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Thread: Zebralight SC64c

  1. #31

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    I was really unhappy with my SC5c and the SC64c appears to be the 18650 version of that from what I can tell. But I don't think I'll be able to resist giving it a try. [tint] lotto/gambling addiction hotline: 800-522-4700
    GOOD TINT!

  2. #32

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by markr6 View Post
    I was really unhappy with my SC5c and the SC64c appears to be the 18650 version of that from what I can tell. But I don't think I'll be able to resist giving it a try. [tint] lotto/gambling addiction hotline: 800-522-4700
    Maybe youíll have better luck with this one! I expect tint will be similar but you never know! Have you heard anything on when these will be released?

  3. #33
    *Flashaholic* gunga's Avatar
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    I like my sc5c II. Looking forward to the 18650 version.

  4. #34

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    I would love a headlamp version of the MkIV Plus

  5. #35
    Flashaholic* Derek Dean's Avatar
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Mark, I know you've tried using filters. Have you given up on those? I continue to filter every new light I get, and I'm one happy camper.

  6. #36

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Dean View Post
    Mark, I know you've tried using filters. Have you given up on those? I continue to filter every new light I get, and I'm one happy camper.
    I just don't like the idea of filters, so I gave up.

    Zebralight is killing me with the 4000K stuff! But I've clearly proven my insanity here in the past by purchasing the same stuff over and over, so I guess I'll remain a buyer
    GOOD TINT!

  7. #37
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by markr6 View Post
    I just don't like the idea of filters, so I gave up.

    Zebralight is killing me with the 4000K stuff! But I've clearly proven my insanity here in the past by purchasing the same stuff over and over, so I guess I'll remain a buyer

    I like 4000k, but not yellow 4000k . Can handle a little towards yellow like the 219c 4000k's i have(nice and a change). My most used and loved ZL is the sc62d, 320lm max and 5000k from the luxeon T(damn i love this light and may get another). Very close by the sc63w with a nice 4500k beam. I prefer the sc60's body, be it 62/63 and maybe 64! over the chunky 600 models............just like the design and how compact they are(62 my fav out of the 62 and 63).

    I think if they offered 4000/4500/5000k then most(if not all) would be happy...........even a 6000k for the cool junkies out there.

  8. #38

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    I like 4000k, but not yellow 4000k . Can handle a little towards yellow like the 219c 4000k's i have(nice and a change).
    I agree with that. The 4000K 219B dropin in my Malkoff MD2 is perfect. I call it "gray" since it's basically lacking any tint; just perfect, natural color rendering. You really can't call it warm or cool.

    I guess I'm hesitant with the 4000K in a Zebralight since even the 4400/4500K lights from them were usually too yellow. Just bad tints from Cree overall. I have a few that are OK. One was perfect like a Nichia, but I sold it since I didn't like the form itself (huge SC5w OP).

    The SC5c I tried was pure awful. Yellow with no real discernible CRI advantage. I want to give them another try, though.
    GOOD TINT!

  9. #39

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by markr6 View Post
    I agree with that. The 4000K 219B dropin in my Malkoff MD2 is perfect. I call it "gray" since it's basically lacking any tint; just perfect, natural color rendering. You really can't call it warm or cool.

    I guess I'm hesitant with the 4000K in a Zebralight since even the 4400/4500K lights from them were usually too yellow. Just bad tints from Cree overall. I have a few that are OK. One was perfect like a Nichia, but I sold it since I didn't like the form itself (huge SC5w OP).

    The SC5c I tried was pure awful. Yellow with no real discernible CRI advantage. I want to give them another try, though.
    My H600Fc III has a beautiful 4000K that doesn't look yellow at all. It's a shame the XM-L2 easywhite only works behind a frosted lens.
    Hello darkness my old friend,
    I've come to talk with you again...
    I liked neutral tints before they were cool.

  10. #40

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by Random Dan View Post
    My H600Fc III has a beautiful 4000K that doesn't look yellow at all. It's a shame the XM-L2 easywhite only works behind a frosted lens.
    Yeah I've heard mostly positive feedback on the easywhites. Must be a higher win-rate with that lotto.
    GOOD TINT!

  11. #41
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    I did not look at the finer details when i got the sc5c mkII, i thought it was the xm-l2 easywhite(which i wanted). but got the xp-l2 easyshite instead Well its not too bad, i am use to it, but it can come across as over yellow depending on my eyes! Not a fan of these new CREE LED's tbh, the .2's, the xp-l2 along with the xp-g3's.

  12. #42

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    I did not look at the finer details when i got the sc5c mkII, i thought it was the xm-l2 easywhite(which i wanted). but got the xp-l2 easyshite instead Well its not too bad, i am use to it, but it can come across as over yellow depending on my eyes! Not a fan of these new CREE LED's tbh, the .2's, the xp-l2 along with the xp-g3's.
    I have the sc52w with easy white XML2 and I think itís a great tint. Think itís 4500k. I hope the sc64C is gonna be better since itís higher cri. Canít wait.

  13. #43

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by ven View Post
    ... Not a fan of these new CREE LED's tbh, the .2's, the xp-l2 along with the xp-g3's.
    Depend on which bin you choose, xp-g3 4500k 90CRI with TIR is quite nice & xp-l2 3-step /4000k /80CRI has very nice pink tint unlike xp-l2 2-step/4000k/90CRI has yellowish tint.

  14. #44
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by Cobraman502 View Post
    I have the sc52w with easy white XML2 and I think itís a great tint. Think itís 4500k. I hope the sc64C is gonna be better since itís higher cri. Canít wait.
    I don't think they used any 4500K easy whites.

  15. #45

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    THREE new models on the product sheet!

    SC600 IV

    SC600w IV

    SC600w IV HI

    ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)
    Last edited by markr6; 10-13-2017 at 08:17 AM.
    GOOD TINT!

  16. #46

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    My only concern with filters is how heat resistant they would be. Also, how would you go about adhering them to the lens without screwing with the beam quality?

    I have an L6vn that I got Vinh to cherrypick me a 3000k 70.2 80CRI 2-step easywhite LED. The tint is decent all things considered, but the hotspot is still yellow compared to the spill. I think it would be the ideal candidate for a minus yellow filter, but at the same time I'm not sure if the filter could handle the insane amount of heat the 70.2 throws outwards.

  17. #47
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by cclin View Post
    Depend on which bin you choose, xp-g3 4500k 90CRI with TIR is quite nice & xp-l2 3-step /4000k /80CRI has very nice pink tint unlike xp-l2 2-step/4000k/90CRI has yellowish tint.
    This is not correct.

    LED bins are not one Tint or CCT. They are a range of both Tint and CCT. The tighter the binning spec(5, 3, 2 Step MacAdam Ellipse for Cree and smX07, smX05, smX03 for Nichia) the smaller the variation or range.

    So, one persons sample can vary, sometimes greatly, in both Tint and/or CCT even when both lights use the exact same bin and type of LED. This has been aptly dimed the "Tint Lottery"

    Now, depending on the bin, certain LED's can have a higher percentage of emitters in one spectrum(ie. colour/tint). For instance, as you can see from the datasheet of the 2-Step XP-L2 Easywhite that ZL uses in the new "c" models you have a much higher chance of getting one with a yellowish/greenish tint. In fact, you only have about a 15-20% chance of getting one with a pinkish/magenta tint vs. yellowish/greenish. With the 3-step, your chances are slightly better but the extremes will be worse and you have a chance of getting one that is very pinkish/magenta or yellowish/greenish(much more so then the 2-step). The 5-step is even worse yet.




    Three common mistakes I often see on this forum...

    1. Using Tint and CCT(correlated colour temperature) interchangeably.

    Tint and CCT are not the same thing. Although Tint does change with CCT, Tint is the colour of the light emitted where as CCT is the temperature. Two emitters with the exact same CCT can have totally different tints depending on the samples. A sample that falls far above the black body radiation line can have a strong greenish tint where as one that falls way below can have a strong pinkish tint even though they both might be the same CCT.

    2. Assuming all samples of a particular model of a light will have the same tint.

    I frequently see threads and posts of people asking what the tint is like on a particular light or what emitter choice has the best tint. Most of the time this is a pointless question as unless the manufacturer is hand selecting(cherry picking) LED's the tints for a particular model can and usually do vary greatly. Just because one person got a nice "pure white" or "creamy" sample, doesn't mean you will. That person just may have won the "Tint Lottery".

    3. Assuming all samples of a particular model will have the same CCT or the exact CCT that the manufacture states in the specifications.

    Manufacturers specified CCT is "nominal". Just like Tint, LED bins have a range of CCT. For instance, on a regular 5000K(Nominal)5-step Cree emitter colour temps can vary around 300-400 Kelvin so, one person may get a sample that is 5200K while another may get one that's 4800K.
    Last edited by Tachead; 10-13-2017 at 11:28 AM.

  18. #48
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by markr6 View Post
    THREE new models on the product sheet!

    SC600 IV

    SC600w IV

    SC600w IV HI

    ps. make that FIVE (SC64 and SC64w)
    Nice find.

    I wonder why they chose to use XHP35's for the CW and W models when they used XP-L2's for the new AA flashlights and headlamps? I guess they care more about output then Tint and CCT consistency because the XP-L2's are 3-step vs. the 5-step XHP35's. You would think the XP-L2's would be more efficient too as they are standard 3V emitters.
    Last edited by Tachead; 10-13-2017 at 09:33 AM.

  19. #49

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    I'm pretty sure both the XPL2s and XHP35s can be sourced in either 5,3, or 2 step easywhite selections.

    XPL2s are probably a lower voltage LED, so less boosting is needed to run them, which is easier on the AA batteries as opposed to 18650s.

  20. #50
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by twistedraven View Post
    I'm pretty sure both the XPL2s and XHP35s can be sourced in either 5,3, or 2 step easywhite selections.

    XPL2s are probably a lower voltage LED, so less boosting is needed to run them, which is easier on the AA batteries as opposed to 18650s.
    Nope, the XHP35 only comes in 5-step for the 4500K bin. And, the XP-L2 only comes in 3 and 5-step(4500K Bin).

    Yep, they are 3V vs 12V. You would think it would generate less heat and be more efficient to use a 3V emitter even with 18650's. The only reason to use the 12V XHP35's that I can see is a slightly higher max output. Personally, I would have rathered them use the better binned XP-L2's like the other new models. It seems like basically they just bumped the drive current and added the new UI. Not a big change for a new model imo. Hopefully we see some body and reflector changes/improvements too.
    Last edited by Tachead; 10-13-2017 at 11:14 AM.

  21. #51
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by Tachead View Post
    This tint bin chart has the BBL and CCT lines in the wrong position. Here's a corrected one.


  22. #52
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by maukka View Post
    This tint bin chart has the BBL and CCT lines in the wrong position. Here's a corrected one.
    Thank you sir.

    I will swap it for the one I used.

  23. #53

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    2 and 3 step doesn't mean better binned as far as tint goes for anything over 3500k for cree emitters. As mentioned earlier, it actually makes it harder to get a slightly rosy colored emitter (which is what people generally want I guess.)

    My 5-step XHP35 HI emitter in my SC600 is the best tint I've seen outside a nichia.

  24. #54
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by twistedraven View Post
    2 and 3 step doesn't mean better binned as far as tint goes for anything over 3500k for cree emitters. As mentioned earlier, it actually makes it harder to get a slightly rosy colored emitter (which is what people generally want I guess.)

    My 5-step XHP35 HI emitter in my SC600 is the best tint I've seen outside a nichia.
    But, it does mean better consistency in both Tint and CCT. It also means much less extremes. You have no chance of getting an extremely yellowish or pinkish sample with a 2-step. But,with a 5-step you have a chance of getting an extremely yellowish or pinkish sample. The CCT will also come much closer to matching the specifications with a 2-step vs. a 5-step. A 2-step 4000K will be 4000K +/- approx. 30-50 Kelvin. A 5-step 4000K will be 4000K +/-approx. 200-225 Kelvin.

    Also, keep in mind the warmer you go the more yellowish/orange an emitter will get even if both samples are right on the BBL. A 3500K emitter will always be more yellowish/orange then a 4000K one(given they are both the same distance above the BBL of course). Really, people who don't like yellow shouldn't be buying lights with 4000K or less emitters in them anyway because they are always going to be differing degrees of yellow.

    Tint preference is a subjective thing but, imo rosy/pinkish can be a bad thing too if too extreme. In a warm emitter like the "c" models, I think a slightly yellowish biased emitter looks more like an incandescent bulb then a rosy/pinkish one and I think that's the effect many people are after as long as it's not too extreme. With cooler LED's however, you can start to get a greenish tint when you are above the BBL and I don't think barely anyone likes greenish.

    Really, people complain no matter what lol. Remember the days of the 219a? Everyone complained about the pinkish tint now, they want it and don't like yellow. In a perfect world every emitter would be smack dab in the middle of the BBL but, I don't see that happening anytime soon. So for now, personally, I am still gonna go for emitters with tighter binning and hope I win the lottery lol. I am also going to just use my lights in the real world instead of comparing them to one and other and pointing them at a white wall all night.
    Last edited by Tachead; 10-13-2017 at 12:15 PM.

  25. #55

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Man, I am getting more and more excited about this light as time passes. Here are my thoughts at the moment.

    Has there been any confirmation on the body style of the SC64? Any pics that I might have missed?

    I am also wondering about the size of the hotspot on this one. I own the SC62c and the main complaint I have about it is the small hotspot. I want the SC64 hotspot to be at least as large as the SC62 and SC63. The color temp was fine on the SC62c but the hotspot size and the lower lumens vs the SC62w keeps me from using it as much.

    Although it isnít as big a deal as the hotspot size, I hope the SC64c doesnít take as big of a hit on lumens vs the SC64w as the SC62c vs SC62w.

    On the tint, the warmer the color temp the more you move into green to yellow to orange. I prefer the small window of as ďyellow as possibleĒ erring on the side of orange. I detest green. Looking at the chart, my target would be the upper most right hand corner of 5s.

    Quote Originally Posted by maukka View Post
    This tint bin chart has the BBL and CCT lines in the wrong position. Here's a corrected one.


    I only know what I read on the internet.

  26. #56

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by fnsooner View Post
    Man, I am getting more and more excited about this light as time passes. Here are my thoughts at the moment.

    Has there been any confirmation on the body style of the SC64? Any pics that I might have missed?

    I am also wondering about the size of the hotspot on this one. I own the SC62c and the main complaint I have about it is the small hotspot. I want the SC64 hotspot to be at least as large as the SC62 and SC63. The color temp was fine on the SC62c but the hotspot size and the lower lumens vs the SC62w keeps me from using it as much.

    Although it isnít as big a deal as the hotspot size, I hope the SC64c doesnít take as big of a hit on lumens vs the SC64w as the SC62c vs SC62w.

    On the tint, the warmer the color temp the more you move into green to yellow to orange. I prefer the small window of as ďyellow as possibleĒ erring on the side of orange. I detest green. Looking at the chart, my target would be the upper most right hand corner of 5s.

    Iím hoping the sc64C doesnít get a big hit on lumens either. The max per CREE is about 1100. If itís the rumored 800 lumens I might go with the sc64w and hope for the best with the tint lotto.

  27. #57

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by Cobraman502 View Post
    Iím hoping the sc64C doesnít get a big hit on lumens either. The max per CREE is about 1100. If itís the rumored 800 lumens I might go with the sc64w and hope for the best with the tint lotto.
    If it is 800 lumens(SC64c) vs 1400 lumens(SC64w), I would be fine with the difference. The SC62c was 320 lumens vs around 900 lumens for the SC62w, which was a lot.


    I will probably get both the SC64c and w eventually.

    Last edited by fnsooner; 10-22-2017 at 08:14 PM. Reason: Numbers
    I only know what I read on the internet.

  28. #58
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by fnsooner View Post
    If it is 800 lumens(SC64c) vs 1400 lumens(SC64w), I would be fine with the difference. The SC62c was 320 lumens vs around 900 lumens for the SC62w, which was a lot.


    I will probably get both the SC64c and w eventually.

    I will be fine with the difference too(800 is plenty) but, I am guessing the SC64c will be more then 800 lumens. The H600Fc MKIII is 800 lumens and it uses the much older generation XM-L2 Easywhite. My guess is the SC64c will be between 900 and 1100 lumens. If they meet their pre-order estimate, we will find out very soon.
    Last edited by Tachead; 10-22-2017 at 08:59 PM.

  29. #59

    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by fnsooner View Post
    I am also wondering about the size of the hotspot on this one. I own the SC62c and the main complaint I have about it is the small hotspot. I want the SC64 hotspot to be at least as large as the SC62 and SC63. The color temp was fine on the SC62c but the hotspot size and the lower lumens vs the SC62w keeps me from using it as much.

    Although it isnít as big a deal as the hotspot size, I hope the SC64c doesnít take as big of a hit on lumens vs the SC64w as the SC62c vs SC62w.
    I'm pretty sure the Luxeon T has a smaller die than the XM-L and XP-L families, which should be responsible for the smaller hotspot.

    I'd expect a fairly similar beam profile to the SC63, but it's not a perfect reference either.

  30. #60
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    Default Re: Zebralight SC64c

    Quote Originally Posted by iamlucky13 View Post
    I'm pretty sure the Luxeon T has a smaller die than the XM-L and XP-L families, which should be responsible for the smaller hotspot.

    I'd expect a fairly similar beam profile to the SC63, but it's not a perfect reference either.
    Although far from perfect, here is a pic of the XP-L2 easywhite on the left and Philips Luxeon T.on the right.

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