Q for CPF medical professionals

This is indirectly a flashlight related medical question. Through building increasingly small electronics for flashlight mods, I have become moderately proficient at hand assembly of surface mount technology [SMT] components in sizes down to 0.5mmX1mm and lead pitch down to 0.5mm. I want to attempt a build that is significantly more challenging than those previously attempted. I believe that I may be running up against the limit of normal hand tremor [no pathology present] for me. I seem to remember reading some years ago that there is a drug that is used [in what I think was an "off label" application] by some surgeons to reduce their hand tremor during delicate surgury. Do you know what this drug is? If so, does it have any significant risks or contraindications for occasional use for this purpose? TIA.

Don't go there. JMHO.

Don't drink anything with even the slightest amount of caffeine in it! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif No tea, coffee, cola drinks, mountain dew, etc. And learn to shuffle a deck of cards the way a cardshark would. That would give you lots of dexterity and muscular training.

As for the drug, sorry, don't know what it is.

Maybe you can explore other ways of making this item? Maybe using something to help steady your hand, or solder where you can just glue on the items and then bake it to make the solder flow?

I work w/ surgeons exclusively, and I have never heard of anyone taking any such medication.

I agree w/ the advice to limit caffeine intake (or nay other stimulant - diet pills, pseudoephedrine, nicotine, etc...)

Sam

[edited to clarify my statement]

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Flotsam said:
I work w/ surgeons exclusively, and I have never heard of any such medication.



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Sam, it sounds like you may be well positioned to make an inquiry.

I believe you may to at least investigate some of the performance-enhancing drugs used by competition target shooters (usually these are drugs that would slow heart rate etc). While these are banned for e.g. olympic competition, they *may* be legal for general consuption, possibly even without a prescription (though somehow I doubt it). Hey, at least reading about it couldn't hurt, right?

You can naturally lower your resting heart rate through strenuous excersice. This is probably a better route long-term.

The medications are blood pressure medications called "beta blockers".

At low doses they have minimal side effects. They can be contraindicated in people with asthma, COPD, and a few other lung problems.

The effectiveness is very individual. Some people will see a huge benefit, some will see none.

Bill

Maybe a trip or call to GNC or some viatmin store would be worth the effort? I take over the counter steroids, and other supplements to help my muscles work better.

Beta blockers are strictly prescription.

Bill

Doug... I know what you're talking about... it was on an episode of Nip/Tuck, right? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif Sean had developed a tremor... (the "yips"... a psychosomatic thing)... and he was eating some drug like it was going out of style. At the time, when I heard what the drug was, I couldn't believe he was literally EATING them... can't remember what it was now... I'll do some research and see if I can find it.

Beta blockers can reduce tremors, as can benzodiazepines (valium & such), primidone, alcohol, barbituates, etc...(many of which are used for the treatment of essential tremor). However, using them when not medically necessary, can put you at risk for their other side-effects - in the case of beta blockers - hypotension, bradycardia, etc... - Not something most surgeons would want to risk - it's not good to pass out in the OR ( but if you do, please fall away from the sterile field /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif )


Sam

Go have a beer....

[ QUOTE ]
bwaites said:
The medications are blood pressure medications called "beta blockers".

At low doses they have minimal side effects. They can be contraindicated in people with asthma, COPD, and a few other lung problems.

The effectiveness is very individual. Some people will see a huge benefit, some will see none.

Bill

[/ QUOTE ]
Bill, you are on the money. I visited my Doc today for a checkup and while there asked about this. He confirmed that beta blockers serve this function. He says that they are often quite effective and he has written a number of Rx's to use them for this purpose. Unfortunately I have a condition for which they are contraindicated so I did not ask for samples or an Rx.

I was on beta blockers for a while, I would *NOT* recommend going on them, the minute steadiness improvement is not worth the side effects IMO.

Sideeffects? Ive been taking one most of my life for my MVP. I take 2 50 mg pills a day. Keeps my heart at a steady slow rate and slows lots of my involuntary actions. FOr one, you cant scare me, I dont jump in that respect. It also seems to effect the so called feeling of love. That or I may be austic. I seldom smile, oftened wondered if that was me, the pills or something else.

Outside of that my heart valve shrunk several mm to the point it no longer leaks and the docs can bearly hear it echo any more. When I changed docs, the new one was concerned as the dose was enough to cause an elephant to go to sleep, but it works fine for me.

BTW, I have trimmers so bad I cant draw a line with a ruller, I dont see any help in that respect. Like suggested pain killers are good for reducing them in my experience. Also slows your speech. Nothing like a lidicane patch to give me a southern accent.

I take a herb called Kava Kava when I wish to calm down. It's now hard to find due to some people having liver problems but is still legal and can be found if you look hard enough. also try velarin root, it's weaker then valium but has a similar relaxing effect.
Aside From that I could recomend you try soldering diffrently, with very fine pitch SMD's it's not needed to solder each pin at a time. Belive it or not you can put liquid flux onto the pins and use a "mini wave" solder tip that shorts 5 ot 6 pins at a time but the flux causes the solder to not stick inbetween the pins as you pull the tip away. I can solder a 200+ pin flat pack while wired on 250mg of caffine with out a problem.
Or you could use solder paste and hot air, thats safer for capacitors as the heat shock from an iron can crack the internal ceramic dielectric plates.

cobb:

That's exactly it. It prevents adrenaline from working in your body. You never really get excited, and exercise becomes a lot more difficult imo.

How about a natural approach that doesn't cost anything and has no side effects - exercise. I've found that I can become unusualy calm and steady following a spurt of exercise, particularly after spending some time in a nice warm pool. Soldering some SMT components would be much easier for me immediately following such an activity, as it would tend to get rid of those tiny jitters.

Even a long hot bath can help, methinks.

Thanks. I have had my blood pressure raise when I was in my height of pain and the doc told me i had little effect on my blood pressure and gave me some type of water pill, {lace-its} I believe. It worked and since my pain has been under control I am now only borderline. I use to have BP of 110/60 with a 50 pulse. Now its like 140/80-90 with 70 pulse.

[ QUOTE ]
flownosaj said:
Go have a beer....

[/ QUOTE ]

That's actually not a bad suggestion.

If the condition is benign essential tremor, alcohol consumption might temporarily suppress the tremor.

You might have already done this, but try stabilizing your elbows, forearms, and wrists by resting them on a well-padded surface, whenever you're doing any precision work. This will help to reduce any tremor contribution from the shoulder, arm, and forearm musculature.

For extreme precision, you may have to also stabilize your hand, and try to perform the task using only your thumb and index (and/or middle) finger.

I don't know of any surgeons who take medication to suppress tremors. If one's tremors are bad enough that they interfere with one's ability to operate, it's time to retire...