The Fenix HP11 - a Review in Four Parts

[robostudent5000]

Has anyone noticed how the HP11 on 4x Eneloops, the brightness falls as the battery capacity diminishes?
Thus, eventually only the first three levels of brightness work; then with further use, only the first two levels of brightness works.
It behaves like a conventional LED flashlight powered by disposable CR123's?
This is different to conventional LED flashlights powered by rechargeable protected 16340's and 18650's where the brightness is at maximum the whole time, until the very end when the battery is flat and cuts out with no warning at all???
Thus the Eneloop chemistry is similar to disposable primary CR123 chemistry and performance?
I wish the HP11 stayed at maximum brightness the whole time - until it gets flat...

protected Li-ion cells cutoff suddenly because the protection circuits cut them off once they get to a certain voltage. Eneloops and lithium primaries don't share the same chemistry but are similar in that neither have nor need protection circuits. you can safely drain them down farther than you can a Li-ion, so you can actually get more out of their capacity than you can with a protected Li-ion. if Eneloops and lithium primaries behaved like protected Li-ion's, instead of dropping down into the lower levels once almost drained they would just cutoff at that point and rob you of the extra run time you get on the lower levels.

[Deanz69]

One of the best reviews so far - I have a HL 20 and will definitely get the HP 11 after reading your review.....

[degarb]

Has anyone noticed how the HP11 on 4x Eneloops, the brightness falls as the battery capacity diminishes?
Thus, eventually only the first three levels of brightness work; then with further use, only the first two levels of brightness works.
It behaves like a conventional LED flashlight powered by disposable CR123's?
This is different to conventional LED flashlights powered by rechargeable protected 16340's and 18650's where the brightness is at maximum the whole time, until the very end when the battery is flat and cuts out with no warning at all???
Thus the Eneloop chemistry is similar to disposable primary CR123 chemistry and performance?
I wish the HP11 stayed at maximum brightness the whole time - until it gets flat...

I notice no dimming and I have compared since I have four of these. Just loss of levels. The turbo sucks almost an amp, and so is pretty useless. I cant mow my lawn in two hours. The 133 level, the high, is fine, and dropping down to mid at 8 hours is far preferable than getting that last half hour of light. The 50 lumen level is pretty bright and a good fall back.

Most people hate lights that just cut off. There even is a certain liability to this.

I got some eneloop xx 2500s, I should try runtime on turbo to see if I get better results than with the 2700s. With regular batteries, turbo sometime kills the pack in what seems 20 minutes. I can see your gripe, if you bought the light to run it for nearly four hours on turbo. I have no idea the real run time for turbo with good cells, without testing fully. I bet about 2.3 hours at best. Then again, maybe a lot less.

[subwoofer]

Has anyone noticed how the HP11 on 4x Eneloops, the brightness falls as the battery capacity diminishes?
Thus, eventually only the first three levels of brightness work; then with further use, only the first two levels of brightness works.
It behaves like a conventional LED flashlight powered by disposable CR123's?
This is different to conventional LED flashlights powered by rechargeable protected 16340's and 18650's where the brightness is at maximum the whole time, until the very end when the battery is flat and cuts out with no warning at all???
Thus the Eneloop chemistry is similar to disposable primary CR123 chemistry and performance?
I wish the HP11 stayed at maximum brightness the whole time - until it gets flat...

In post 2 of this thread I made that observation. Personally I am moving away from li-ion powered lights, and certainly wouldn't use these in critical applications.

I don't think we have reached the point that RCR123s are by any means 'conventional', so would actually argue that alkaline and ni-mh powered lights are far more conventional.

My preference for standard AA powered light (what I would call conventional) is that the power source is proven, easily available, safe and does not rely on protection circuits which sudden cut all power. The massive advantage of this is that lights powered with these batteries do fade out and give you plenty of warning that the batteries need to be replaced.

The HP11 with its big battery pack is going to be used when you need long runtimes and don't want to be unexpectedly plunged into darkness.

The loss of higher output levels and then finally a gradual fading out of the lowest level is the safest mode of failure and one of the HP11's good features.

[peterharvey73]

Thanks for the reply everyone.
Like you all say, I guess gradually dimming is okay after all.
Next time I use the HP11, I will pay attention to how long it can stay on the Level 4 maximum turbo mode, before it starts to drop levels and dim.
The HP11 is still a fine light, and I would recommend it to anyone...

[arizona1]

Funny story involving HP11... The other day i went i a night hike with a few friends of mine, and when we got back to the car we found out that the last headlight on my friends PT Cruiser went out. So on the 5 mile drive back (on country roads) i had my hand out the window using the HP11 as an improvised headlight, needless to say it worked very well and got us back.

[leeholaaho]

Is the headband big enough to fit over a cap such as the one in the link

http://www1.macys.com/shop/product/p...5-_-69-_-MP569

TIA for any reply

[degarb]

Funny story involving HP11... The other day i went i a night hike with a few friends of mine, and when we got back to the car we found out that the last headlight on my friends PT Cruiser went out. So on the 5 mile drive back (on country roads) i had my hand out the window using the HP11 as an improvised headlight, needless to say it worked very well and got us back.

This is a situation where the bra light would have come in handy.

[Therrin]

In post 2 of this thread I made that observation. Personally I am moving away from li-ion powered lights, and certainly wouldn't use these in critical applications.

I don't think we have reached the point that RCR123s are by any means 'conventional', so would actually argue that alkaline and ni-mh powered lights are far more conventional.

My preference for standard AA powered light (what I would call conventional) is that the power source is proven, easily available, safe and does not rely on protection circuits which sudden cut all power. The massive advantage of this is that lights powered with these batteries do fade out and give you plenty of warning that the batteries need to be replaced.

The HP11 with its big battery pack is going to be used when you need long runtimes and don't want to be unexpectedly plunged into darkness.

The loss of higher output levels and then finally a gradual fading out of the lowest level is the safest mode of failure and one of the HP11's good features.

You guys think in different terms than those of us who spend 6 to 14 hours underground on a regular basis.

I'll simply put a long-run-time-low-output headlamp on my helmet in addition to my primary headlamp & primary handheld, which gives out plenty of light to see and change batteries by (though is crappy for actual exploration purposes underground). That way when my other lights "cut out" because of their regulation, I can still easily swap batteries on them.

The point is that when there is someone who uses their lights *regularly* and up to full capacity all the time, running rechargeable's is significantly cheaper in the long run than running primaries.

Sure, if you only use it now and then, or once a month, run primaries. But if you're one of those folks who uses your light ALL THE TIME (literally), using rechargeables is pretty much the only way to go. Lithium ion cells have a greater power density than almost anything else on the market right now. So while RCR123's and 18650's may not be "mainstream", that's only because "mainstream" users usually aren't "all-the-time" users of their lights. They use them occasionally. All-the-time users don't want to go through 15 primary cell batteries everytime they do a "run" (underground, aboveground or otherwise). And if you do one trip a month, and you're going through 45 primary cells per trip, it gets pretty expensive. (trust me)

[DisrupTer911]

Out of curiosity, what sort of exploration are you doing that you're using 45 cells in one trip?

I'd suspect most caving trips if that's what you're doing would be 1-2 days as I think it would be difficult to carry enough supplies into a cave to last a week, especially if you're crawling through tight spots.

[subwoofer]

You guys think in different terms than those of us who spend 6 to 14 hours underground on a regular basis.

I'll simply put a long-run-time-low-output headlamp on my helmet in addition to my primary headlamp & primary handheld, which gives out plenty of light to see and change batteries by (though is crappy for actual exploration purposes underground). That way when my other lights "cut out" because of their regulation, I can still easily swap batteries on them.

The point is that when there is someone who uses their lights *regularly* and up to full capacity all the time, running rechargeable's is significantly cheaper in the long run than running primaries.

Sure, if you only use it now and then, or once a month, run primaries. But if you're one of those folks who uses your light ALL THE TIME (literally), using rechargeables is pretty much the only way to go. Lithium ion cells have a greater power density than almost anything else on the market right now. So while RCR123's and 18650's may not be "mainstream", that's only because "mainstream" users usually aren't "all-the-time" users of their lights. They use them occasionally. All-the-time users don't want to go through 15 primary cell batteries everytime they do a "run" (underground, aboveground or otherwise). And if you do one trip a month, and you're going through 45 primary cells per trip, it gets pretty expensive. (trust me)

I think you missed my point - AA power doesn't equate to primaries, only a chemistry which gives a predictable performance.

I only use rechargeable batteries, mainly eneloops, and also use RCR123s and 18650s, but still prefer AAs, however this is not the thread to debate the pros and cons of different power sources as it is a review thread and we should stick to the topic of the HP11 and its performance.

'Mainstream' all depends on your context and in a general context RCR123s and 18650 are not 'mainstream', however in certain activities they now probably are.

[Bolster]

Out of curiosity, what sort of exploration are you doing that you're using 45 cells in one trip?

Yes, please let us know that at least, before returning to topic. Very curious what you're doing underground for that long! You're not a vampire are you?

[Nyctophiliac]

Hi Sub,

been lurking on this thread for a while - finally today purchased the HP11 for myself, due in no small way by your thorough review and the responses to those who have posted in reply.

No real need for a headlamp in the normal course of events in my life. For my biking I use a TK21 on my helmet and it serves me well on and off road (I cycle for an hour or so every night, even when wet - the weather not me!!!) and as you have said, no obvious way to attach this HP11 to a bike helmet.

But I am going to spend Saturday underground this weekend - a mining trip no less - and the thought of having a new light with guilt free reasons cannot be resisted, so HP11 it is. I'll let you know how I get on.

BTW - I have fixed the glare from the diffuser by using a 5mm thin strip of black Gaffer(Duck) tape around the edge and folded over the diffuser disc - the tape is white on the adhesive side so minimising light loss - and totally opaque - not too easy to notice even when light is off.

I'm taking the HP11 as my helmet light, a Zebra H31 as backup headlamp, my TK45 as area light and various other AA style lights as redundant backups and 'New York Reloads'.

I'm also supplying backups for three others in the party - The Fenix L2D and Quark 2AA lights that have been keeping my drawer full are finally going to have a decent purpose (not to mention 'Descent' !!!!) And I'm looking forward to letting them carry the spare cells too!

Recharge city around here until Saturday!

If you don't hear from me here, then in my opinion the light is rubbish!

~to be continued~

[degarb]

BTW - I have fixed the glare from the diffuser by using a 5mm thin strip of black Gaffer(Duck) tape around the edge and folded over the diffuser disc - the tape is white on the adhesive side so minimising light loss - and totally opaque - not too easy to notice even when light is off. [/I]

Back in 2007, I bought a box of industrial velcro. Still in basement, not all used up by far. So, I simply cut a inch off and stuck it on the diffuser (caulked the explosed sticky part) with about 6 mm sticking out. Looks like a factory fix to the glare.This is something I have had to do with all brands of lights I have that come with diffusers. Though, I usually just wear the lights on top of a baseball cap-so glare is impossible.

[Bolster]

If you don't hear from me here, then in my opinion the light is rubbish!

That may be the most clever and well written post I've read on CPF--!

[SkyPup]

Thanks for this great review, I purchased three of them and they also make great Christmas presents!!

[subwoofer]

Hi Sub,

been lurking on this thread for a while - finally today purchased the HP11 for myself, due in no small way by your thorough review and the responses to those who have posted in reply.

No real need for a headlamp in the normal course of events in my life. For my biking I use a TK21 on my helmet and it serves me well on and off road (I cycle for an hour or so every night, even when wet - the weather not me!!!) and as you have said, no obvious way to attach this HP11 to a bike helmet.

But I am going to spend Saturday underground this weekend - a mining trip no less - and the thought of having a new light with guilt free reasons cannot be resisted, so HP11 it is. I'll let you know how I get on.

BTW - I have fixed the glare from the diffuser by using a 5mm thin strip of black Gaffer(Duck) tape around the edge and folded over the diffuser disc - the tape is white on the adhesive side so minimising light loss - and totally opaque - not too easy to notice even when light is off.

I'm taking the HP11 as my helmet light, a Zebra H31 as backup headlamp, my TK45 as area light and various other AA style lights as redundant backups and 'New York Reloads'.

I'm also supplying backups for three others in the party - The Fenix L2D and Quark 2AA lights that have been keeping my drawer full are finally going to have a decent purpose (not to mention 'Descent' !!!!) And I'm looking forward to letting them carry the spare cells too!

Recharge city around here until Saturday!

If you don't hear from me here, then in my opinion the light is rubbish!

~to be continued~

Nycto

Didn't you get a closer look at it at the last meetup? It was the one I was strobing in the car when we were waiting for the take-away.

The diffuser fix sounds good, but I prefer more permanent fixes to gaffer tape (though some people seem to consider it a permanent fix).

Isn't the TK21 a bit big to helmet mount? I have a Quark mounted on my cycling helmet but as a single AA light is nice and lightweight. My TK21 is mounted on the bike itself.

I think you'll do well with the HP11, and it sounds like an interesting trip. Will you take a camera and tripod to take a few photos?

Definitely hoping you don't think the light is rubbish ;-)

[Nyctophiliac]

No camera - we're going in with microphones and recorders. But I might snap a couple with my phone.

Yeah - good though the gaffer tape fix is - it is temporary - if I have time I'll try to figure out a better solution - did you try the tipp-ex and marker solution? I did wonder if glow paint on the edges would be good, maybe try it later.

The TK21 is held in two of the velcro lockblock mounts on my helmet, one in front of the other. With London traffic being as lethal as it is, I find the weight is easily borne against the benefits of getting a drivers full attention just as they are about to pull out in front of you!

[subwoofer]

No camera - we're going in with microphones and recorders. But I might snap a couple with my phone.

Yeah - good though the gaffer tape fix is - it is temporary - if I have time I'll try to figure out a better solution - did you try the tipp-ex and marker solution? I did wonder if glow paint on the edges would be good, maybe try it later.

The TK21 is held in two of the velcro lockblock mounts on my helmet, one in front of the other. With London traffic being as lethal as it is, I find the weight is easily borne against the benefits of getting a drivers full attention just as they are about to pull out in front of you!

I did try the tipp-ex and black marker, but found that the light still leaked at the point where the diffuser and black plastic mount meet. This was no good.

What worries me is if you did come off your bike; having a large metal object attached to your helmet could cause all sorts of nasty problems. Motorcyclists who used to use the rubber sucktion fitted animal ears, found that even those made injury worse in accidents. The helmet should really not have anything attached and if anything it should be as small as possible; bike mount would be much better. Be careful out there.

[Nyctophiliac]

What worries me is if you did come off your bike; having a large metal object attached to your helmet could cause all sorts of nasty problems. Motorcyclists who used to use the rubber sucktion fitted animal ears, found that even those made injury worse in accidents. The helmet should really not have anything attached and if anything it should be as small as possible;

Strangely, the caving helmets all say that attaching lights to the helmets reduces their ability to protect your head - probably from the same reasoning. Still, I have never seen a caver without a fairly bulky light clipped onto the helmet. Right above the frontal lobes too!

I know that I have avoided accidents simply by turning my head in the direction of the car/taxi/lorry/bus that is about to cut me up, and therefore shining my light directly at them - never for long I hasten to add. I don't need to dazzle, just that they never seem to notice me with just lights on the handlebars. But I agree, the safety of the helmet is compromised. I could always stay safe at home ;-)

As for the HP11 - I think some thin card glued to the barrel of the diffuser, so that it overlaps with it when closed, would be best - no glare and no gaps. But leaving enough purchase to flip up the filter when not needed.

I do like the use of the Surefire pop up diffuser, but I haven't got one yet.

cheers.

[Nyctophiliac]

I would like to cast my vote in favour of this light.

Five hours underground with it as my primary headlamp (on a helmet, natch) and constant use has confirmed its usefulness and reliability. For the most part the lamp was on in medium mode - only going to a higher mode for long distance illumination. (People tend not to like it if you dazzle them when down a mine!)

The headstrap is of sufficient size to go around the rim of the caving helmet and a couple of pieces of gaffer tape ensured that it wouldn't come off in extreme circumstances. The diffuser was used for most of the time and only raised for long distance viewing - I didn't find a tunnel that the light could not illuminate to the end on turbo.

Despite me bumping the light and it's batterypack on the roof many many times, the light functioned very well indeed. Most of the other cavers had Petzl Duo, Raptor or Stenlight lamps, but were impressed with mine.

My backup lights were never used and I did not need to change the batteries at all.

Very happy with this lamp and thanks to this review that I went for it.

Cheers Subwoofer, now to figure out how I attach it to my cycle helmet!

Just a couple of pics so far:


Showing how my tape anti glare fix works - not too pretty, but functional.

A diffused high was enough light for this shot.

Fellow flashaholic Remoteneeded proves he is unafraid of small spaces or mud!

[GulfCoastToad]

Therrin, not enough info to reproduce your diffuser.

I found if I go to "walmrt's" pharmacy and buy their empty contact lens case with translucent caps, I can hot-glue/amazing-goop the edges a cap to elastic ($1, in fabric department) then tightly glued to the head the lights. When not in use, just flip the diffuser off to the side. This design seems to work very well on one of my lights; the contact lens case cap diameter seems to be perfect for most lights; and would work on hp11 in a pinch. I figure if this hp11 diffuser breaks off, I can reattach with this method, with added benefit of no elastic touching metal bezel. (Stock diffuser slightly insulates the warm metal, though only a potential problem with turbo mode.).

Can you post some pics of this mod?

[Kitchen Panda]

My big Christmas treat this year was an HP11 in yellow (thanks to my very thoughtful wife picking up on 2 months of hints, including a shortcut to the Fenix site on her desktop). Apart from household use, I plan to take this headlamp with me on my occasional site visits to hydro power plants and industrial sites (mostly I'm deskbound, but a couple of times a year I get out into the real world).


I failed the top strap IQ test, but at least I knew it was a test. The owner's manual does show the strap correctly assembled, but I guess I've gotten used to hand-holding consumer instruction manuals. A little Googling was helpful to figure out the top strap. I was pleased to find the straps allow the unit to be attached to a hard hat. Since if I drop a hard hat it may float down river for days, I will probably attach the lamp and hat with some kind of lanyard to prevent loss if I nod my head while looking over a tailrace handrail. I can pull my toque down over the battery box to help keep it warm, thoguh I suspect several hours in cold weather will still freeze the batteries. The battery cord is too short to tuck the box into a parka pocket.

One problem in the review seems to have been fixed. My lamp, serial number F45RB100731, was packed with a different diffuser - the clear lens drops into an opaque rim, and there's a tab at the 7 o'clock position (with hinge at 12:00) to flip up the diffuser. This eliminates the black marker/tape treatment others had to use to get rid of glare. The tab catches enough light that you can see if you've left the lamp on.

I've never owned a headlamp before, and now I wonder why. It's been terribly convenient around the house as I familiarize myself with the unit (I'm not playing, I'm training!). Though minor household work like stacking folding chairs or making the bed aren't much of a workout for the lamp, it is surprisingly comfortable to wear for hours at a time. It did get used for a semi-serious job when I was fixing some lamp sockets at my mother-in-law's house. One thing I really appreciate is that the light comes from between your eyes, making easy to see down deep holes (like lamp sockets). I was startled one evening to realize I could effortlessly see down into the back of the subwoofer speaker port while sitting on the couch. It was also useful for cleaning up Christmas toys that had rolled under various furniture.

Low-low (4 lumens) is quite enough for navigating around furniture or reading a Kobo (it was a good Christmas for gadgets). The 50 lumen setting is a lot of light and I like that the lamp should run for 20 hours at this level...I don't have to worry about changing batteries every few hours. Turbo mode will be useful for big/deep/dark openings that I run across, and actually lasts a long time, though I haven't clocked it yet. I did check the current draw in the various modes and it looks consistent with the advertised time on 2500 mAh NiMh. I suppose to get the weight down I could put in L91 lithium/iron disulfide cells, but I bet I'd only need 3 to get the same run time (and roughly the same voltage) as four NiMh.

Forgot to mention - beamwidth is about 7 degrees for the hot spot, according to tape measure, calculator and a little trig. The beam is much wider with the diffuser on, but I didn't measure it.

The construction looks...adequate. There are lots of hard plastic pieces that obviously shouldn't be abused, such as the battery carrier and the headband clips. That's OK, though, I won't be using this unit for hard usage in a cave. However, I may get to go underground in a mine this year, and I'll be sure to bring this lamp with me if I do.

Bill

[LUPARA]

THANKS for the great review! I actually ordered the HP11 before reading the review, after which I was very comforted at my choice of headlamp.
I almost bought a Zebralight H50, mainly because I like to keep things simple ... but I will get much more use out of the HP11 'cos it will be used outdoors where throw is a comfort
when hiking through areas that tends to have feral dogs, wild bore etc., things that need to be seen at a distance; and it will also serve as my bike light.
I'm sure that we're about to see some cool newer designs and improvements that will make the HP11 look like a dinosaur in a couple of years!!

[asval]

Nice and informative thread

Was considering buying the HP11, but the cost and lack of proper water protection turned me off it (IPX 6 ). Chose the Klarus ST20 at $40 with IPX8 rating and lighter weight at the cost of not being able to load 2 AA's . Sure the HP11 has 37 more lumens, but from looking at a couple of sites I don't think it'll make that much of a difference.

Here are the sites I used for comparison if anyone is interested

First one has the hp11 with a bunch of other lights which I used to the best of my abilities to find a comparable light to the Klarus ST20 since it only appears in the second link.

http://fonarik.com/test/indexen.php?...scene=1&mode=0

http://www.light-reviews.com/klarus_st20/

Granted the HP11 does include accessories (strap+ diffuser) for those extra $25, but for my application I don't think it'll make a difference since I just want to strap it to a bike helmet and use it for camping trips.

Hope I made the right choice

[Freely]

Great thread! It was just what I needed to determine if the Fenix HP11 was the headlamp for my needs. I've decided to order one tonight. Thanks to the OP for his excellent review and continued follow ups.

[Freely]

One problem in the review seems to have been fixed. My lamp, serial number F45RB100731, was packed with a different diffuser - the clear lens drops into an opaque rim, and there's a tab at the 7 o'clock position (with hinge at 12:00) to flip up the diffuser. This eliminates the black marker/tape treatment others had to use to get rid of glare. The tab catches enough light that you can see if you've left the lamp on.[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]



If you position the diffuser so that the tab is located at the 10 o'clock position and the hinge is located at the 2 o'clock position, then no light is visible to your eyes with the diffuser either open or closed. The diffuser reflection problem is fixed!

[robostudent5000]

nice! a functional diffuser. maybe fenix is finally getting it after all.

now only if they would get that a lot of headlamp users need a mode in the 10-20 lumen range.

[subwoofer]

That diffuser looks so much better. I'm glad Fenix have listened and updated the design.

[vēer]

Thanks for this awesome review, I was really tempted to pull the trigger on Hp11 about a week ago when it was on sale for 49$ but resisted since there is no real use for it at the moment and I dont have that much cash to keep it as a spare one
Not yet...
Really love what Fenix did with this one, almost 4h on max from 4xAA batteries is really respectable, I wish they made something with 1xAA and ZebraLight functionality form factor wise and mode wise as well.