Best way to get good light in front of my car? (2006 Volvo V70)

ameli0rate

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I have a 2006 Volvo V70 with plastic headlights. They are universally considered utter [expletive].

This is it;
CfieJ9Ul.jpg


It uses H11 and H9 bulbs, so no HIR available (that I know of), and the plastic fades (since polished, but that's short-lived), and I *really* have a dislike of the European solution of a few large UFO landing lights on a bar in front of the grille.
I've seen solutions from the 2001-2004 glass headlights opened up and using Morimoto HID projectors to replacing the OEM fluted glass with a clear lens. My understanding (from lurking here) is that both solutions are illegal due to modifying an existing "system" of bulb/reflector/housing. The former gives very nice light, sharp cut-off etc, but is discouraged due to alignment issues between headlight and the HID unit's attachment inside of it.
The latter is illegal because the fluting in the glass focuses and shapes the light, so the clear glass will make for glare and poor(er) lighting.

I *could* just plug&play the Volvo ABL (active bending lights) with projector HIDs. They won't active-bend due to lack of software, but they are OEM and fit right in, etc. They are $1400 EACH!


My current thinking has me mounting some additional lights in the grille, flush, sort of like the new Mustangs. It's not a large grille, so something smallish would be nice.


Small, round projectors should do the trick. One high beam, one low beam, alternatively one or two high/lows. HID or Halogen, while the HID will have better light output it's also a matter of how much better compared to the halogens. Dollars and sense, right?

ECE pattern whenever possible - probably not legal, but an improvement.

They would have to be sealed to live behind the grille, so something like this;

http://www.rallylights.com/hella-60mm-projector-headlamp-module.html
These have the benefit of using HIR bulbs.

This guy;
http://www.rallylights.com/90bh-hella-bi-halogen-90mm-hi-lo-headlamp.html
An additional $100 EACH (total $214 each) for the ECE lens, [children of unwed parents!] But I'd have lots of light, both low and high.
The only downside is the H9 bulbs with shorter lifespan, but I'd have a master switch so these are only on when needed. Most after-dark city driving wouldn't require these to be on.
Oh, and they need some connectors, brackets and parts too, at additional cost.

Then there's this one, the bees knees;
http://www.rallylights.com/hella-bi-xenon-90mm-hi-lo-headlamp.html
HID, bi-xenon, and costs accordingly at $605 each, plus some brackets and wires. I *could* get one at a time.



Given that I like a relatively small unit (hehe) and sealed for outdoors use, I looked around a bit for what is out there for bikes.
The only thing I've found is this;
http://www.trailtech.net/lighting/hid/scmr16

It's a reflector HID with an ungodly amount of light up to 300 feet. It does rival the bi-xenon Hella at 2/3s of the cost. One flood, one spot and I can see to the horizon.
The downside is that they can ONLY be used as high beams. I'd be effectively blind with the factory low beams.


So ideas? Thoughts? Suggestions? Has anyone used the SCMR16s? The videos on youtube don't paint a good picture (or rather, they're not very flattering to the light).
 

Alaric Darconville

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I have a 2006 Volvo V70 with plastic headlights.

It uses H11 and H9 bulbs, so no HIR available
That is correct.

I've seen solutions from the 2001-2004 glass headlights opened up and using Morimoto HID projectors to replacing the OEM fluted glass with a clear lens. My understanding (from lurking here) is that both solutions are illegal due to modifying an existing "system" of bulb/reflector/housing.
That is correct. Also, you probably couldn't choose more poorly than to choose "Morimoto".

I *could* just plug&play the Volvo ABL (active bending lights) with projector HIDs. They won't active-bend due to lack of software, but they are OEM and fit right in, etc. They are $1400 EACH!
Your factory headlamps are pretty close to requiring an absolute replacement. If it were my car and my money, I'd absolutely go with the OEM ABL headlamps.

My current thinking has me mounting some additional lights in the grille, flush, sort of like the new Mustangs. It's not a large grille, so something smallish would be nice.
Which requires cutting the grille, possibly blocking airflow, as well as the problems with mounting the lamps securely enough that they do not jostle around wildly while the car is in motion. The moment of inertia of the lamp could mean that after a few good potholes, you'll be looking at a broken grille unless you did the mounting "just-so".

http://www.trailtech.net/lighting/hid/scmr16

It's a reflector HID with an ungodly amount of light up to 300 feet. It does rival the bi-xenon Hella at 2/3s of the cost. One flood, one spot and I can see to the horizon.
The downside is that they can ONLY be used as high beams. I'd be effectively blind with the factory low beams.
It looks like an HID capsule in a reflector designed for a halogen bulb. It'd be bright, but the light control may leave quite a bit to be desired. I doubt they rival the Hella offerings, and they probably don't even have the build quality that you need. I'd avoid it.

Has anyone used the SCMR16s? The videos on youtube don't paint a good picture (or rather, they're not very flattering to the light).

While pictures and videos rarely are useful in determining a lamp's quality, perhaps there's nothing to be flattering about with those lights.
 

Franco

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Out of curiosity, how expensive would a new set of headlights (not the OEM HID upgrade) be?

A new set, without close to ten years worth of lens and reflector deterioration, might actually be the upgrade that you're looking for. In go some quality bulbs, and you may not even feel the need for additional, expensive lighting that requires surgery on the grill of the car.

Not as exciting a solution as installing the Hella 90mm Bi-Xenon unit though, I know.
 

Alaric Darconville

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$2,800 on a 2006 V70 .... I would sell the car first.
D'oh, that's right-- EACH.

Originally, that car carried a $31K to $40K MSRP, but hopefully it's paid off if you're the original owner.

I guess it depends on how much I loved the car. A car like that, cared for properly, might be worth spending money on. I think it'd be better spent on quality factory parts without trying to fabricate mounts and dealing with empty performance promises (like those offered at TrailTech).

Factory original headlamps might be a good idea. You do say that
They are universally considered utter [expletive]
but sometimes subjective impressions of a vehicles lamps don't align with the objective performance. On the other hand, you might find the ADL lights more reassuring to drive behind.
 

-Virgil-

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I have a 2006 Volvo V70 with plastic headlights. They are universally considered utter [expletive].

That may be, though keep in mind subjective impressions of headlamp performance are usually far out of line with their actual, objective safety performance.

It uses H11 and H9 bulbs, so no HIR available

True, but these make a nice improvement in any H11 headlamp's performance.

the plastic fades (since polished, but that's short-lived)

If you're having to polish the lenses, the lamps are "zombies" -- dead and in need of replacement.

I *really* have a dislike of the European solution of a few large UFO landing lights on a bar

I don't know that I would call that "the European solution". The European solution is European-code headlamps -- individual owners in any country may choose to install auxiliary lamps of one kind or another. Also, lamps in front of the grille can create cooling problems; be careful if you do decide to go this route.

I've seen solutions from the 2001-2004 glass headlights

Those are very good, especially the European-code units. Your best fix here is going to be a set of these or a set of the European-code version of the headlamps you have now. But even if you go for the US-spec versions, new headlamps need to be your first step. Auxiliary lamps really can't safely compensate for used-up headlamps.

opened up and using Morimoto HID projectors

This is a very bad idea with any projectors, and an exceptionally bad idea with "Morimoto" junk.

to replacing the OEM fluted glass with a clear lens.

This is a whoppingly ignorant, bad idea.

I *could* just plug&play the Volvo ABL (active bending lights) with projector HIDs. They won't active-bend due to lack of software, but they are OEM and fit right in, etc. They are $1400 EACH!

Yeah, not really cost-effective.

My current thinking has me mounting some additional lights in the grille, flush, sort of like the new Mustangs. It's not a large grille, so something smallish would be nice.

Hard to get good performance out of small lamps, and hard to mount aftermarket lamps with sufficient rigidity and stability in the grille.

Small, round projectors should do the trick.

Don't bet on it!

One high beam, one low beam, alternatively one or two high/lows.

Sloppy mounting inherent in aftermarket in-grille setups aren't as big of a deal with high beams, but intolerable with low beams because of the glare issue. Just can't get enough aim stability.


This is a weak lamp -- low performance and not a very sturdy mount system. It's intended for laxly-regulated ATV applications.

Really, you should be focusing your effort (and money) on replacing the past-dead headlamps before you start looking/spending for auxiliary lamps.


One of many under-engineered, over-hyped toys on the market.
 

ameli0rate

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Thanks for all the comments, guys!

True, but these make a nice improvement in any H11 headlamp's performance.

Oooh, I don't know how I missed that before. Thanks!

Also, lamps in front of the grille can create cooling problems; be careful if you do decide to go this route.

Very common in Sweden (long, dark winters, and even in the summer, long stretches of unlit, no-traffic roads with wildlife). The summers can get very warm and this far no reports of overheating - in properly maintained cooling systems. My car has fresh and proper coolant and a new water pump. Flushed and ready. :D I'm not too worried about it, plus an UltraGauge gives me a baseline of coolant temps at all times.
Two or three Hella 500's or similar large lights mounted like this are VERY common.

This guy mounted them behind the grille and claims no issues with temps.

[2001-2004 Volvo glass headlights] Those are very good, especially the European-code units. Your best fix here is going to be a set of these or a set of the European-code version of the headlamps you have now. But even if you go for the US-spec versions, new headlamps need to be your first step. Auxiliary lamps really can't safely compensate for used-up headlamps.

Doh! I didn't think of that. I could source the European ones! The glass "early" ones require wiring adapters. No biggie. The plastic ones are available in E-Code versions too, so I'll see what I can do about that. $438 each, yikes, but that would buy me another 14-15 years until the plastic ones fade again.

As for mounting in the grille, I actually meant "with proper brackets to the slam panel" and not just into the plastic grille. I *hate* vibrating lights - not just meeting them, but sitting in a car and looking at the things shaking a lot is epilepsy inducing.

I prefer the cleaner stock look, so extra lights would have to go behind/flush in the grille. I don't have a mesh grille so I really couldn't mount them BEHIND, so I'd have to cut the grille, which is why I like the smaller ones. 90mm Hellas seem to be as small as one can go and still have rave reviews.

I only buy used cars. They are depreciating assets, so no way I'd buy a new one. This one was only $7000 with 109K miles two years ago. Original owner and all that. This car would be perfect if it had RWD (and decent headlights), but I have had 10 VOlvos since 2005 because they're wagons (fetish of mine) and they are cheap to buy, have a premium feel inside, and have cheap parts and are very easy to work on - when they need work. Oil samples shows this one to be in excellent mechanical shape even at 110K miles. I am due to change again at 130K miles - it's a turbo, I change every 10K and sample the oil.

Back to the lights - I'll poke around and see if the part numbers are different between E-Code lights and the US-available ones. If they're different, I'll have to see if I can order the E-Codes in via US companies, or if I have to order them from overseas.
Thanks again for the very simple solution. Let's hope it makes the lights as good as I want them to be.
 

-Virgil-

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I'll poke around and see if the part numbers are different between E-Code lights and the US-available ones

Yes, they are.

I'll have to see if I can order the E-Codes in via US companies

No, you can't (unless things have changed since 2 years ago when I did this exact same swap to the glass European lamps on my own '05). I recall finding vendors offering knockoff garbage (Scan-Tech, DJAuto, DEPO, TYC, etc), all of them claiming "OE quality" which is a flat-out lie. I wound up having Dan Stern get them for me. I don't know if he drives one of these wagons, too, but he had a good list of bits, bobs, and bulbs to make the swap work optimally, and it did.
 

caravan64

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If you're interested in driving lights you might want to give a look at LedRider lights. I will be purchasing a pair of the 5x xml lights in a few weeks for my motorcycle. Just a thought.
 

SemiMan

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If you're interested in driving lights you might want to give a look at LedRider lights. I will be purchasing a pair of the 5x xml lights in a few weeks for my motorcycle. Just a thought.

Or you could buy lights that have even a hint of engineering for real automotive road-going purposes ...
 

-Virgil-

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SemiMan's right again. There is no shortage of toys and trinkets marketed as lighting equipment for 4-wheeled vehicles, but the pile of BS for 2-wheelers is an order of magnitude higher and deeper.
 

ameli0rate

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An update to this thread.

Work sent me to Europe where I asked a friend to pick up a set of European V70 (actually, they're S60) headlights.
They finally arrived and I put them in yesterday.

Whole gallery: http://imgur.com/a/7TXdx

My [deity of choice]! Just looking at them next to the original ones reveals how bad the originals truly were. Without the reference, I thought they were better than they actually are. I mean, besides the crappy light from the OEM US Spec headlights, these ones HAD to be dangerously bad.

HwmbQZil.jpg
.


The old headlight on the left (passenger side of the car) and the new on the right (driver side) show a bit of how blurry the old light is whereas the left is more 'distinct' (for lack of better term). I'm guessing that it's a combination of old reflector and scatter from (what remains of) the plastic lens.

YnsFlsgl.jpg



As an additional bonus, these lights use the H7 and H9 bulbs instead of the H11 and H9 in the US headlights. This opens up the possibility of using better H7 bulbs. Are the 65w 2100 lumen Osram Rally bulbs workable in this scenario without breaking eyeballs and laws? If not, what bulbs are currently recommended for H7 replacement?

JrtOEzDl.jpg




Big thanks to you guys, particularly Alaric and Virgil, for steering me right. These lights were about $800 shipped to my door, which included a little extra packing to keep them safe, which pushed them into a higher shipping tier.
I've only had this morning's early-morning commute to see the result and still need to aim them up a bit more (with the aid of a trusty Home Depot wall, this evening) but it's already a remarkable difference.
Instead of the indistinct blob of light, now I have a pretty sharp horizontal cutoff with a kick-up on the right.

It's not the cheapest solution, but I think it's the cheapest *good* solution. Another benefit is that the car looks a lot better now too. Not so tired and haggard. :D

Thanks again!
 

Alaric Darconville

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An update to this thread.

Work sent me to Europe where I asked a friend to pick up a set of European V70 (actually, they're S60) headlights.
They finally arrived and I put them in yesterday.
Nice!

I mean, besides the crappy light from the OEM US Spec headlights, these ones HAD to be dangerously bad.
They were bad not because they were US-spec headlamps, they were bad because they were worn out. One of the most pervasive myths in automotive lighting is that in Europe the headlamps are automatically better than in the US.

Big thanks to you guys, particularly Alaric and Virgil, for steering me right.
You're welcome!

Thanks for updating the thread-- hearing success stories is always great.

These lights were about $800 shipped to my door, which included a little extra packing to keep them safe, which pushed them into a higher shipping tier.
But $800 well spent in terms of safety and in the appearance of the car (helps that resale value).

I've only had this morning's early-morning commute to see the result and still need to aim them up a bit more (with the aid of a trusty Home Depot wall, this evening) but it's already a remarkable difference.
Better still, find a competent service department with an optical headlamp aimer. A few more dollars to make sure it's right is part of the complete upgrade.

It's not the cheapest solution, but I think it's the cheapest *good* solution.

Way cheaper than the OEM lamps I'd mentioned much earlier, and compared to "Morimoto" and "retrofits", it's a REAL solution.
 

-Virgil-

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Good update -- I would have gone for the '01-'04 glass-lens lamps instead, myself, but yes, new plastic is better than old plastic.

I don't think I'd use the 65w H7 in that lamp; I'd use these instead.
 
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ameli0rate

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Yeah, the US ones seem to have a more blob-of-light appearance as opposed to the E-code horizontal cut-off. I think the myth that E-code is better isn't entirely wrong there if what I read was correct that we here in the US have some scattered light upwards to illuminate road signs and Europe does not (is this correct?). My thinking is that the cut-off means more light goes on the road and less to blind other people. That's better. To me, at least. :D


Alaric - yes, you're right. I should call around and see who might have a headlight aimer. That would sort it out properly without my fiddling.

Virgil - You think the 65w is too much heat for the housing (being plastic AND in Texas)? The lamps you linked - the image seems to show some blue tint on the bulbs?! Blue tint gives me shivers.
I thought about that for a bit too, but ultimately went "safe" with the looks of the facelifted headlights. If the reflectors get aged, its' good to know that I can see visibly faded plastic too and replace it at that time. Plus I don't need the conversion harness from the new car to the old headlights.




On a related note, what's with "Xtra vision" and all the "100% more light than..." claims?

In a proper bulb, light would be a function of voltage and wattage and resistance and all that, so if you have a 55w bulb getting 13v, it should theoretically give off as much light as another bulb of the same specs. Is there a difference? If so, where is it? In the filament? Type of metal? Type of gas in the bulb?
 

Alaric Darconville

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Yeah, the US ones seem to have a more blob-of-light appearance as opposed to the E-code horizontal cut-off. I think the myth that E-code is better isn't entirely wrong
Both systems have particular advantages and disadvantages, but to say that one specification is inherently better is to be entirely wrong.

My thinking is that the cut-off means more light goes on the road and less to blind other people.
Or, it could mean that the same amount of light UNDER the cutoff goes on the road; the light above the cutoff is simply wasted. So, perhaps less glare for others, but still the same seeing performance for the driver (other than less backscatter for that driver).

Alaric - yes, you're right. I should call around and see who might have a headlight aimer. That would sort it out properly without my fiddling.
Someone in a recent thread said they paid $25.00 at a body shop. Let your fingers do the walking!

The lamps you linked - the image seems to show some blue tint on the bulbs?! Blue tint gives me shivers.
You'll notice the tint is not around the filament itself. This serves to color on the light that is not part of the main beam; the functional portion of the beam is uncolored. The end result is to reduce the total amount of light emitted by the bulb (to stay within legal limits)-- light that isn't actually useful in the first place.

On a related note, what's with "Xtra vision" and all the "100% more light than..." claims?
It means that somewhere in the functional part of the beam, there is x% more light with that bulb than with a standard bulb. It might, on first glance, sound like so much marketing hooey, but it's only partially marketing hooey. Ultra-tight filament precision leads to better beam focus leads to more light in the test zone somewhere.

In a proper bulb, light would be a function of voltage and wattage and resistance and all that, so if you have a 55w bulb getting 13v, it should theoretically give off as much light as another bulb of the same specs. Is there a difference? If so, where is it? In the filament? Type of metal? Type of gas in the bulb?
Tighter filament winds can lead to a hotter hotspot with higher luminance (in cd/m2​) and higher luminous efficacy. Again, that smaller, tighter, more-precisely placed hotspot has the side effect of better focus. (And, unfortunately, shorter life.)
 
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-Virgil-

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if what I read was correct that we here in the US have some scattered light upwards to illuminate road signs and Europe does not (is this correct?)

Not really. Both the US and ECE low beam standards contain requirements for upward light to illuminate overhead road signs -- it is definitely not the case that all or most overhead signs are self-lit in Europe. The minimum upward-light requirements are pretty similar, the ECE stnadard actually requires slightly more upward light than the US standard; the difference is that the US standard allows much more than the ECE standard.

Virgil - You think the 65w is too much heat for the housing

Heat resistance is not a notable characteristic of the particular plastic used in those reflectors, and the 65w Osram bulb is no longer in production -- they have replaced it with an 80w bulb.

The lamps you linked - the image seems to show some blue tint on the bulbs?

There is a small blue ring just below the tip. It is not in the light path between the filament and the reflector, so it does not do the bad things that blue-all-over bulbs do. That blue ring is there for two reasons: to sell bulbs to people who think blue is good, and to reduce the spherical light output of the bulbs to a value within the legal maximum. Bulb output is tested spherically (summing all the light leaving the bulb in all directions), but once the bulb is installed in a headlamp, only light leaving the bulb at a much more restricted range of angles makes it into the beam pattern. So the blue band is for reducing light leaving the bulb at angles not relevant when the bulb is installed in a headlamp, where the bulb performs as if it were an "over spec" item.

On a related note, what's with "Xtra vision" and all the "100% more light than..." claims?

Xtreme Vision is a Philips brand name applied to that particular model of bulb. It doesn't mean anything in itself. The "up to +100" figure refers to the increase in light within the headlight beam. There's some material that may help you understand here.

In a proper bulb, light would be a function of voltage and wattage and resistance and all that so if you have a 55w bulb getting 13v, it should theoretically give off as much light as another bulb of the same specs.

I don't know what you mean by "proper", but the rest of what you say is definitely not correct. Browse through the (partial) list of headlight lamps and take a look at the wide range of lumens produced by different types of bulbs. That chart lists the maximum allowable actual wattage, but the HB2 low beam, the HB4, the HB5 low beam, the H1, the H3, the H7, the H11, and the HIR2 all have nominal ratings of 12.8v, 55w.
 

ameli0rate

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Or, it could mean that the same amount of light UNDER the cutoff goes on the road; the light above the cutoff is simply wasted. So, perhaps less glare for others, but still the same seeing performance for the driver (other than less backscatter for that driver).

Ahh. I didn't think of it that way.

Alaric Darconville said:
You'll notice the tint is not around the filament itself. This serves to color on the light that is not part of the main beam; the functional portion of the beam is uncolored. The end result is to reduce the total amount of light emitted by the bulb (to stay within legal limits)-- light that isn't actually useful in the first place.

I see. This is different from the Ricky Racer all-blue bulbs that reduce *all* the available light so as to appear cool to the Fast & Furious crowd?


Heat resistance is not a notable characteristic of the particular plastic used in those reflectors, and the 65w Osram bulb is no longer in production -- they have replaced it with an 80w bulb.
Ok, so stay with the regular (but good reputation) bulbs then. I'm not interested in 80w or anything fancy. Besides the plastic lights turning into a Dali painting, I'm sure my wiring would frown. All things considered, the Osram bulbs in the new headlights make for a supreme combination compared to my old faded headlights. There may be some "I-got-new-fancy-headlights" bias with me now too, but as long as I can see, am visible and happy (and no safety regulations are broken), all is well.

-Virgil- said:
There is a small blue ring just below the tip. It is not in the light path between the filament and the reflector, so it does not do the bad things that blue-all-over bulbs do. That blue ring is there for two reasons: to sell bulbs to people who think blue is good, and to reduce the spherical light output of the bulbs to a value within the legal maximum. Bulb output is tested spherically (summing all the light leaving the bulb in all directions), but once the bulb is installed in a headlamp, only light leaving the bulb at a much more restricted range of angles makes it into the beam pattern. So the blue band is for reducing light leaving the bulb at angles not relevant when the bulb is installed in a headlamp, where the bulb performs as if it were an "over spec" item.
Thanks, that explanation makes sense to my non-professional brain.

-Virgil- said:
I don't know what you mean by "proper", but the rest of what you say is definitely not correct. Browse through the (partial) list of headlight lamps and take a look at the wide range of lumens produced by different types of bulbs. That chart lists the maximum allowable actual wattage, but the HB2 low beam, the HB4, the HB5 low beam, the H1, the H3, the H7, the H11, and the HIR2 all have nominal ratings of 12.8v, 55w.

Clicking through your link answered that. By "proper" I meant something that doesn't seem to exist - a sort of uniform standard for bulb performance as made by a reputable manufacturer. I was thinking that bulbs are the same, so given the same voltage most bulbs would give the same output. If I grok what you're saying, bulbs are NOT the same, because it depends on the filament coil density, careful (and more careful, then most careful and then perfect) positioning of said filament, whether it has things like the blue band and possibly a host of other variables.

In short, the very reason I'm here. Thanks again for the detailed answers. While my "what bulb" question is easily answered with "this one", I try to understand why before I mindlessly micturate away my money on gadgets.
 
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-Virgil-

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I'm not sure what benefit you might realize by going with a European part number

Those particular '01-'04 S60/V70 European headlamps happen to be model-specific versions of the fabled and (justifiably) famous, much-loved Cibie CSR headlamps. Extremely good beam patterns out of them. The US version certainly isn't bad, and uses the same optical technology, but the beam isn't focused as well as the European version.
 
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