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Thread: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

  1. #31
    Flashaholic* Fusion_m8's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Hi jayrob:

    could you PM the name of the ebay seller where you got the 75w/85w 4300K ballast?

    Thanks.
    Before we can become old and wise, first we have to be young and foolish.
    When I die, I want to be like grandpa, peaceful and asleep. Unlike his passengers, screaming and yelling...



  2. #32

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by jayrob View Post
    Yeah it looks good in your pictures so it would be impossible to be sure unless the two were side by side...

    However I did notice that all of those pictures looked yellowish. So it could be the camera or exposure...
    You're unmodded ebay light was blueish for the naked eye? Mine is at worst a slight tint of green when warmed up but not at all blue.

  3. #33

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Yes mine was blue just like the picture...

    Those pictures actually are very close to how it looks in person (the color), but in person, the lights seem much brighter than the pictures show...



    Quote Originally Posted by Fusion_m8 View Post
    Hi jayrob:

    could you PM the name of the ebay seller where you got the 75w/85w 4300K ballast?

    Thanks.
    PM incoming...
    Last edited by jayrob; 06-17-2012 at 01:55 PM.

  4. #34

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Might have been an underpowered one you had, but like you say only by comparing them in person it would be properly visible if there is any difference.

  5. #35

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    OK guys, I did see the step down to 24W on the FF3, along with the audible click at about 13 minutes of walking around in 55-60 degrees. It's still darn bright though, after a minute I couldn't remember how much brighter it had been. It was pretty hot after 30 minutes, I was keeping my hand further back toward the tail for comfort. Also heard the click when it was off and cooling, assuming this was the temp reset.

    Jayrob, your magmod looks awesome I've got to resist getting one of those 75W bulb/ballast combos but if I see the right host... (hmmm, FM is having that big sale)

  6. #36

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by Thatspec View Post
    OK guys, I did see the step down to 24W on the FF3, along with the audible click at about 13 minutes of walking around in 55-60 degrees. It's still darn bright though, after a minute I couldn't remember how much brighter it had been. It was pretty hot after 30 minutes, I was keeping my hand further back toward the tail for comfort. Also heard the click when it was off and cooling, assuming this was the temp reset.

    Jayrob, your magmod looks awesome I've got to resist getting one of those 75W bulb/ballast combos but if I see the right host... (hmmm, FM is having that big sale)
    Thanks for the compliment!

    Details of the build shown here...
    Last edited by jayrob; 06-17-2012 at 01:52 PM.

  7. #37
    Flashaholic* mvyrmnd's Avatar
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    Mine arrived today. I've taken a few comparison photos

    From left to right: Arlec Spotlight fitted with a 6000K 55W HID kit, FFIII, Jetbeam M1X V1 (3x18350) and my Mac's 3300L.





    It's a very broad selection of lights, my biggest light, my newest, my only LED thrower and a massive flood monster.

    What this little comarison will show is just how capable the little FFIII is

    The tree is 120m away. A control shot is pointless as it would only be black All the photos were taken with an iPhone 4S, on HDR mode and the exposure upped (all by the same amount) to get it a bit closer to real life.

    55W HID Spotlight


    FFIII


    M1X


    3300L


    The 3300L puts out a huge amount of light, but it's all out of answers at 25m. The FFIII has quite a wide hotspot thanks to the OP reflector, but for lighting up a footy oval without making your arm tired, it's just magic. It's a little bit ridiculous seeing that amount of light coming from something so small. The M1X is outclassed in every way and it's clearly obvious that the 55W Spotlight's 7" reflector outguns eveything else.

    In short, I like it a lot
    Last edited by mvyrmnd; 06-18-2012 at 10:58 PM.

  8. #38

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Nice comparisons!

    I like that Arlec mod. I built a similar spot light for KuanR, and still have it for him because he is out of the area and has not taken delivery yet...

    But I didn't want to use it in my comparisons, because it just wasn't fair. It's a 100W 4300K with a 7" reflector that would just crush these smaller lights:




    Details of the build shown here...

    P.S. Can you PM me a link to where you got your host for the large yellow? I like that voltage indicator you have on there. Is that what that is? I would like to learn more about that build!
    Last edited by jayrob; 06-18-2012 at 10:43 PM.

  9. #39
    BVH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Being the tinkerer and skeptic I am, I wanted to be sure my FF3 was putting out as advertised! First, it is definitely regulated. (Not that I had any question about this but always nice to confirm) As Voltage dropped while in use and fully warmed up, Amperage increased and the calculation always resulted in the same Watts (Input). When Voltage hit 13.00, Amps was 4.02 for a total Input Watts of 52.26. Using the familiar ballast efficiency of 80%, my FF3 is putting out 41.81 Watts to the bulb. Now for the usually disclaimer: Output is AC so to be 100% accurate, I'd need a special $2500+ meter capable of simultaneous, very high count Amp and Volt readings and of determining Power Factor Correction. But for us, it's close enough. Not sure why the Chinese translated FF3 thread was referring to something about a 5 Amp manual setting (by-passing step down)? They see 5 Amps and probably more like 8-9 Amps for a micro-second on start up but will never see 5 Amps when running after warm up. Not even when the cells are nearly empty at 3.0V.

    After testing, I took it outside and with a 500-700 foot overcast ceiling, I could easily see a soft glow on the cloud bases.
    Last edited by BVH; 06-18-2012 at 10:22 PM.
    WWII 60" Anti Aircraft Carbon Arc (Sold), Short Arcs: 1.6KW NightSun, 1KW VSS-3A, .8KW TrakkaBeam, 600 Watt M-134 Gun Light, 500 Watt X-500-14s, 500 Watt Starburst, 300 Watt Locators, Megaray, 150 Watt Set Beam & Communicator, Maxabeam Gen3, LarryK14@52V

  10. #40

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by BVH View Post
    Being the tinkerer and skeptic I am, I wanted to be sure my FF3 was putting out as advertised! First, it is definitely regulated. (Not that I had any question about this but always nice to confirm) As Voltage dropped while in use and fully warmed up, Amperage increased and the calculation always resulted in the same Watts (Input). When Voltage hit 13.00, Amps was 4.02 for a total Input Watts of 52.26. Using the familiar ballast efficiency of 80%, my FF3 is putting out 41.81 Watts to the bulb. Now for the usually disclaimer: Output is AC so to be 100% accurate, I'd need a special $2500+ meter capable of simultaneous, very high count Amp and Volt readings and of determining Power Factor Correction. But for us, it's close enough. Not sure why the Chinese translated FF3 thread was referring to something about a 5 Amp manual setting (by-passing step down)? They see 5 Amps and probably more like 8-9 Amps for a micro-second on start up but will never see 5 Amps when running after warm up. Not even when the cells are nearly empty at 3.0V.

    After testing, I took it outside and with a 500-700 foot overcast ceiling, I could easily see a soft glow on the cloud bases.
    Good to know, thanks for measuring battery current draw...

    At full charge what was it drawing from the batteries after warmed up? Maybe 3.5 Amps?

  11. #41
    BVH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    I'm using AW IMR 1600's and had about 7 minutes run time on the batteries prior to the test so I don't know what steady Amps are with topped off cells. But I'm sure your 3.5 is in the ball park, maybe even a bit less.
    Last edited by BVH; 06-18-2012 at 10:42 PM.
    WWII 60" Anti Aircraft Carbon Arc (Sold), Short Arcs: 1.6KW NightSun, 1KW VSS-3A, .8KW TrakkaBeam, 600 Watt M-134 Gun Light, 500 Watt X-500-14s, 500 Watt Starburst, 300 Watt Locators, Megaray, 150 Watt Set Beam & Communicator, Maxabeam Gen3, LarryK14@52V

  12. #42

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Good to know...


  13. #43
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    Cool Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    My FFIII is clocking in at 224k lux at 1m and eating 18350 cells (not a typo...kids don't try this at home) at a clip of 4 every 10:51. Lovin' me some FFIII!!!
    Last edited by Colonel Sanders; 06-18-2012 at 11:48 PM.
    SPY 007 XM-L2, BVH 150w Vec192 HID, Gen III Maxabeam, Barn Burner, FireFox III, Mac's Customs 3840L & Damascus/Cu/Al Tri-EDCs, ma_sha1 FrankenMag, Drake, MF Scorpion 4x XM-L2, Tri-219 EYE10, XP-G2 X10

  14. #44

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    I've got 8 of those new Panasonic 3400mAh cells... (NCR18650B)

    They are really nice cells.

    The Fire-Foxes III is unbelievable!

  15. #45

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Worthy of the double post...

    I just got news that the ebay seller has listed the lights with 4300K bulbs now.

    I asked them to also list the bulb replacements for 4300K because of lots of people that already have the lights and want to get replacement bulbs.

    So that should be easy to find soon enough with a search for 'HID flashlight bulb 4300k'...

  16. #46

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    where can you buy this light ?

  17. #47

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by hahoo View Post
    where can you buy this light ?
    Which one? Fire-Foxes?

  18. #48

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    yeah...

  19. #49

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by hahoo View Post
    yeah...
    Since they don't like us to quote sale sites, you can just Google 'Fire-Foxes Group Buy'

    Then you will see a link to the GB that Lips did...

    From there, you can try to see if he is going to possibly do another GB, because there was a huge savings. Not only that, but these are just about impossible to get.

  20. #50
    Flashaholic* jmpaul320's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    i ran my ff3 infront of my air conditioner tonight for 20 mins lol .... no step down

  21. #51

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by jmpaul320 View Post
    i ran my ff3 infront of my air conditioner tonight for 20 mins lol .... no step down
    Mine stepped down after 8 1/2 minutes in normal room temp...

    But the 24W is still very bright!

    Can't believe this little cannon...

  22. #52
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    My top 4 lights right now are Barn Burner, Maxabeam, FF3, Mac's Customs 3840L.


    Not bad company for the little guy.
    SPY 007 XM-L2, BVH 150w Vec192 HID, Gen III Maxabeam, Barn Burner, FireFox III, Mac's Customs 3840L & Damascus/Cu/Al Tri-EDCs, ma_sha1 FrankenMag, Drake, MF Scorpion 4x XM-L2, Tri-219 EYE10, XP-G2 X10

  23. #53

    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Sanders View Post
    My top 4 lights right now are Barn Burner, Maxabeam, FF3, Mac's Customs 3840L.


    Not bad company for the little guy.
    Yeah hanging out with the big boys!

    It's getting all the attention because of how bright it is, along with it's incredibly small size.

    But I should mention that the Magic Scorpion is also a very nice 40W HID! (IMO)

    It is comparable in throw, with a deeper reflector. The one thing that really stands out to me, is how quite the ballast is for the Scorpion...

  24. #54
    Flashaholic* mvyrmnd's Avatar
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    I've decided that the 3300L and the FFIII are a good match. Easily handheld, each hugely powerful, once a wall of light and the other with some punch.

    I've been running on AW IMR 1600's. Mine stepped down after 9 mins while tailstanding on the kitchen table. The light cut out after 25 mins, the batteries came out at 3.5, 3.5, 3.1 and 2.6 volts. It appears I have one weak battery, but the circuit seems to be able to monitor them individually and cut out to protect the weaker cell. The others still had a good 20% left in them.
    Last edited by mvyrmnd; 06-22-2012 at 07:46 PM.

  25. #55
    BVH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by mvyrmnd View Post
    ............... The light cut out after 25 mins, the batteries came out at 3.5, 3.5, 3.1 and 2.6 volts. It appears I have one weak battery, but the circuit seems to be able to monitor them individually and cut out to protect the weaker cell. The others still had a good 20% left in them.
    I would guess that each cell is not monitored for voltage but that the LVC circuit tripped on overall pack low Voltage. Further guessing that each of your cells recovered to your measured Voltage total of 12.7V in the time it took you to get them out and measure them but that the LVC tripped at 12V.
    WWII 60" Anti Aircraft Carbon Arc (Sold), Short Arcs: 1.6KW NightSun, 1KW VSS-3A, .8KW TrakkaBeam, 600 Watt M-134 Gun Light, 500 Watt X-500-14s, 500 Watt Starburst, 300 Watt Locators, Megaray, 150 Watt Set Beam & Communicator, Maxabeam Gen3, LarryK14@52V

  26. #56
    Flashaholic* mvyrmnd's Avatar
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    I guess that'd be more likely

    So if my weak cell got much weaker it'd be over discharging and pushing the safety limits.

    Time for new batteries!

  27. #57
    BVH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Yes, a very good point you make. LVC is not fool-proof protection for unprotected cells in Series. Best to charge all four cells in the same charger at the same time - even though the charger might have four independent circuits and you may get varying finish voltages. They're bound to be close, though. Or better yet, parallel charge them in a custom made cradle as I do.
    WWII 60" Anti Aircraft Carbon Arc (Sold), Short Arcs: 1.6KW NightSun, 1KW VSS-3A, .8KW TrakkaBeam, 600 Watt M-134 Gun Light, 500 Watt X-500-14s, 500 Watt Starburst, 300 Watt Locators, Megaray, 150 Watt Set Beam & Communicator, Maxabeam Gen3, LarryK14@52V

  28. #58
    Flashaholic* mvyrmnd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    Quote Originally Posted by BVH View Post
    Yes, a very good point you make. LVC is not fool-proof protection for unprotected cells in Series. Best to charge all four cells in the same charger at the same time - even though the charger might have four independent circuits and you may get varying finish voltages. They're bound to be close, though. Or better yet, parallel charge them in a custom made cradle as I do.
    I've built a parallel charger for my unprotected 32650's I use in my 3300L to ensure they're properly balanced. They go in the same and come out 0.1V different. Not bad by my reckoning.

    I do charge the 4 IMR's in the same charger and they all come out within 0.05V of each other, but it seems this one cell in particular is a bit weak.

    For now I won't bother too much. I know I get a solid 20mins out of them, and will just avoid running it until shut off. Once I buy 4 new, dedicated cells for the FFIII I'll look into a dedicated, parallel, charger for them.

  29. #59
    Flashaholic* jmpaul320's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fire-Foxes III compared to Magic Scorpion 40W and 85W Ebay HID...

    anyone running the new panasonic 3400mahs? just wondering how much more runtime you are getting and how the cells run?

    Im running sanyo 2600s now, they seem to fit better in the battery case... i tried aw3100s, they were a tight fit... i noticed running the sanyos, the light seems to get a little hotter faster... its the same thing when i run a single sanyo 2600 in a different light as well... maybe the discharge current is slightly higher from these cells?

  30. #60
    Flashaholic* mvyrmnd's Avatar
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    If that were the case, the IMR's I'm using would be getting toasty.

    It's possible the lower the internal resistance of the cell (IMR is much lower than LiCo) the lower the temp of the cell when under load.

    The 2600 would have a higher IR than the 3100, therefore run hotter under high load.

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