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Thread: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

  1. #1
    Flashaholic*
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    Default When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    I see NHTSA has issued a "notice of proposed rule making" today regarding ADB lighting:

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/public-insp...2018-21853.pdf

    SUMMARY: This document proposes amendments to Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 108; Lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment, to permit the certification of adaptive driving beam headlighting systems, if the manufacturer chooses to equip vehicles with these systems. Toyota Motor North America, Inc. (Toyota) petitioned NHTSA for rulemaking to amend FMVSS No. 108 to permit manufacturers the option of equipping vehicles with adaptive driving beam systems. NHTSA has granted Toyotas petition and proposes to establish appropriate performance requirements to ensure the safe introduction of adaptive driving beam headlighting systems if equipped on newly manufactured vehicles.

  2. #2

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Official release with easy-click "Comment Now" button is at here (much easier to read; that Amazon document you found has screwed-up letter spacing).

    The release of this NPRM is a very positive development, but it does not answer the question of when will we see ADB in the USA. This is one step in a multi-step process. There's the comment period on this NPRM (ends December 11), then comments have to be considered, which could happen as a part of the final rulemaking action or there could be a revised NPRM and a further comment period, then eventually there would be an effective date. A realistic "ADB legal as of" date to hope for would be between one and two years from now. Could be shorter, could easily be longer.

    One disappointing thing I see in NHTSA's proposal is that they would still keep the 75,000 candela intensity limit for high beams, set in the late 1970s. That strikes me as wrongheaded. The UN ("ECE", "European") regs permit high beam intensity of up to 215,000 candela in an ADB system, that is nearly triple the US value. The whole reason why NHTSA never upgraded the maximum high beam intensity above 75,000 candela was because they were concerned (1) about glare caused by misuse of high beams, and (2) that a higher-intensity high beam would require states to change their laws regarding when drivers have to use low beam in terms of distance to oncoming or preceding cars, and since NHTSA claims not to have authority to force states to change laws (except for that whole "we're going to withhold your highway funding unless you raise your drinking age to 21/lower your speed limit to 55/etc, but I guess that doesn't count) the dimming distances based on low-intensity high beams would be much too short with high-intensity high beams. BUT THE WHOLE POINT OF ADB is that it's a system that automatically and dynamically keeps glare out of other drivers' eyes!

  3. #3

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Is ADB possible only with a bunch of LEDs in a grid arrangement?

    Can you achieve ADB with DLP technology, which is light source agnostic?

    I read about an experiment by a bunch of college kids that were able to adopt a regular DLP projector, like the kind you might use at a meeting, into a car headlamp.

    https://www.technologyreview.com/s/4...rain-and-snow/
    Last edited by Ls400; 10-22-2018 at 04:23 PM.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    But how do you get so many pixels from car headlights? One approach comes from cinema and projector technology. Its called Digital Light Processing (DLP). Many thousands of tiny mirrors are switched electronically and release light onto the screen or in the case of a car headlight onto the road. Because of the mirrors the technology is also called Digital Micromirror Device (DMD). The actual light source can be LEDs or laser diodes. Osram is a leading supplier of both. Numerous car and headlight manufacturers are working on DLP technology.
    https://www.carlightblog.com/2017/09/22/pixels-galore/

  5. #5

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400 View Post
    Is ADB possible only with a bunch of LEDs in a grid arrangement?
    No, there are all kinds of different technologies for achieving an ADB system. It can be done with HID or even halogen (the world's first ADB system was the Lucas Autosensa, shown off as a prototype in 1970), it can be done in numerous ways with LEDs or laser diodes, it can be done with raster scanning, with DLP, etc. All of the different methods are currently under development and it will be interesting to see which one(s) wind up "winning" in the long term. The system you read about (and linked to) is one of numerous different development lines.

  6. #6

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Can someone clarify why ADB is not allowed yet in the US? I keep hearing an explanation along the lines of "FMVSS requires separate high and low beams," which, to me, doesn't quite make sense. Sometimes it's formulated as "FMVSS requires the ability to toggle between high beam and low beam, and ADB doesn't provide for the ability to toggle between high/low," which makes even less sense since can't you just disable the ADB function and go between high and low? Or is it that FMVSS wants a full-time toggle between high/low?

    https://jalopnik.com/a-50-year-old-r...hea-1594900077

    August 7, 1968: IT IS RESOLVED THAT President Nixon is doing a superb job of managing this great nation. FURTHER, BE IT KNOWN that the Volkswagen Karmann-Ghia is the pinnacle of automotive design and shall forever be understood as the finest vehicle of the modern era. THUSLY, IT IS HEREBY ENACTED THAT ALL HEADLIGHTS MUST HERETOFORE HAVE "HIGH" AND "LOW" SETTINGS, ASSUMING THAT "HERETOFORE" MEANS "IN THE FUTURE."
    Last edited by Ls400; 10-24-2018 at 02:39 PM.

  7. #7
    Moderator Alaric Darconville's Avatar
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    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400 View Post
    Can someone clarify why ADB is not allowed yet in the US? I keep hearing an explanation along the lines of "FMVSS requires separate high and low beams," ]
    Did you read this at all? Read it, and read it carefully. The answer is in there.

  8. #8

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    NHTSA's lighting standard, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard (FMVSS) No. 108, has been viewed as not permitting ADB. In particular, the current lower beam photometry requirements do not appear to allow the enhanced beam that ADB systems provide.
    I'm not clear on this passage. I am reading that ABD would cause low-beams to blow past the maximums for various points in the low beam. So is this a semantic issue? ADB systems don't have clear-cut "low beam" and "high beam" operation modes. So by not having these clear-cut modes, that would make photometric evaluation of low and high-beams difficult?

    FMVSS No. 108 primarily regulates lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle.
    Unrelated, but would you regard this as a weakness of FMVSS 108, in that by primary treating lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle, it cannot regulate on-vehicle headlamp aim? Why was FMVSS 108 written to treat lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle?
    Last edited by Ls400; 10-24-2018 at 04:04 PM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400 View Post
    I'm not clear on this passage.
    It means an ADB system can't conform to some of the requirements that apply to low beams. The specifics are variable, and don't really matter.

    would you regard this as a weakness of FMVSS 108, in that by primary treating lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle, it cannot regulate on-vehicle headlamp aim?
    There's no reason why FMVSS No. 108 couldn't regulate on-vehicle headlamp aim, it just doesn't.

  10. #10
    Moderator Alaric Darconville's Avatar
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    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400 View Post
    I'm not clear on this passage. I am reading that ABD would cause low-beams to blow past the maximums for various points in the low beam. So is this a semantic issue?
    No, it's not a semantic issue. The interim beams (between true "low" and "high") would fail testing as a low beam (yet also fail in testing as a high beam).

    Quote Originally Posted by NHTSA
    The ADB system's lower beam, on the other hand, would probably not always comply with the lower beam photometric requirements. An ADB system can produce a variety of lower beams; each lower beam must comply with the applicable lower beam photometric requirements. The base lower beam is designed to conform to the current lower beam photometry requirements. However, the augmented lower beam(s) provide more illumination than the base lower beam would; the purpose of ADB is to produce a lower beam providing more illumination than a current FMVSS No. 108-compliant lower beam. Therefore, it is likely that the augmented lower beam would not always comply with existing lower beam photometry requirements."
    Granted, a multi-beam low beam system COULD probably provide additional lighting in conformance with the requirements, but why not make it just that ONE low beam that is the very best a low beam can be, instead of having multiple low beams that increase the complexity of the system?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400
    ADB systems don't have clear-cut "low beam" and "high beam" operation modes. So by not having these clear-cut modes, that would make photometric evaluation of low and high-beams difficult?
    Not if the body computer had a test mode setting a dealer or jobber could activate, no.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ls400
    Unrelated, but would you regard this as a weakness of FMVSS 108, in that by primary treating lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle, it cannot regulate on-vehicle headlamp aim? Why was FMVSS 108 written to treat lighting as equipment independent of the vehicle?
    It's somewhat related-- if they regulated on-vehicle aim, then "bending lights" (such as the LS430 low beams, which selectively swivel into a turn) would not be permitted.
    Quote Originally Posted by NHTSA
    NHTSA concluded that FMVSS No. 108 does not prohibit bending light headlamps because the standard does not specifically address initial or subsequent headlamp aim (the standard addresses only aimability requirements). Advanced headlighting systems that can actively re-aim the lower beam horizontally are currently available as original and replacement equipment in the U.S.

  11. #11

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaric Darconville View Post
    if they regulated on-vehicle aim, then "bending lights" (such as the LS430 low beams, which selectively swivel into a turn) would not be permitted.
    I don't see how you figure that, can you walk me through? I think there's nothing stopping them from regulating on-vehicle aim and allowing swivelling beams. It's not either/or.

  12. #12
    Moderator Alaric Darconville's Avatar
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    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by -Virgil- View Post
    I don't see how you figure that, can you walk me through? I think there's nothing stopping them from regulating on-vehicle aim and allowing swivelling beams. It's not either/or.
    When the headlamp swivels, the aim changes (particularly on the left side (assuming RHT)) in such a way that it can become more glaring to other traffic. If they were to regulate on-vehicle aim, leaving it at regulating only the static/normal aim would permit swiveling beams. If they regulated both static AND swiveling aim, that might come with steep requirements for preventing glare to oncoming traffic in certain turning situations.
    Last edited by Alaric Darconville; 10-25-2018 at 09:09 AM.

  13. #13

    Default Re: When Does ADB Lighting Arrive in USA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alaric Darconville View Post
    When the headlamp swivels, the aim changes (particularly on the left side (assuming RHT)) in such a way that it can become more glaring to other traffic. If they were to regulate on-vehicle aim, leaving it at regulating only the static/normal aim would permit swiveling beams.
    Yes...

    If they regulated both static AND swiveling aim, that might come with steep requirements for preventing glare to oncoming traffic in certain turning situations.
    ...which is pretty much exactly where we're at right now: they're proposing to impose steep requirements on ADB systems.

    There's still nothing that would prevent them from regulating headlamp aim on new vehicles (with or without swivelling beams), they just...don't.

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