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Thread: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

  1. #1471

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by -Archie- View Post
    No, they're still offering them. As for household round cells - they've gradually removing any traces of related information from PG site, obviously loosing interest to the consumer market. Reason probably is an insufficient profit due to marketing mistakes.

    But it was always known that PowerGenix's production facilities are in China (AFAIK I've read that in former CEO D.Squiller's interviews), and company who made cells for them (I believe, it was BPI) seems to be now free to sell them to any party interested. If you like appearance of AA and AAA cells in the PowerGenix wrappers - they're widely available now as well among the others...
    But as far the technology goes. Will there be any improvements. I think these cells were not giving a fair shot. Try again if you don't succeed?

  2. #1472

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by Suarez View Post
    Hello millguy,

    thanks for the information for another way existst to update / "reflash" a charger which accidentally has been bricked !

    As you stated above that you are not able to upload files here, may i suggest "filetea.me" - a hoster ideal for uloading lightweight files for free w/o registration.

    It would be awesome if you do so and only share the link here - this would be a great help for all users who now got - for whatever reason ever - a bricked MC3000.

    As SkyRC possibly is now in "holiday / reorganisation / CES 2016" mode, people wouldn΄t have to wait weeks more far into the next year to get their chargers working again !

    Wishing you all a peaceful XMas time ;-)
    Can't get filetea to work. Looking for another.

    Sorry folks, I pulled the links. The file really wasn't mine to share anyway, and I only put it up for the unfortunate owners of bricked devices.
    I see now some are using it on perfectly good ones, and don't want to be responsible for anything going wrong.
    Last edited by millguy; 12-28-2015 at 03:55 PM.

  3. #1473
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by millguy View Post
    Can't get filetea to work. Looking for another.
    I've sent PM to you with my email address; still waiting for the answer!

    P.S. Got the files from DropBox; many thanks!
    Last edited by -Archie-; 12-25-2015 at 04:24 PM.

  4. #1474

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Could the next FW update recognise LiFePO4 cells in Dummy mode? I have already written a program to charge LiFePO4 cells (RCR2) which I only rarely need to charge so no big issue for me.

    Seems like the main use of this charger for me - when I don't want to be "joyful" - will be the convenience of being able to charge anything I have (including D NiMH) with one charger and so save space and also not have to remember different operating procedures for different chargers. Even though the LiFePO4 program I have written is very simple to use, I am sure to need reminding when I come to (infrequently) use it. Thus if the next FW update could have recognition of LiFePO4 in Dummy Mode, that would be great.


    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    TERMINATION will be nizn option in next fw update, no prob at all.
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  5. #1475
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    If you have many different chemistry batteries, you could write a charge program for each. After you have done that it is simple to temporarily change that programs to Refresh, Discharge, or anything else you want to do. This will reduce the number of programs you have to create, and yet it allows you to do anything you want. Temporarily change the charge current, discharge current, charge voltage, etc. I find this method very fast and easy to use and it is ideal for something you do infrequently.

  6. #1476

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    WOW, that was fast !
    Thank you very much indeed, got the MC3000 back functional ;-)

    Great !!!

    So the waiting for all users of "damaged" units is over...


    Quote Originally Posted by millguy View Post

  7. #1477

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Hi kreisl,

    First of all, thank you for your help brining this dream charger into a reality.

    Improvement / feature suggestion for future FW update:

    Pulse charging option -
    As seen in HKJ's excellent (thank you for all your reviews, HKJ!) review of the mc3000, charging NIMH at a low rate ( ~ <0.5C) can lead to overcharging as 0dV/dt / -dV/dt termination signal may be missing entirely. For absolute minimum one might want to consider ~ 2500 mAh * 0.5 >> 1.25A as pulsing current and PWM down to desired charging rate for average charging current less than 1.25A.

    There are also literature (can't find it - but definitely read about it) suggesting that charging lithium chemistry based batteries at a high rate actually improves total usable capacity over life. It was seen under electronic microscope that charging at a high rate provides more uniform (in physical dimension over the entire cell) charging than slow charging, where the actual charging process is highly localized which is somewhat damaging to the cell.

    At least there are some empirical study on effects/benefits of pulse charging on lithium chemistry batteries, to just cite one:
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...78775301008205

    I suppose the hardware would be capable of PWM given how precise this charger can regulate its voltage output in the CV phase of lithium ion battery charging.

  8. #1478

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by Suarez View Post
    WOW, that was fast !
    Thank you very much indeed, got the MC3000 back functional ;-)

    Great !!!

    So the waiting for all users of "damaged" units is over...
    Glad it worked for you too.
    The one I ordered to replace my "bricked" one should be here in a few days. Guess I'll have to find a use for two of 'em.
    Last edited by millguy; 12-25-2015 at 09:15 PM. Reason: Spelling

  9. #1479

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by -Archie- View Post
    In fact, 4P80T is very good MCU-based charger, many times better than PG ones - but as most cheap Chinese devices, require some fixing/modding. At least it was true for my sample.

    As for cell's quality control, you're probably right...
    As I already posted in this thread, the NiZn cells I have look suspiciously similar, so yes, I may be right

    Not damaging the cells it charges does make 4P80T-NiZn better than the PowerGenix 1-hour NiZn charger and yes, my 4P80T-NiZn also required some "fixing/modding" (otherwise it might have destroyed itself upon its first power up), but that was not enough to make it work properly. I will send you a PM with more detail, as it's way off topic here and I'm curious about your experience with the UltraCell plus+ charger.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarioJP View Post
    I thought NiZn were discontinued?
    Quote Originally Posted by MarioJP View Post
    By Powergenix. Did another company took over? I see new NiZn cells in new labels at Amazon. Original label were Powergenix. Man those batteries had so much potenial. Super high discharge rate. Those cells aint no joke when it comes to Amps.
    PowerGenix no longer vendors NiZn cells for end-users, as their support told me, they are "focused on micro and mild hybrid systems for the automotive markets". But, as you know, the cells are still being manufactured and vendored by other companies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Suarez View Post
    WOW, that was fast !
    Thank you very much indeed, got the MC3000 back functional ;-)

    Great !!!

    So the waiting for all users of "damaged" units is over...
    It will also be useful to those with functional chargers who wish to upgrade to FW 1.03 now rather than wait indefinitely for the appearance of the new firmware online
    Last edited by B-2Admirer; 12-26-2015 at 01:22 AM.

  10. #1480

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Of course ;-) Based on my technical understanding I have not considered it΄s worth mentioning that the method also is suitable for "normal" updating to version 1.03 ;-)

  11. #1481

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by kyzhkcpf View Post
    Hi kreisl,

    First of all, thank you for your help brining this dream charger into a reality.

    Improvement / feature suggestion for future FW update:

    Pulse charging option -
    As seen in HKJ's excellent (thank you for all your reviews, HKJ!) review of the mc3000, charging NIMH at a low rate ( ~ <0.5C) can lead to overcharging as 0dV/dt / -dV/dt termination signal may be missing entirely. For absolute minimum one might want to consider ~ 2500 mAh * 0.5 >> 1.25A as pulsing current and PWM down to desired charging rate for average charging current less than 1.25A.

    There are also literature (can't find it - but definitely read about it) suggesting that charging lithium chemistry based batteries at a high rate actually improves total usable capacity over life. It was seen under electronic microscope that charging at a high rate provides more uniform (in physical dimension over the entire cell) charging than slow charging, where the actual charging process is highly localized which is somewhat damaging to the cell.

    At least there are some empirical study on effects/benefits of pulse charging on lithium chemistry batteries, to just cite one:
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...78775301008205

    I suppose the hardware would be capable of PWM given how precise this charger can regulate its voltage output in the CV phase of lithium ion battery charging.
    merry xmas g****

    and sorry. no food here.

    moving on.
    Last edited by kreisl; 12-26-2015 at 11:07 AM. Reason: am not being rude. just cynical. hhh

  12. #1482

    Lightbulb Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    I just wanted to share a hidden setting I found (LCD Contrast), but did a search and saw that kreisl had already mentioned it (I somehow missed that post)

    Well, FWIW I can at least say that it's present in the FW 1.02 as well

  13. #1483

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Update: So looks like i am being refunded. They suggest to look for a different charger. I know that its out of stock but to suggest another model as in don't bother with the pre-order. Leaves me with more questions than answers. Too many fillers and not a lot solid clear answers. Well this just sucks. SkyRC needs dealers here in the US. GB is just terrible they don't understand the definition of a pre-order.
    Last edited by MarioJP; 12-26-2015 at 09:43 AM.

  14. #1484
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by MarioJP View Post
    GB is just terrible they don't understand the definition of a pre-order.
    My advise based on personal experience with GB: never participate in their preorders. Just wait until particular item is on sale directly....

  15. #1485
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    merry xmas g****
    fyi: I am not connected in any way to the post that you quoted. Why make such wild guesses? That's about as accurate as the prior squirrely guesses that I am you!

    In any case, Happy Holidays to you too.
    Last edited by Gauss163; 12-26-2015 at 12:22 PM.

  16. #1486

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by Gauss163 View Post
    fyi: I am not connected in any way to the post that you quoted. Why make such wild guesses?
    and i never said or implied that you were.

    i've heard enough about the topic pulse-charging and the decision has been taken against it. take it or leave (it).

    If anybody is going to miss pulse-charging in this product, then i advise him/her to look for some other charger, thanks!!

    i hope this was clear enough.

    now we can all move on.

    basta.


    Q: Which were the reasons why you decided against it?
    A: Not every engineering decision is open for discussion. So no further comment.

    Q: But pulse-charging is superior, i quoted science-direct, didn't i?
    A: Whatever your point was, i am sure that you made your point. But I am done.

    Q: Done, really?
    A: Bye.
    Last edited by kreisl; 12-26-2015 at 12:44 PM.

  17. #1487
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    ...If you are going to miss pulse-charging in this product, then i advise you to look for some other charger
    You should address your reply to the user who made the request. It has absolutely nothing to do with anything I wrote here. I would recommend improving the UI and thermal design before increasing the variety of charging algorithms implemented.
    Last edited by Gauss163; 12-26-2015 at 01:40 PM.

  18. #1488

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    merry xmas g****

    and sorry. no food here.

    moving on.
    Hi kreisl,

    I just did a quick search on pulse charging discussion in this thread and looks like there's been enough talks about it. I was proposing pulse charging as an optional extra feature (especially for NIMH battery if one wants to charge a high capacity with low average current!). I will send an email to skyrc and see if they would be interested.

    Thank you.

  19. #1489

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by MarioJP View Post
    Update: So looks like i am being refunded. They suggest to look for a different charger. I know that its out of stock but to suggest another model as in don't bother with the pre-order. Leaves me with more questions than answers. Too many fillers and not a lot solid clear answers. Well this just sucks. SkyRC needs dealers here in the US. GB is just terrible they don't understand the definition of a pre-order.
    Why you didn't try HKE, it was my first time with them but everything was fine, I ordered from them after some users shared their bad experience with GB back in this thread.

  20. #1490

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by megawolf View Post
    Why you didn't try HKE, it was my first time with them but everything was fine, I ordered from them after some users shared their bad experience with GB back in this thread.
    I know. I should of, it was the price on gb that made my choice it was a bit cheaper. But, now i see what a mistake.=no charger before the year ends....oh they better not come up with a survey. I will rate them so low. Google play store reviews on gb app are spot on.

  21. #1491
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by megawolf View Post
    Why you didn't try HKE, it was my first time with them but everything was fine, I ordered from them after some users shared their bad experience with GB back in this thread.
    HKE is a class act. I have purchased an AceBeam K60 and two MC3000s from them. They have great service and superior communication by e-mail. Always very friendly and competent.

  22. #1492

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Possible Issue in V1.03 - Slot 3 "No Battery" ?!?

    ...i am nearly shure that i΄ve read somehere about it already, but i could not find the thread again - e.g. in another forum ?!?

    What i΄m talking about:

    Unfortunately i did not check if this also happened in FW 1.02, but here i noticed some small issue while using Data Explorer / Micro-USB Connection.
    All four slots were in use while discharging NL 189 3400mAh, and Data Explorer grabbed all to the point, everything ok.
    After removing the four cells, selecting another program and inserting four Eneloops for charging, the third slot displayed "No Battery".
    Reopening / closing the slider to check the cell for correct seat lead to the same result "No Battery"
    After removing the Micro-USB cable (which still was plugged in from the measurements) slot 3 became alive and did eveything like expected, measuring IR e.g.
    As it is able to reproduce the same state again and again (!checked!), this may be another point which isn΄t that heavy and "not an error at all", but may possibly be corrected in an later FW version...
    Anyone who also can reproduce this ?!?

    --- Offtopic Start ---

    I know i am a relatively new / late member to this forum, but since the first announce of the MC3000 i΄ve read most nearly everything in this thread - and i am still related to all the technical stuff about this charger.
    IMHO exactly this had been the reason for all of the "techies" here to visit this forum over and over again with it΄s now roundabout 1500 postings... You know what i mean ?!? Imagine a child who first time looks at his new toy with shining eyes…

    If someone here did have bad experience with the charger itself, it΄s available options and / or the order, which is certainly very annoying for the people concerned, I hope that everyone will be ultimately satisfied - either by a later delivery of the MC3000 or the "money back" option ... Either way , I keep my fingers crossed . But it would be very unfortunate if the bad experiences of individual would tarnish the recent overall technical research spirit of this forum ...

    --- Offtopic End ---

    Suggestions about the cell not being recognized in slot 3 after data grabbing / USB connection are welcome ;-)

    Regards !

  23. #1493

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by -Archie- View Post
    My advise based on personal experience with GB: never participate in their preorders. Just wait until particular item is on sale directly....
    Received mine from GB, no problem at all.

  24. #1494
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    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by clintb View Post
    Received mine from GB, no problem at all.
    Let's all hope that it doesn't break down on you and that you don't have to ship it back to them.

    They've had some issues lately.

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  25. #1495

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by Suarez View Post
    Unfortunately i did not check if this also happened in FW 1.02, but here i noticed some small issue while using Data Explorer / Micro-USB Connection.
    The implementation of MC3000 device in DEX is still in beta and i am observing myself few things on the PC screen (bugs) which need revision in DEX. They are absent in PCLS, so.

    The question is: Are you observing the same unexpected behavior when there is no DEX (or no micro USB) communicating with the device?

    I am not experiencing any unexpected behavior with the device alone. The hardware is mature, and the firmware too. It's not a bug, it's a feature
    Last edited by kreisl; 12-26-2015 at 02:46 PM.

  26. #1496

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by kyzhkcpf View Post
    I will send an email to skyrc and see if they would be interested.
    Sorry, the decision on pulse-charging is done. Don't expect any response from Sky.

    Sorry again.


  27. #1497

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    @kreisl
    can you update the first page with the optimum settings for charging batteries (if possible) something like this:

    900mAh battery (Eneloop)
    Capacity: 1100 or Off
    C. Current: 0.3A to 0.5A
    Cut Current: Off
    DeltaV: 1mV
    and so on......

    Something like a beginners guide from the experts (what are the Best settings to use)

  28. #1498

    Rolleye11 Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    ...of course the hardware is mature, the FW too ! The unit in general is functioning absolutely flawlessly regarding it΄s origin features. Answering your question ΄en detail΄,
    the behaviour ! only ! occours in DEX / Micro USB mode, and my intension only was to point at the circumstance itself...

    Thinking of possible other users which for example are also doing measurements with Data Explorer or other external signal capture hardware who forgot to disconnect the cable before using the charger for
    a new task - they occasionally may think one of the charger΄s slots may be defective if not thinking in / recognizing the cable still connected...

    On the other hand (and with one eye twinkering) this of course ! must ! be a feature - only implemented to remind the user to disconnect the cable lately ;-)

    Regards !

    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    The implementation of MC3000 device in DEX is still in beta and i am observing myself few things on the PC screen (bugs) which need revision in DEX. They are absent in PCLS, so.

    The question is: Are you observing the same unexpected behavior when there is no DEX (or no micro USB) communicating with the device?

    I am not experiencing any unexpected behavior with the device alone. The hardware is mature, and the firmware too. It's not a bug, it's a feature

  29. #1499

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Hi kreisl

    Neither am I - the device is great and I have tried out quite a bit of charging on different batteries by now. This thing is a techi dream but also simple to use in Dummy mode. There could not be better praise for it than HKJ saying he has replaced his other chargers with the MC3000 (so have I).


    Could the next FW update recognise LiFePO4 cells in Dummy mode?

    Quote Originally Posted by kreisl View Post
    I am not experiencing any unexpected behavior with the device alone. The hardware is mature, and the firmware too. It's not a bug, it's a feature
    EagTac M25C2 Turbo_VN_XPG2-PDTc version; SureFire UB3T Invictus; Nitecore SRT7; TrustFire X6; LumaPower MVP (3xCree) , Sunwayman V11R; 4Sevens Quark AA Tactical; Nitecore DI (R2, GDP, Q5); LiteFlux LF2XT-R2;

  30. #1500

    Default Re: SkyRC — IFA 2014 / CES 2016 — MC3000 charger-analyzer

    Quote Originally Posted by MarioJP View Post
    Update: So looks like i am being refunded. They suggest to look for a different charger. I know that its out of stock but to suggest another model as in don't bother with the pre-order. Leaves me with more questions than answers. Too many fillers and not a lot solid clear answers. Well this just sucks. SkyRC needs dealers here in the US. GB is just terrible they don't understand the definition of a pre-order.
    Glad that you're getting a refund. Agree that GB's communication needs to improve if they want to get more customers.

    Anyway, I noticed that they have listed the MC3000 as "backorder" and coming in stock on Jan 10 (for the EU & US plug version). Perhaps they choose to use "backorder" instead of "pre-order", who knows?

    However, it appears that the AU & UK versions are in stock (no mention of "backorder"). For those who don't want to wait you can just grab any one of those and simply replace the power cord.

    PS. I was going to suggest you order from HKE but it looks like they are also out of stock and can only ship on Jan 15.

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