Whats the technical definition of light vs ultralight backpacking in cold weather?

I was just reading a definition of the difference between the 3 categories of hiking/backpacking: 1.Traditional, 2. lightweight, 3. ultralightweight. They said that technically a lightweight pack weighs under 20lbs, while an ultralight pack weighs under 10lbs. A traditional pack can weigh 30-60lbs.

Back in 2007, I was invited on a backpacking trip for 3 days/2 nights down the Appalachian trail in Shenandoah natl park, along Skyline Drive. But the trip was to happen in early February. I have no problem with winter camping or backpacking. I've easily done just as much camping out in winter than in summer. So I quickly said "Yes"!

Problem was, I no longer owned any good quality, new-ish backpacking stuff that was newer than 15 years old! Not only that, but what stuff I did still have was average at best(and old). I was not outfitted for a long winter backpacking trip through the mountains. I know all about the ultralight, single person tents that weight 2lbs, and have so little room that you MUST lay down in them at all times. I dont like the idea of that unless I am backpacking alone....,.No, I dont like it even then!

I have always owned 2 person tents that were roomy enough for 2 people to comfortably sit up, stretch out, and still have room for your boots inside at your feet, and still be able to bring in your jacket and clothes so they arent all cold the next morning! So I looked for a lightweight 2 person tent that weighs no more than about 5- 5.3 lbs, which is pretty light for that size tent, especially a well built, durable tent with a fly and footprint. I bought a Marmot tent. I bought the ultralight Osprey Atmos 50 pack. I bought a light, mid priced sleeping bag good to 30 degrees F. Then we found out just before the trip a major cold front was coming through, and we were stuck with 2 nights with temps down to 6-8 degrees F, and daily highs of around 22 degrees. My sleeping bag wasnt good enough, so I borrowed a terrible Slumberjack bag that was allegedly good to 10 degrees, and was cold all night! It weighed about 8 lbs! I usually can handle a bag thats 5-10 degrees above the outside temp because I like it cool, but this wasnt good. Later I bought a Marmot Helium down bag that weighs 2 lbs, good to at least 15 degrees.


Long story short, I took way too much stuff with me in 2007, and my pack weighed about 32lbs, and I didnt use much of the stuff the entire time, so the next year I brought less on 2008's winter trip(also February) to the AT in Pa. This time I still brought lots of stuff like my Katadyn Guide filter, MSR Simmerlite stove, lots of light backpacking clothes, etc., but my pack was still around 22-24lbs full. Granted it was winter and you MUST bring more, thicker clothes, jackets, socks, insulated boots, plus 3 days of food, etc. Water, water filter, stove, mess kit, plate, bowl, cup, tent, sleeping bag, Nalgene bottles etc. plus the weight of the pack itself.


There's often this wealthy guy who goes with us who sold a software firm he started in about 2004, at 29 years old for 12 million dollars! He always has new, high tech ultralight gear of the finest quality, yet his pack weighed 15lbs on both trips, so I dont see how you can safely pack for winter and bring less than 10lbs for a 3 day trip without starving, freezing, going without water, or just being uncomfortable! In summer I could easily get my pack down to 17 lbs or so for a 3 days trip, by not bringing my entire tent, only the footprint and fly. Or just the tent without the fly or footprint, which is all mesh except for the floor and parts of the ceiling, etc.


How can a person possibly pack less than 10lbs in mid winter? What do you consider to be reasonable weight for backpacking in colder weather? Warmer weather?

A lightweight backpacker searches for the lightest AAA torch - no matter how much it costs.

An ultralight backpacker uses a rubber band to hold the LED wires onto the battery contacts.

cold all night is the worst! whats the point of low weight if youre miserable? the answer is no you cant be comfortable in winter with 10 pounds..unless its for one dry night with a 5 lb bag...
Id bet the rich guy had uranium buried under his tent for the warmth..

..an ultralight backpacker has a whittled down toothbrush..

could you do something with other items in your bag. for example, heat some hot water and throw it in a bottle to keep next to your core. or hike at night and rest in the day.
or do a two person tent and cuddle with the other dude lol(share the weight too)

This Thread would fit perfectly in the new CPF EDC forum.

Ultralight packing can give a way of a good light in the cold weather and it can be easily be access in the cold weather.

Either way, These boots would be awesome for ultralight, winter, backpacking. The grip is out of this world. And as far as a pack... I think that I personally could get my pack down to 20 pounds for a 1-2 night excursion. Any lighter and I wouldn't feel safe, because I'd be taking away gear that is very likely I'll need. And as far as a light, it would probably be a foursevens QP2L-X. just run it on low the whole time and you should be good to go. or maybe a preon with lithium AAA and then a spare. or two.

My spring and fall pack weighs around 24lbs INCLUDING food and some water. Winter pack is around 27lbs. I've tried the <15lb thing but wasn't comfortable and felt more like a hobo just surviving out there. I've seen people with about ~15lb in the winter, but any less I would have to see it for myself.

Bobpuvel said:

Either way, These boots would be awesome for ultralight, winter, backpacking. The grip is out of this world. And as far as a pack... I think that I personally could get my pack down to 20 pounds for a 1-2 night excursion. Any lighter and I wouldn't feel safe, because I'd be taking away gear that is very likely I'll need. And as far as a light, it would probably be a foursevens QP2L-X. just run it on low the whole time and you should be good to go. or maybe a preon with lithium AAA and then a spare. or two.

Click to expand...

I just received my new cool weather, early spring, fall boots yesterday, they are Rocky Silent Stalkers, and they wear like sneakers almost. Here they are:

http://www.midwestboots.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=RK1890

But about 2 weeks ago I ordered another pair of Rocky boots, and I wanted the Rocky Lynx hunting boots for hiking, because I used them on other backpacking trips and they were great all around, but now Rocky is discontinuing that model and replacing it with other models, so I found a pair of more upscale Rocky Lynx boots called Rocky Lynx RTAP boots, with 800 gram Thinsulate Ultra instead of the 400 gram in the base model Lynx boots I'd bought before, but when I got them in, they are a mid winter boot, but the pictures didnt show that, so I now have 2 new pairs of boots, when I only really wanted to buy one right now. At least they are on sale for $119 instead of the $160-$170 they normally cost:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008Z4LIAO/?tag=cpf0b6-20

The soles on the Silent Stalkers are nice and all, but the soles on the RTAP Lynx boots are just awesome!

There are three ways to pack for a winter trip. 1. Pack light, spend little, and freeze. 2. Pack heavy, spend a decent amount, and stay warm. 3. Pack light, spend a lot, and stay warm. (Avoid #1.)

On winter trips, most people will not be comfortable packing light. This involves a tarp tent, a Gore-tex bivy sack with poles, and a 0 degree or better Down sleeping bag. You will be warm in your sleeping bag, but freeze anywhere else. You will end up packing a lot of clothes for warmth. While these clothes may not be in your backpack, they should be considered as part of the weight. Your shelter may become a kite and blow away in the wind as well. I would not suggest this type of backpacking in winter unless you can find some trees for cover to block out the wind as well as a way to maintain a fire to stay warm outdoors.

#2 is packing heavy. This is what most do in the winter to not freeze. They pack a 4 season tent. This will weigh from 6-16 lbs. for a two man tent. They use a warm sleeping bag 0 degrees or better. They bring a white gas or propane stove and plenty of fuel (these are about the only stoves that work in really cold weather, other than wood burning stoves). They carry snow shoes, ice axes, crampons, and possibly rope if crevasses are an issue. Packs can weigh from 50-80 lbs even for short 3-4 day trips.

#3 is packing light but spending a lot. Here is where you purchase high quality specialized gear. For example, you can get gear from places like TitaniumGoat.com and purchase specialized tarp tents for winter that can work with portable wood burning stoves so you can pack light and stay warm without a 4 season tent. You can reduce the weight on your pack to nearly nothing by using a pulk sled, or traveling faster by cross country skiing. Remember that in thick snow, snowshoes will only let you float so much weight before you're postholing with heavy and bulky objects on your feet.

Ultralight backpacking is appealing until you get below freezing. In the 40s and 50s, you can get away with using a 1.5 oz. alcohol titanium stove (Vargo Triad XE). Down to about freezing, you can probably use the same stove on Esbit tablets before seeing diminishing returns (too much fuel used to boil water). Down to about freezing, you can use a 2 lb. 25 degree down sleeping bag. Once you get down into the 20s, you start to freeze in a tarp tent with a bug bivy and have to use a bivy sack with a pole or a four season tent. This adds about 2 to 10+ lbs. Going from a 25 degree bag to a 15 degree bag adds about a lb. In the 20s, alcohol freezes, and wind blows out lit Esbit tablets. You need something that cooks fast. You end up using a butane stove in the 20s. An MSR Pocket Rocket weighs about 3.5 ounces and 12 more ounces per 8 oz. fuel can (need one per 3 days below freezing at least). MSR fuel works into the teens. Below this, you need propane or Coleman fuel. These stoves weigh from 2-4+ lbs. with a full fuel bottle. Into the low teens, you want a 0 degree bag or better. These add about another lb. I would say that on average, you will add at least 5 lbs. of pack weight per 10 degrees F below freezing excluding mountaineering gear (snowshoes, crampons, ice ax, rope, rock and ice climbing gear, avalanche beacon, GPS, etc..)

Some advantages of winter travel are no bugs (leave the bug spray at home), you can melt snow to get water (leave the water filter at home), and there are other ways to carry your pack than on your back.