gov.uk
    Still waiting for my Lummi order made in October 2009. Last 3 messages to Lummi still unanswered. I think my money has gone. Buyer beware.iPhone 4. iStiki.Mount.

  19. #49
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by chrsb View Post
    It should be left open, some of us are still waiting on our lights
    I don't mean to sound harsh. But honestly at this point, if you're one of Rob's older customers . . . You're not going to receive anything from him except the two-finger salute, UK equivalent, of the middle finger.

    On a different forum, I have heard rumors that brand new customers have gotten lights. Though those claims are being made by new members as well. So, it's likely another con job. Friends of Rob making accounts, pretending to be satisfied customers. Even if the stories are true, once again, it's clear that Rob worships at the alter of the All Mighty . . . The All Mighty Buck. He's made it clear that's all he cares about. He still refuses to do right by his old customers. And, once again, it seems he's selling the lights that they paid for to his new customers.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  20. #50
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Sadly, true.Still, if Trading Standards and PayPal get enough complaints, they might act.I make sure I post my experiences wherever I can. I helps shoppers decide on what to buy.There is always the option of court. It costs £30, but if you win you get expenses. Whatever, the 'accused' has to travel, and Devon is quite a distance from civilization.
    Still waiting for my Lummi order made in October 2009. Last 3 messages to Lummi still unanswered. I think my money has gone. Buyer beware.iPhone 4. iStiki.Mount.

  21. #51
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    deleted
    Last edited by 127.0.0.1; 02-08-2012 at 08:04 AM. Reason: :(

  22. #52
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    I haven't done any business with Rob but I would like to throw in my $.02 worth because it is mainly because of this forum and other threads on CPF/CPFM that I didn't order from Rob.

    I think Rob's designs are beautiful and on more than one occassion I have heard their siren song calling to me. So I return here to see if things have improved. Reading here about the experience of others who gambled with Rob and are now stuck probably forever in limbo waiting for their lights is what has repeatedly reminded me to not get involved with him.

    I think this forum serves a useful ongoing purpose. Whether it should be located here or somewhere else I don't know, but it's important for the information to be available. Hopefully it doesn't degenerate into a moderation nightmare. I can understand people being passionate about losing their money, I certainly would be. I am grateful there is a place where the information can be shared and that people are sharing their experiences. I'm convinced you saved me a lot of grief.

    I continue to hope Rob will turn around his business practices as I think he could have been an asset to the flashlight community, but he has been so bad for so long I doubt it will ever happen. Very sad.

  23. #53
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by rumack View Post
    I continue to hope Rob will turn around his business practices as I think he could have been an asset to the flashlight community, but he has been so bad for so long I doubt it will ever happen. Very sad.
    Just a quick update:

    Rob is still cheating customers. Recent victim was a member on EDCF who had inquired about Rob, his designs, and business practices. While he was warned, he decided that Rob's lights were tempting enough to take the risk of being cheated. (In all honesty, it's not a risk. It's a guaranteed sure thing. Like playing Russian Roulette with a round in every single chamber, pulling the trigger, and hoping for a misfire when the hammer lands on a live round.)

    Ironically, a couple of individuals had posted on EDCF that Rob had indeed delivered lights to them. Their stories sounded fishy as Hell. I'm not saying they're friends of Rob out shilling for him. I am saying they posted they were new customers who had received the items they purchased from Rob. However, the individual who posted the inquiry topic and chose to take a chance; well, he's also a new customer. And, Rob definitely cheated him out of his money as well.

    If Rob ever decides to become an honest, respectable, businessman again; it doesn't look like it'll be happening any time soon.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  24. #54
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Honestly the vibe I get from Rob is that he honestly believes he'll make things right for everyone once he gets his business profitable. The problem is that he doesn't have any business-management skill. The couple times I ordered lights from him, I had to remind him what I had ordered and when I had ordered it. He comes up with good designs, but he barely knows how to deliver and has no idea how to run a profitable business, and the most damning thing of all is he's deluded himself into thinking it's okay to screw people over as long as his intentions are good.

    One of the last lessons teenagers learn, perhaps *the* lesson that separates teenagers from adults, is realizing that intentions don't matter once you've acted. Once you do whatever it is you've decided to do, if it goes badly, your intentions only affect the severity of your punishment, nothing more. Rob clearly has not learned that lesson yet.

  25. #55
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    I have no charitable feelings towards Rob. I believed the sad stories to start with. Perhaps they were true, but he has been seduced by the idea of money for nothing. His lifestyle on FaceBook must be expensive. I say 'believed'. I was cleverly conned into feeling sorry for him.If he's never suffered the consequences of his actions, he's going to have a rude awakening before too long. What he does amounts to fraud. Some of the buyers here have been waiting years. He has no intention of fulfilling their orders. He continues to dupe new customers. These aren't the actions of a hapless businessman. He knows exactly what he's doing. Anyone who thinks Rob is going to 'make things right' when his business becomes profitable should remember that he's kept the money discussed here for years. He must make a tidy sum from not providing what he's paid for. If he'd stopped taking orders, maybe. If he'd declared himself bankrupt, maybe. He's morally bankrupt, that's for sure. No, I have no charitable feelings towards Rob at all.
    Still waiting for my Lummi order made in October 2009. Last 3 messages to Lummi still unanswered. I think my money has gone. Buyer beware.iPhone 4. iStiki.Mount.

  26. #56
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    I'd be more inclined to believe he's a genuine con-man if he hadn't ever bothered to sell real products in the first place. It seems unlikely he'd go through all the trouble to build up a following for several years just to waste his reputation like this. I think he got himself in over his head and he's too proud to go out of business like a sensible businessman would.

  27. #57
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by fyrstormer View Post
    I'd be more inclined to believe he's a genuine con-man if he hadn't ever bothered to sell real products in the first place. It seems unlikely he'd go through all the trouble to build up a following for several years just to waste his reputation like this. I think he got himself in over his head and he's too proud to go out of business like a sensible businessman would.
    Normally, I'd agree. But this sort of thing seems to happen quite often. Individual builds up a reputation on CPF. Things are fine at first. Then all of a sudden, there are delays. The delays get longer, and the excuses start. After awhile, no one gets what they ordered. Their money gets kept. Rob is simply one individual on a short list of former, respected, modders / builders on CPF who have decided it's far easier just to keep the money they've gotten. No one is born a con-man. Some decide to sell out their good name for a very cheap price.

    If Rob was at least very slowly delivering on orders, it would be a different story. But, he's not.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  28. #58
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    The last correspondence I received from Lummi was not what I'd expect from someone full of remorse.
    Let's face it. He has £100 of my money. Multiply that a few times and it's a tidy sum.
    My advice to anyone thinking of buying an Orb, Raw, Wee or iSticki from Lummi is don't.
    Still waiting for my Lummi order made in October 2009. Last 3 messages to Lummi still unanswered. I think my money has gone. Buyer beware.iPhone 4. iStiki.Mount.

  29. #59
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrAT View Post
    The last correspondence I received from Lummi was not what I'd expect from someone full of remorse.
    Let's face it. He has £100 of my money. Multiply that a few times and it's a tidy sum.
    My advice to anyone thinking of buying an Orb, Raw, Wee or iSticki from Lummi is don't.
    You're in a bit of a better position than some members who placed orders with Rob. Since you're both in the UK, you should have more legal options available to you. Not sure, but I'm assuming the UK has a Small Claims Court for civil suits in which individuals can represent themselves; just as in America. Filing a criminal complaint with the police would help as well. If you send anyone money in exchange for an item which they didn't deliver, that's theft in any country or region.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  30. #60
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    Default Re: What should we do with this forum?

    [Trolling post deleted - DM51]
    Last edited by DM51; 03-20-2012 at 04:51 AM.
    "The Flogging Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!"

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