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Thread: got ls led need info

  1. #1
    Flashaholic* TrevorNasko's Avatar
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    Default got ls led need info

    well my adiction got the better of me [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img] . i got a white ls led. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] now what? do run it striaght from 3v ,4.5 ,2.4 ,3.6...? i don't do resisters so forget that. forget heatsinks too because i don't solder. i don't need retrofit instructions because i'm making my own project box flashlight. i just need to what best to power it from. i prefer 1.2v rechargebles but am open to anything

  2. #2

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    I find the white LS runs quite nice off 3 volts...no heat sink needed. I use two pre-made clip wires I got at radio shaft...insulate the bottom with small peices of tape to prevent shorting...the AA lithiums Silviron is testing seem nice so far...for long run time go with two "D"`s. I used a paper towel insert for batt housing. Pretty sad but works. Surprisingly bright.

    Ken...the speller and now kool kid

  3. #3
    Flashaholic
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    for the love of God please get a soldering iron.its not rocket science.do you want me to buy you one!

    hey but for real get a soldering gun.it really is not tough.just practice! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    Enlightened
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    I have to second that! If you are willing to invest in a Lux, you should get a soldering iron, some flux, solder, and go to it! ( on some old components first )

    I managed to teach my daughters to solder when they were about 8 years old so they could do a nice job on their 4-H Fair projects. ( three blue ribbons this year in electricity with 1 being a basic LED circuit)

    It's the only way to go.


    Rob [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

  5. #5
    *Retired* The_LED_Museum's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Definitely practise soldering, but not on the LS at first. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    Start out with scrap material; blown resistors, old axial lead caps, stuff salvaged from a blown circuit board, wires twisted together, that kind of thing.

    Then move on to the "live" stuff. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

    For about eight bucks, you can buy a little 30 watt iron at Radio Shack that will work on pretty much anything except those tiny, grain-of-sand-sized SMDs.
    Solder prices can vary, but you should be able to find a little tube of 60/40 rosin core (made specifically for electronics work) for less than two bucks.

    In leiu of special soldering aids, ordinary alligator clips can usually be used to hold parts together while soldering, if you cannot hold them together by hand.

  6. #6
    Flashaholic* TrevorNasko's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    i buy led lights not tools because i've no money left after buying leds for them. however if you make it seem worthwhile i might reconsider. you will need to work hard though

  7. #7
    Flashaholic* TrevorNasko's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    does everyone agree 3v is the way to go why not 3.6v

  8. #8

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    EDIT
    sorry i am using 2 types the RED/amber and the whites, the voltages are hugely different
    I should have known its always that way with the different types, just stupidly thought the LS was different

    i have been running the ls's off of 3 1.2v AA nimys but the RED is over 400ma and they get hot as heck, on thier own heatsync.

    in the video light the WHITES run at almost 4 at about 3.78 with 3 of them on a 12v regulated, the only drop is the wire lengths
    they're doing fine after 5 hours of use, but they are excessivly heatsynced,

    there is thermal current runaway

    but the AA bateries withe the RED just start lowering in voltage when the current gets going, i guess it would be a problem if one Just removed them from charge, then ran it non intermittentally.

    the 12v ones 3 WHITES in a bank the current keep going up for a while then it cools out, but it is very high, i think the life of them wont be as long, and the sync was definataly needed

    running the nitchitas WHITES at 4v with 3 to a bank on the same 12 regulated toasted the ones that were getting Heat from the others (center ones), so me thinks that the RED LS heatsynced can handle more than the little ones UNsynced

    the things sure can put out a lot of light even at the lower voltages/currents and they are LOADS more efficient like that, between 300 and 500ma the visable difference sure isnt 2/5ths more like squezing out the last 1/5th

    course i did lose ONE its was so simple and stupid too, i just reversed it, heck i reversed all the others at one time or another, but this one died without a blip
    it was the cyan one [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img]
    darn i hate learning

    burning these things at over 350ma the red/amber or 385ma for the white, is losing them slowly the specs show they will be losing 20% in 10,000 hours running Normally

    i just tested the red again
    (it is Lower voltage than the whites & cyan)
    and its at 700ma according to my cheap meter, when used on half lifed NIMY batteries
    the voltage is only at 3.25
    so
    it would certanally warrent a resister to have any kind of life out of it even with 3 nimhy batteries

    none of this really is making any sence, as the peak current is 500ma the thing should be toast mabey its just residual retnal burn

  9. #9
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Aragorn, sock away the money you would spend on LEDs for just one month and you should be able to get a nice soldering setup from RS. Just play with your current LED stuff for that month - consider it a sacrifice for greater enjoyment in the future! 3V should be fine for an LS - just be a little dimmer than it could be.

    Now, I thought this was a good place to put a question that I can't figure out rather than start my own topic. I finally took readings from my LS 3-D cell (4.5V)flashlight conversion and it's only drawing 124mA (????) I only have 3.03 Ohms of resistance on the circuit and the voltage going through the circuit reads at 2.25V (???). Any idea what's going on? With that resistance it should be pulling just about 350mA at 3.4V [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img]

  10. #10

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Bad batts...bad conections...bad resistor...bad LS...bad meter...bad math...?

    Highest probability...low batt voltage

    Recommendation...check

    Bad

  11. #11
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Bad batts...bad conections...bad resistor...bad LS...bad meter...bad math...?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Hmmmm, batts - new, came with light, connections - solid soldered, resistance - tested, LS - ????, meter - new craftsman digital, math - impeccable [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]. I'll check what I can, hopefully it's not the LS. How would one tell if it's the LS?

  12. #12

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Doug, even though new please check batt voltage. Especially since they came with the light...are they alkiline?

  13. #13

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    If you get 4.5 or so...I would check the LS...remove one cell...insert dummy batt...use clip wire to bypass resistor...remeasure amp draw and check if it is in keeping with Silveron`s and others 3 volt tests...if it is...and you math is impecable...as we all know it is (like my spelling?)...you must have a bad resister

  14. #14
    Enlightened
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    I'd tend to suspect the batteries as well. Also, when you checked resistance, did you check if from the appropriate spot on the PR bulb to the LS contacts? I just finished a conversion last night and noticed that I have -.5 ohms more resistance than calculated in my circuit (as you'll see when I post pictures tonight I'm a ham-fisted solderer).
    BTW, since you've got a lot of experience doing these conversions, do you know the best gauge of wire to use? I used a fairly thick wire (similar to the wire in the pictures on your conversion site), but when it came time to "smash" all the components into place it was pretty tough to do. I thinnk it would be a lot easier to do with thinner wire but don't know what the minimum size would be. The max wattage that needs to be carried is something like (4.5V x 350 mA = 1.6 Watts). Anyone know? [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img]

  15. #15

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Frankly, it does not make sense...with 2.25 volts going through the curcit...the amp draw should be...less than 10ma anyway, if it lit at all...could you be measuring at the wrong points...or have your meter set wrong...is it bright?

  16. #16
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Aragorn:
    i buy led lights not tools because i've no money left after buying leds for them. however if you make it seem worthwhile i might reconsider. you will need to work hard though<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    If you buy discreet LEDs, 2 things are just about inevitable....
    A. you WILL become a full-fledged a light junkie. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
    B. you will hesitatingly start to attempt soldering [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
    -barring advanced Parkinson's disease, I'll bet (in time) you'll become surprisingly adept at it.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    ... do you know the best gauge of wire to use? I used a fairly thick wire (similar to the wire in the pictures on your conversion site), but when it came time to "smash" all the components into place it was pretty tough to do. I think it would be a lot easier to do with thinner wire but don't know what the minimum size would be. The max wattage that needs to be carried is something like (4.5V x 350 mA = 1.6 Watts). Anyone know?
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Danno, 30AWG should work ok.

  18. #18
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Wow! Lots of ideas. Battery volts: 1.54 each x 3 Alkaline; circuit resistance reads 3.3 NOT 3.03 as it should be, but this is a minor problem - still should have 3.3V going to the LS. Thick wire?: yup, don't remember the gauge but it's the thicker stuff. Meter is digital autoranging. Is it bright?: Subjectively, yes! Do I sleep at night?: Not lately [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img] (check the time of the post...) It MUST be something stupid that I am doing with the meter. Meter test points - good possibility - where is the best place to take mA readings? It seems that it would be the same anywhere in the circuit - is this incorrect? How about Volt readings?

    DP

  19. #19
    Flashaholic* Quickbeam's Avatar
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    Finally got some sleep, but not before checking a few things. I have a second LS and I get exactly the same readings. 35mA directly connected to 2 cells and 158ma directly connected to 3 cells measured between the positive terminal of the batteries and the positive terminal of the LS. I would suspect the meter, but my 3-LED PR base conversion draws 59mA - exactly what you would expect for 3 Nichias with 100ohms resistance on each (about 20mA each). Tried new batteries - same thing. And a nice aside, I hooked the spare LS up reverse polarity for about 1 second on 3 cells w/no resistance (never said I wasn't tired, just couldn't sleep! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] ) and it survived just fine.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    These LS leds seem quite sensitive and the DMM shunt could be causing the reduced current draw.

  21. #21

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    _________________________________________
    I only have 3.03 Ohms of resistance on the circuit and the voltage going through the circuit reads at 2.25V (???). Any idea what's going on? With that resistance it should be pulling just about 350mA at 3.4V

    _______________________________________

    please correct me if i am wrong
    ahh i am always wrong , just correct me :-0

    if you use 3 Ohms and the led has a 1 ohm resistance, isnt 3/4 of the power being disipated into the resister ?

    the specs (from what i read) is the led has 1 ohm

    we know that the resistance of the led changes when it is heated.

    ahh math what good does it do anyway :-)

  22. #22
    Enlightened
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    Default Re: got ls led need info

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>if you use 3 Ohms and the led has a 1 ohm resistance, isnt 3/4 of the power being disipated into the resister ?
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I don't think so. I'm no EE, but these are my thoughts (take with a grain of salt). The power dissipated by the resistor is the voltage drop times the amperage. So, assuming it's 4.5 volts dropping to 3.4 volts at 340 mA, the power used is 1.1v X .340A = .374W. The power being used by the LS is the voltage across it times the amperage. Again, assuming 3.4 volts, the power is 3.4v X .340A = 1.156W.

  23. #23

    Default Re: got ls led need info

    sounds exactally right
    so the resistance for the led in that scenario is more like 9-10 ohms

    the current across the Whole circuit would be the same wherever he measured it right?
    just the voltage drop accross the led and the resister are different?

    the resistance of a underpowered resister would become Higher as it was overpowered, and the higher the led is powered the higher its resistance would be ???
    UNTIL, its resistance gets greater from the thermal runaway???
    -----------------------------------------
    so from the Silveron post (with the math)

    So, to run an LS on 4.5V you would want a 3.15 ohm resistor- (4.5 - 3.4 / .35 = 3.1428..) Since resistors in this range are hard to find, use three 10 ohm resistors in parallel which will give you 3.333 Ohms - close enough.
    { 1 / (1/10 + 1/10 + 1/10) = 3.333}

    To run an LS on 3 NiCd or NiMH rechargable batteries which are nominally 1.2V each you would need a .57 ohm resistor- { 3.6 - 3.4 /.35 = .571 }
    -----------------------------------------

    so testing this THEORY
    i put a .6 ohm 10w resister with my 3 nicads
    and the ma is still 500
    even when the batteries are at 3.5
    i get a voltage drop of .2 across the resister
    the led voltage drop is 3.3

    DUH cause the voltage on a RED
    the one i am testing is supposed to be 2.6

    if at first you dont succeed Fry Fry Again
    back to the drawing board

    EDIT
    so with a WHITE one running off of 3 nicads works PERFECT, no resister needed
    the RED or the AMBER would be the ones to Definatly need some protection

    the red DOES run beautifully off of 3v
    and the WHITE is really DULL with lower 3volt batteries, even though it uses very little power in that scenerio

    now that is much better

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