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Thread: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

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    *Flashaholic* HKJ's Avatar
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    Default Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)



    Official specifications:
    • Typical capacity: 3120mAh
    • Minimum capacity: 3000mAh
    • Nominal voltage: 3.6V
    • Standard charge: CC/CV, 0.2C, 4.2V
    • Standard discharge: CC, 0.2C, 2.5V
    • End-of-charge voltage: 4.2V +/-0.05V
    • End-of-charge current: 0.02C (About 62mA)
    • End-of-discharge voltage: 2.00V
    • Continuous maximum discharge: 5C/10C (15A/30A) with temp cutoff at 80C
    • Max. discharge current vs. time: 30A-40A > 44s, 55A > 19s, 80A > 6s (Never discharge above 80C)
    • Cycle life: 300 cycles @ 0.5C to 80%
    • Initial impedance: 8mOhm - 18mOhm
    • Weight: 46.4g +/- 1.5g
    • Operating temperature: Charging 0C ~45C, discharging: -20C ~ 60C
    • Storage temperature: -5C ~ 35C




    The latest and probably last high current battery from Sony and it was a very high capacity together with the high current.











    There is no doubt this is a quality battery, the curves track perfectly and capacity is nearly constant with current.
    At high current the battery gets hot and I stopped the 20A and 30A test due to that.




    At 15A or greater Sony species that there must be a temperature cut-out at 80C, I could just stay below that at 15A





    But at 20A and 30A I hit 80C or rather went above. Here I was up to 91C.















    Conclusion

    Very few batteries can handle high current as well as Sony VTC batteries and this cell also high capacity.
    But this cell is not "draw all the current you want and stay safe" (That type of battery do not exist), to stay safe some requirements must be fulfilled!

    I will rate it a very good battery.



    Notes and links

    The batteries was supplied by ENERDan for review.
    Sony are in the process of selling their battery division (Except alkaline) to Murata.

    How is the test done and how to read the charts
    How is a protected LiIon battery constructed
    More about button top and flat top batteries
    Compare to 18650 and other batteries
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    *Flashaholic* ChrisGarrett's Avatar
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    First in on the new Sony VTC6 review...woo-hoo!

    Well, somewhat disappointing, but more choices are good.

    I'm not a vaper, so I don't need 20A, or even 15A.

    Chris
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Thanks for the review HKJ, excellent as usual.

    Impressive cell! It not only retains the position of the VTC as the king of the high drain cells, but it actually topples the Samsung 30Q right across the current range. We have a new king!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Thanks as always......what would we do without you A great 30Q alternative imo, even if the 30Q might not match it, both are more than enough for 99% of flashlights ........nice to have choices!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    Thanks as always......what would we do without you A great 30Q alternative imo, even if the 30Q might not match it, both are more than enough for 99% of flashlights ........nice to have choices!
    I agree ven. I have a stack of 30Qs and they're outstanding. For the price they are unbeatable, and that probably hasn't changed.

    This new Sony cell might be good for Vinh's high drain battery packs though, such as the RC40vnF.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I think the vtc5 will still outperform although a light meter would be requires, however it offers a happy medium between the 10a 3500 LG's and the 2600 mah VTC5's...........

    Only problem, demand= higher cost factor, for what we would notice to the eye(nothing) would it be worth the potential price increase(running on presumptions here and no doubt counterfeit risks).

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    *Flashaholic* HKJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Comparing to the Samsung the lifetime may not be as good. Sony rates it at low current and Samsung rates it at high current, i.e. it is impossible to compare correctly.
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Excellent points, i just spoke to my battery guy norb, he said they are grade B or something and waiting for grade A (or along those lines). Might be the ones available to him for now...........

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    Excellent points, i just spoke to my battery guy norb, he said they are grade B or something and waiting for grade A (or along those lines). Might be the ones available to him for now...........

    Edit- spoke to norb, class B are potentially damaged or have been stored in poor /adverse conditions for periods of unknown time. Until A become available he will not be selling them due to following good practice. So just be aware if they pop up on eBay ! You might not be getting the better cell.........If a trusted seller then a different story possibly . But the class A are not available to the public yet......

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    Edit- spoke to norb, class B are potentially damaged or have been stored in poor /adverse conditions for periods of unknown time. Until A become available he will not be selling them due to following good practice. So just be aware if they pop up on eBay ! You might not be getting the better cell.........If a trusted seller then a different story possibly . But the class A are not available to the public yet......
    Hi Ven,

    Who's placing the designation on them? Sony wouldn't know how they were stored, so it's probably not them. Any of Sony's major distributors might know, but one would think that they'd store them carefully.

    Then there's the dealers and if they're doing it, I don't know...

    Chris
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisGarrett View Post
    Hi Ven,

    Who's placing the designation on them? Sony wouldn't know how they were stored, so it's probably not them. Any of Sony's major distributors might know, but one would think that they'd store them carefully.

    Then there's the dealers and if they're doing it, I don't know...

    Chris

    Hi there Chris, i dont know the ins and outs tbh, only from a good source in the business who has a warehouse in HK. He said the ones available are grade B as the grade A have not been released yet or available to get. He also said cells right now are not good, many like LG are damaged or some are even rattling inside! Many with unknown history, he will only get cells that have proof of storage and up to 2 months old, some are of unknown age, possible stored in poor conditions and for long periods, be it temperature or damp issues. This is from someone who literally imports 1000's and 1000's and said right now its not good! We talked about a few brands, one a well known one for exaggerating their ratings and he said many others are the same and can not be fully trusted. Of all the brands, KeepPower are pretty much the only one he trusts as their specs and information regarding age/storage are accurate. Actual cell brands, he does strongly rate the Samsung right now.

    The vtc6 have my interest, just not enough to take over the 30Q for me, not yet anyway.........

    I get the impression they get stored all over buy the buyers, no doubt many variables there in conditions and how stored. By public or buyers, this i mean covers manufacturers too.

    Sony themselves will have controlled conditions no doubt there, its from Sony and to where they go is the issue IMO. I am presuming here, buying cells in bulk you will want the fact sheet, storage information, birth dates etc and when buying large quantities, you are relying on trusted contacts at the other side of the world.

    Sony have not made the grade A available yet, it seems grade B are , by who , or who actually has them i dont know, only that he will not buy them due to too many unknown variables .
    Last edited by ven; 08-04-2016 at 11:14 PM.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Can't say for Sony, but I have seen shipping package for Tadiran Li-Ion batteries for military use (proximity fuses for artillery shells). The box was sealed, had moisture sensor, shock sensor, temperature low/high indicator. It was prohibited to use these batteries, if any of above sensors were triggered.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by CuriousOne View Post
    Can't say for Sony, but I have seen shipping package for Tadiran Li-Ion batteries for military use (proximity fuses for artillery shells). The box was sealed, had moisture sensor, shock sensor, temperature low/high indicator. It was prohibited to use these batteries, if any of above sensors were triggered.
    Ha! I remember seeing the news story on the Malaysian 370 crash, when they went to the maintenance hangar where the batteries for the black boxes were stored and they were sitting out in the open, in 100+* weather and 80% humidity, so anything's possible.

    Chris
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    Flashaholic* candle lamp's Avatar
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Another excellent test review. HKJ! Thanks.

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    Flashaholic Subterrestrial's Avatar
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Thank you for the excellent review and test HKJ. I just heard about these this morning and got excited. Sounds like a distillation of the best aspects of the VTC4s and VTC5s (my two favorite IMRs) for the most part. I have a couple of sets of VTC5s I haven't even used yet, so I doubt I'll be picking these up just yet.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    THANKS FOR THE REVIEW HKJ!


    Just a thought of this grade "A" and grade "B" VTC6. I would not think HJK's sample was grade B?? So grade "A" must be available?! He got his from Enerpower[German co. I think].

    I got mine from IMR Batteries which is a reputable dealer. I think mine will be grade A!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    As always, thanks for the review!
    I also ordered up 4 of these from IMR.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I got two of these batteries from Illumination Supply yesterday. And I'm quite impressed by them. Admittedly, the name 'Sony VTC' tends to scream out loud 'vape cells' and 'low capacity'. Because of this, people assume that there are better options for flashlights (ie NCR18650B, LG MJ1, NCR18650GA). But the truth is that these cells are actually REALLY good for flashlights, and not just those with crazy high current draw. One of the best things about these cells is their ability to maintain voltage under a load. And they do this better than pretty much ANYTHING out there. The result? Your light stays nice and bright throughout the whole discharge cycle, particularly if you like to use your higher levels. Usually, when I swap to a fully charged cell, I can REALLY see how dim my light has gotten. The difference is MUCH less pronounced with these cells. If you don't like your light to dim, these are your cells.

    But what about capacity? Why live with 3000mAH when you can have 3400-3500mAH? Because there really aren't any 3400-3500mAH batteries, that's why. Unlkke 26650s (which hit their numbers fairly well), 18650s tend to be overrated by a couple of hundred mAH in real world use. For instance, at 3A, the capacity of an NCR18650GA is only 3103mAH vs the rated 3400mAH (per HKJ testing). The NCR18650GA ups this to 3208mAH, but is short of its rating by the same amount. On the other hand, the VTC6 gives you 2935mAH. This is only 165mAH short of the NCR18650B and 270mAH short of the NCR18650GA - FAR less than the difference on paper. The result? My SC600Fd runs ALMOST as long on a VTC6 as an NCR18650GA! And it runs brighter to boot! Because of this, I DEFINITELY consider this battery to be worth consideration, even if you NEVER plan to draw over 3A.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I have 8 of these in my quiver now. I'm using them in my highest amp draw modded lights, which draw 12 amps! Love 'em!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by MAD777 View Post
    I have 8 of these in my quiver now. I'm using them in my highest amp draw modded lights, which draw 12 amps! Love 'em!
    I have 8 as well. It's perfect for my "show off" lights. Everything else I use 30Q...because they are much cheaper.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I use them in my M2Xvn,TX25C2vn and SDMiniVN.

    I change batteries After 15 minutes to a max of 20 minutes. These are powerful modded lights. For these lights, and to be expected, I can definitely tell the difference when I put a fresh one in,even after 15 minutes when the cells are ~ 3.87v.

    The 30Q's were mentioned,,,they are very good cells for the price. The run time pleasantly surprised me. Using my TK75vn, The voltage after 38 consecutive minutes[step down step up @ 20 minutes] on turbo was 3.66V. The voltage with my Soshine[18 months old/panny 3400 cell] after the same time was 3.65V,,,,,,I know they are 18 months old. I do not think a brand new 3400 panny cell would last longer than the 30Q and/or the VTC6 as StorminMatt ​ described.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by Capolini View Post
    I do not think a brand new 3400 panny cell would last longer than the 30Q and/or the VTC6 as StorminMatt ​ described.
    And bear in mind that my runtime comparison with the NCR18650B was for a bone stock SC600Fd running on H2 high, NOT a Vinh light. As current draw increases, the small capacity advantage of the NCR18650B decreases (and possibly becomes andisadvabtage when voltage sag is taken into account).

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I have 10 of these cells for my vape mods. Thus far they are stellar performers and surprisingly affordable. Why are they "likely the last" high amp cells from Sony?

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by CelticCross74 View Post
    Why are they "likely the last" high amp cells from Sony?
    Because Sony has sold the LiIon battery branch to another company. It is probably not the end of the VTC batteries, but expect another name on the cell.
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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I read on my hometown dealers[Liionwholesale.com] website that there is a code on here to identify MANUFACTURING DATE.

    For those who do not know and are interested, the information is given on the "Sony specification/Data sheet". It is located in section 6.

    6. Identification and Marking (Lot Number Definition:Manufacturing Date of Cells)

    Here is the link:

    https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...51569019225974


    It starts with the year 1992 which is"A" and correlates w/ the alphabet. 1993 would be "B" and so on.Cut to the chase,,,,,,,,X=2015, Y=2016

    Y=YEAR
    M=MONTH
    D=DAY
    D=DAY
    S=ELECTRODE HISTORY


    -All you need to do is look at the SET of Numbers below: SE US18650VTC6

    - Look at the LAST Five numbers/letters to determine the Manufacturing date:

    X=2015 AND Y=2016

    MY LAST FIVE NUMBERS/DIGITS FOR MINE READ: YD28P

    Y=[LETTER Y] =2016
    M=D=APRIL[4TH LETTER/4TH MONTH]
    D=2
    D=8
    P=ELECTRODE HISTORY

    MINE WERE MANUFACTURED APRIL 28TH,2016.


    I GOT THEM IN THE BEGINNING OF AUGUST,,,,,,,,THEY WERE JUST OVER 3 MONTHS OLD!
    Last edited by Capolini; 12-19-2016 at 12:10 PM.

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    So, it is now obvious why Sony had to sell. The letter 'Z' is coming up next year, and they couldn't figure out a new code! LOL

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    ^^^

    LOL!! Similar thought as mine,,,as I was figuring out the years/letter correlations I said to myself they have to sell all their batteries by the end of next year!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    In one aspect I am NOT impressed with these batteries at all. They have been used 5.5 months.

    One has 40 cycles and the other 20 cycles. Once they have been below 3.70V for testing. Other than that they have NOT been below 3.8 Volts!

    BOD: April 28,2016

    Purchased: August 22,2016

    One came off of the charger @ 4.20v,,,the other @ 4.19v. Eight hours later they were both 4.14v. When they were new, which was not long ago[!], the resting voltages would be 4.18/4.19v Five or Six days later.

    I realize ALL batteries drop several Hundredths of a volt after resting. IMO these have dropped too low of a voltage/too quickly compared to ALL of my other batteries that are much older. If they were a few years old it would not concern me, but they are not.

    AS FAR AS I KNOW THEY ARE GENUINE WITH ALL THE CORRECT MARKINGS. I BOUGHT THEM FROM A REPUTABLE DEALER.

    Is this a sign of them DEGRADING too fast? I think it might be.

    I have many batteries of all sizes that are b/w 1.5 and 3 years old whose resting voltages are higher after sitting for several days!

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    I was about to buy four of these a week or so ago, however I got busy and forgot to place the order. Now I am not sure if I want these or 30Q's?

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    Default Re: Test/Review of Sony US18650VTC6 3000mAh (Green)

    Quote Originally Posted by Capolini View Post
    In one aspect I am NOT impressed with these batteries at all. They have been used 5.5 months.

    One has 40 cycles and the other 20 cycles. Once they have been below 3.70V for testing. Other than that they have NOT been below 3.8 Volts!

    BOD: April 28,2016

    Purchased: August 22,2016

    One came off of the charger @ 4.20v,,,the other @ 4.19v. Eight hours later they were both 4.14v. When they were new, which was not long ago[!], the resting voltages would be 4.18/4.19v Five or Six days later.

    I realize ALL batteries drop several Hundredths of a volt after resting. IMO these have dropped too low of a voltage/too quickly compared to ALL of my other batteries that are much older. If they were a few years old it would not concern me, but they are not.

    AS FAR AS I KNOW THEY ARE GENUINE WITH ALL THE CORRECT MARKINGS. I BOUGHT THEM FROM A REPUTABLE DEALER.

    Is this a sign of them DEGRADING too fast? I think it might be.

    I have many batteries of all sizes that are b/w 1.5 and 3 years old whose resting voltages are higher after sitting for several days!
    I remember when you bought them and I think that it was Ven who stated that his battery guy suggested that there might be VTC6 floating around, which might not have been stored properly and were classified as 'B stock.'

    What charger are you using again?

    I would think that 4.14v after a few hours is too much for a newish cell, but if you bang on them hard, say while using them in a sub-ohm mech vaporizer, then perhaps, but you don't seem to be doing that?

    Charge them up to full, let them rest 2 hours, discharge them down at 1A (the max for something like an Opus charger) and then see what you see.

    Chris
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