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Thread: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

  1. #1

    Default Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Playing in the shop yesterday. Sales have been really slow so I've had some time to work on fun stuff. Does this get anyone more excited?









    Any feedback? More detail? Different shapes? This requires two different operations AFTER the CNC process. Turning the radial grooves on the lathe and then milling the axial grooves on the mill. Point being, adding more detail is more time (and more cost). If you are liking the head better, what do you think I should do on the body? Does it work as-is? Right now the axial grooves (along the length of the head) are made with a 1/4" ball mill. I was thinking if I used a 3/8" ball mill they would match the size and depth of the body grooves. Would that be cool?

    Alternatively, what WOULD get you interested in one of my lights OR what is preventing you from buying one? Consider this a customer survey. I want to build lights you guys want to buy, not just push whatever I make. So, please let me know what I can do to deliver a light that you want to buy. Only thing is I'd like to stick with the 1x18650 platform for the time being...but let me know if this is a deal breaker/maker for you.

    I can do smaller lights eventually but right now I have a lot invested in this "size" light in terms of design, materials, programming, etc.

    I've also been talking to a company about PVD coating some lights. Don't know the cost yet. I hope they can do some samples for me over the next few weeks.

    Thanks for your feedback!

    Jason

  2. #2
    Flashaholic
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    That looks great , or at least different

    I was thinking the other day on your project.. thinking in my case what is missing in my flashlight collection and what came into my mind was this type of flashlight but probably with a aspheric lens for throw. I know its a bit too much "away" from your project but... you have a PM.

    Regards,
    Artur

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    Flashaholic* The Coach's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Looks pretty good, I like it. Same guts? How does it affect the beam?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Same guts. Beam seems identical to me...as in you can't "see" and shadows from the crenelations.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    I like it. You do nice machine work! Have you thought about offering finishes in HA or ceracote?

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    Flashaholic Aepoc's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by Art View Post
    That looks great , or at least different

    I was thinking the other day on your project.. thinking in my case what is missing in my flashlight collection and what came into my mind was this type of flashlight but probably with a aspheric lens for throw. I know its a bit too much "away" from your project but... you have a PM.

    Regards,
    I have been looking for a nice light of this size with an aspheric lens as well. I have plenty of flood lights and plenty of smaller lights, but I am missing a smaller throw light. I think an aspheric lens option would really get some people excited. I definitely would make me excited!
    EDC: HDS Ra Clicky T SN7156 (100L WWGD) or Lunasol 20 (I can't choose between the two)
    Favorites: Sub 1-D Tri-XML Copper Mag | DBS V3 XML w/ Aspheric Lens | Leaf/SF MN21 Turbo Lego | The Kroma

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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    i think i would like it more if the axial groves only went through the finned portion of the head or if you got rid of them all together and used the ball mill to make head fins that match the body but thats just my opinion


    btw i love your light the way it is and would own one if it wasnt for a move and a bench full of unfinished projects

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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    also i dont know if anyone else has said it yet but titanium seems to sell really well on this forum

  9. #9

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Eh, titanium's overrated. SS is where it's at. (Let the material flamewars begin!)

    I'd like a 14670 option (same size head, slimmer body). I'm probably a very small minority in that, but there ya go. And there's virtually no competition in that niche, you know.

    A single mode option would be nifty, too, for those of us who like to know how much light we're getting before we hit the switch.

    That said, not too sure I'd buy a SS 14670 model, either. This isn't a criticism of your lights or pricing at all, but I'm not the kinda guy who spends $200 on a custom very often.



    The one thing that would really make me more likely to buy is if I could handle one for five minutes, see if I actually like the grooves (I'm an aggressive knurling fan, so I have doubts), and generally get a chance to fall in love with the light -- since I live deep in the midwest, I'm not likely to see one at a CPF meetup; there's not really much you can do about this angle.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by Benson View Post
    The one thing that would really make me more likely to buy is if I could handle one for five minutes, see if I actually like the grooves (I'm an aggressive knurling fan, so I have doubts), and generally get a chance to fall in love with the light -- since I live deep in the midwest, I'm not likely to see one at a CPF meetup; there's not really much you can do about this angle.
    I wouldn't say that exactly. That reminds me, I've been considering starting a pass-around. Can anyone tell me where to look up the standard procedure for that?

    Stainless and Ti...love both, but I don't think they are appropriate for a light this powerful. The aluminum already has enough trouble moving the heat away. Also, my other assumption is that people would be even less likely to buy a $400 light from me since I'm relatively new. So, CPF'ers, is that true or would a Ti light turn you into a buyer?

  11. #11
    Flashaholic* ^Gurthang's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Archer,

    First, your work is outstanding, beautiful and worth every penny you charge [wish I could afford one of your lights]. However, the new head doesn't quite match the body, to my eye. I agree w/ Mag1Kateball, make the head grooving similar to the body grooving and keep the bead blast finish [my favorite look on your lights].
    ^G When I reply, threads die....

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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    i just look at it as Ti sells if you look in the sales forum titanium never lasts long also maybe offer trits in your lights that seems to be a big turn on around here

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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    and as far as heat mac uses ti in his edc with an sst50 or triple in it and it seems to be fine

  14. #14

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    tritium slots and a choice of colors i like blue

    gitd switch multi function switch options so you can have a ultra low with your new head design

    regarding new reflectors some talk on more lumens so if the new reflectors can some how crank out

    higher lumens in this size..wow

    i like where your going im on the edge watching for new developments

  15. #15

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by ^Gurthang View Post
    the new head doesn't quite match the body, to my eye.
    Now if I said that I'd get banned, American forums have an odd over the top reaction to me saying 'I don't like it'

    But as someone has gone before me, I'll just agree

    Workmanship is great, I like the shiny ball grooves but having two styles/materials going on looks odd. Can you do the same ball grooves on the head perhaps?
    I've yet to see someone do some OTT head grooving and I probably like the look of deep hard edge straight slots more.

    HTH

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    Flashaholic* bigchelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Since this is a customer survey and I have seen your lights in person I will say this.

    The build quality is awesome and the design too.

    For me I think you are trying to offer 2 things in one. A good throw light/plenty spill too with compact size. While this is generally a good idea you have some issues.

    For EDC the bezel size can be smaller at the expense of less throw of course, but alot of spill. Which is good for close up tasks.

    Then offer replacement bezels a customer can install on their own and call it a turbo head or something. Then the Throw will be there 100%.

    Or

    Offer a DarkSucks thrower with SMO reflector.


    You cant have both but many try and its a compromise I guess.

    I try to have my personal lights be one or the other. If its a EDC light, I like it small and floody. If its a thrower its big like a Surefire 6P size with giant bezel for throw, but only EDC on special ocasions while visiting local parks ect....


    bigC
    Surefire 6P with Malkoff M60 simple, bright, efficient.

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    Flashaholic sigsour's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    I agree what others have said; I think the head and body dont match as well as your older head. I actually like your newer head better and would be cool to redo the rounded grip area. I love your lights and hopefully one day soon I will have one.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by Disintergrator66 View Post
    I like it. You do nice machine work! Have you thought about offering finishes in HA or ceracote?
    I've thought about it I'm not familiar with the details of ceracote...other than it's popular. I assume it's a non-conductive finish that needs to be machined off? I've stayed away from HA because you also have to machine it off, and the super hard/fine grit is hard on a CNC machine. It also requires all three parts to go back for a second round of machining...which takes time...which costs money...which raises the price. Given that, is this something other people are interested in and would be willing to pay for?

    Quote Originally Posted by ^Gurthang View Post
    Archer,

    First, your work is outstanding, beautiful and worth every penny you charge [wish I could afford one of your lights]. However, the new head doesn't quite match the body, to my eye. I agree w/ Mag1Kateball, make the head grooving similar to the body grooving and keep the bead blast finish [my favorite look on your lights].
    Thanks! I appreciate that I agree that the head doesn't match the body. I actually did some heads with body-size grooves a long time ago (prototypes). I didn't think it looked very good but I'll try to dig one up, post a pic, and let you guys be the judge or make more suggestions.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimtesla View Post
    tritium slots and a choice of colors i like blue

    gitd switch multi function switch options so you can have a ultra low with your new head design

    regarding new reflectors some talk on more lumens so if the new reflectors can some how crank out

    higher lumens in this size..wow i like where your going im on the edge watching for new developments
    I just ordered some green, white, ice blue, and orange tritium from Bart yesterday. That stuff's not cheap. As far as an ultra-low moonlight mode...not going to happen with the drivers I currently have available to me. I need to sell a lot of lights before I can get something custom made. As far as more lumens...physics pretty much dictates a larger head at this point. I have a variety of things on order that will throw better and put out more lumens but the heads are going to be substantially larger.

    Quote Originally Posted by bitslice View Post
    Workmanship is great, I like the shiny ball grooves but having two styles/materials going on looks odd. Can you do the same ball grooves on the head perhaps? I've yet to see someone do some OTT head grooving and I probably like the look of deep hard edge straight slots more. HTH
    It's both materials are actually aluminum. The warmer color is nickel plated (a finished production body) and the head is bare aluminum (prototype fresh of the machine). I don't intend that the final light have two different colors...just a "form study" if you will. I also agree the two styles don't match. I have a "fine grooved" body I'll take some photos of with my most recent head. I can't say that I like it much, but maybe someone can suggest what might look better. Oh, and what is "OTT"?

    Quote Originally Posted by bigchelis View Post
    Since this is a customer survey and I have seen your lights in person I will say this. The build quality is awesome and the design too.

    For me I think you are trying to offer 2 things in one. A good throw light/plenty spill too with compact size. While this is generally a good idea you have some issues.

    For EDC the bezel size can be smaller at the expense of less throw of course, but alot of spill. Which is good for close up tasks. Then offer replacement bezels a customer can install on their own and call it a turbo head or something. Then the Throw will be there 100%.

    Or

    Offer a DarkSucks thrower with SMO reflector. You cant have both but many try and its a compromise I guess.
    Hey BigC! Good to "see" you around. I have about 5 different kinds of reflectors on order, from 35mm to 80mm. This should get interesting An 80mm reflector is gonna look real freaky on that little body but it should have a 4.5 degree beam and throw like crazy. I'll be interested to see how many lumens I can get out of this thing. I'd like to test some of the "800" lumen XML lights and see if they are really producing that high. Have you tested any? Oh, by bezel do you mean the entire head? I don't have a traditional screw-in bezel where you could swap it out and use a deeper reflector with the same diameter.

    Sorry for the long post and no pics, but I didn't want people to feel like they were talking to the wall

  19. #19
    Flashaholic* bigchelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Jason,

    Sounds like a nice little monster light with 80mm Reflector. Its probably similar to a TurboForce D-Mini, where the body is dwarfed by the huge reflector.

    I have tested Various XM-L Mag builds and P60 drop-ins with the 2.8A driver. All of them make 650~750 OTF lumens.

    Only exception are the custom Mag builds that are direct drive, those make up to 1100 OTF at 4.5A or so via 6T XM-L, but due to heat they settle at 840ish minutes later and this is with copper heatsinks and LED to copper bonding.

    disregards the optional screw-on bezel since those are likely not going to work for you.
    Surefire 6P with Malkoff M60 simple, bright, efficient.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    a P60 can make 650-750!? Color me impressed. I might have to kludge and McR18 reflector into one of my lights and see what it reads. I have a TIR XML that puts out around 625 I think.

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    Flashaholic* bigchelis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by archer6817j View Post
    a P60 can make 650-750!? Color me impressed. I might have to kludge and McR18 reflector into one of my lights and see what it reads. I have a TIR XML that puts out around 625 I think.
    Yes, but dont forget the P60 drop-ins I test are from PCC and those are out of copper. So, its cheating a little bit.
    Surefire 6P with Malkoff M60 simple, bright, efficient.

  22. #22

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Hi folks,

    I've been fooling around in the shop a bit and thought I'd post some pics. My initial testing doesn't show much significant difference from my aluminum heads between time "0" and 1 minute. I haven't done any 3 min+ tests yet.




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    Flashaholic* shao.fu.tzer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Make it anodized and Surefire E series thread compatible and you'll have a serious winner. I like it.. a lot.

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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by shao.fu.tzer View Post
    Make it anodized and Surefire E series thread compatible and you'll have a serious winner. I like it.. a lot.
    Jason, how many times have I emailed you to do this (SureFire E-series thread compatible 18650 body)? There's demand for this. Trust me.

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    Flashaholic scottyhazzard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Quote Originally Posted by archer6817j View Post
    Hi folks,

    I've been fooling around in the shop a bit and thought I'd post some pics. My initial testing doesn't show much significant difference from my aluminum heads between time "0" and 1 minute. I haven't done any 3 min+ tests yet.



    DUDE! Nice, very nice. Like this body style much, much more. Copper is very cool. I would like to see some longer run times tested for heat disipation. If copper times are longer than that's a plus to weigh against the cost. That first head that you showed on this thread in aluminum was perfect to me. The grooves that you milled into the length of the head I think would look cool if added to the length of the body like a nod toward fluting on a revolver cylinder then cerakote the whole thing. If you could make a bezel for a 6P that looks like that first head & leave it up to the customer to cerakote that would be awesome. Watching the thread for the Cryos bezel I see there is more demand then than they can supply. I would think that this could help supplement your fund in the process of building your name that already looks to have a good start. That's my two cents. Whatever you do, keep it up!
    I'm a Lumenaut, on a bold quest of discovery. To find the smallest, toughest, eyeball searing-est torch that modern science can create!

  26. #26
    Flashaholic scottyhazzard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Saw this page & was thinking of your work on pushing more lumens & shaping the right host so here is a link

    http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...men-OTF!/page4

    Hope it gives you some ideas, I think your work shows great promise & I can't wait to see what you come up with. I'm having second thoughts about my career especially in light of what you are doing.
    I'm a Lumenaut, on a bold quest of discovery. To find the smallest, toughest, eyeball searing-est torch that modern science can create!

  27. #27

    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Okay, so I got some carbon tube in the mail and I was feeling a little frisky today...




  28. #28
    Flashaholic scottyhazzard's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    That is totally awesome! I love it. Must be crazy expensive though.
    I'm a Lumenaut, on a bold quest of discovery. To find the smallest, toughest, eyeball searing-est torch that modern science can create!

  29. #29
    Flashaholic sassaquin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    Wow, what a beauty! In my opinion, your best and most original design yet.
    It pays to be a little frisky.

  30. #30
    Enlightened EASTWOOD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark Sucks: --wanted--feedback on new prototype head!

    [QUOTE=archer6817j;3697484]Okay, so I got some carbon tube in the mail and I was feeling a little frisky today...



    I really like the look of this light. Very nice! Any idea what the price would be?

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