"Quad dual beam" halogens on '17 Ford Super Duty

The halogen headlights on the 2017 Ford Super Duty trucks are called "quad dual beam". There are 4 low beam lamps and 4 high beam lamps. I can't recall ever seeing that arrangement on a vehicle.

That's very interesting. If it is as described, it is difficult to imagine how it complies with certain aspects of Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 108, let alone various state laws.

Seen a few of these on the roads up here already. Surprisngly one of fords least glaring designs, subjectively at least.

Ford is also proud of the fact the the combined 4 low beams on the 2107 Super Duty produce more light output than the high beams on the previous generation.

Got some links to Ford's propaganda on these lamps? I'm not finding a whole lot with a Google search.

-Virgil- said:

Got some links to Ford's propaganda on these lamps? I'm not finding a whole lot with a Google search.

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Me neither

http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/trim/f250xl/

click on "Exterior Features" in the menu bar, then scroll down to "Headlamps-quad dual beam halogen"

OK, so without seeing more than that pic, it could be a pair of H13s on each side, both wired and with optics to provide low and high beam. Certainly technically possible, not difficult, but still hard to imagine how this gets by some of the aspects of state usage regulations. I'll have to keep my eyes out and see what more I can learn.

If that's what they did, four H13s, that's certainly going to put out a fair amount of light, but it's also going to gobble up a lot of electricity.

Wow! I just returned from my daily dam inspection at work. As I came downhill onto the dam in my 10 year old F250 Super Duty 4x4, I met a big shiny late model Ford truck with SIX illuminated lights. Daytime, and I was in a tall rig, so it did not dazzle me. But I guessed that the owner had done some creative wiring to allow him to switch on his fog lights along with high beam. Now, reading this, I think I just met one of those new trucks, four headlights on low, plus the fog lights on.

I do not think this is a great idea. From 1958 (OK trivia fans, I know which two cars had quads in 1957) until the present, four illuminated headlamps has meant "high beam." I think drivers will be confused by this.

-Virgil- said:

That's very interesting. If it is as described, it is difficult to imagine how it complies with certain aspects of Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 108, let alone various state laws.

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Speaking of compliance, how is Jeep getting away with their stacked DRL, headlight and foglight, all illuminated simultaneously (6 light sources, 4 of which are allowed simultaneously, to my knowledge)?

John_Galt said:

Speaking of compliance, how is Jeep getting away with their stacked DRL, headlight and foglight, all illuminated simultaneously (6 light sources, 4 of which are allowed simultaneously, to my knowledge)?

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Which model are you talking about?

Hamilton Felix said:

I do not think this is a great idea. From 1958 until the present, four illuminated headlamps has meant "high beam."

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That ship has already sailed, though. BMW's recent models use the upper half of both the inner and outer headlamp optics to provide the low beam, so the cars have a four-lit appearance whether on low or on high beam.

OK, I've received more info on the Quad Dual Beam system: Yes, it is two H13 bulbs per side, each wired up to be active on low and high beam. This does not run afoul of FMVSS 108, which states (in S10.15.1): "A replaceable bulb headlighting system (...) must provide in total not more than two upper beams and two lower beams and must incorporate not more than two replaceable light sources in each headlamp." Note that it refers to beams, not to compartments, and to light sources, not lit light sources. So the Ford Quad Dual Beam system uses two H13 bulbs on each side to provide the low beams and the high beams. Perhaps one of the compartments provides the hot spot (distance throw) while the other one provides spread/width. Or perhaps they both provide more or less a complete beam, but the two of them together provide a stronger beam. It will be interesting to see how the task is split up: if I lose one of my H13s, do I lose my distance reach or my spread/foreground on that side, or do I still have a complete beam, just not as strong of a beam? Have to wait and see.

I'm sure this is a better-performing headlamp system than the outgoing setups with single H13 or something like H11 low/HB3 high. But yee dogs, 120w per side on low beam and 140w per side on high beam (@ 12.8v) for a total of 240w low beam and 280w high beam? Not that there's going to be any shortage of power available in a truck like that, which I'm sure comes equipped with a monster alternator, but wow, that's a whole lot of amps (about 20 of them) to achieve the task.

-Virgil- said:

I'm sure this is a better-performing headlamp system than the outgoing setups with single H13 or something like H11 low/HB3 high. But yee dogs, 120w per side on low beam and 140w per side on high beam (@ 12.8v) for a total of 240w low beam and 280w high beam? Not that there's going to be any shortage of power available in a truck like that, which I'm sure comes equipped with a monster alternator, but wow, that's a whole lot of amps (about 20 of them) to achieve the task.

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But was there NO OTHER WAY to make a better headlamp? It's almost like they did this "because they could". And there's still the matter of "is the low beam actually GOOD?" and "does it minimize glare?" and all that.

Hamilton Felix said:

...I think I just met one of those new trucks, four headlights on low, plus the fog lights on...

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I could be wrong, but doesn't the law in many states prohibit having more than 4 "headlights" turned on? Will 4 low beam headlights plus 2 fogs turned on simultaneously be illegal in some states?

I can see this starting a new trend among pickup owners. The aftermarket will no doubt come up with a quad LED setup, plus LED fog lamps. Glare monsters.

-Virgil- said:

But yee dogs, 120w per side on low beam and 140w per side on high beam (@ 12.8v) for a total of 240w low beam and 280w high beam? Not that there's going to be any shortage of power available in a truck like that, which I'm sure comes equipped with a monster alternator, but wow, that's a whole lot of amps (about 20 of them) to achieve the task.

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From what I see at the Ford site, the standard alternator for the gasoline engine version is 157A, with options of 200A and 240A.

Alaric Darconville said:

But was there NO OTHER WAY to make a better headlamp? It's almost like they did this "because they could". And there's still the matter of "is the low beam actually GOOD?" and "does it minimize glare?" and all that.

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In the heavy duty truck world, more and bigger is better. Doesn't matter if it actually is or not. Four headlamp bulbs?!?!?! Sold!!!

-Virgil- said:

Which model are you talking about?

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The cherokee.

Alaric Darconville said:

But was there NO OTHER WAY to make a better headlamp?

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There are many other ways to make a better headlamp. This appears to be a brute-force type of method.

It's almost like they did this "because they could"

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You might not be far off the mark, there. I'm guessing this was put in front of focus groups and the reaction was positive.

And there's still the matter of "is the low beam actually GOOD?"

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Yes, that's true -- we'll have to wait and see.

SubLGT said:

doesn't the law in many states prohibit having more than 4 "headlights" turned on? Will 4 low beam headlights plus 2 fogs turned on simultaneously be illegal in some states?

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Yes to both. Not that it practically matters much, because that's the kind of law that is seldom enforced (except sometimes as a reason to see what other violations and infractions might be accompanying). But maybe enforcement in no-more-than-four-lights states will trim down the number of people using their fog lamps all the time. Here's an interesting question: can the fog lamps on this truck be operated with position/tail lamps alone, or only with the low beams?

John_Galt said:

how is Jeep getting away with their stacked DRL, headlight and foglight, all illuminated simultaneously (6 light sources, 4 of which are allowed simultaneously, to my knowledge) on the cherokee?

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They're not. The DRL is not lit at the same time as the headlamps. The front position ("parking") lamp is lit with the headlamps. Those two functions, DRL and front position light, are provided by the same LED array operated in a bright mode for the DRL function and a dim mode for the front position light.