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Thread: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

  1. #301
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    is a larger thrower in the works yet or still just a pipe dream of mine?

  2. #302

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by tab665 View Post
    is a larger thrower in the works yet or still just a pipe dream of mine?
    Its a good idea but not in active development. How do you see your ideal size/performance balance?
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  3. #303
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by ElectronGuru View Post
    Its a good idea but not in active development. How do you see your ideal size/performance balance?
    something to fill the void surefire left when they discontinued their larger TIR/fresnel lights. although the malkoff hound dog super has filled that spot it didnt replicate the beam surefire had when they first released the M6LT. so something in the 2-3 l-ion cell range, with a M series sized head depending on what lens/optic you go with... but i think it might also be a good time to jump on those larger tesla cell sizes (i forget if its 21700 or 20700) for a couple hours of full output runtime

  4. #304
    Administrator Kestrel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    After using my BOSS for a couple of weeks I do have two firmware suggestions / improvements related to the ‘bounce’ feature – which is IMO one of the greatest innovations I’ve seen in my years here at CPF.

    Permit /mode-specific/ ‘Bounce’ sensitivity settings
    With my ‘Medium’ mode set a little on the high side - ~4-5W - and with bounce sensitivity @ ~84 or so after calibrating @ 'High'; if reflection conditions are optimum, the bounce will trigger on Medium mode as well. I can imagine either wanting bounce to /always/ or /never/ trigger on Medium, so being able to configure/program bounce sensitivity in each mode will permit either configuration reasonably reliably. For example, if I was to always want ‘Bounce’ on my ~4-5W medium mode, it would be nice to be able to set its sensitivity to 100 on ‘Medium’ but only its current ~84 on ‘High’. On the other hand, with that feature option I could just as easily program out 'bounce' completely on 'Medium' if that was desired.

    Permit mode change cycling despite ‘Bounce’ being triggered
    If I want to /discreetly/ cycle to ‘Medium’ or ‘Low’ modes, in a High-first configuration I must avoid triggering ‘bounce’; For example, attempting to cycle to the lower modes while suppressing High-first, traps me in a ‘High-bounce-Red’, ‘High-bounce-Red’ infinite loop of changing modes. ‘Bounce’ is always being prioritized over mode changes, and I don’t imagine it would have to be this way – normal mode change pressing could in theory get me to Medium (& subsequent Low) even if ‘bounce’ is being triggered.

    Thank you & Best regards,
    Last edited by Kestrel; 08-31-2018 at 10:01 AM.

  5. #305
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Just wanted to reiterate an earlier request, made by others here as well for a smaller dedicated AA model --
    same form as the Boss - copper, other metals, etc. This would be a great light (given of course good mode spacing, LED offerings, etc.)!
    I think that the Boss form in this smaller AA version would be a stunning must-have light for many.
    See a few more recent comments as well as comments #250 - #259 especially.

  6. #306
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by Kestrel View Post
    After using my BOSS for a couple of weeks I do have two firmware suggestions / improvements related to the ‘bounce’ feature – which is IMO one of the greatest innovations I’ve seen in my years here at CPF.

    Permit /mode-specific/ ‘Bounce’ sensitivity settings
    With my ‘Medium’ mode set a little on the high side - ~4-5W - and with bounce sensitivity @ ~84 or so after calibrating @ 'High'; if reflection conditions are optimum, the bounce will trigger on Medium mode as well. I can imagine either wanting bounce to /always/ or /never/ trigger on Medium, so being able to configure/program bounce sensitivity in each mode will permit either configuration reasonably reliably. For example, if I was to always want ‘Bounce’ on my ~4-5W medium mode, it would be nice to be able to set its sensitivity to 100 on ‘Medium’ but only its current ~84 on ‘High’. On the other hand, with that feature option I could just as easily program out 'bounce' completely on 'Medium' if that was desired.

    Permit mode change cycling despite ‘Bounce’ being triggered
    If I want to /discreetly/ cycle to ‘Medium’ or ‘Low’ modes, in a High-first configuration I must avoid triggering ‘bounce’; For example, attempting to cycle to the lower modes while suppressing High-first, traps me in a ‘High-bounce-Red’, ‘High-bounce-Red’ infinite loop of changing modes. ‘Bounce’ is always being prioritized over mode changes, and I don’t imagine it would have to be this way – normal mode change pressing could in theory get me to Medium (& subsequent Low) even if ‘bounce’ is being triggered.

    Thank you & Best regards,
    I definitely agree with giving mode-changes priority over bounce-detection. If the bounce-detector is triggered the instant the light is turned-on, it shouldn't actually dim the light until the bounce-detector stops being triggered and starts being triggered a second time. The use-case I'm thinking of is, if you turn-on the light while it's cupped in your hand, then you move your hand away, then you accidentally point the light at a nearby wall. On the other hand, if the bounce-detector isn't triggered until, say, more than 0.5 seconds after the light is turned-on, then it should dim the light as soon as it's triggered instead of waiting for a second trigger.

  7. #307
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by phosphor22 View Post
    Just wanted to reiterate an earlier request, made by others here as well for a smaller dedicated AA model --
    same form as the Boss - copper, other metals, etc. This would be a great light (given of course good mode spacing, LED offerings, etc.)!
    I think that the Boss form in this smaller AA version would be a stunning must-have light for many.
    See a few more recent comments as well as comments #250 - #259 especially.
    A 2xAA version would be larger than the 2x123 version. A 1xAA version would be too weak to power the driver at full brightness, unless you use a 14500 Li-Ion cell instead of a real AA. If you use a 14500 cell you'd get the same performance as you would from the 1x123 version that already exists. So there's no advantage to using AAs with this light. It's just too powerful for alkaline, NiMH, or any type of lithium primary batteries.

  8. #308

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by fyrstormer View Post
    A 2xAA version would be larger than the 2x123 version. A 1xAA version would be too weak to power the driver at full brightness, unless you use a 14500 Li-Ion cell instead of a real AA. If you use a 14500 cell you'd get the same performance as you would from the 1x123 version that already exists. So there's no advantage to using AAs with this light. It's just too powerful for alkaline, NiMH, or any type of lithium primary batteries.
    Yeah, it would need to be a 1xXPL type platform. Which reduces performance, which should also come with a lower price. So the first step would be prioritizing the 371 features to remove to make the board both smaller and cheaper.
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  9. #309
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by ElectronGuru View Post
    Yeah, it would need to be a 1xXPL type platform. Which reduces performance, which should also come with a lower price. So the first step would be prioritizing the 371 features to remove to make the board both smaller and cheaper.
    LOL

  10. #310

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Electron Guru, respectfully, I have only one suggestion: keep inventory of popular designs and product.

    I do not understand why the necessity repeating the process of new designs of limited stock for that are popular and that sell out almost immediately.

    Though there is some art and aesthetic to the popular sold out designs, the product is not Picasso or Renoir, it is high end utility. Marketing research will bear out that far more profit can be made by refilling stock when (actually BEFORE) something sells out, and as the fervor of sales decreases, slowly lowering prices until sales again pick-up, and repeating until market is saturated. Produced in more quantity, unless necessarily all designs are handmade and hand-finished, should decrease the cost per item, and keeping pricing steady, increases profit.

    Case in point: (rhetorically) How many V5 WASP were created, how many sold? What is the business principle behind allowing stock to deplete and sales to end, forever? What purpose could that serve for TorchLAB?

    Even if the group looks at your customer wish lists and only produce an exact amount of items that have been requested, that would be far more beneficial to the group and prospective customers than limited runs that sell out never to be produced again. I'm not an MBA or anything, far from it, but this inscrutable business practice is maddening, and not just to me, but to many other CPF members that end up empty handed with no reason and no possibility of throwing our money enthusiastically to the designers group for unavailable designs.

    Please, the suggestion is, earn more profits by paying attention to popular designs and offering them until market saturation.

    Thank you!

  11. #311
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Many Thanks to Oveready and the Team for being a unique and something of an iconoclast in this current flashlight market. Not many companies sell out of products so fast, and hopefully this keeps it interesting for the Team. A person can be on the Oveready mailing list and should be able to get product when it first becomes available, if they are devoted. Personally, it is refreshing to see an enterprise that does not value profit above all else. One opinion.

  12. #312
    Flashaholic Stoneking's Avatar
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    Default Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by night.hoodie View Post
    Electron Guru, respectfully, I have only one suggestion: keep inventory of popular designs and product.

    Thank you!
    This is most likely due to Oveready being a small team.
    I would imagine they work very hard to produce and provide the quantity of quality items they produce, while designing new ideas / improving on old ideas, shipping orders that have been placed, customer service, sourcing materials as well as their day to day lives. I’m sure I’ve missed a few.
    I would absolutely kill for a Wasp/BOSS style light, Acme threads a must.
    -Maybe even Titanium!
    Hopefully one day, until then I just hope and enjoy the great lights they generously offer.
    But being a small team is quite possibly why they do things the way they do.
    This is just my opinion, also given respectfully.
    Last edited by Stoneking; 11-06-2018 at 04:30 PM.
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  13. #313

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by night.hoodie View Post
    Electron Guru, respectfully, I have only one suggestion: keep inventory of popular designs and product. I do not understand why the necessity repeating the process of new designs of limited stock for that are popular and that sell out almost immediately.
    Thank you for the feedback. Its a great question and no customer wants things to be unnecessarily difficult to buy. Unless its some kind of scarcity game, which is not our way. Our availability problems come down to scale. Were we surefire with built in production and hundreds of dealers each buying 200 of everything we make, I would just order 10000 of everything and it wouldn't be an issue. But we make nearly everything we sell and don't have a wholesale layer to absorb extra quantity or feed it back to us.

    Our production is small scale and spread out. BOSS alone is made across 3 states and 2 countries. And many things we make are essentially prototypes that may or not sell. We made a set of brass BOSS parts and are still selling through them. I made a set of acrylic hosts and sold out the first week. Rushed back to make more (over 2 years ago). Even now selling under cost, they are still on the shelf. And it can take 6 months to make something that sells out in 6 days. Even 6 weeks seeing it go down after 2 weeks, still leaves me sold out for another 5 months.

    Theres also changing tastes. Frosted titanium is a much better finish. Predestressed its doesn't show marks even after severe use that would blemish brighter finishes. But it doest look like other titanium so its hard for customers to show they even bought titanium, so they sat on the shelf. When we launched BOSS, everyone wanted combos. Then everyone wanted complete lights. Now more people want 35's. We are making the next set of titanium BOSS mostly 35, improving availability of those. We are also making extra heads in all metals, allowing dudes to turn their combos into full lights.

    There's also infrastructure and capacity. Wasp and BOSS are made by the same guy (Tom). We made a set of Wasp, then sales slowed and we made a set of BOSS. Demand on the new light was so popular we had to stop Wasp production to make room to make more BOSS. He could invest in capacity to do both but that comes with greater fixed costs that don't go away as demand fades. And we don't charge enough to have the extra cash needed to cover both eventualities.

    There's also competition. When I came out with the first delrin battery capsules, everyone wanted 18650. They are now pouring out of China (in just the 18650 size) so thats now my least popular size (since mine cost more). But I can't make more of the other sizes until the one I used to make more of sells through. Someone sent our McClicky kit to China for duplication, so we take longer to sell the same number of brass or can't make as many at a time (which is why I'm currently out).

    That said, we are making progress. Between Lego and BOSS light pages, there are now 20 light variations ready to ship with no waiting. And we should be able to bring back Wasp next year. Along with new ideas we are also working on.
    Last edited by ElectronGuru; 11-07-2018 at 04:57 PM.
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  14. #314
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Argh. I see the Boss 35 Ti is out of stock again. Maybe I should've bought one immediately and tried to replace the color LED myself, instead of trying to talk you into doing it for me.

  15. #315
    Flashaholic Stoneking's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by ElectronGuru View Post
    And we should be able to bring back Wasp next year.
    Amazing and hopefully becomes a reality!
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  16. #316

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    I'm hoping for a red secondary in a 219C but it seems to be more popular than amber and I usually sold out. Can someone shed some real world experience between the two.
    "It's not rocket surgery"

  17. #317

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by greatscoot View Post
    I'm hoping for a red secondary in a 219C but it seems to be more popular than amber and I usually sold out. Can someone shed some real world experience between the two.
    Here are the benefits




    People who like rich color also like 219 and also prefer amber. So we stock 219/red much less often. But I do have extra boards, so let me know your preferred finish and I'll see if I can arrange it.
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  18. #318
    *Flashaholic* fyrstormer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Red is better for protecting dark-adapted vision, but it also requires dark-adapted vision before you can see anything. My camera can see at night using the red light in my Surefire E2E Triple better than I can -- and if you know anything about cameras, you know they aren't great at seeing at night in the first place. Amber is much easier to see with, provided you haven't been walking around in pitch-blackness for a half-hour and are unlikely to do so in the near future.

  19. #319

    Default Re: Suggestions - Oveready / TorchLAB

    Quote Originally Posted by fyrstormer View Post
    Red is better for protecting dark-adapted vision, but it also requires dark-adapted vision before you can see anything. My camera can see at night using the red light in my Surefire E2E Triple better than I can -- and if you know anything about cameras, you know they aren't great at seeing at night in the first place. Amber is much easier to see with, provided you haven't been walking around in pitch-blackness for a half-hour and are unlikely to do so in the near future.
    Thanks for this info.
    "It's not rocket surgery"

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