XM-L-sized SK98 clones; any good?

I should point out that this thread's actually about the larger 18650 SK98

OK, the latest addition to my burgeoning budget Cree arsenal is one of the Sipik68 clones, this one an UltraFire from BangGood for ~$5, and I must say I like it; didn't used to be a fan of zoomies, but I can now see their place.
I've just noticed that they have a scaled-up version with the ubiquitous T6 XM-L / 18650 combo; this one for ~$8, which is making it very hard for me to restrain my paypal-clicking finger. One big thing I liked about the Sipik design was the heat fins attached to the body itself, rather than cosmetically and uselessly to a sliding head, so that's a big plus for an XM-L torch in my mind. Big question is though, how worthwhile is an XM-L behind a lens? Seems everyone fighting the thrower war is using the likes of the XP-E2, that the XM-L's output isn't suited to a zoomie? Or will a de-doming reveal an $8 monster? Thoughts from the informed?

(there's also a "bronze" version available for ~$9, seems to be exactly the same specs but somehow it's now 1600lm rather than 1000lm; yes I do know the true source capabilities of an XM-L, and the rather large grains of salt required when dining on these delights)

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Tmart have the 18650 one reduced just now. 3 mode is supposed to be better than 5 mode.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

The Sipik Sk98 which is the 18650 version of the sk68 did not have good heat syncing if I remember right. The UF version, I've not seen a review for but the price is right

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Thanks for that CarpentryHero, checked out a few threads on the SK98, seems that to counter the nice heat fins they decided to give a hairs-breadth of thermal path; unless the UF version has different machining in the head, it really needs some more metal added to aid in getting the heat out to those lovely fins.

Despite this I'm still sorely tempted, would be cool (in a geekish way) to have a big-brother/little-brother collection. Sounds like the flood is nice but the throw is disappointingly large, as to whether a de-dome would make a big difference I guess only experimentation will tell...

Decisions, decisions.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

I bought the SK-98, and I used it to work on my car a few times. I used it on high for quite a while, and left it on the next highest setting to light up an area until the battery was dead. This light held up very well considering I also dropped it a few times from 3 feet.

CarpentryHero said:

The Sipik Sk98 which is the 18650 version of the sk68 did not have good heat syncing if I remember right. The UF version, I've not seen a review for but the price is right

Click to expand...

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

I had both - SK68 with XP-E and SK98 with XM-L. I compared them (both in stock condition) and the result was, that the SK68 with an 14500 has clearly more throw than the SK98, because the spot is much smaller. Of course the SK98 is brighter and has better runtimes, but the SK68 with 14500 was more fun for me... So I donated the SK98 to a friend and I often carry my SK68 with me...

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Couldn't resist temptation, just ordered a version from dx. Funnily enough, this one was called an Ultrafire SK68! More expensive than the banggood one, and doesn't have the nice silver bezel for the two-tone look, but it says it can run off either 1x 18650 or 2x CR123As, and lists the high-drive current as 2.4A, whereas banggood doesn't give any details about such things. While I don't trust dx's figures implicitly, they tend to be more accountable than banggood for such things (eg. their battery ratings, an example: Capacity: 3000mAh [actual 2200mAh])

Will run it in stock mode for a while and see how it goes, and possible de-dome in the future; will try to get before and after comparison shots if I do such a thing.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

OK, a quick preliminary mini-review. As stated above, I ended up getting this version from DX instead of the banggood one.
I'll sidetrack myself straight way here and note that both DX and banggood have multiple different versions of the "Ultrafire", and it's obvious on closer inspection that they aren't all coming out of the same factory; for one, some have five heat-fins, and others have four. Also different tailcap methods and styles, eg. some are internally threaded, others external. Some use a metal cover over the emitter, others plastic. This bears out the theory that Ultrafire is just a supplier sourcing from various manufacturers, some will be better/different than others.

Back on track; she's pretty bright. Flood is impressively wide, but as expected the throw is a little lacking; die image is about 2times as wide/high as the XP-E image of my Ultrafire SK68 clone, and as such it's not as intense even though the source is brighter. Also the image is not perfectly crisp, even when focused as best as possible; lens must be a little mismatched for an XM-L.
Will attempt a de-dome in the near(ish) future and see just how much of an improvement it makes (if I don't stuff the LED).

Tail current measurement @High with my cheapie DMM was ~1.5Amps from a Trustfire 2400 protected blue 18650; don't know if this is an accurate max, if leads are restricting current, or if battery isn't capable of spitting out more current. So we'll say a minimum of 1.5Amps on High, which if it's a true T6 (who knows?) that should put the emitter output somewhere in the high 500s. So at a guess, ~500 lumens OTF on flood (throw will be catching less emitter lumens).
Colour is a little on the cool side, and CRI doesn't appear to be fabulous, but that's to be expected.
This version is 5mode, high, medium, low, strobe, SOS (true SOS, not "SO-repeat"). Seems to have memory as in it'll be on the last mode you used, unless turned on within a very short period from when turned off, in which case it switches to the next mode. Haven't figured out how to get to the driver to see if we can tell what driver it's using and what it's theoretical current capabilities should be.

Build quality is pretty decent, but far from superb; some fairly sharp edges that could have been better machined, threading's a little rough but adequate, a fair bit of general minor marking under the anodising. Not sure how well the anodising will hold up, but that's OK. The torch is good and hefty, just a little less polished than it could be.
One minor reason I went for this variant is that it has a green GITD tailcap. I'm guessing the orange tailcap versions aren't GITD. Tailstands OK, the tailcap is a tiny bit too big but only very slightly interferes with tailstanding. Well and truly lights up a room when tailstanding in flood mode with roof bounce. As with the SK68, you can unscrew the bezel/lens for a pseudo lantern mode.

The pill unscrews as a whole and seems like it should give a good thermal path to the body. As opposed to reports of the Sipik version having heat issues due to the star barely resting on the lip of a hollow pill, this version has a solid plate of aluminium all the way under the star, which is pressed down with thermal paste (not glued or screwed though). So theoretically the path from LED to body should be pretty decent. However the heat fins that I found appealing are a fair way down the neck once you see it with the zoom assembly off, so they won't come into play as readily as I had imagined. Still useful, but not as close to the emitter as I had envisaged.
On a side note, the star was marked with "Cree XML-U2", though I doubt that has any bearing on which bin is actually populated.

Conclusions? Pretty good value for money, no problems with it yet. It's a bit of a muthaflooda, quite a hefty pool of consistent light when in flood mode, but the throw mode needs some tightening up for it to be considered as a real thrower; it's little brother does a better job of throw. We'll see how a de-dome performs, if not then it's a very quick job to replace the emitter with something with a smaller die (max-driven XP-G perhaps?)
Would I buy it again? Well, I wouldn't not buy it again, I just personally don't have a need for more than one of these. It's bright, cheap, reasonably well put together (if a little on the sharp side), and fairly versatile. And it's kinda cool in a geeky way to have the little brother / big brother combo.




Rough beam pics: Ultrafire SK68 clone on left, Ultrafire SK98 clone on right

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

So probably a brain fart sort of question, but how does one remove the focusing ring on these things? I have 2 of these and one (actually labeled Sipik) where the focus movement is quite gritty. I'd like to see if i can smooth it out some.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Revolvr said:

So probably a brain fart sort of question, but how does one remove the focusing ring on these things? I have 2 of these and one (actually labeled Sipik) where the focus movement is quite gritty. I'd like to see if i can smooth it out some.

Click to expand...

I agree. I want to know how to remove the "zoom" (focusing ring) on a regular Sipik SK-68... Anyone ever done it?

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

On this one you
a) remove the bezel/lens
b) unscrew the pill using some long-nose pliers (see the two indents in the pill top?)
c) pull out focus assembly; the pill has a lip and o-ring which stops the focus assembly coming off

With my "little brother" UF SK68 clone the pill doesn't have convenient grip points, so haven't tried unscrewing it yet to see what the pill's like. Appears to also be a screw-in assembly, but not 100% sure.

PS. After popping off the metal emitter cover I'm buggered if I can get the thing back on; seems like it should snap in (press fit) somehow, but doesn't seem to want to work. Oh well, probably best to cover the area with a matt black piece of something anyway to reduce artifacts. There's a clear piece of plastic to protect against shorts.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

RoGuE_StreaK said:

On this one you
a) remove the bezel/lens
b) unscrew the pill using some long-nose pliers (see the two indents in the pill top?)
c) pull out focus assembly; the pill has a lip and o-ring which stops the focus assembly coming off

With my "little brother" UF SK68 clone the pill doesn't have convenient grip points, so haven't tried unscrewing it yet to see what the pill's like. Appears to also be a screw-in assembly, but not 100% sure.

PS. After popping off the metal emitter cover I'm buggered if I can get the thing back on; seems like it should snap in (press fit) somehow, but doesn't seem to want to work. Oh well, probably best to cover the area with a matt black piece of something anyway to reduce artifacts. There's a clear piece of plastic to protect against shorts.

Click to expand...

Thanks. BTW, my Ultrafire branded 68 doesn't have the indents in the LED retainer ring, but the Sipik branded unit does.

Frankly I'm not convinced either one are actually UltraFire or Sipik. But still, not bad lights for the price.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Well, you never know until you try... I took a SK-68, held it by the bezel/zoom section, and just kept "unscrewing it" and it finally came apart in my hands...

(For more details please see the "Inexpensive little AA light Sipik68 & Clones." thread.)

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Thanks Rosoku, but I should point out that this thread's actually about the larger 18650 SK98 and your info is probably more useful in the SK68 thread; wonder if maybe a mod can edit the thread title? I didn't know the Sipik98 (and co) existed as a name when I originally posted, I just saw it as a blown-up version of the Sipik68

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

RoGuE_StreaK said:

Thanks Rosoku, but I should point out that this thread's actually about the larger 18650 SK98 and your info is probably more useful in the SK68 thread; wonder if maybe a mod can edit the thread title? I didn't know the Sipik98 (and co) existed as a name when I originally posted, I just saw it as a blown-up version of the Sipik68

Click to expand...

Good point. I moved it. (And, it looks like the moderator has also changed this thread title.)

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Been using my SK98 for 2 weeks at work and no problems with heat.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

Update: now de-domed!
(text copied from the LED main sub-forum)
scored the dome a few times with a blade, then soaked in petrol (91 RON "standard unleaded") for 21hrs. Was waiting to see if the dome just floated off, but it didn't. The slightest of touches with a plastic toothpick and it popped right off, no goo left except a tiny bit under the bond wires. Little bath in some isopropyl (very hard to find in Aus due to drug-lab restrictions etc., used Isocol from the chemist) and she's all good. Surprisingly when I picked up the dome it completely disintegrated into dust.
Seems warmer, and definitely a smaller, more intense die image when behind a lens; seems about 3/4 off it's previous size.

First pic shows bottom of pill, where the driver is fitted; can't figure out how to undo this, might be a press-fit?
Second pic shows the aluminium under the star, as opposed to the hollow that the Sipik98 apparently has. I need to replace the thermal grease with thermal adhesive, as the star isn't held firmly in place, only wedged in by it's edges.
Third pic shows the de-dome through the lens, note that there's still a little goo over the bond wires, which is a good thing for protection but does add a little artifact to the die image.




Beam comparison; SK68 with domed XP-E, SK98 with original domed XM-L, SK98 de-domed


All in all a successful first outing into de-doming, came out 100% clean and didn't remotely feel like there was a risk of breaking the bond wires; YMMV
Die image is definitely smaller, which should give better throw (no empirical testing on distance)

PS. I'll revise my statement about mode memory; after further exploration, it seems that it will always restart on High rather than what you left it on; which suits me fine, but others may have different opinions. As long as it doesn't start on strobe I'm happy, better to cycle down to a lower mode than have to cycle through the strobe and SOS to get back to high. I'm cool with having strobe and SOS, as long as they don't get in the way too much.

Re: XM-L-sized SIPIK68 clones; any good?

This is a great light imo. I've been using mine every day at work for 11 months now with no problems.