Question on PP c/card fees.

Just wondering, if I pay someone using a c/card based PP account, is the fee an additional 3% or 4%? Its just that I paid someone yesterday for a couple of lights, and I calculated the total + 3%. But then I saw a different post in BST today that says add 4% for c/card PP fees... So I'm confused now, and besides, I really don't wanna short change the person I'm buying from... TIA!

PayPal charges 2.9% + 30¢ for USD transactions.

I was consistently coming up short 5-25 cents in my transactions with PayPal when using my Business account.

I didn't realize why until I did the math. PayPal takes away 2.9% from a larger number than the number I add 2.9% to, so I was shorted every time, i.e., $100 + 2.9% = $102.90, $102.90 – 2.9% = $99.92.

I just assumed the PayPal fees listed on their website would work for me as well as them.

So, I have to charge slightly more than PP does to break even. I don't have a formula that works, so I have to figure it out on a per case basis.

try this formula x-.029x=100
or .971x=100 or x=100/.971, with x ending up =102.986611740473738414006179196704
so multiply your original amount by 1.029866 then add 30 cents, that should do it I think within a penny.

Since obviously many are unware of it, the PayPal agreement specifically prohibits the passing on of PayPal fees on top of the transaction price. In addition, it violates state laws in many places, including California. So if you want to give a discount for cash or check, that's legal, but anyone asking the buyer to pay the PayPal fees is violating the PayPal agreement, and State Laws in most of the United States, and most of the world. The notable exception is the UK, where it is permitted.

Is it against the agreement to offer a discount for non CC paypal accounts?

The fee is taken from top so better take X / 0.971 etc

There is additional 1% on top of the 2,9% for international

So the 3,9 vs 2,9 might be US vs international seller ?

I´m usually calculating with a flat 4% instead of 3,9 plus 0.35€uro and then round down /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Klaus

if you are using 3.9 the formula would be adjusted
as x/.961 or 1.04058272632674297606659729448491
rounded off to 1.04058 I am not sure if the addition of .35 is before or after but simple algebra can determine it regardless.

Thanks for your replies guys. Yikes, I've never been a big fan of numbers, but thanks for the detailed calculations anyways. I like Keith's version better... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I will try and digest both Lynx's and Klaus' equations later tonight...

Klaus, you mentioned the extra 1% might be for international transactions, however, when I'm processing the payment in PP, I pay it directly in US dollars, thus the conversion fees, etc are charged to me by my c/card company. While I am not sure but I don't think there is another 1% unless I'm paying in Euros, for example for a USD transaction. Hmm... now I really don't know... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

Stanley,

I think theres no real "reason" behind except PayPal trying to make some more money - it has NOTHING to do with currency conversion though anyway - its just that basically the fees for premium accounts are 1% higher for non-US based PP account members - the interesting part is that this is nowhere properly documented - like the english help pages still show from 2.4 to 3.4 % as fees for wuropean members - the german help pages show the correct numbers:

Monatlich empfangene Zahlung (USD) €0,00 EUR - €2.500,00 EUR €2.500,01 EUR - €10.000,00 EUR €10.000,01 EUR - €50.000,00 EUR €50.000,01 EUR - €100.000,00 EUR > €100.000,00 EUR
EUR 3,9 % + €0,35 EUR 3,4 % + €0,35 EUR 3,2 % + €0,35 EUR 2,9 % + €0,35 EUR 2,4 % + €0,35 EUR
USD 3,9 % + $0,30 USD 3,4 % + $0,30 USD 3,2 % + $0,30 USD 2,9 % + $0,30 USD 2,4 % + $0,30 USD
CAD 3,9 % + $0,55 CAD 3,4 % + $0,55 CAD 3,2 % + $0,55 CAD 2,9 % + $0,55 CAD 2,4 % + $0,55 CAD
GBP 3,9 % + £0,20 GBP 3,4 % + £0,20 GBP 3,2 % + £0,20 GBP 2,9 % + £0,20 GBP 2,4 % + £0,20 GBP
JPY 3,9 % + ¥40 JPY 3,4 % + ¥40 JPY 3,2 % + ¥40 JPY 2,9 % + ¥40 JPY 2,4 % + ¥40 JPY

Now it seems you can try to qualify for dealer status and get discounts down to 2,4% at >100.000 volume /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

Klaus

Stanley, you are not the only one confused and I am happy you brought this topic up.

I have received payments from many, and the rates I have had 'skimmed away' vary from 3.3% to 4.9%. Most are around 4.2 or 4.3% Considering that international members of CPF have no other practical choice for sending flashlight money but Paypal, I can live with it.

But I too do not want to short change anyone when paying. So far, adding 4% seems to be OK unless the receiver is being generous enough not to pursue a few missing cents (which I think many members have actually done, but there is no way of confirming this even after prodding if the amount was sufficient).

Paying from an existing balance does not require any fee, so that is my prefered method for PP transactions. My current balance is zilch /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/broke.gif I wish there was a way you could add funds directly to your own Paypal account from a bank account or CC.

Matthew,
I guess at the end of the day I wouldn't want the seller to lose out or feel short changed, as its not fair to them. I guess so long as no one complains about the arrangement, both parties should be ok. Thanks for pointing that out though, interesting to know anyways...

Klaus,
I think you're probably right, its probably another one of PP's methods of making more profits out of everyone... And with it not being properly documented and all the varying fees just confirms that even more. Hmm.. wonder if they have a web page that explains the same in Malay language? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Thanks for the details Klaus!

Neko,
I guess you're right, 4% is probably a safe enough bet without causing the seller to lose out too much. Hopefully this doesn't make all the other sellers stop selling stuff internationally though, us overseas flashaholics will be in trouble then!!

PP was only allowed into Malaysia a few months ago, and we are only allowed c/card transactions. We too, can't top up our PP funds directly from our bank account, and that sucks how we have to pay charges twice, once for the c/card currency conversion, and then PP fees as well. Wish there was a way I could top up my account to make payments too... short of selling my lights of course!! It sucks, but for now we're stuck with PP it seems... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon23.gif

There is no problem with discounts of any kind. The problem is strictly with surcharges on CC transactions.
And let me assure you , you don't need to be anywhere near $100,000 a month to get a merchant account. I pay 2.2% +30 cents, and it can get as low a 1.7%. If you are really at 100K per month, you shouldn't be talking to PayPal, you should be taking directly to a merchant bank like Wells Fargo (who actually runs PayPal). In fact if you are doing more than about $10,000 a month via CC, you shouldn't be doing business with PayPal.