Brightest compact single 18650 flashlight?

Are there any compact single 18650 flashlights that have output of 2000 lm or more?
The ones I've seen so far don't exceed 1100 lumens

Emisar D4
Comes in Nichia 219c, XPL, and XPG2 varieties. All +/- 3,000 lumen.

that is beyond what 1 led can do
it is also pretty much beyond what 1 18650 can do
if you find something that does that, it will be thermally and time limited
wle

wle said:

that is beyond what 1 led can do
it is also pretty much beyond what 1 18650 can do
if you find something that does that, it will be thermally and time limited
wle

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The green one has the V54 on it those are the lights that mine wish they were born into, that dude makes awesome mods.

These two lights are so exciting, kinda like back when I got my very first, really good 5mm led light, the red led Infinity Ultra!
It would run for a week straight on a fresh AA, filling the room with usable red light for adjusted eyes, and when I opened it to change the "heavy duty" alkaline battery it would nearly always make a little pop from the vented gases.
Many nights of drinking beer and playing chess were illuminated solely by that little red light, hung by a tack from the ceiling.

I got my first D1 a few days ago, with the neutral HI emitter, the skin on my hand feels a little bit sunburned from covering the light while switching modes from turbo, and I've given myself a few mild headaches by using my closed eyelids as low precision lux meters to compare it vs my H600w.

Just ordered the cool HI D4 tonight, and I'm no fan of cool light - but the greater throw and less waste heat sold me on it.
I can hardly wait for the D1S.

eh4 said:

These two lights are so exciting, kinda like back when I got my very first, really good 5mm led light, the red led Infinity Ultra!
It would run for a week straight on a fresh AA, filling the room with usable red light for adjusted eyes, and when I opened it to change the "heavy duty" alkaline battery it would nearly always make a little pop from the vented gases.
Many nights of drinking beer and playing chess were illuminated solely by that little red light, hung by a tack from the ceiling.

I got my first D1 a few days ago, with the neutral HI emitter, the skin on my hand feels a little bit sunburned from covering the light while switching modes from turbo, and I've given myself a few mild headaches by using my closed eyelids as low precision lux meters to compare it vs my H600w.

Just ordered the cool HI D4 tonight, and I'm no fan of cool light - but the greater throw and less waste heat sold me on it.
I can hardly wait for the D1S.

Click to expand...

Yep Emisar is the ONLY brand for me for best performance, ease of use and price. Hands down.

ank said:

Are there any compact single 18650 flashlights that have output of 2000 lm or more?
The ones I've seen so far don't exceed 1100 lumens

Click to expand...

Just be aware that any 18650 tube light over 600-700lm will require a step down at some point so as to not overheat. The higher the output, the faster the step down is required! There are plenty of 18650 lights brighter than 1500lm, well for about 30-75 secs!

A 1,200 lumen light with a floody beam will look dimmer than a 800 lumen light with a very focused beam.

Are you looking at just raw numbers (lumen) or do you have a specific use/application in mind that might point to the type of beam profile that would work the best for you?

D4 certainly has the output, realistic and depending on which LED, your looking from 15s to maybe 40s of run time before some aggressive step downs to try and keep under control. As Stephen and wjv have pointed out, much over 600lm is going to need a step down due to heat. If you need 2000lm for any decent amount of time(minutes rather than seconds) then a 4 cell pop can would be the better choice. If your happy with short bursts ~30s types, then the D4 will fit that requirement. Again as mentioned, its more flood bias, if you want to punch some light down field the D4vn with xp-g2 PDT and the D1/D1vn would suit. The D1 is a little larger in the head(body the same as D4), this is around 43kcd and 1300lm. The spill is plenty bright and usable, large hot spot (compared to some) to make it a usable throwy light.

Here on the far left is the D1, others D4's


For super compact, the zebralight is hard to beat..................Far right is the sc63w xhp35 4500k(very nice and ample bright!)

The D1vn may be a good option with sst40 off vinh, this is 2300lm
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?438988-Emisar-D1vn-Smallest-18350-18650-Thrower-R

For $68...............well its tough to beat all things considered!

Ven beat me to the ZL recommendation--my 63w and 600FdIII+ get use every day; both over 1000 lumens for quite awhile when cooled by moving air outdoors. Ven's picture above shows the range between "compact" and "brightest," depending on what your true objective is in the realm of "brightest compact."

Lots of other 1x18650 lights get well over 1000 lm raw output for various lengths of time depending on their ability to regulate heat. I prefer temp-regulated drivers that both step down and step back up to maintain a constant temp (as opposed to timed step-downs, or drivers that only step down but not back up).

Curious:

Q1: Are there thermal issues for the 18650 itself or is this just about the emitter getting too hot ?

Q2: If heat dissipation is a size limiting factor, what then is the smallest 18650 light that could "continuously" run eg: a Cree 100 Lumen/Watt light continuously as 1000 Lumen == 10W heat dissipation, flashlight body staying below 50 C at ambient temperature of 25 C ;-) ... Or is that the wrong question and the best trick to dissipate the heat is to keep the flashlight head thermally insulated from the body and give it all the work to dissipate the heat (don't touch the head during operation...).

Q3: If heat dissipation is the issue, would investment into copper help ? Any flashlights with out there ?

te36 said:

Curious:

Q1: Are there thermal issues for the 18650 itself or is this just about the emitter getting too hot ?

Q2: If heat dissipation is a size limiting factor, what then is the smallest 18650 light that could "continuously" run eg: a Cree 100 Lumen/Watt light continuously as 1000 Lumen == 10W heat dissipation, flashlight body staying below 50 C at ambient temperature of 25 C ;-) ... Or is that the wrong question and the best trick to dissipate the heat is to keep the flashlight head thermally insulated from the body and give it all the work to dissipate the heat (don't touch the head during operation...).

Q3: If heat dissipation is the issue, would investment into copper help ? Any flashlights with out there ?

Click to expand...

Q1- Basically the LED's are putting out very high outputs, these are too high to run in single 18650 form/size/mass/heat sink.

Q2-The Emisar head does get too hot to actually touch and the body very warm. Not a flashlight for kids or people who dont have an interest in lights IMO. Along with size/heat sinking, its important to get the heat out to the body to help dissipate...... The hand holding the light helps this, over say being left tail stood on the side.
Q3- Cu does help soak up the heat,but also can get very hot depending on the light. Cu is great in fact, however it is also dense/heavy/soft. So using cu inside the head as added heat sink, or actual cu heads(the s41 to name one flashlight, cu cryos head to name a custom part . Texas Lumens makes some very nice hosts that are cu, although the weight is not always ideal for EDC, cu does get a nice patina and for me gives it a personality.

50oC with ambient 25oC with most 18650 lights, you would struggle to hold much over 600lm/type output. There are many more factors of course, so only rough! Depending on the LED itself (look how hot an xhp 35 and xhp 70 run!!! ).

If 1000lm is needed(also bare in mind a single 18650 light even holding that output would not get you through a night), then a dual 18650 light would be better for heat management(general comment with added size/heat sink)along with running time at that output. To get hours of 1000lm use for around 4hrs(variable, just rough example) then a 4 cell light would be required .

Basically, a single 18650 lights use of around 1000lm is usually a burst or turbo mode, 3-5mins it will step down or become too warm/hot. Depending on your actual requirements te36 would depend on which light would be more suited for you. High output/run time and heat management usually means going up in size from a single 18650 light. A 600lm thrower light will throw light a lot further than a 3000lm flood light. So over actual lumens, i tend to focus on what actual type of light for a specific application. Some want to throw a light to spot things in the distance, they down want to flood a field to see that object 300yrd away. Just an example..............

Too add, many dont actually need very high outputs for long duration's(granted its nice to have that choice!). Even a 200lm light is plenty for most tasks, quick 1000lm burst to scan around environment etc etc. So over the lumens figure, think beam type, UI/form factor, LED colour temp and tint. All subjective, but i would rather have 200lm of a nice 4000k beam than 500lm of 7000k. I say subjective, as a weapon light for example , a cool white may be a preferred choice and someone in the forces may not care about colours popping over lighting an area up. For my general EDC type uses, i like neutral and warm side of neutral to use(4000-5000k).

With the D1 (and D4, same firmware, smaller head)
The heat regulation is adjustable by clicking 10+ times rapidly and keeping the switch held down on the last click. It flashes then flicker/strobes, then goes to high (turbo) and stays there, getting hotter and hotter until you release the switch.

So now you've calibrated the thermal stepdown to the level that You are willing to hold;
good system!
Don't do the thermal calibration with gloves on, might result in an unpleasant surprise for you later, and might fry the led?

Hands make pretty good liquid cooled heat sinks, with your entire body as the radiator.

Also, I've been too preoccupied by trying to get the clicks right at 10 and hold, which is unnecessary, just 10 or more and then hold... so I hadn't thought about the flashes at the beginning and end of the heat calibration, but are the first flashes the current step down temp, and the final flashes the new step down temp?

Three clicks for battery voltage, followed by two more clicks for current temperature is a really neat feature.
It's something I wouldn't think is I'd use much but playing with it is giving me a better sense of what's going on with the light and how the power and temp are being managed as I use the light differently.

Finally, the voltage check doesn't seem to quit flashing until you turn it off. If this is the case then it could be considered another beacon mode, one that is giving information about how much longer it might run. Useful or not it's neat. The regular beacon is better, as it flashes at the last used power setting.

Q1, the cell type doesn't affect thermal management except that it changes the light size and shape. Small cells often are incapable of high power, so they tend to remain cool. If there is a predictor of cell heat, I'd guess internal resistance and power output (watts) might be better.

Q2, think of the mass of the flashlight as "thermal inertia." The greater the flashlight's mass/inertia, the more energy it takes to get it to move away from starting temp to some given higher temp. So, greater mass makes initial heat-up slower when a hot rod LED turns on.

But sustained output means that inertia by itself won't save the day--the light has to move (conduct) the heat out into the environment somehow. That is why the thermal conductivity from the LED into the air is important. Design has to take a lot into consideration...Mounting of the LED circuit board is important, materials are important (Q3, copper can help; yes, many lights use lots of copper), and the surface area of the radiation fins is important.

I'm not sure that exactly answered your questions, maybe others can fill in some gaps for me.

eh4 said:

With the D1 (and D4, same firmware, smaller head)
The heat regulation is adjustable by clicking 10+ times rapidly and keeping the switch held down on the last click. It flashes then flicker/strobes, then goes to high (turbo) and stays there, getting hotter and hotter until you release the switch.

So now you've calibrated the thermal stepdown to the level that You are willing to hold;
good system!
Don't do the thermal calibration with gloves on, might result in an unpleasant surprise for you later, and might fry the led?

Hands make pretty good liquid cooled heat sinks, with your entire body as the radiator.

Also, I've been too preoccupied by trying to get the clicks right at 10 and hold, which is unnecessary, just 10 or more and then hold... so I hadn't thought about the flashes at the beginning and end of the heat calibration, but are the first flashes the current step down temp, and the final flashes the new step down temp?

Three clicks for battery voltage, followed by two more clicks for current temperature is a really neat feature.
It's something I wouldn't think is I'd use much but playing with it is giving me a better sense of what's going on with the light and how the power and temp are being managed as I use the light differently.

Finally, the voltage check doesn't seem to quit flashing until you turn it off. If this is the case then it could be considered another beacon mode, one that is giving information about how much longer it might run. Useful or not it's neat. The regular beacon is better, as it flashes at the last used power setting.

Click to expand...

You will not fry the LED unless you wrap the light in a towel. The light does have self-protection temperature limits which you can't turn off. So yes, thermal calibration with gloves on makes no sense, but is not dangerous.

I haven't had the chance to check it out, but the new Olight M2R Warrior might be another option?

what LED has the highest lumen per watt?
thanks

mercrazy said:

what LED has the highest lumen per watt?
thanks

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XP-L, XP-L2, XM-L2, XHP70.2 all exceed 200 lm/W, but at very low currents.
I'm sure there are high power LEDs from other manufacturers that do this as well.

LEDs are just one variable. What you pick here determines your choice of drivers and optics and these greatly affect total system efficiency.
First determine light size and desired beam shape. Then seek LED-optic-driver combos that can deliver that.