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Thread: Foursevens Mini Mark II

  1. #121

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by matrixshaman View Post
    ...But with the battery 4sevens sent I can say it is very freakin' BRIGHT
    By the way, M-S: what was your experience with the step-down from turbo, when using the 4/7s battery?

  2. #122

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    I got mine in and did some output and current tests.

    For the record, my lightbox is calibrated to what I believe to be US ANSI and ties up closely with my HDS 325 (@0.02 and 325) and ti-force's review of a couple Quarks (btw, ti-force is the only CPF reviewer that claims very accurate lumens using laboratory tested calibration lights). This scale is lower than that used by Selfbuilt, and most Chinese domicile companies - for example, the best I can get off my 1st gen ZL SC52 is ~230/440 lms from an Eneloop/14500 (all the other modes are similarly off as well).

    My measurements on a fully charged OEM cell are as follows, runtime calculated assuming 550mah batt spec is correct:

    - Max 1000-1050 lms, 3A current draw, 11 mins calc assuming continuous
    - Medium 280 lms, 0.514A, 66 mins
    - Low 17 lms, 35ma, 16 hours
    - Moonlight 0.25 lms, 4ma, 138 hours

    My sample holds max (very flat) for 30 seconds, and then ramps down over the next 10 sec. to ~325 lms and then regulates flat again - I don't know where the 15sec comes in, except to say it could be 47s "under promise/over deliver" thing, and also perhaps to technically qualify for the 30sec ANSI FL1 rule. The light seems to hold a flat 1k+ over 4V, and I'm even getting a flat 800+ at 3.6something V. The head gets warm, but nothing uncomfortable against your upper lip.

    For those that aren't familiar with 47s take on memory mode, it is unique in that if you turn on to a memory mode, then the next mode in the sequence will always revert to the first mode the series (i.e., low in stock #6 config). But if you start cycling, and don't turn off, then it will continuously loop cycle as most other lights. When cycling this light, the off period seems to need to be very short... I seem to be skipping medium often if I'm not fast enough.

    I'm impressed, and happy to see that 47 is still sticking to honest lumens. Maybe some else would like to do a low mode runtime test to see if the 550 mah capacity is right. That's all for now, hope it helps.

  3. #123

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    I got mine in and did some output and current tests....

    My sample holds max (very flat) for 30 seconds, and then ramps down over the next 10 sec. to ~325 lms and then regulates flat again - I don't know where the 15sec comes in, except to say it could be 47s "under promise/over deliver" thing, and also perhaps to technically qualify for the 30sec ANSI FL1 rule....

    The head gets warm, but nothing uncomfortable against your upper lip....

    I'm impressed, and happy to see that 47 is still sticking to honest lumens. Maybe some else would like to do a low mode runtime test to see if the 550 mah capacity is right. That's all for now, hope it helps.
    That's a huge help, reppans! Solid numbers that confirm my impressions.

    I hope that they *did* write the code for a 30-second ramp-down, since that way it is both ANSI-compliant and also more directly comparable to other lights.

    Interesting that the ramp-down takes ten seconds--that probably explains why I had some general sense that it was dimmer at 60 seconds, but could not be sure. The eye is a surprisingly bad lumen-meter!

  4. #124

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Seems like FourSevens is definitely taking full advantage of the ANSI 30-second measurement standard... is it literally a timed step-down, or temperature based?

    In my opinion, this is a 325 lumen light with a 1,000 lumen burst mode.

    No mode between 17lms (16 hrs) and 280lms (1 hour)? Or is there a way to re-configure the mode spacing?

  5. #125
    Flashaholic* matrixshaman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by lampeDépêche View Post
    Nice pix, Matrixshaman--very helpful!

    "speculate" above on thread was curious about the flood on this beam: "Would love to see how the flood is on this light."

    Your reaction is: "It is a very large hot spot - basically it's a flood light - at about 4 feet you have roughly a 2 foot diameter hot spot, at 10 feet it looks like about 4 or 5 foot diameter hot spot. "


    That's all true, but my reaction is: very little flood. A beam that is 2 ft in diameter at 4 ft distance is a 28-degree cone (tan 14 = 0.249). It's true that the beam inside of that 28-degree cone is very even and floody--no hot-spot internal to it. But that's still a relatively narrow cone.

    And I would estimate that 90%-95% of the output is going into that cone--the spill outside of it is very faint (though it looks pretty good in your photo, because of the white-wall-bounce effect.).

    So it's not a wall-of-light effect, like (e.g.) a ZL frosted lens putting out a 90-degree cone (tan 45 = 1, so that means an 8 foot circle when held 4 feet away). Much less is it a pure flood mule with a 120-degree cone, like the ZL X02 and X03 series.

    It's more like a thrower that throws a big, hot spot with very little spill.

    I think that's a useful beam for all urban and suburban uses--close up it's great, and at 50 meters away, it will bathe a 20m to 25 meter circle in even light. (So, across the parking lot you will see two cars end to end). Not a rural thrower (but then at this size, who would expect that?) and not an arms'-length flooder.
    You are totally right - that describes it much better. I've been away from CPF too long - LOL.
    There is no important work, there are only a series of moments to demonstrate your mastery and impeccability. Quote from Almine

  6. #126
    Flashaholic* matrixshaman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by lampeDépêche View Post
    By the way, M-S: what was your experience with the step-down from turbo, when using the 4/7s battery?
    I have actually never run it more than about 10 seconds on turbo. I'll have to try that with the Lumen meter to see if there is a noticeable drop. Probably tomorrow. edit: Cancel that - see reppans post - thanks reppans.
    Last edited by matrixshaman; 11-13-2016 at 12:46 AM.
    There is no important work, there are only a series of moments to demonstrate your mastery and impeccability. Quote from Almine

  7. #127
    Flashaholic* matrixshaman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    I got mine in and did some output and current tests.

    For the record, my lightbox is calibrated to what I believe to be US ANSI and ties up closely with my HDS 325 (@0.02 and 325) and ti-force's review of a couple Quarks (btw, ti-force is the only CPF reviewer that claims very accurate lumens using laboratory tested calibration lights). This scale is lower than that used by Selfbuilt, and most Chinese domicile companies - for example, the best I can get off my 1st gen ZL SC52 is ~230/440 lms from an Eneloop/14500 (all the other modes are similarly off as well).

    My measurements on a fully charged OEM cell are as follows, runtime calculated assuming 550mah batt spec is correct:

    - Max 1000-1050 lms, 3A current draw, 11 mins calc assuming continuous
    - Medium 280 lms, 0.514A, 66 mins
    - Low 17 lms, 35ma, 16 hours
    - Moonlight 0.25 lms, 4ma, 138 hours

    My sample holds max (very flat) for 30 seconds, and then ramps down over the next 10 sec. to ~325 lms and then regulates flat again - I don't know where the 15sec comes in, except to say it could be 47s "under promise/over deliver" thing, and also perhaps to technically qualify for the 30sec ANSI FL1 rule. The light seems to hold a flat 1k+ over 4V, and I'm even getting a flat 800+ at 3.6something V. The head gets warm, but nothing uncomfortable against your upper lip.

    For those that aren't familiar with 47s take on memory mode, it is unique in that if you turn on to a memory mode, then the next mode in the sequence will always revert to the first mode the series (i.e., low in stock #6 config). But if you start cycling, and don't turn off, then it will continuously loop cycle as most other lights. When cycling this light, the off period seems to need to be very short... I seem to be skipping medium often if I'm not fast enough.

    I'm impressed, and happy to see that 47 is still sticking to honest lumens. Maybe some else would like to do a low mode runtime test to see if the 550 mah capacity is right. That's all for now, hope it helps.
    Thanks for the excellent data! That will save me digging out my light meter as I said above - I'm sure your numbers are a lot more exact and meaningful here. That's great to know you got those results with a real and accurate light sphere. This light rocks!

    Regarding the off period you mentioned I also noticed it's very brief. I had a hard time initially getting it into configuration mode which requires the 10 on-off cycles. I found the easiest way to do that was to twist it to the point where the light just turns on and then back it off just enough so it goes off. Then squeeze the front half to the back half which I found can be done quickly squeezing and releasing to get the 10 cycles.
    Last edited by matrixshaman; 11-13-2016 at 12:58 AM.
    There is no important work, there are only a series of moments to demonstrate your mastery and impeccability. Quote from Almine

  8. #128

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by matrixshaman View Post
    Thanks for the excellent data! That will save me digging out my light meter as I said above - I'm sure your numbers are a lot more exact and meaningful here. That's great to know you got those results with a real and accurate light sphere. This light rocks!
    Yeah, I'm thinking it's a winner.

    But I agree with the criticism about the mode-spacing. The medium really should be in the 100 lumen range, given that the high settles down to 325 after 30 seconds.

    (And I don't object to calling this a 325 High with a 1000 lumen Burst-Mode, as holygeez03 suggests. Pretty much everyone's top output level these days is a burst-mode, and if it's not a timed step-down after that then it's a temperature-regulated step-down. I don't see that as false advertising or bad design. Just the opposite: if you design a light so that its max output is limited to what it can sustain for hours on end, then you'll be leaving a lot of useful capability on the table, not taken advantage of. Why not give me the option of that sustainable hours-on-end level as one of the middle levels, and also give me access to the far higher burst-modes?)
    Last edited by lampeDépêche; 11-13-2016 at 01:03 AM.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    I received mine today. The magnetic charger works quickly. The light is indeed super bright for it's size. It took these feeble fingers a bit to get the timing right to reliably change modes. It takes a very quick off-on. The step down is a gradule dimming. Very hard to notice when it starts. The pocket clip lets you carry it bezel up or down and does not touch the head of the light. The threads work very smoothly. With the cool-guy charger and battery and two clips I think this light is a bargain as well.

  10. #130

    Lightbulb Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    I got mine in and did some output and current tests.
    For the record, my lightbox is calibrated to what I believe to be US ANSI and ties up closely with my HDS 325 (@0.02 and 325) and ti-force's review of a couple Quarks
    Thank you so much for the figures -
    I'll link your post in -

    RUSH REVIEW - 4Sevens Mini Mk II (1020 lumens)


    The closest flashlight I have to compare - 4Sevens QP2L-X with its 780 lumens burst mode


  11. #131

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    I emailed Foursevens about the step down and they said:
    'Yes the light is constant and for 15 seconds it hits 1020 lumens. Then it will gradually ramp down to 50% of that.



    The light actually goes down to 550 but the light has thermal protection so if the light gets to hot it will drop down to 300.

    TJ'




    Although it says step down to 300 after 15 seconds on the website, apparently it steps down to 550, then another drop to 300 after the thermal regulation kicks in.

  12. #132
    *Flashaholic* Chauncey Gardiner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Assuming my Mark II starts to step-down at 15 seconds, it takes another ten seconds before I'm able to notice the reduction in output. I've no regrets concerning the purchase of this light. The Mini Mark II is truly an amazing light.

    ~ Chance
    Never point a flashlight at anything you don't intend to illuminate! Never buy a flashlight you have to make payments on.

  13. #133
    Flashaholic* oKtosiTe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by defbear View Post
    I received mine today. The magnetic charger works quickly. The light is indeed super bright for it's size. It took these feeble fingers a bit to get the timing right to reliably change modes. It takes a very quick off-on. The step down is a gradule dimming. Very hard to notice when it starts. The pocket clip lets you carry it bezel up or down and does not touch the head of the light. The threads work very smoothly. With the cool-guy charger and battery and two clips I think this light is a bargain as well.
    Heh, your post confused me to a degree. I though you meant an Olight S1R style external charger at first, and was about to comment that this light doesn't have internal charging. I should have read your entire post.

  14. #134
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    I'm curious for folks who have received their lights with battery if you could answer a question. On the FourSevens site David keeps reinforcing that you need a 10C battery and makes reference to the fact that Foursevens "special" battery has some sort of protection. This confuses me. I presumed that the battery is just the rebranded Olight IMR which is rated at 5C or 2.75A. The battery is unprotected. Further, the maximum draw for this light (based upon a review) is 3A. So is the FourSevens battery some truly special battery with 10C discharge *and* protection? Further, does anyone believe you really need 10C (~5.5A for a 550mA battery) to get full brightness?

  15. #135
    Enlightened mattodio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II



    The battery that came with is a RCR123A
    3.7V 550 mAh 5C for high-drain devices, built in protection

    Tbh I cannot tell a difference between it and an AW IMR but I also dont have an accurate measuring device besides my eyes.

    I was thinking it would have came with an IMR since it said special battery on the web site, but i guess any good old RCR is enought to pump out the 1020

  16. #136
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by mattodio View Post
    The battery that came with is a RCR123A
    3.7V 550 mAh 5C for high-drain devices, built in protection

    Tbh I cannot tell a difference between it and an AW IMR but I also dont have an accurate measuring device besides my eyes.

    I was thinking it would have came with an IMR since it said special battery on the web site, but i guess any good old RCR is enough to pump out the 1020
    Thanks. So the battery sure *looks* the same as a 550maH 5C Olight IMR battery. How sure are you that this battery has a protection circuit? Can you feel it in the negative end of the battery or note the characteristic strap down the side of the battery? I'm just curious. Does is say "built in protection" on the battery itself? Thanks so much for this information.

  17. #137
    *Flashaholic* Chauncey Gardiner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    A picture is worth a thousand words. I can't feel anything on the negative end or the side of the battery.

    ~ CG
    Last edited by Chauncey Gardiner; 11-15-2016 at 06:46 PM.
    Never point a flashlight at anything you don't intend to illuminate! Never buy a flashlight you have to make payments on.

  18. #138
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Thanks! It looks like there is a metal cap on the positive end that probably contains the circuit. This is more common these days (Fenix cells etc...).

  19. #139
    *Flashaholic* Chauncey Gardiner's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    You're welcome.

    Moonlight mode.


    Never point a flashlight at anything you don't intend to illuminate! Never buy a flashlight you have to make payments on.

  20. #140

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Battery comments FWIW...

    Got a chance to do a runtime test on low - mine ran for almost exactly 17hrs, and the output was a flat 16-17lms (good regulation). That's ~280 lm-hrs from a 2 W-h battery. I usually test 1xEneloop lights and the best I've seen is ~280 lm-hrs from a 2.4 W-h Eneloop (Quark XPG2 and SC52 ~20 lms) - I suppose the difference being boost drivers are less efficient than buck.

    I metered the battery toward the end of the run and got:
    3.58V @ 12:30
    3.53V @ 14:00
    3.48V @ 15:00
    3.40V @ 16:15
    Protection tripped at 17:00
    3.04V immediately after reset (note: while the charger seems to charge regardless of polarity, the reset seems to work only one way, so I marked the heads +/-)

    Using a Drok USB multimeter (these things are great for $15), the charger drew 565mah @ ~5.15V and 2/3A from the wallwart while under CC (full charge from empty). In practice, the wallwart mah output is a reasonably good indicator of the mah that makes it into the battery, with the 20-25% voltage difference representing the conversion losses. Cell always comes off at 4.22V, and it took ~1:15hrs to fully charge.

    Also ran max output @ 3.55V for 1min (performed normally), which brought V down to 3.50. Tried it again, and the circuit tripped in ~5 secs. Reset and tried again on Medium, and I think it tripped in a minute or two. So the edge of the battery cliff is ~3.50V (and matches the graph below) for med/max outputs.

    I agree with Andrew that this cell probably the same as Olight's protected 5C IMR given it has the same PCB? seam near the head, same written specs, and David's Olight affiliation. Knowing David/47s, as a true US owned/operated company in the litigious US, my GUESS is that the battery is based on AWs new 15C IMR that HKJ has tested HERE - this cell would meet the 10C requirement Andrew mentions above, but is probably under spec'd for lawyer labeling/conservatism. David/47s has to make sure their products are as idiot proof as possible using proprietary batteries (eg, Regen), protection circuits (47s won't sell unprotected IMRs), and under spec'd (5C labeling), because some Joe Six Pack American will find a way to burn his house down and bring lawsuit. Think I'll pick up a couple of those Olight 5Cs for my burst mode Quarks on 1CR123 tubes.

    Whatever cell is in there, it's an IMR based on the voltage characteristics. I usually use protected ICRs and like to recharge in the 60-80% (~3.8-3.7V) depleted range since frequent top-up charging wears li-ions out faster. The equivalent 60-80% depleted range for an IMR will be in the 3.65-3.55V range. The Drok mah indicator matches up closely - charged from 3.8V only ~200mah went in, from 3.65V ~300mah went in. A screen shot from HKJs comparator comparing the discharge curves for the IMR 15C to an ICR. The 0.1A curve is a close approximation of resting voltage (all my numbers are resting V).


  21. #141

    Thumbs up Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by reppans View Post
    Battery comments FWIW...

    Got a chance to do a runtime test on low
    ...
    Thank you so much for this valuable information - very impressive.

    Again, I have linked your post in -

    RUSH REVIEW - 4Sevens Mini Mk II (1020 lumens)

    Thank you

  22. #142

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    To get back to some posts..

    Quote Originally Posted by holygeez03 View Post
    ..is it literally a timed step-down, or temperature based?
    I would guess timed, but I've done all my runs at consistent 67F ambient.

    Quote Originally Posted by matrixshaman View Post
    .. I'm sure your numbers are a lot more exact and meaningful here. That's great to know you got those results with a real and accurate light sphere..
    I don't have a sphere, I'm using a DIY plumbing pipe special w/LX1330 lux meter - it's a standard light box the BLF guys are using. I'm comfortable with it based on how it matches ti-force's review of the QT2L-X BM (all modes), HDS (min/max), and a few other Quarks (most modes).

    Quote Originally Posted by UnknownVT View Post
    Thank you so much for the figures -
    I'll link your post in -

    The closest flashlight I have to compare - 4Sevens QP2L-X with its 780 lumens burst mode
    You look like you're using a DSLR... you know you that you can actually use its light meter as a serviceable lumen meter? Not as good a lux meter, but far better than the eye can distinguish, and better than a pix comparison. 1/3stops get a bit wide for metering max output, but it has great accuracy at the lower/sub lumen range (actually all I really care about). Just need a beam diffuser, or bounced sample, and calibrate too/solve for shutter speed. Eg, calibrate your QP2L-X to 1/800 of sec, and you should see 1/1000 from the mini.

    Note here guys: I can no longer get the 1000+ lumens readings as I did on the first day. I'm now more in the 850-950 range on >4V and 700-850 range <4V. Perhaps too many repeated ~50 sec Max output runs has weakened the light, or battery, somewhat. Still a killer pocket rocket.

    On a personal preference note (I'm a low lumen/efficiency nut):
    - disappointed the moonlight is so far off. I love the "bright" ~0.4 lm moonlights of my recent Quarks - it's my most often used mode/light. 1 lm spec would have been a good equivalent for this floody low lux beam, esp. with the giant step to 17 lms.
    - not a fan of the mode spacing: 0.25 > 17 is too big gap, while 250 > 1000 is too close (you can see a 3-4x difference while mode switching, but it's hard to tell which mode it is from off/memory). I usually don't go for bright lights because they always seem to forfeit good low mode spacing. IMHO a tiny capacity light like this should take better advantage of battery-efficient mode spacing. An even 10x spacing of 1/10/100/1000 would really ring the bell for me, and would make a lot more sense for the CR123/non-combo version (currently 500/300 max to > 250 med??) Love the Quarks 0.3/3/30/300 ish spacing - but I guess I'm one of the few low lumen/runtime guys on CPF.
    - The off-on timing to get reliable mode switching is too short. Still skipping modes too much, need to set everything up just so to get reliable switching. This would frustrate the non flashaholics.
    - Clip seems strong and love the recess so it doesn't rotate. Floody beam is great for headlamp mode on a ball cap (although 0.25/17 mode spacing is bit too dim/blinding, respectively, for me). I'd reduce the knurling under the tip of the clip... to save pocket chew.
    - high beacon/low beacon seem the same on my sample, full output.
    Last edited by reppans; 11-16-2016 at 01:49 PM.

  23. #143

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Has anyone else been having issues contacting foursevens lately?
    I ordered 2 flashlights on November 4th (mini mark 2 combo first wave, and quark smart light) but only received the quark smart light, in what i can only assume is a packing error.
    I've tried contacting them through email and phone but they haven't responded to email nor their phone for the past few days now.
    Was really excited to get the mini mark 2 but unsure what to do now.. Any tips on how I can reach them?
    Last edited by speculate; 11-17-2016 at 01:45 PM.

  24. #144
    Flashaholic* Nake's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    According to their site, the Mini is on backorder.

  25. #145
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Just took delivery of my new Mini Mark II from the "second wave". Nothing substantive to add on this thread from a "metrics" perspective but I can confirm that it is a wonderful EDC. My first 4Sevens light was the original Mini and I can say without a doubt that this light is a significant refinement from the first series. The clip is great (unlike the Olight clips that are hard as heck to get in and out of my pocket) and the fit and finish is top notch. A bit green on low but otherwise excellent for a CW pocket light. Can't wait until it gets dark.

  26. #146

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Finally received my light after a month. Does anyone else's light run extremely hot to the touch when on max brightness after 15-30 seconds? As in, too hot to keep your hands on it. Im just wondering if this is normal or if I got a lemon.

  27. #147
    Enlightened mattodio's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Quote Originally Posted by speculate View Post
    Finally received my light after a month. Does anyone else's light run extremely hot to the touch when on max brightness after 15-30 seconds? As in, too hot to keep your hands on it. Im just wondering if this is normal or if I got a lemon.
    Just tested, mine gets warm but never turns into a hot potato. Ambient temp is about 70°

  28. #148
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Nope. Just slightly warm. I *do* have lights that are literally too hot to touch after about 30 seconds. This one is just slightly warm. It steps down right around that point (~15-20 seconds) and seems to run around body temp.

  29. #149

    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    Mine never gets really hot. I have to say I'd kind of given up on Foursevens but this one is great!

  30. #150
    Flashaholic* wacbzz's Avatar
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    Default Re: Foursevens Mini Mark II

    I love that these limited edition versions now have the neutral XM-L2 U3 in them, but hate that it cannot be had in the black aluminum...

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