Foursevens Preon P0

[Got Lumens?]

I just got my hands on one and checked it out. now I know the eneloop problem better.
they do need to spec MLP IC's
that way they can keep the design intact but the IC will be far more flush to the board
and allow room for eneloop heads or make the light 2 threads longer and bring the pos contact up

I agree, about the components specs. In height there's currently ~1mm battery shoulder clearance. The space between the components and center needs ~0.25mm more. Raising the contact ~0.50mm in height(3/4 thread) requires retooling and conflicts with design concepts. Energizer Lithiums are working fine. Let's wait and see what develops. I too want to use Eneloops.
GL

Edit: There are only two components that are causing the problem of not being able to use Eneloops.

[JulianP]

I agree that a flashlight should work with all types of batteries, including eneloops. Having said that, I've now used my Preon P0 for five days with Sony's Cycle Energy rechargeables, with no problem whatsoever. Being a CPF member and subscriber to this thread, I have nervously turned it on and off many times per day thinking it would soon malfunction. This did not happen. In a couple of weeks I will order a few more Preons, for other family members and for my bedside. As a night owl, I have taken to walking around the house with the Preon on moonbeam, to retrieve stuff like my cell phone and iPad. When I need both hands, I just put the Preon in my mouth like a cigarette. It's so light that it can be held this way for a few minutes with minimal discomfort. Weird, I know, but it's yet another use for this flashlight. Okay, no eneloops or 10440's, but until something better comes along, this is it for me.

[Flying Turtle]

Being a CPF member and subscriber to this thread, I have nervously turned it on and off many times per day thinking it would soon malfunction.

This sounds so familiar.

I've only tried using some old Energizer and Duracell NiMH's, with no problems.

Geoff

[rdrfronty]

Ok guys, I understand most like eneloops. They are great batteries. But I don't see why wanting to use them would warrant modifying a new little light just to make it fit. I mean if you really like tinkering with stuff and knowing these little lights are pretty cheap, sure ok, to each their own hobby. But what is really wrong with using the standard alkaline that comes with it? I've been using the Preon as my edc for about two weeks now using the duracell that came with it. It's hard to say just how long it will last, but I'd be surprised if it doesn't over a month. And with the cost of a AAA Duracell I should be able to keep it powered for a year for $5. So why take a chance of screwing up a perfectly good little light with a big button top battery like the eneloop? I guess if you really use your edc a bunch at work, etc. I guess an eneloop starts makes more sense. But at just over the cost of a gallon a gas to power my Preon for a year as a edc-I'm pretty content with a good alkaline.
I guess I just love my little preon and couldn't see chopping on it. Of course I haven't been a flashaholic as long as most here and am afraid to mess up any of my new prized possessions

[swxb12]

Out of the box, I'm having the same type of flaky mode changes with Duracells, Eneloops and Energizer Ultimate Lithiums. Considering returning it now

[jonnyfgroove]

My P0 is showing signs of wear and potential shorting and I've only used the included alkaline.

[127.0.0.1]

Ok guys, I understand most like eneloops. They are great batteries. But I don't see why wanting to use them would warrant modifying a new little light just to make it fit. I mean if you really like tinkering with stuff and knowing these little lights are pretty cheap, sure ok, to each their own hobby. But what is really wrong with using the standard alkaline that comes with it?

because this is in the gift-light category and no one wants to be gifted a flaky light. like getting coal for christmas...

almost all similar lights simply -work-

no one wants to be locked into alkalines because eneloops have more benefits than simply 'being rechargable'

[jorn]

Out of the box, I'm having the same type of flaky mode changes with Duracells, Eneloops and Energizer Ultimate Lithiums. Considering returning it now

Tighten the pill.

almost all similar lights simply -work-

no one wants to be locked into alkalines because eneloops have more benefits than simply 'being rechargable'

The only, even close to similar light, is the DQG. Overalll, the cheaper P0 feels like it's better buildt. The rest is huge compared with the P0 and DQG. And youre not locked into alkalines. Eneloops is the only NIMH i know of that might not fit.

Here is a pic with some other current controlled aaa lights.

[rdrfronty]

However the thing about gift giving is that non flashlight people likely never heard of eneloop and would usually use energizer and duracells. But flaky lights certainly would be a poor gift. My light is working flawlessly, but I guess I'm one of the lucky 1/2 of the owners. Guess they are a hit & miss.

[Got Lumens?]

My P0 is showing signs of wear and potential shorting and I've only used the included alkaline.

As Jonny mentioned above, There seems to be some tollerance differances in the PCB driver boards. My second sample that has used only Duracell alkaline battery does show a slight wear mark on one of the chips. I am confident that this will not cause future problems as there is some side to side give(0.15mm) with the battery and appears to have stopped with no further wear.

because this is in the gift-light category and no one wants to be gifted a flaky light. like getting coal for christmas...
almost all similar lights simply -work-
no one wants to be locked into alkalines because eneloops have more benefits than simply 'being rechargable'

I agree. This is not a problem for CPF crowd, but poses challanges to the non-flashaholic and public that are not adept at cleaning, connections, and proper lubrication that most flashlight in this catagory require.

I think one solution to this problem would be for Four Sevens to develop and sell a maintenance kit for thier flashlights. A simple and easy to understand guide that explains causes of flicker/dim output(dirt/debris/weak battery/etc.) and how to remedy them using the kit.

I am sure that Four Sevens is aware that some folks like and want to use Eneloop and square shouldered button batteries in these lights. We await to see a response. Either a driver PCB change, or a non-recommend for square button cells is needed to put this to rest.

GL

[shelm]

square button cells is needed

Eneloops arent square. You mean in its profile view?
the eneloop nub is a perfect cylinder. nothing square about it
maybe someone wants to post a close-up of the Eneloop and the duracell nubs to show what the exact difference is.

[gbelleh]

I've been using my P0 with Eneloops from day one (didn't even know about this problem when I got it). It's still working fine with Eneloops after almost 2 weeks using it every night.

I have no idea if anything is wearing or about to short out, but so far so good.

[IceRat]

I got mine today and I really like it. I bought other lights with the focused lens and didn't care for them with the small spot and no spill. This light has such a wide spot that it lights everything. Mine came with a spare o-ring. I think a rubber band from my daughter's braces might work as an o-ring. The magnet, holds the battery in, I have to shake it out. I have been using the same Sony Cycle-energy batteries for a few years and they works great. I love my Preon1 kit I bought when they came out and usually carry it in Preon1 form with the clip. I also carry a Maratac now and then but the battery doesn't last as long as the Preon.

I was wondering if anyone tried reversing the lens to see it it changed the beam? Also will the magnet mess with my cell phone or a thumb drive that might be in the same pocket?

Great light 4Sevens, thanks!

[Burgess]

I've also wondered if the magnet will cause confusion
with my electronic devices.


i DO know the magnet will affect my Compass, unless i keep it ~20 cm away.

Quite a shame really, cuz' my P0 is quite Ideal for map-reading !


Gotta' love that Low Mode.


_

[Got Lumens?]

Eneloops arent square. You mean in its profile view?
the eneloop nub is a perfect cylinder. nothing square about it
maybe someone wants to post a close-up of the Eneloop and the duracell nubs to show what the exact difference is.

Yes Shelm that is what I meant, Thanks. Reworded to shoulder.
I have videos showing the differance in My Mini-review thread with updated photos, lux values, and some beamshots
here's a couple low-res photo snapshots from them:

.
. . . Click to Enlarge. . . . . . . . Click to Enlarge

I will take some hi res photos later tonight.
GL

[Got Lumens?]

maybe someone wants to post a close-up of the Eneloop and the duracell nubs to show what the exact difference is.

Shelm, something like this?


. . . . . Click to Enlarge
GL

[Got Lumens?]

How about some beam shots

. .
. . 10" Free Hand . . . . . . . . . 6" on Stand
. . . . . . . . . . . .. Click to Enlarge

GL

[shelm]

Shelm, something like this?

Yes, exactly like this! Thanks a million for your efforts, your PO contributions rock!!!

To me, the nubs look the same: positive button tops (nubs!)

[kaichu dento]

because this is in the gift-light category and no one wants to be gifted a flaky light. like getting coal for christmas...

almost all similar lights simply -work-

no one wants to be locked into alkalines because eneloops have more benefits than simply 'being rechargable'

I agree with you on the basis of the fact that the light should just simply work, but if the Eneloop problem was the only issue it would still make for an excellent gift light as most recipients would be likely to use alkalines anyway.

However the thing about gift giving is that non flashlight people likely never heard of eneloop and would usually use energizer and duracells. But flaky lights certainly would be a poor gift. My light is working flawlessly, but I guess I'm one of the lucky 1/2 of the owners. Guess they are a hit & miss.

Here's hoping for some solid solutions soon, as I'm still without one and waiting for better reliability reports before ordering.

[toylover]

How about some beam shots

. .
. . 10" Free Hand . . . . . . . . . 6" on Stand
. . . . . . . . . . . .. Click to Enlarge

GL

How did you do that? Did you just dremmel out the GITD coating? Beam shot for the High setting please.

[someguy4747]

Well, I received my second Preon P0. I'm not exactly sure when but I'm guessing it was delivered yesterday. I just checked the mail box today. I got the USPS First Class shipping notification on Thursday so I'm surprised it got here so fast. This is my second light because my first one was DOA. I contacted 4sevens on Monday, 2/6/12. They said they were currently waiting on another batch of lights as the first one was already sold out. They said they would ship the light out to me as soon as the new batch came in. I did not expect a replacement this soon! Now I feel bad because I have not yet sent back my first light. Oh well, I'll ship it tomorrow.

As expected 4sevens took care of the issue and in quite a timely manner in my opinion. I am quite pleased with the light now that I have one that works. The beam profile is unbelievably wide! It is a pretty unique light. It is still light out so I cannot comment on the moonlight mode quite yet. The modes switch fairly reliable for me. I get the mode I expect to get about 75% of the time. I suspect the black foam to be the culprit of this issue. However, I fear I may have broken my last P0 by using an eneloop in it I am not yet willing to try the light without the foam. I did remove the foam on the new light and everything appears to be identical to the previous light. It still appears that there is no room for the wider eneloop contact. It looks like this light will require primaries only. I find this surprising since so many of us use Eneloops exclusively(I do) and I really believe we(CPF) are the base for 4sevens. Anyway, the only noticeable difference between the first and second light is that the second light has a black o-ring instead of the clear one. The new light did include a second o-ring and this o-ring was clear so I guess the color means nothing.

All things considered I like the light. The size and unique beam are what make the light interesting to me. I think it would be a great gift light but at the moment I question it's reliability. I will have to put it on my personal keychain for a few months before I can consider giving the light as a gift. It is almost too pretty to put on my keychain! Almost...haha

[Streamer]

Glad to hear you got your replacement so quick.

You can use Energizer lithium primary. Sold at your local market....... Great runtimes with them.

[Got Lumens?]

Well, I received my second Preon P0. I'm not exactly sure when but I'm guessing it was delivered yesterday. I just checked the mail box today. I got the USPS First Class shipping notification on Thursday so I'm surprised it got here so fast. This is my second light because my first one was DOA. I contacted 4sevens on Monday, 2/6/12. They said they were currently waiting on another batch of lights as the first one was already sold out. They said they would ship the light out to me as soon as the new batch came in. I did not expect a replacement this soon! Now I feel bad because I have not yet sent back my first light. Oh well, I'll ship it tomorrow.

As expected 4sevens took care of the issue and in quite a timely manner in my opinion. I am quite pleased with the light now that I have one that works. The beam profile is unbelievably wide! It is a pretty unique light. It is still light out so I cannot comment on the moonlight mode quite yet. The modes switch fairly reliable for me. I get the mode I expect to get about 75% of the time. I suspect the black foam to be the culprit of this issue. However, I fear I may have broken my last P0 by using an eneloop in it I am not yet willing to try the light without the foam. I did remove the foam on the new light and everything appears to be identical to the previous light. It still appears that there is no room for the wider eneloop contact. It looks like this light will require primaries only. I find this surprising since so many of us use Eneloops exclusively(I do) and I really believe we(CPF) are the base for 4sevens. Anyway, the only noticeable difference between the first and second light is that the second light has a black o-ring instead of the clear one. The new light did include a second o-ring and this o-ring was clear so I guess the color means nothing.

All things considered I like the light. The size and unique beam are what make the light interesting to me. I think it would be a great gift light but at the moment I question it's reliability. I will have to put it on my personal keychain for a few months before I can consider giving the light as a gift. It is almost too pretty to put on my keychain! Almost...haha

SomeGuy, Excellent story! I am glad they took care of you in such unexpected fast service

Glad to hear you got your replacement so quick.
You can use Energizer lithium primary. Sold at your local market....... Great runtimes with them.

Streamer, ++1. I just got some Energizer Lithium AAAs, and they function flawlessly, within the current Preon0 specs.


**---> Anyone have some runtimes using the lithium AAAs?

How did you do that? Did you just dremmel out the GITD coating? Beam shot for the High setting please.

Toylover, I did not post any beams of the high mode, because they appear identical. Here is the start link to thread where my posts are describing the modd and lux readings I took. Posts #199, 201, & 203.

GL

[jonnyfgroove]

Lithium runtime graph from hiuintahs.

[Got Lumens?]

Lithium runtime graph from hiuintahs.

Thanks JohnnyGroove

[TheCleanerSD]

Got a replacement P0 in this weekend. Had to RMA my original one which gave out after about a week of use. The replacement is one of the "newer" batch models with the black o ring. Apart from that change, there doesn't seem to be much physical difference. I can say that the threads on my new model are noticeably smoother than my original, and I can easily activate and switch modes with one hand. On my original light, nothing short of a very firm two-handed twist would get it to turn on. The difference in feel was enough to surprise me. Not sure if this speaks to improved quality control, or if my original was just a bad apple.

[mrlysle]

Lithium runtime graph from hiuintahs.

If the thing will do over 5 hrs on high with a lithium primary, and specs from 4/7's say 120 hrs on low, based on an alky, anyone care to venture a guess on what kind of runtime you'd get on low with a lithium primary? Since the high runtime more than doubles over rated specs with a lithium, could we safely assume runtime on low would more than double to say, 240 hrs minimum? That's 10 days on low. Pretty respectable from a AAA cell.

[Streamer]

If the thing will do over 5 hrs on high with a lithium primary, and specs from 4/7's say 120 hrs on low, based on an alky, anyone care to venture a guess on what kind of runtime you'd get on low with a lithium primary? Since the high runtime more than doubles over rated specs with a lithium, could we safely assume runtime on low would more than double to say, 240 hrs minimum? That's 10 days on low. Pretty respectable from a AAA cell.

If stated runtimes are 1.5 hours on high and 120 hours on low with alkalines, then by direct proportion the primary lithiums (yielding 5 hours on high) would yield 400 hours on low. That would equal 16.6 days. at @.24 lumens. I hope so.

[mrlysle]

If stated runtimes are 1.5 hours on high and 120 hours on low with alkalines, then by direct proportion the primary lithiums (yielding 5 hours on high) would yield 400 hours on low. That would equal 16.6 days. at @.24 lumens. I hope so.

Yea, that would be awesome! Thanks!

[Helmut.G]

If stated runtimes are 1.5 hours on high and 120 hours on low with alkalines, then by direct proportion the primary lithiums (yielding 5 hours on high) would yield 400 hours on low. That would equal 16.6 days. at @.24 lumens. I hope so.

Alkaline sucks at medium currents and is nearly unusable at high currents. That's where the big difference comes from.
In moonlight mode, however, the difference will be marginally or alkaline might even be slightly better (at room temperature that is. low temperatures give litium another advantage, alkalines are useless in the cold).