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Thread: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

  1. #1
    Flashaholic* Paul_in_Maryland's Avatar
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    Default Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    article
    I'm posting this at the top level since a buggy is neither an automotive vehicle nor a bike.
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  2. #2

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Tough one, but as much as I respect the Amish for sticking with their beliefs and not bothering anybody they are likely in the wrong on this one.

    They are using a road likely built by a government entity and traversed by other traffic. This means they have to abide by some level of safety concerns and likely won't get a lot of sympathy from a judge, especially if they refuse to pay the fines.

    Article stated they had made an attempt to mark their buggies with safety tape and such as an objection to the shape of a triangle, but even if this was the case I don't think the state will make an exception.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    I wonder what aspect of the orange safety triangle is against their religion. I'm quite surprised they couldn't reach some type of agreement instead of sending 8 people to jail.

    EDIT: if it's the triangle shape, just get 6 and make a hexagon?

    EDIT2: ahhh its the colour. I'm quite suprised they couldn't use a red/dark orange safety triangle, you can even get blue ones.
    Last edited by Henry50; 09-15-2011 at 08:27 PM.

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    Flashaholic* Morelite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    The requirement is for any slow moving vehicle and a horse drawn buggie fits the description of a vehicle.

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    Flashaholic Acid87's Avatar
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    I'm fine with people living by their own religion and beliefs but when these beliefs become dangerous to other motorists it becomes illegal. Dangerous driving isnt confined to one race creed or colour it is universal and laws should be followed.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Slow moving vehicles are a clear danger to faster traffic--and themselves. If they removed their safety triangles on their own land....okay, but on public roads, laws must be obeyed. Just like I follow traffic laws of my state.

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    Administrator Norm's Avatar
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Reminds of


  8. #8
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Why don't they use black reflective tape?
    Why don't they knock out the orange center of the safety triangle, that part doesn't have a reflex reflector.
    If the red is still too bright, why not use a colorless reflex reflector triangle.

    They tried nothing, and they are all out of ideas. (both parties)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    So what sort of buggies where they useing? There are several different things known as buggies and three of them could possibly be what that article is talking about, yet the article omits the information
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    Unenlightened Halfpint's Avatar
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    While this may be somewhat late, I haven't been able to find whether or not there has been a resolution reached though I'll also admit that I most likely didn't do all that great of a search, as a farmer myself I haven't ever been `hassled' over whether or not I might have one of those slow moving vehicle triangles on all of my equipment. This may be partly because I have most likely have somewhat `gone overboard so to speak' on all the reflective tape and paint jobs on our equipment? (`Course what *I* have done has a high probability of conflicting with the Amish `loud colours' edict. {WAN GRIN!})

    But, there are several different `tapes', `films', and `paints' that, until they are illuminated by other vehicle's lights, are almost un-noticable. (Something *I* was quite, and pleasantly, surprised to discover.) Now... I do not know if they are new, I just recently discovered the ones I've seen and haven't yet found out who makes them, but I wonder if they might be something that properly applied would satisfy at least the safety reasons for the slow moving vehicle' marking requirements *and* the Amish proscription of the triangle?
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  11. #11

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    it is a law, you have to have the triangle on slow moving vehicle used on public roads.
    the key word public roads.

    he can do anything he wants on his farm, but once he uses English roads, he must obey English rules
    Last edited by alpg88; 08-09-2012 at 07:31 AM.

  12. #12
    Flashaholic* Alaric Darconville's Avatar
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelW View Post
    Why don't they use black reflective tape?
    Why don't they knock out the orange center of the safety triangle, that part doesn't have a reflex reflector.
    If the red is still too bright, why not use a colorless reflex reflector triangle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Halfpint View Post
    But, there are several different `tapes', `films', and `paints' that, until they are illuminated by other vehicle's lights, are almost un-noticable. (Something *I* was quite, and pleasantly, surprised to discover.)

    I wonder if they might be something that properly applied would satisfy at least the safety reasons for the slow moving vehicle' marking requirements *and* the Amish proscription of the triangle?
    Those safety triangles also MUST function in the daylight, so there's no satisfying the requirement without a daylight-visible triangle. This is why there's a specification for the design and performance of the "Slow moving vehicle emblem" defined in ANSI/ASAE S276.5 MAY98, Slow-Moving Vehicle Identification Emblem.

    Old thread is old.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    I thought I had seen some gray safety triangles on Amish buggies. Now I'm going to have to go look

    I've never seen an Amish buggy without a safety triangle.

    I think they are going to have more and more trouble getting special treatment in cases like this in the future. My barely informed understanding is that these types of decisions are made locally, and in the end they can do pretty much what they want as long as the local leader can justify it to himself.

    Speaking of bikes, they usually have really good lights on their bikes too. It's pretty neat to see one of their youth groups leaving a meeting, dozens of very good lights. I've always been curious what they were using.

  14. #14
    Thread Killer Illum's Avatar
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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    His options are pretty limited in that regard, if this occurred here our state might mandate amber strobes

  15. #15

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Quote Originally Posted by Illum View Post
    His options are pretty limited in that regard, if this occurred here our state might mandate amber strobes
    Ive seen amber strobes on their buggies before. Each amish sect or clan has different rules on what they can wear, drive (even in the case of mennonites), etc. Most dont fully agree totally on everything. Some are allowed phones, but only outside of the home. Some wont even use electricity.

    Where the triangle bit comes in is a religious symbol. Father, son, holy ghost thing. Its not the color in some cases, its the shape. For others its the color being against their religion, or in some cases, both shape and color. Its all up to their religious leader and community beliefs as to what does and doesnt pass as kosher for them.

    In my non amish belief, its dangerous to have a black buggy out at night or dusk without some sort of warning device for cars.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    Quote Originally Posted by Danjal View Post
    Ive seen amber strobes on their buggies before. Each amish sect or clan has different rules on what they can wear, drive (even in the case of mennonites), etc. Most dont fully agree totally on everything. Some are allowed phones, but only outside of the home. Some wont even use electricity.

    Where the triangle bit comes in is a religious symbol. Father, son, holy ghost thing. Its not the color in some cases, its the shape. For others its the color being against their religion, or in some cases, both shape and color. Its all up to their religious leader and community beliefs as to what does and doesnt pass as kosher for them.

    In my non amish belief, its dangerous to have a black buggy out at night or dusk without some sort of warning device for cars.
    Very true. Lets not forget that it was an Amish community that manufactured, for a time, the world's most popular microwave ovens (Amana brand).

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    Default Re: Amish men jailed over refusal to use orange safety triangle on buggies

    A big part of the problem is that the buggies need to be readily identifiable as slow-moving vehicles by drivers from outside the area (locals can be assumed to read the paper and know that "fringe religious group got an exemption to the standard triangle, and this is what they are using instead"). Realistically, they can expect to be sharing the roads with drivers based out of any of the "lower 48" and all 10 Canadian provinces, so that the ONLY "slow-moving vehicle" sign that will be universally recognized is (surprise) the orange triangle they object to. To complicate matters, the drivers from furthest away (and therefore least likely to know about local exemptions) are those driving the vehicles capable of causing the most damage.

    In the left corner, weighing in at 3000 pounds, Amish Farmer and his horse and buggy. In the right corner, weighing in at 80,000 pounds, Billy Big Rig and his 379 Pete with a flatbed load of steel. Probable result: scratched chrome on the truck's bumper, debris from the horse and buggy not recognizable as to what it was originally.
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