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Thread: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

  1. #31
    HKJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    You can get the actual capacity of some RCR123 on my website, but why not make the battery tube slightly larger in diameter and support 18350 cells, you get considerable more energy for 2mm more in diameter.
    My website with battery and charger information: lygte-info.
    More than 1000 reviews of batteries, charges and other stuff.
    Compare 18650 LiIon batteries or smaller (RCR123, 16340, 14500, 10450) LiIon batteries.

  2. #32

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by GrainOfLight View Post
    Do you think that Nitecores claims are reasonable and I should look for another manufacturer to complete my light with better runtime? Or do you think that the claim from my manufacturer i reasonable?
    Do you think it has something to do with the batteries that Nitecore are using or is it more related to the driver circuit within the board?
    Sorry, but I haven't tested various RCRs to confirm their capacity. I suggest you follow HKJ's link, since he has done the most extensive work here.

    But as a general rule, I would treat all manufacturer's claims as suspect until verified independently. My own flashlight testing shows that most runtime specs are not very accurate. Any battery with the same chemistry should give you equivalent output - it is mainly runtime that will vary, directly with actual capacity. For that, you will need find independent tests - manufacturers claim what ever they want.
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  3. #33

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by HKJ View Post
    You can get the actual capacity of some RCR123 on my website, but why not make the battery tube slightly larger in diameter and support 18350 cells, you get considerable more energy for 2mm more in diameter.
    Good point and trhanks for the suggestion. I didn't know these batteries existed. They seem to make CR123A batteries obsolete... Are they a new technology, because I can't see a lot of flashlights out there using this battery. What are the differences between 18350 and 16340 (CR123A), besides the capacity and diameter. Are there any downfalls?

    Thanks again!

  4. #34

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Thanks! Yeah im being very suspicious on these Nitecore claims. I just want to know a general runtime operation for the common XM-L2 using a rechargeable RCR123A at approximately 220 LUMENS. After hearing HKJ's comment I am looking forward to hearing about the 18350 capabilities!

  5. #35
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by GrainOfLight View Post
    Good point and trhanks for the suggestion. I didn't know these batteries existed. They seem to make CR123A batteries obsolete... Are they a new technology, because I can't see a lot of flashlights out there using this battery. What are the differences between 18350 and 16340 (CR123A), besides the capacity and diameter. Are there any downfalls?
    They are just another size of LiIon batteries and the slight increase in diameter leaves space for more capacity.
    When working with RCR123 size you also has to be aware of the different voltages. 16340 and 18350 usual has higher voltage than CR123 (A maximum of 4.2 volt), but you can get some that has a maximum of 3.4 volt (Most common in 16340 size).
    I have written a bit about it here: http://lygte-info.dk/info/CR123A%20a...utes%20UK.html
    My website with battery and charger information: lygte-info.
    More than 1000 reviews of batteries, charges and other stuff.
    Compare 18650 LiIon batteries or smaller (RCR123, 16340, 14500, 10450) LiIon batteries.

  6. #36

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Thanks, th einformation on your page is amazing, I really appreciate your time and effort gone into this! I really like the look of the Ultrafire XSL18350 batteries. I think Trustfire make these, do you know? The Ultrafire XSL18350 seems to be perfect for my light and according to your graphs and data along with the specifications from the CREE XM-L2 we have as follows:

    The CREE XM-L2 delivers approximately 220 LUMENS @ 700mA discharge current. Therefore according to your results, if I request drive the LED @ 700mA, we should get approx 220 LUMENS and see the runtime fall somewhere between 90 mins (discharge @ 0.5A) and 45 minutes (discharge @ 1A): hopefully this falls close to the 1 hour mark

    I see the battery doesn't perform too well at currents over 2A, but for my flahslight with high setting of 220 Lumens, I think I will be fine.

    Do you have any other comments on this battery since doing the test? or do you have another alternative in mind for me that blows this battery out of the water?

    Thanks again, you really have saved me a lot of research time with your data!

    Terrence


    Quote Originally Posted by HKJ View Post
    They are just another size of LiIon batteries and the slight increase in diameter leaves space for more capacity.
    When working with RCR123 size you also has to be aware of the different voltages. 16340 and 18350 usual has higher voltage than CR123 (A maximum of 4.2 volt), but you can get some that has a maximum of 3.4 volt (Most common in 16340 size).
    I have written a bit about it here: http://lygte-info.dk/info/CR123A%20a...utes%20UK.html

  7. #37
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by GrainOfLight View Post
    ... Ultrafire XSL18350 batteries. ...
    Do you have any other comments on this battery since doing the test? or do you have another alternative in mind for me that blows this battery out of the water?
    Ultrafire is often a bad name on batteries, the reason is that multiple factories uses that name and some of them only print wrappers. The biggest problem is with 18650 size, I do not know how much problem there is with the 18350 size.
    My website with battery and charger information: lygte-info.
    More than 1000 reviews of batteries, charges and other stuff.
    Compare 18650 LiIon batteries or smaller (RCR123, 16340, 14500, 10450) LiIon batteries.

  8. #38

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Thanks, have you hear of Trustfire? I am looking at these and ordering direct from the Trustfire factory, so they should be legit.

    http://trustfire.en.alibaba.com/prod...e_battery.html

    Quote Originally Posted by HKJ View Post
    Ultrafire is often a bad name on batteries, the reason is that multiple factories uses that name and some of them only print wrappers. The biggest problem is with 18650 size, I do not know how much problem there is with the 18350 size.

  9. #39
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by GrainOfLight View Post
    Thanks, have you hear of Trustfire? I am looking at these and ordering direct from the Trustfire factory, so they should be legit.

    http://trustfire.en.alibaba.com/prod...e_battery.html
    Trustfire is not a quality brand, but may work.
    My website with battery and charger information: lygte-info.
    More than 1000 reviews of batteries, charges and other stuff.
    Compare 18650 LiIon batteries or smaller (RCR123, 16340, 14500, 10450) LiIon batteries.

  10. #40

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Hi HK and everyone else.

    After a lot of forum reading and questioning, I get the feeling that there is a strong following for AW batreries including the IMR 18350.

    From what I can understand is that IMR allow for a higher discharge current but lower capacity that ICR's.

    In my application I will only have a drive current of around 700mA to 1A. So am I correct in saying that the bets battery for me to use will be a ICR 18350 rather tan an IMR?

    If so, unfortunately AW does not provide the ICR, this may be because Panasonic does not produce the cells... or something along those lines.

    Does anybody know of a manufacturer that sources high quality (potentially Japanese) cells and distributes them as ICR 18350, or am I better suited to selecting an IMR?

    Thanks for all the help.

    Terrence

    Quote Originally Posted by HKJ View Post
    Trustfire is not a quality brand, but may work.

  11. #41
    Flashaholic* RI Chevy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    This thread is for CR123A Lithium primary cells, or at least it started out that way. To avoid confusion, you may want to start a new thread for your questions relating to different battery chemistry.

  12. #42

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Shame lithiums can't be shipped abroad.
    Battery junction have the Titaniums at 98c each but won't send to UK
    I've settled on 7dayshop's own brand.
    4 for £2.59
    We'll see how long they last in my Solarforce Skyline I.

  13. #43

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Sc32w draws 2 - 2.5 amps from Surefire CR123A in H1 mode. Is it safe?

  14. #44

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Got a Solarforce L2P and running a LEDengin 365 UV P-60 drop-in that is rated 4.2v-8.4volts max. What can I expect the runtimes to be using any of these CR123a batteries listed?

  15. #45

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    I know this thread originated in 2013, has battery technology accelerated past the information posted in this thread or is this still valid information?

  16. #46
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Hello McCoy,

    Welcome to CPF.

    The information is still valid.

    Tom
    Behind every Great man there's always a woman rolling her eyes...

    Most batteries don't die - they are tortured to near death, then murdered...

  17. #47
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Links to the charts on SB's page and here seem to be broken...did they get archived somewhere I hope?
    Lights removed for search accuracy

  18. #48

    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by rotncore View Post
    Links to the charts on SB's page and here seem to be broken...did they get archived somewhere I hope?
    Photobucket was doing "maintenance" yesterday - so all my figures and charts were down for most of the day, it seems. Looks everything is back up fine today.
    Full list of all my reviews: flashlightreviews.ca. Latest hobby: whiskyanalysis.com. Latest flashlight review: Thrunite TN42.
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  19. #49
    Enlightened Screwball69N's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Has any on tried or tested the Sanyo 18650 4000mAh or the 4500MaH please let me know if they live up to there specs

    4000mAh Sanyo HR4/3AU NiMH Flat Top Cell



  20. #50
    *Flashaholic* kj2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    There are no 4000+ mah 18650s, yet.

  21. #51
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Looks like the Titanium 123's did quite well, and for the price it seems quite good too. After seeing this review I figured it was time to get some for my brandy spankin new Elzetta Bravo B333 (AVS/cren bez/HiLo tail) . Ordered from Battery Junction I got 125 cells of the Titaniums after using a coupon it came out to exactly $0.80 cents per cell shipped to my door. That seems pretty cheap. I guess I'll see how well they perform.
    And btw I just joined up here! Pretty cool forum.

  22. #52
    Flashaholic* RI Chevy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Welcome to the Forum!

  23. #53
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    If anyone has any input about the Titanium 123's that are part of SB shootout please say how you like them, good or bad. In fact if there are any longer usage reports on any of these cr123's I would appreciate it. Any leaking/dead new cells/etc...

  24. #54
    Flashaholic* RI Chevy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    I have only used battery station and Surefire cells. Never used Titanium 123's.

  25. #55
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    I've heard mostly good things about those U.S. made 123's . I do have a little concern about the Titaniums however and it's pretty much just about it's country of origin PRC, and the fact that I'm using them in a 2x series light which brings in one more factor as far as safety is concerned.
    They did however seem to do quite well in Selfbuilt's shootout and I was able to get them at a low price (0.80cents) delivered.

  26. #56
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    True. But the test was done 3 years ago. Keep us informed as to the performance of those cells.

  27. #57
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    According the specifications posted at Battery Junction, the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery has a maximum continuous discharge current of 1.5 amps. This is the same limit that CR123A batteries made by other manufacturers have. The same spec at Battery Junction says that 3.0 amps is the maximum pulse discharge current for the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery.

    Now, I do not have any details about how the pulse discharge current is determined for the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery. I do, however, have a spec sheet for the Sanyo CR123A battery. It defines maximum pulse discharge current to be that current that causes battery voltage to sag to 1.0 volts in only 15 seconds!

    Here is the quote:

    Current value for obtaining 1.0V cell voltage when pulse is applied for 15 seconds at 50% discharge depth at 23 degrees C.
    Obviously a "useful" pulse will usually be significantly shorter than 15 seconds.

    So why does the spec at Battery Junction say that the PTC High Current Discharge Protection on the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery is set to 5 amps? That is much higher the PTC used by CR123A batteries that are made in the U.S.A. Frankly, it is higher that what I choose to use myself. Having the PTC set to 5 amps allows many flashlights to pull too much current from CR123A batteries.

    In the last decade, high-output LED flashlights have surpassed the current that CR123A batteries can safely supply. All the CR123A batteries that I have checked are rated for a 1.5-amp maximum continuous draw. In a 2xCR123A series configuration, that means a top output of around 600-700 lumens.

    CR123A still has an important place in the flashlight world. Its small size, long storage life, and good operating characteristics at temperature extremes (both hot and cold) mean that it will continue to be used for the foreseeable future.

    Just don't try to pull too many amps.
    Prince plays George Harrison's masterpiece While My Guitar Gently Weeps. R.I.P.
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  28. #58
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by KeepingItLight View Post
    According the specifications posted at Battery Junction, the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery has a maximum continuous discharge current of 1.5 amps. This is the same limit that CR123A batteries made by other manufacturers have. The same spec at Battery Junction says that 3.0 amps is the maximum pulse discharge current for the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery.

    Now, I do not have any details about how the pulse discharge current is determined for the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery. I do, however, have a spec sheet for the Sanyo CR123A battery. It defines maximum pulse discharge current to be that current that causes battery voltage to sag to 1.0 volts in only 15 seconds!

    Here is the quote:



    Obviously a "useful" pulse will usually be significantly shorter than 15 seconds.

    So why does the spec at Battery Junction say that the PTC High Current Discharge Protection on the Titanium Innovations CR123A battery is set to 5 amps? That is much higher the PTC used by CR123A batteries that are made in the U.S.A. Frankly, it is higher that what I choose to use myself. Having the PTC set to 5 amps allows many flashlights to pull too much current from CR123A batteries.

    In the last decade, high-output LED flashlights have surpassed the current that CR123A batteries can safely supply. All the CR123A batteries that I have checked are rated for a 1.5-amp maximum continuous draw. In a 2xCR123A series configuration, that means a top output of around 600-700 lumens.

    CR123A still has an important place in the flashlight world. Its small size, long storage life, and good operating characteristics at temperature extremes (both hot and cold) mean that it will continue to be used for the foreseeable future.

    Just don't try to pull too many amps.
    Woops, Didn't mean to copy the whole post.
    But in the Elzetta Bravo it is supposed to be under 1.5A I believe.
    But in My 1x123 Olight S10 it seems like too much for the cell in turbo/Hi at least the the RCR16340 cell. Maybe you have some knowledge on some of the very small 1x123 lights.
    Last edited by LED Monkey; 05-01-2016 at 05:40 PM.

  29. #59
    Flashaholic* KeepingItLight's Avatar
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    Kudos to Elzetta! It keeps current draws within specifications.

    I do not know about the Olight S10.

    I have read reports, however, that the Olight S1 draws over 2 amps in turbo mode. One CPF member measured 2.2 amps. I am using the protected, button-top Olight RCR123A rechargeable Li-ion battery in mine.

    The current limitations I described above apply to non-rechargeable CR123A batteries. I do not know the limitations of the rechargeable Olight battery I am using. Please, let me know if you have a datasheet of some kind.
    Prince plays George Harrison's masterpiece While My Guitar Gently Weeps. R.I.P.
    Great vocals & guitar by LeAnn Rimes & Joss Stone as they cover Gershwin's Summertime.

  30. #60
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    Default Re: Selfbuilt's CR123A Battery Comparison 2013

    I don't have a datasheet. I did see a YOUTUBE review of the Olight S1 "Review the light" I think he goes by Bigmac or something like that here CPF, and the S1 would shut off in the outdoor beam shots because it was drawing too many amps on Hi/turbo with a protected RCR123. He said it should be able to run on high with an unprotected IMR RCR123.

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