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Thread: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

  1. #1
    Flashaholic* LEDAdd1ct's Avatar
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    Default Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Just picked up two of the Sylvania 14 watt, 1100 lumen LED bulbs, stated to be roughly equivalent to a 75 watt incandescent. Have them running in two lamps right now. Quick first impressions:

    1) They run way cooler than the 100w bulbs that were in there, as my living room is no longer an instant oven

    2) They are not quite as bright, since they are spec'ed at being roughly equivalent to a 75 watt incandescent, as opposed to the 100 watt incandescent bulbs they replaced

    3) Color temperature, rated at 2700k, is very close to an incandescent...if you were not a flashoholic you would not notice the difference...and even then, unless someone told you to look, you probably would not notice the difference

    4) When listening up close, there is a very noticeable hum, like listening to power lines...I am guessing it is the circuit that takes the 120v AC and makes it DC

    5) The light is distributed very, very evenly! This is a major plus. I am very proud that LEDs have come this far and can drop right into common A19 sockets. Way to go Osram/Sylvania!

    Model = LED14A19
    Also known as Sylvania Model 78911

    Power Draw = 14 watts
    Apparent Incandescent Equivalent = 75 watts
    Stated CRI = 80
    Stated Color Temp = 2700K

    Apparent Color Temp = Good
    Actual Temperature (hand around bulb) = Very Good
    Power Draw in Watts = Very Good
    Uniform Light Distribution = Very Good
    Mercury = No
    Noticeable Hum = Bad

    I probably would not use these if you are sensitive to low frequency hums, or in a bedside lamp. Other than that, I'd say these are pretty darn cool and a step in the right direction!

    EDIT: I swapped the 100 watt bulb into a different lamp in the same room, and compared them. The 100 watt incandescent is noticeably brighter, but more than that, the 100 CRI is noticeable vs. the 80 CRI of the Osram. The LED bulbs appear yellower, while the 100 watt incandescent has better tint and a fuller palette of colors on the objects the light strikes. I'd love to see an 18 or 20 watt LED bulb equivalent to a 100 watt incandescent, with comparable lumens...soon, I suppose...as for the tint, we're close, but the CRI at 80 for the LED vs. 100 for the incandescent isn't quite there yet. But we are not far out...
    Last edited by LEDAdd1ct; 09-01-2012 at 10:07 PM.
    "...and the diode multiplied and grew in brightness. And God saw that it was good."

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    The efficacy of 78 lumens per watt at 2700K is excellent for a 75 watt equivalent bulb! The highest efficacy CFL I have ever seen is 77 lumens per watt.

    Two issues concerning Energy Star certification.

    The minimum lumens required for a 75 watt equivalent bulb are 1110 not the 1100 of this bulb.
    The humming noise is an issue. Energy Star specs require the bulb produce less than 24dBa measured at a distance of 12 inches from the bulb.

    By any chance is there a dimmer on the circuit this lamp is on? Or, is the lamp one of those tri-light(3 preset levels of illumination) units?

  3. #3
    Flashaholic* LEDAdd1ct's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by slebans View Post
    By any chance is there a dimmer on the circuit this lamp is on? Or, is the lamp one of those tri-light(3 preset levels of illumination) units?
    1) The lamps were purchased from the local Goodwill. They are vintage, and operate as follows...

    From OFF state we get:

    1) Rotate knob once, nothing
    2) Rotate knob twice, light
    3) Rotate knob three times, light (same level as before)
    4) Rotate knob four times, OFF

    This is with the incandescent. There is no noticeable change in brightness.

    The bulbs were $40.00 each from Lowe's. I will be returning them for four reasons, reasons which impact me but may not necessarily impact others:

    1) For $40.00 they were really neat to try out, but too expensive to keep. I need to find out what my rate is per kilowatt hour, and figure out how long these would take to pay for themselves at, say, six hours a day.

    2) They are not quite bright enough for my living room. The 100 watt incandescent bulb is just a bit brighter, but it does make a difference.

    3) The tint isn't quite there. It is just, just slightly too warm for me at 2700K...I think I would like maybe 3400K or 4000K better, as these are just a little too yellow. They are kind of like a Cree 5B.

    4) I don't care for the hum.

    When they can release a 100 watt equivalent bulb (not a press release as linked below, but the actual bulb!)

    Link

    without the hum, then I will probably deal with the color being ever so slightly "off" a higher CRI source. I think the extra lumens would compensate for that. But the real killer for me on a shoestring budget is price. I tried a few of these

    Link One
    Link Two
    Link Three

    and like the first one best, because it shows usage by the month and by the year.

    I also used these two maps to do a quick and dirty cost estimate:

    Map One

    Map Two

    Please forgive my math skills, but this is what I get:

    First I go here, and find out that, assuming 15 cents per kw/hour, running a 100 watt bulb for six hours a night per year equals $32.76 per year:

    Link

    Using the $40.00 Sylvania 75 watt equivalent this thread concerns, with a 14 watt draw, we get this:

    Link

    a rate of $4.59 per year.

    Okay, so, we get:

    $32.76 - $4.59 = $28.17 saved over one year

    Now we need to save $40.00 - $28.17 to justify the cost of the bulb.

    $40.00 - $28.17 = about $11.83, or about $12.00

    At $2.17 per month difference between the 100 watt draw of the incandescent ($2.52 per month) and the 14 watt draw of the LED (35˘ per month), we need an additional seven months for the bulb to pay for itself:


    Initial outlay for bulb = $40.00

    Amount saved per month = $2.17

    $2.17 per month * 19 months = $41.23 saved

    So, in one year and seven months, the bulb will pay for itself.

    Please, please, please check my math!

    Also, let me know which calculator you guys prefer. I like doing one thing at a time, and having both the monthly and yearly cost immediately available, which is why I like this one best:

    Link

    @slebans, I will try the LED bulb on both lamp settings. I don't know why the twisty knob has two ON positions, when two seem exactly the same.

    Will report back shortly...

    NOTE: This press release here has a handy table showing Osram/Sylvania's linup.

    Link

    This thread is about the A19-14w. I'd love to try the A21-20w, with a 20 watt draw and 100 watt equivalent (to incandescent) output. But Lowe's didn't have any, and I am not sure if they are out yet.

    The other big thing is this: In one year and seven months, what will the same $40.00 get me? More lumens? Better tint? Higher CRI? Lower power consumption? Hmm...

    One thing is for sure, though. With respect to the light distribution, you would not know these were not incandescent bulbs, and that is a win all on its own.

    One more thing: For the lumens, these put out way less heat than incandescent bulbs! So if the area you want to light gets hot all on its own and you want to put a stop to that, these will cure the problem very quickly!

    EDIT: Nope, humming does not go away when rotating lamp twisty switch/knob to different positions. Sylvania needs to get rid of that hum.
    Last edited by LEDAdd1ct; 09-02-2012 at 10:46 AM.
    "...and the diode multiplied and grew in brightness. And God saw that it was good."

  4. #4

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    sounds like you have 3-way lamps.... you can buy 3-way CFLs but the medium and high levels are too close together to really separate them as one being more useful than the other. I have one lamp with a 50/100/150 CFL.. wish they made a 15/70/200 or something like that
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  5. #5
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Thanks for the review.


    Hopefully when you return the globe you can incorporate this with some other shopping etc. If it’s a one off trip to take the globe back there are a few costs involved here!




    I bought one of the Philips 17/75 watt lights. It has a very good quality light. I only bought the one to test as it cost the earth (while doing some other shopping), but kept it, at least I have an asset over spending the money on cappuccinos!


    LED lighting is looking more & more worthwhile in my part of the world, 28.0 cents per kw, over 2000 kw usage per quarter 37.7 cents per kw. With lots of price increases over the next few years being forecast!

  6. #6
    Flashaholic wws944's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    One year and seven months for breakeven is really not that bad. (Consider that the "save the earth" types here in California are pushing solar panels which, even after massive tax rebates, are more like 10-15 years to breakeven.) Our Tier 2 and Tier 3 rates are more like $0.30-$0.50/kwh. The breakeven point for highly used bulbs, like in my kids bedrooms or in the kitchen, is under a year.

    BTW, here is a fun calculator that takes into account cost of bulbs and expected life times: http://www.superbrightleds.com/energ...calculator.php
    Last edited by wws944; 09-04-2012 at 10:41 AM.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by wws944 View Post
    One year and seven months for breakeven is really not that bad. (Consider that the "save the earth" types here in California are pushing solar panels which, even after massive tax rebates, are more like 10-15 years to breakeven.) Our Tier 2 and Tier 3 rates are more like $0.30-$0.50/kwh. The breakeven point for highly used bulbs, like in my kids bedrooms or in the kitchen, is under a year.

    BTW, here is a fun calculator that takes into account cost of bulbs and expected life times: http://www.superbrightleds.com/energ...calculator.php
    I think the problem with LED bulbs is they refuse to compare themselves to CFLs in savings as most of us use CFLs already the savings over them is practically nothing compared to incan savings.
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Arc View Post
    I think the problem with LED bulbs is they refuse to compare themselves to CFLs in savings as most of us use CFLs already the savings over them is practically nothing compared to incan savings.
    This is very true! The savings are great compared to incan, but marginal compared to CFL. I'm waiting for the technology to mature to 200lm/W...then we'll really have something.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by ratsbew View Post
    This is very true! The savings are great compared to incan, but marginal compared to CFL. I'm waiting for the technology to mature to 200lm/W...then we'll really have something.
    Sometimes the savings is ZERO compared to CFLs I have seen LED bulbs that are LESS efficient than CFLs in the stores but in some cases they may be preferred anyway. I am thinking when 200 Lm/W LEDs become mainstream, that is when most made are that efficiency or better we could see LED bulbs in the 150 Lm/W range and if produced in quantity the prices could see under $15 for a 100 watt equivalent bulb. The CFLs I have seen are from 40 to ~70 Lm/W with average in the 50s to 60s while LED bulbs are perhaps into the mid 70s at the top end and in the 40s at the bottom also as the less efficient ones seem the very low output ones replacing chandelier bulbs and perhaps 12v halogen lighting (spotlights, PAR I think).
    My advice is to keep buying CFLs for a few more years.. LED bulbs will overtake them just like CFLs went from $25 to $2 today I think we could see $8 LED bulbs putting out 500-700 lumens in the next 8-10 years if not sooner.
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  10. #10
    Flashaholic* Steve K's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynx_Arc View Post
    I think the problem with LED bulbs is they refuse to compare themselves to CFLs in savings as most of us use CFLs already the savings over them is practically nothing compared to incan savings.
    Can't argue with that. I've got CFLs installed in places where the light will be on for a long time. In places where the light will be turned on and off frequently or only used briefly, I've either left it as incandescent or put together a LED light.

    I do still have the bathroom to deal with.... but I'm considering making something from Seoul Acriche 2 LEDs. It gets used enough that there would be an energy savings, and the fixture doesn't take CFLs (and gets turned on and off frequently enough that CFLs might not be a good solution regardless).

  11. #11

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    If you look all the data on the Dept of Energy's Caliper testing site *most* of the bigger name LED retrofits have exceeded CFL in terms of absolute efficiency. Some by a considerable margin. Most of us would agree that the light quality from the better bulbs is more than superior to the typical cheap phosphor set used in your average CFL as well. Obviously there are junky LED retrofits that need to be avoided.

    In terms of brute force light for the dollar though it's a different story. A 27watt, $3.99 daylight CFL throws a lot of light for the money and you should be able to get a couple years out of it.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve K View Post
    Can't argue with that. I've got CFLs installed in places where the light will be on for a long time. In places where the light will be turned on and off frequently or only used briefly, I've either left it as incandescent or put together a LED light.

    I do still have the bathroom to deal with.... but I'm considering making something from Seoul Acriche 2 LEDs. It gets used enough that there would be an energy savings, and the fixture doesn't take CFLs (and gets turned on and off frequently enough that CFLs might not be a good solution regardless).
    Yes CFL's are a bargain now for heavy use areas that see few on/off cycles during a day while LEDs would probably be a good choice for something that gets a lot of on/off in a day with moderate use... if the usage is very short like a minute at a time 10 times a day even an incan may be fine with it as the cost savings is negligible but the wear on electronic based lighting reduce longevity on them. A bathroom light is an idea place for LEDs especially if you can get a very good CRI one for the ladies to primp under. I have a CFL in my bathroom that was put in there 8 years ago still going strong and it is inside a glass globe even but the longest it runs a day is when someone takes a shower for about 5-20 minutes at a time.
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  13. #13

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    Quote Originally Posted by blasterman View Post
    If you look all the data on the Dept of Energy's Caliper testing site *most* of the bigger name LED retrofits have exceeded CFL in terms of absolute efficiency. Some by a considerable margin. Most of us would agree that the light quality from the better bulbs is more than superior to the typical cheap phosphor set used in your average CFL as well. Obviously there are junky LED retrofits that need to be avoided.

    In terms of brute force light for the dollar though it's a different story. A 27watt, $3.99 daylight CFL throws a lot of light for the money and you should be able to get a couple years out of it.
    I think the major problem is LED screw in base replacements are "barely" exceeding CFLs, with the very latest and most efficent models rather costly right now... and energy prices for the most part cheap enough that in most parts of the US it would take 15-20 years for the cost savings along with replacement of CFLs when they wear out to equal one LED bulb. CFL bulbs had it a lot easier than LED bulbs because even at $20 when they first came out the savings in electricity was tremendous.. you could save up to 80% using them while LEDs vs CFLs the savings is perhaps 10-20% at most if you compare the more efficient CFLs vs the mid range to top LED ones. Even when they hit 50% more efficient the energy savings compared to CFLs is 80% less than comparing to incans... in other words when a CFL takes 12 watts and you have a 50% more efficient LED that puts out the same amount of light for 8 watts you are only saving 4 watts... when the two bulbs replace a 60 watt bulb one is saving 48 watts the other 52 watts. the differences vs incans is such that one bulb is 48/60 or 80% more efficient the other 52/60 or 86.67% more efficient. not even 7% more efficient compared to incans. Is the 7% more efficient worth $20+ in cost more? That is the question people should ask themselves.
    One other thing to consider..... 80% savings going to CFL from incan, vs 7% from CFL to LED or 10% savings which means a CFL vs incan recoups their investment 10 times as fast as if you go from a CFL to LED.
    Last edited by Lynx_Arc; 09-05-2012 at 12:41 PM.
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  14. #14
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    CFL only last about 2 years now if you are lucky, & they are not 50 cents a globe!

    So until LED globes have been engineered to last 5 minutes they are still worth looking at!

  15. #15
    Flashaholic wws944's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    If ones sole criteria is lumens/watt/$$, then CFL beats LED. But there are a lot of other reasons to choose LED over CFL in many applications. (Insert usual things like dimmability, CRI, safety, etc.)

  16. #16
    Flashaholic* LEDAdd1ct's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    ...obsession with LEDs...
    "...and the diode multiplied and grew in brightness. And God saw that it was good."

  17. #17

    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    One area where I think we all agree LED replacement pretty much annihilates the older tech is with recessed incandescent. The Cree based fixtures started this trend but increasingly other brands are stepping into the market and doing a marvelous job. Efficiency is orders of magnitude superior, the replacement cost ratio isn't that bad, longevity is a given, and in most cases color is either equal, or better.

    Still, recessed incan could have just as easily been replaced by linear CFL decades ago had it not been for residential architects / electricians living in the 50's. The cookie cutter building boom in the 90's just spread the bad ideas. So, on one hand LED has made stunning leaps in this application, but on the other had it's replacing a technology (dedicated incan fixtures) that should have been killed off years ago.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Sylvania Ultra LED 14w 1100 Lumen (like incan 75w)...

    My Kill-A-Watt meter pegs this one at 16.7 watts, a bit of a disappointment for a bulb spec'd at 14 watts. Of 11 models of led bulbs I have tested, 8 have drawn below spec, and only 3 have been over, so it's unlikely that my meter is reading high.

    Other than consuming 20% more power than spec, it has proven to be a good replacement for a 75 watt table lamp.
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