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Thread: Why Quality Matters

  1. #1
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    Default Why Quality Matters

    This past weekend my wife was heading to the beach with some girls from church to camp for a night. She asked me for a light and I racked my brain thinking of a good light that would also have a fairly simple interface. I finally decided on the Nitecore EX10 . . .simple but powerful. That night she calls me and tells me that the light is broken and isn't even screwing together. "Impossible" I say to myself, thinking how can you not get it screwed back on. When she returned I looked at the light so I could fix it because she obviously had no idea about lights. I quickly found the problem . . . the head broke completely off. I'm talking complete aluminum break all around the head. My wife is a runner not a weight lifter and I'm frankly shocked that the Nitecore would break in such a fashion. I have nitecores to give as gifts. Can I trust them?

    So, when my daughter who on Tuesday left for college, asked for a light I racked my brain again thinking of a simple light that wouldn't break. The result, she now owns a AA Brass Peak. It isn't the brightest light in the arsenal but it will give her light when she needs it. I'd rather have a simple working light than a fancy broken one.

  2. #2
    Enlightened nicodimus22's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Along the same lines of thought is "the best light is the one you have with you" when unexpected things happen. This is why so many people are fans of the Fenix E01. It's not going to light up the woods, but you can easily have it with you at all times on your keys, so it's likely to be the light that may actually save you in a sudden emergency. To your point, it's also more or less bulletproof.

  3. #3

    Crackup Re: Why Quality Matters


    Just purchased my Nitecore EX 11.2 the other day, and I have to read this?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    No manufacturer will ever have a 100% perfect record. I guess you got a duff one?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    I have read on here that Nitecore is prone to this happening. I will not buy their products. Their are many good reviews on lights here & you can do a search and find out what works for you. I have camped with the E01, Gerber Infinity & the E05. I liked the E05 best of all..!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Funny thing. Just ordered a SS Eiger QTC to replace my old E01 that i gave to a friend (that light was amazingly tough). My other EDC is a NiteCore EZAA R2. Both of those lights have been 100% reliable being carried in my pocket for over a year.

    The Peak should be on a different level entirely in terms of build quality, i'm eagerly awaiting it.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    And, how did the mentioned light break? Did i get this right, the body broke apart?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    I am pretty stuck on surefire lights i have a m961 that i droped on concrete and busted the lense still worked

  9. #9
    Flashaholic* pjandyho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Nitecore EX10 breaking at the head is not new at all. Many have encountered this issue and it would usually break at the thread. I thought Nitecore would have fixed this problem by now but it seems to still be happening. That's another reason why I am not buying anymore Nitecore lights following one disappointment after another.
    The love of light is the reason why I don't walk in darkness. But darkness has it's beauty...Sadly, my lights are much more beautiful!!
    Beam shots Night Trekking with HDS high CRI and McGizmo Haiku & Mule high CRI

  10. #10

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    What do you mean "by now"? No one in this thread mentioned one of the newer models breaking.

  11. #11
    Flashaholic* pjandyho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by Dsoto87 View Post
    What do you mean "by now"? No one in this thread mentioned one of the newer models breaking.
    Maybe the definition I used was wrong. What I meant is that this issue only seemed prevalent in the limited run EX10 with GDP emitters and any EX10 made before that. Read somewhere that Nitecore had fixed this issue after the GDP edition but it is still happening.
    The love of light is the reason why I don't walk in darkness. But darkness has it's beauty...Sadly, my lights are much more beautiful!!
    Beam shots Night Trekking with HDS high CRI and McGizmo Haiku & Mule high CRI

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    I don't believe the age of the light was ever mentioned. This very well may be an older model.

    Personally I have an older EX-10 and the only times it won't light, are when the battery is shot. I EDC'd it for about a year, while working as a contractor. Needless to say, it has taken some abuse, and survived.
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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Somebody asked how she broke the light. She broke it by twisting the head onto the body. And let me say that I loved this light and thought it was a tough little hombre. I was seriously shocked that it came back broken.
    Last edited by Dadof6; 09-09-2011 at 04:32 AM.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    mil spec lights are darn nearly indestructible. there are videos in youtube of torture tests and what not, but expect to pay top dollar for these lights.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    How old was the light ?

    As has been said, this did happen with some very early Nitecores, but was long since fixed. The EX10 hasn't been produced for sometime now, so is it possible that this was an older light or a second-hand purchase ?

  16. #16
    *Flashaholic* Monocrom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    As has already been pointed out, this is not something new. Although it is more than a bit surprising that it is happening with recently-made Nitecore flashlights.
    "The World is insane. With tiny spots of sanity, here and there... Not the other way around!" - John Cleese.

  17. #17

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    Why do people keep assuming this is a newer light? It's two models behind and though there have been a few other issues with the current crop, I have yet to hear of any of the new ones splitting

  18. #18
    Flashaholic* pjandyho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by Dsoto87 View Post
    Why do people keep assuming this is a newer light? It's two models behind and though there have been a few other issues with the current crop, I have yet to hear of any of the new ones splitting
    We may have been wrong about when the light was bought but let's face it, Nitecore has one of the worst QC you can find. Used to be my favorite brand after Surefire but they have been going down the ladder ever since their success with both the D10 and EX10. I have been bugged with nothing but problems in all my latest purchases (IFE series, D11.2, EX11.2...) and that is enough to keep me out of their brand for good. So even if we were to get the date of manufacture right regarding the OP's light, it is not going to change the fact that Nitecore is problematic as a whole.

    Edit to add: And let's not forget, Nitecore isn't exactly a cheap light to buy and considering everything is made in China with one of the lowest costs in the manufacturing industries one could find, so I expect perfection.
    Last edited by pjandyho; 09-10-2011 at 11:25 PM.
    The love of light is the reason why I don't walk in darkness. But darkness has it's beauty...Sadly, my lights are much more beautiful!!
    Beam shots Night Trekking with HDS high CRI and McGizmo Haiku & Mule high CRI

  19. #19
    *Flashaholic* nbp's Avatar
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    Default

    I had an EX10 for a bit and had no problems, but you have to admit, lights snapping in half is an embarrassingly large manufacturing flaw. This isn't an emitter 1 mm off center - the light broke in half! I doubt dadof6 even considered the possibility of this happening when he handed off the light, and I think it's reasonable to be disappointed in the manufacturer and the level of quality in that particular model.

    The design was nice, I'm glad to hear they have since fixed it. Are they replacing the defective lights?

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    EX10's breaking in half is no news. However I can see why, their walls are so thin, that's why it is so light. It is a compromise and combined with a small manufacturing fault meant a catastrophic disaster.
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  21. #21
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Murphy's Law.....things go awry. Part of the human condition is to look for permanence in a universe where there is no refuge from change. Once I owned a Brass Peak, but when I went to use it the light fell out of my hand and plunged into the raging river below. I wished it were the same light your wife was using.
    Last edited by phosphor; 02-26-2012 at 01:44 AM.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    The only lights I had go bad are Nitecore and Jetbeam and I understand they are affiliated. Either way I don't buy their products anymore and haven't had any more faulty lights. Three Nitecores and Three Jetbeams so it wasn't like I just received one bad sample.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    357mag1, Can I ask what sort of problems you had with your Jetbeams & Nitecores? I own one Jetbeam a RRT-3 and have been happy with it so far and also just purchased my first Nitecore. Thinking now that may have been a mistake!

  24. #24
    Flashaholic* angelofwar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by Burntrice View Post
    No manufacturer will ever have a 100% perfect record. I guess you got a duff one?
    But the head breaking off??? C'mon...that goes beyond "one just got out"...sounds like poor machining/material...coupled with poor QC.

    My older brother is also military and deploys to "hostile" environments quite frequently...he got one of my old L1's a few years back. My younger bro is an adventurer/outdoorsy guy, and he got one of my G2L's a few years back as well. I couldn't/wouldn't give them anything less.

    I'm glad your wife wasn't in a "less than hospitable" situation...it could have broken at a worse time. The things I do, my lights CANNOT fail...if, by an act of God, they do, I'll have a back-up (usually a...well, E1B Back-up...).

    I've heard of Surefires being broke on purpose, or extreme "accidents", but have never heard of one failing due to A) Unknown reasons (i.e. giddy electronics) B) Being dropped (minus a busted bulb). On the other hand, I've read stories of SF's surviving extreme accidents, that, well, most MIC lights would not have survived. I tell people at work this...Surefire isn't just a "cool tactical name"...(o.k., maybe it is now), but, it's actually a description of the light..."Guaranteed To Work".

    (And yes, there are others, HDS, Peak, Elzetta, etc. al., that have similar track records of "just working", I only mention SF cause that's what I own)

    Edit...just realized this was a semi-necro thread, but, the stories are still the same...
    Last edited by angelofwar; 02-28-2012 at 07:22 AM.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    The real answer is the CPF motto: 2=1, 1=0.

    I don't think the Surefires/HDSs are so much more reliable that if you must have light, you can go without carrying a spare. In any case, at 3x the price, I'm pretty certain the risk of 3 cheaper lights failing at the same time is quite a bit smaller than 1 HDS or Surefire failing. I've done searches of "HDS/Surefire + warranty" and read through enough failure threads to know they are far from perfect too.

    I'm not arguing about the better feel of build quality, pride of ownership, better customer service or warranty; just the point that if you buy the highest quality light, you're somehow protected from ever being in the dark. A back-up is always going to be the best solution for that.
    Last edited by reppans; 02-28-2012 at 08:00 AM.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by 380long View Post
    357mag1, Can I ask what sort of problems you had with your Jetbeams & Nitecores? I own one Jetbeam a RRT-3 and have been happy with it so far and also just purchased my first Nitecore. Thinking now that may have been a mistake!
    Sure. I purchased a Jetbeam M1X in 2009 and the wife got me a RRT-1 for my birthday in 2009. Loved those lights and purchased one more of each as well as the Jet 1 Pro EX3.

    First disappointment was the 2nd M1X was really a totally different light and by design and had much less throw. That is comparable to buying a sports car and finding out they detuned the engine without mentioning it anywhere in the specs. The worst part was I turned it on one day and it just died. Fortunately that light was under warranty and Bug Out Gear took care of getting a replacement.

    My first RRT-1 had impressive throw and I liked the ring. My second for some reason never threw as well and periodically would not turn on. It eventually died outside warranty. Just refuses to come on.

    The Jet 1 Pro EX3 was an awesome 2AA light and one of my best 2AA throwers. After having it for about 18 months it started acting up. It hasn't quit completely yet but is much dimmer than when I purchased it. I've stripped it down and cleaned the threads and checked connection points to no avail.

    Similar issues with my Nitecore Extreme Infinity and D10, two of my favourite EDC lights until the D10 quit working (won't turn on) and the Extreme keeps going dim. It hasn't died but is not reliable. I've carried two Quarks about three times as long as either of those lights and they are still going strong.

    I did order an EZ 123 which would not come on out of the box. Finally sent it back after cleaning threads and checking connections repeatedly.

    Out of 9 lights purchased 5 Jetbeam and 4 Nitecore only three are presently working without issues. With well over 200 lights in my collection I know how to keep them maintained and none of the other lights have failed.

    The only bright side is my Nitecore PD20 and the original M1X and RRT-1 all still work and are well liked. I would have already purchased an RRT-3 if it wasn't for the above track record. It is a higher end light so lets hope the quality control is better than I experienced or you just get lucky and it keeps running like these three.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by 357mag1 View Post
    Out of 9 lights purchased 5 Jetbeam and 4 Nitecore only three are presently working without issues. With well over 200 lights in my collection I know how to keep them maintained and none of the other lights have failed.
    Wow, that's some testimonial.

    When you read about the random failure here and there, you gotta take it with a grain of salt. But when you hear from people with reasonably large sample sizes, the statistically "accuracy" means something else altogether.

    Thanks for sharing that.

  28. #28
    Flashaholic* pjandyho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    The real answer is the CPF motto: 2=1, 1=0.

    I don't think the Surefires/HDSs are so much more reliable that if you must have light, you can go without carrying a spare. In any case, at 3x the price, I'm pretty certain the risk of 3 cheaper lights failing at the same time is quite a bit smaller than 1 HDS or Surefire failing. I've done searches of "HDS/Surefire + warranty" and read through enough failure threads to know they are far from perfect too.

    I'm not arguing about the better feel of build quality, pride of ownership, better customer service or warranty; just the point that if you buy the highest quality light, you're somehow protected from ever being in the dark. A back-up is always going to be the best solution for that.
    I agree that we must always carry spare lights. Even though I buy primarily Surefire, HDS, and McGizmo, I am still often seen with at least two or three lights. One thing you should note though is that having multiple cheaper lights does not guarantee less chances of being left in the dark. I have a friend who had a couple of lights (American company and Chinese made but reputable amongst CPF community) failed him because of tail cap issues. I told him to tighten the retaining rings on both the TCs but to no avail. In the end he got to do a simple mod on the TC by opening it up and adding a thin retaining ring in there so that the current could flow properly. It worked in the end but it should not have happened. I have also seen some with one failure after another, myself included. If you are real unlucky, there is no guarantee that even with three cheaper lights it won't fail you simultaneously. I realized that some budget lights come with very poor QC, often with less than adequate soldering, and some with very poor electrical conductivity.

    What I am saying is, buying a more expensive light like, for example a Surefire, does not guarantee failure wouldn't happen but it does greatly minimize failure from happening because of the higher level of QC, design and manufacturing process involved. Having a spare or two is still mandatory if one's life depends on it, and having two or three of such more expensive flashlights does greatly eliminate the odds of failure happening.
    The love of light is the reason why I don't walk in darkness. But darkness has it's beauty...Sadly, my lights are much more beautiful!!
    Beam shots Night Trekking with HDS high CRI and McGizmo Haiku & Mule high CRI

  29. #29

    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    ^^ no arguments from me....

    I'd love to buy a high quality HDS, or Surefire (McGizmo is too much $$ though), not necessarily for reliability, but more for the other intangibles I mentioned above. Unfortunately they won't make anything that fits my needs (AA, moonlight & another single digit lumen mode). So I'm stuck in the mid-priced range trying to cover the theoretical lower reliability with spare lights. I say theoretical because all 5 of my purchase are running just fine (crossing fingers ).

  30. #30
    Flashaholic* pjandyho's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Quality Matters

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    ^^ no arguments from me....

    I'd love to buy a high quality HDS, or Surefire (McGizmo is too much $$ though), not necessarily for reliability, but more for the other intangibles I mentioned above. Unfortunately they won't make anything that fits my needs (AA, moonlight & another single digit lumen mode). So I'm stuck in the mid-priced range trying to cover the theoretical lower reliability with spare lights. I say theoretical because all 5 of my purchase are running just fine (crossing fingers ).
    Other than the 3 brands that I had mentioned above, I think the best and most reliable brand that is also priced cheaper would be Zebralight. That would be my recommendation for anyone like yourself who needed it to run on AA as well as spot a moon mode and so on. I just love my Zebralights.
    The love of light is the reason why I don't walk in darkness. But darkness has it's beauty...Sadly, my lights are much more beautiful!!
    Beam shots Night Trekking with HDS high CRI and McGizmo Haiku & Mule high CRI

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