I'm sure this is going to be a stupid question to those of you who know a lot about batteries but I don't so I'm gonna ask anyway. I know a lot of people will store regular non-rechargeable batteries in the freezer to hold the charge when stored for long periods of time. Can this be done with a rechargeable battery such as an 18650 once fully charged? Will it damage the battery?
Best way to store batteries? - Freezer?
- Thread starter CMA
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idleprocess
Flashaholic
Once upon a time, folk legend held that storing your primary cells (carbon-zinc heavy duty or alkaline) in the refrigerator would prolong the shelf life - something about the colder temperatures slowing down chemical reactions. Whether there was any truth to that or not ... who knows. I would be hesitant to freeze cells because the expansion of water as it transitions from liquid to solid could cause damage.
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mcnair55
Flashlight Enthusiast
Does the battery maker store their batteries in freezers?,as i never saw a freezer at Duracell when they made batteries near me. Follow the instructions on the packet take no notice what so ever of armchair scientists.
To enjoy this hobby at its best you will need the following An Anorak-multimeter-lipo bags-sophisticated charging system-fire extinguisher-under ground fall out shelter and the ability to understand advanced pony poo.
On the other hand follow all instructions and use common sense and you will be fine. :wave:
To enjoy this hobby at its best you will need the following An Anorak-multimeter-lipo bags-sophisticated charging system-fire extinguisher-under ground fall out shelter and the ability to understand advanced pony poo.
On the other hand follow all instructions and use common sense and you will be fine. :wave:
ven
Flashaholic
I have read many posts on fridge, advantageous in hot climates ........
18650 should be stored at around 40% charge or 3.7v depending on mah rating it differs slightly.
Breaking in eneloops i have read too,something i never have done or will with those cells .
I am no expert by any means,but freezing cells cant be good,then you have to wait whilst they warm up so cant use straight away...............pointless to me tbh.
Store in a draw or out of way,40% charge.........simple as that.
If you are in a hot climate,so temp over 25-30oC+(example) then fridge makes sense to keep cells cool as li ion do loose a % over certain temps,increasing the % loss the warmer it is.
Not sure where you are but here in the UK its not an issue .
Sure others will have their views and better info.
What is the reason for storing 18650 in freezer,why would you want to do it?
Cells should be fine for a few months 100% charged,if rotate then no problem anyway,store long term and new/better cells will be out and its not like they are $100 each.....just my opinion.
18650 should be stored at around 40% charge or 3.7v depending on mah rating it differs slightly.
Breaking in eneloops i have read too,something i never have done or will with those cells .
I am no expert by any means,but freezing cells cant be good,then you have to wait whilst they warm up so cant use straight away...............pointless to me tbh.
Store in a draw or out of way,40% charge.........simple as that.
If you are in a hot climate,so temp over 25-30oC+(example) then fridge makes sense to keep cells cool as li ion do loose a % over certain temps,increasing the % loss the warmer it is.
Not sure where you are but here in the UK its not an issue .
Sure others will have their views and better info.
What is the reason for storing 18650 in freezer,why would you want to do it?
Cells should be fine for a few months 100% charged,if rotate then no problem anyway,store long term and new/better cells will be out and its not like they are $100 each.....just my opinion.
thedoc007
Flashlight Enthusiast
This has been covered many times before.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...attery-Storage-Refrigerator-Freezer-Room-Temp
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?384932-Best-way-to-store-batteries-Freezer
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?191688-Store-batteries-in-the-freezer
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?238415-Why-put-lithium-batteries-in-the-fridge
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-Best-way-to-long-term-store-li-ion-battery-s
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...8-Does-freezing-batteries-imcrease-their-life
If you want a summary, my opinion (supported by data) is that it will definitely prolong the life (and slow self-discharge) of pretty much ANY battery type when you store it cool. But putting it in the fridge makes more sense than the freezer. Fewer opportunities for problems to occur in less extreme environments, and you still get most of the benefits. Either way, make sure you store them individually, in a watertight container. Any small gain you get from storing them cool will be more than offset by problems if you fail to let them warm up in the container (to avoid condensation) before use.
Personally, I don't think it is worth the effort. I like my cells to be ready to go. Maybe if you have a super expensive battery pack, and you know you won't be using it for a long period, it makes sense to store it in the fridge. But for typical batteries, I just don't see the value. But that part is definitely up to the consumer...your priorities may differ.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...attery-Storage-Refrigerator-Freezer-Room-Temp
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?384932-Best-way-to-store-batteries-Freezer
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?191688-Store-batteries-in-the-freezer
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?238415-Why-put-lithium-batteries-in-the-fridge
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-Best-way-to-long-term-store-li-ion-battery-s
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...8-Does-freezing-batteries-imcrease-their-life
If you want a summary, my opinion (supported by data) is that it will definitely prolong the life (and slow self-discharge) of pretty much ANY battery type when you store it cool. But putting it in the fridge makes more sense than the freezer. Fewer opportunities for problems to occur in less extreme environments, and you still get most of the benefits. Either way, make sure you store them individually, in a watertight container. Any small gain you get from storing them cool will be more than offset by problems if you fail to let them warm up in the container (to avoid condensation) before use.
Personally, I don't think it is worth the effort. I like my cells to be ready to go. Maybe if you have a super expensive battery pack, and you know you won't be using it for a long period, it makes sense to store it in the fridge. But for typical batteries, I just don't see the value. But that part is definitely up to the consumer...your priorities may differ.
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LanthanumK
Newly Enlightened
With the low self-discharge rates present in modern batteries, it is pointless nowadays.
ChrisGarrett
Flashlight Enthusiast
I have about a dozen li-ions stored in a zip lock baggie in my fridge at ~3.70v, my primaries and NiMH are not.
Chris
Chris
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mcnair55
Flashlight Enthusiast
My instructions do not mention the word fridge or freezer so the rest is pony poo and the work of the part time roket brigade. :devil:
ven
Flashaholic
I do agree mr mcnair ,but i also see the benefits if stored at a low temp,each to their own,it works then fair enough.
Some manufacturers(ok pretty much all of them) wont want you to get extra long life out of products as you wont be spending money on more.We know manufacturers could make a car that does not break down or rust,trouble is they would sell a customer 1 and that would be it :laughing:
I think its more getting the best out of your equipment than anything,looking after it that bit more.As Chris lives in Florida and iirc when i went it was around 88 degrees pretty much all the time. I could see warmer climates effecting cells a lot more than here in the wet cold UK(most of the time anyway).
Just my opinion:tinfoil: and as its summer i best get my anorak out :laughing:
Some manufacturers(ok pretty much all of them) wont want you to get extra long life out of products as you wont be spending money on more.We know manufacturers could make a car that does not break down or rust,trouble is they would sell a customer 1 and that would be it :laughing:
I think its more getting the best out of your equipment than anything,looking after it that bit more.As Chris lives in Florida and iirc when i went it was around 88 degrees pretty much all the time. I could see warmer climates effecting cells a lot more than here in the wet cold UK(most of the time anyway).
Just my opinion:tinfoil: and as its summer i best get my anorak out :laughing:
ChrisGarrett
Flashlight Enthusiast
If we all liked the same things, it would be a boring world, wouldn't it?
It costs me nothing to discharge them down to 3.7v and place them in my fridge, so I do it.
Can't hurt, can it?
Chris
You could have made the same point without being so pompous and without denigrating others.
mcnair55
Flashlight Enthusiast
Chill out and enjoy the banter,nothing wrong with what i said there fella,i enjoy the hobby by following instructions and using common sense.Never in a set of battery instructions have i been asked to store in a fridge but on the other hand i bought a jar of apple sauce last night to go with my pulled pork sandwich and the instructions said store in a refrigerator after opening which i duly did.
There is no need to complicate a hobby for no reason other than you think it may improve it.Many seem to use a multi meter but what for? my batteries last just as long.
Kestrel
Flashaholic
If you were the one and only acknowledged expert on this topic the above post would still be impolite and dismissive.
However, there are many others here that have a considerable depth of knowledge on this topic and I think that the OP (and others) are deserving of multiple points of view.
Please keep my post in mind if you continue to post in this particular thread.
Thanks & Best regards,
Richwouldnt
Enlightened
As I recall Sanyo warns that Eneloop batteries stored at higher temperatures will discharge somewhat faster than if stored at normal room temperature or below. The same is true for Eveready 1.5V Lithium Iron chemistry EA91s per their technical info PDF that I downloaded several years ago. The Evereadys can probably be stored at quite low temperatures seeing as how they are rated to work well below 0 degrees F. I am not sure of the Eneloops operating temperature range but their storage discharge characteristics are specified for 20 degrees C or 70 degrees F per the description on the Battery Junction web site. Cooler storage temps MIGHT slow that down but considering how many recharge cycles the current ones are rated for that seems like over kill.
mcnair55
Flashlight Enthusiast
Your remarks have been noted but when Duracell made batteries in North Wales i never saw a freezer unit at the factory and have never seen any instructions on a packet of batteries asking me to store in a fridge or freezer.I come from the old school of reading the manufacturers instruction sheets and manuals and following there advice.
doc,
thanks for taking the time to do the research and post all those links.
Personally I agree with Chris.
I have maybe half of my 18650's IN lights, which are for the most part kept at room temperature. And ven... despite summer temps in the 90'sF, we have air conditioning
the other half of my 18650's I keep in the refrigerator, nearly fully charged, next to my work-bench in the garage (where I keep my anorak logo-ed :nana: multi-meter, and cell charger )I agree with other posters, that I want my cells ready to go, and believe me, they do work cold right out of the refrigerator. I am sure that one of the links that doc pointed to, includes a link to battery university's informative pages on battery life.
ven
Flashaholic
I can see why people choose to store in fridge its the freezer i:thinking: dont get being honest.We have air conditioning in the UK too,proper old school air con..............windows open:laughing: However my cells will not be in the fridge for 2 reasons,1 i see no big enough benefit personally and becomes another "something to take care of" issue(i just like keeping things simple) and would take up too much room in fridge with my cells and that would mean:tsk:,2nd knowing rach i would have melted li ion on toast :laughing:
Being honest i have cells still going strong 4 or 5yrs on,so as cells do improve over the years(all be it relatively slow) the slight benefits dont out way the extra time/effort/maintenance right now for me. Also cost of cells,preserving for maybe a few months of life(maybe) does not justify it enough for putting in fridge.
If a cell under performs etc i replace it for a few $s ,of the years i have used li ion and nimh i am yet to do so............so i guess there is nothing telling me i need to .
Of course thats just me,each to their own,if it works good stuff,my opinion is more on the quality of cell purchased and where from along with how its used(not running too low,not over charging etc etc ) has more impact on using a fridge to preserve the cell. I am more than happy to by the latest cells(great excuse for me) in a few years time than using older cells of 5yrs old+ that have just been stored.There might be 4000mah 30A cells by then with protection...............would make my 2100mah cells unwanted.........just an example
I enjoy my lights,cell use etc but dont go too deep into everything as for me it takes the edge off the enjoyment(for me so just personal point)and takes up even more time than looking after my cells/lights/charge rates/voltages etc which is almost a full time job now :laughing:
So i guess a few years use/life i am happy with as newer/better cells will be out anyway,most people want the best/latest cells they can get/afford for their use.
:twothumbsjust me
its the freezer i:thinking: dont get being honest.We have air conditioning in the UK too,proper old school air con..............windows open:laughing: However my cells will not be in the fridge for 2 reasons,1 i see no big enough benefit personally and becomes another "something to take care of" issue(i just like keeping things simple) and would take up too much room in fridge with my cells and that would mean:tsk:,2nd knowing rach i would have melted li ion on toast :laughing: Being honest i have cells still going strong 4 or 5yrs on,so as cells do improve over the years(all be it relatively slow) the slight benefits dont out way the extra time/effort/maintenance right now for me. Also cost of cells,preserving for maybe a few months of life(maybe) does not justify it enough for putting in fridge.
If a cell under performs etc i replace it for a few $s ,of the years i have used li ion and nimh i am yet to do so............so i guess there is nothing telling me i need to .
Of course thats just me,each to their own,if it works good stuff,my opinion is more on the quality of cell purchased and where from along with how its used(not running too low,not over charging etc etc ) has more impact on using a fridge to preserve the cell. I am more than happy to by the latest cells(great excuse for me) in a few years time than using older cells of 5yrs old+ that have just been stored.There might be 4000mah 30A cells by then with protection...............would make my 2100mah cells unwanted.........just an example
I enjoy my lights,cell use etc but dont go too deep into everything as for me it takes the edge off the enjoyment(for me so just personal point)and takes up even more time than looking after my cells/lights/charge rates/voltages etc which is almost a full time job now :laughing:
So i guess a few years use/life i am happy with as newer/better cells will be out anyway,most people want the best/latest cells they can get/afford for their use.
:twothumbsjust me
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mcnair55
Flashlight Enthusiast
I can see why people choose to store in fridge
Being honest i have cells still going strong 4 or 5yrs on,so as cells do improve over the years(all be it relatively slow) the slight benefits dont out way the extra time/effort/maintenance right now for me. Also cost of cells,preserving for maybe a few months of life(maybe) does not justify it enough for putting in fridge.
If a cell under performs etc i replace it for a few $s ,of the years i have used li ion and nimh i am yet to do so............so i guess there is nothing telling me i need to .
Of course thats just me,each to their own,if it works good stuff,my opinion is more on the quality of cell purchased and where from along with how its used(not running too low,not over charging etc etc ) has more impact on using a fridge to preserve the cell. I am more than happy to by the latest cells(great excuse for me) in a few years time than using older cells of 5yrs old+ that have just been stored.There might be 4000mah 30A cells by then with protection...............would make my 2100mah cells unwanted.........just an example
I enjoy my lights,cell use etc but dont go too deep into everything as for me it takes the edge off the enjoyment(for me so just personal point)and takes up even more time than looking after my cells/lights/charge rates/voltages etc which is almost a full time job now :laughing:
So i guess a few years use/life i am happy with as newer/better cells will be out anyway,most people want the best/latest cells they can get/afford for their use.
:twothumbsjust me
It is a real shame Duracell shut there North Wales factory as if you knew staff you could have staff discounts like Lego did when they were there.I know a few who work at the JCB plant up the road but at present i have no use for an excavator even with a staff discount but on second thoughts i may have.
CMA,
The Short answer is the best way to store a Li-ion for longevity is at 40% charge in the refrigerator, in an air tight vacuum sealed container.
data to back up that statement can be found here.
The most convenient place to store and use a battery, is fully charged and IN the FLASHLIGHT.
The Short answer is the best way to store a Li-ion for longevity is at 40% charge in the refrigerator, in an air tight vacuum sealed container.
data to back up that statement can be found here.
The most convenient place to store and use a battery, is fully charged and IN the FLASHLIGHT.
