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Thread: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

  1. #1

    Default MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I need some advice on my first flashlight mod.

    I have a MagCharger that I want to modify to the Mag85 configuration. I think I understand what's involved with that from reading threads here. I have a lot of questions, however. I appreciate your patience in reading this thread, and covet any wisdom you can offer me. Thanks in advance for you knowledge!

    Let me tell you what I'm shooting for performance-wise: I'm looking for a poor man's M6. I don't need a light that has bragging rights on the M6 or that claims to "blow away anything else." I have no desire to delude myself laughing at the "poor fools" who bought a SureFire. I love the performance of the M6, and I know I can't afford one. I just want to approach that performance as best I can in a relatively inexpensive mod. So, I'm looking for a form factor, output, beam, and throw that are as much like the M6 as I can achieve in my compromise platform.

    I really want to base my mod on the Mag Charger because the grab-n-go charging ability would be a huge benefit to me. I enjoy fiddling with batteries and chargers and I have been accused of taking my flashlights apart too often...but I want to be able to grab this fully-charged light at a moment's notice.

    I'm left with the following questions:

    -If I cut the MagCharger down to 2D length, can I run a Mag85 on an 8AA/2D adaptor?

    I have seen posts by at least one individual who built a "Mag85" on the 8 cell adaptor. That would seem to give a much nicer form factor (in my opinion). How much performance will I be giving up by going to the smaller volume? I can handle less output in exchange for smaller size. It might also help lower the bulb temp a little and lessen the tendancy of the MagCharger socket to vaporize--?? I don't want to cut down an expensive host only to discover that I really want the extra capacity. I'm looking for a functional compromise light--not the absolute most raw lumens--but I don't want to produce a "camel" that doesn't satisfy me.

    -I'm guessing that there is no easy way to modify the stock battery charger to work with the 8 cell configuration. I don't mind, however, wiring a new battery charger to the Mag bracket. I understand the stock charger takes 16 hours to charge the light anyway--and I wouldn't mind an upgrade that would yield 3-4 hour charge time. It shouldn't be too hard to hook a good charger into the contacts on the Mag bracket, should it?

    -How much run time am I giving up by going to the 2D length? Or would I actually gain some because of the lower voltage? I assume I need to bore the light out to accept the 2500ma cells in an adaptor--or does the MagCharger have a different ID? 45 minutes of useful light would be my ideal. Is that at all realistic?

    -Can I use one of the HOP or stipled reflectors designed for the regular Mag lights? I want to approximate the wide, smooth beam of the M6. I'd also like to have 250'--300' feet of useful throw...but I don't know if I can achieve both. Again, I'm willing to compromise--but I don't want to create an in-between light that is not useful.

    I know this is a long post, and I am asking a lot of elementary questions. I'm sorry about that. You guys have shown me the possibilities, and I'm eager to try my hand at creating something. I want to avoid making dumb mistakes if I can benefit from your collective wisdom. Thanks again for your patience and advice.

  2. #2
    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    theamazingrando,

    OK. First things first:

    I think you would be happy with either of these basic configurations:

    1. A Welch Allyn (WA) 1111 driven by 6 Sanyo HR-3U 2500 mAh NiMH cells
    2. A WA 1185 driven by 9 Sanyo AA's.

    I replaced the 1185 driven by 8 cells with the 1111 driven by 6, because you will be happier with the latter, and it takes fewer cells.

    So,

    Things can be made MUCH simpler if you are willing to leave the MC in stock form. In that case, get your hands on one of FiveMega's wonderful 9 AA-to-3D adadptors and some bare bi-pin 1185's and you are most of the way there.

    Or if it must be 2D, cut it off, and add the threads and o-ring sealing surface to the end, and find some good 3 AA to D adaptors and some bi-pin 1111's and you are most of the way there.

    The rest of it is the charging circuit. First of all, it is an LM317T based constant current charger, so if you simply provide it with enough over-voltage, it will charge 9 cells or 6 cells, but at the same rate as it charged the 5 cell stick. Is that a 16 hour deal? Hmm. If so, that means it would also charge the 2500 mAh AA's in the same time, as they have the same capacity as the 2500 mAh NiCd stick. You can mod the charging circuit to up the current, but not to higher than a 10 hour charge, otherwise you will be damaging your batteries as soon as they reach full charge. Illuminated is the guy to PM about this, as he modded a couple of the MC circuits for Ginseng, but I could also do it.

    It is possible, and even diserable, to make a complete, integrated battery pack out of the AA cells and avoid the whole problem of the adaptors, but there are very few people who can do this for you. I am one of them, and Ginseng is another. Ginseng doesn't have any time these days (grad school), and I am pretty darn full-out with projects as well, but at some point in the far distant future I could maybe make you up a 6 or 9 cell, three stack battery pack with + and - contacts, just like the mag 5 cel stick.

    As far as the reflectors, no, you can't use ones designed for the regular mag lights. The MC uses a plastic cage around the reflector that has the cam on it, whereas on a regular mag the cam is on the reflector itself. So the MC needs a reflector with no nub. And avoid stippled if you want to approximate the M6 beam. Use OP. It's nice and smooth but still throws.

    If you send me your MC, I can mod a HOP 1940 on the lathe to fit. If you send me your charging cradle and wallwart, I can mod that to put out 250 mA and I have wallwarts lying around that will work to charge either 6 or 9 NiMH cells.

    But at the moment I simply don't have enough time to make up an end-to-end soldered pack that would work with the MC.

    My advice is to leave your MC stock--don't bore it or cut it off--and get your hands on a FM 9 AA-to-3 D adaptor (those are really high quality pieces of work) and some bi-pin 1185's. litho123 will sell you WA lamps. I don't know about getting a FM adaptor. Then send the MC and charging system to me. At the end of it all, you will have an MC85. It will run for about 35 minutes, give or take, IIRC. The Sanyo's will deliver 2 AH at that rate, and the lamp will draw 3.3 amps so, basically 2/3.3*60 = 36 minutes is an informed guess.

    I will mod the charging circuit for, say, $10, plus another $5 for the wallwart, $15 for the modded reflector, and whatever return shipping costs. But make sure you can get your hands on a FM adaptor first. And be careful about other adaptors--some of them are too high a resistance to work with a 3 amp draw.

  3. #3
    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    You know, it occurs to me, now that I've had my coffee, that if you are confident enough to cut off your MC and add a new o-ring sealing surface and threads, that you are a WAY better machinist than I am, and that you can just mod your own reflector to fit you MC. So I can sell you a stock 1940 for $10 and you can cut it to fit yourself.

    And if you are that good at machining, you are already, or can easily become, good enough to do your own soldering and electronics work. So just get the skinny on modding your MC circuit from Illuminated. It's more or less as simple as changing out a resistor or two. I can still sell you a wallwart if need be, although if the MC one is 12VDC and 500 mA, it has enough over-voltage already for the 6 cell 1111 mod. So you may be all set on that front as well.

    That only leaves the end-to-end soldered pack, or AA to D apator issue. If you want to learn how to end-to-end solder your own packs, let me know. I can give you some links and info and pointers.

  4. #4

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    By the time you're done boring out the tube, replacing the reflector, and adding the Fivemega holder and AA NiMH cells, you've spent close to $200. Maybe if you want an M6 you should buy an actual M6. Another alternative is buy a Tigerlight, which with the latest lamp is comparable to an M6 LOLA, and brighter lamps (hopefully comparable to the M6 HOLA) are supposedly on their way.

    Simplest mod for a Magcharger is just replace the bulb with a WA 01160 and keep using the stock charger and battery pack. You have a 3D sized light but output is in the M6 HOLA territory.

  5. #5

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I'm no machinist. I had planned on having someone else cut it down for me. I'd like to play around with doing that sort of thing myself--but I think I should start with a $15 maglite--or some plain pipe.

  6. #6

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    So, the MAg85 doesn't really work well on 8 cells? I know I've seen some posts about 8 cell -85s...but I wondered how they would compare to the Mag11.

    If I'm looking for M6-ish performance, would I be happy with a Mag11?

    You're probably right that I should try my MagCharger as a regular Mag85 before I think about chopping it. My ideal light may still be a Mag11 in charger form...I really like the portability

    Do I need to worry about micah or isenglass heat shields under the lamp?

  7. #7

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Is the advantage of a soldered battery pack lower resistance?

  8. #8

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    [QUOTE=paulr]By the time you're done boring out the tube, replacing the reflector, and adding the Fivemega holder and AA NiMH cells, you've spent close to $200. QUOTE]

    I did not buy the MagCharger--I was lucky to acquire it at no cost.

  9. #9
    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Good points by paulr,

    but, for the record, the TL Gen4 LA, or any of the TL LA's, are about 275 lumens. The M6 LOLA is about 400 lumens! No joke. An 1160 MC is about 450 lumens and is only just slightly brighter in a ceiling bounce test than the M6 LOLA. The M6 HOLA blows it away.

    theamazingrando,

    Why not start by dropping in a WA 1160 and see if that pleases you? Best $3 upgrade in the entire flashlight world. And yes, you do have to worry about heat damage to the bi-pin socket. And mica does help.

  10. #10

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Wow, I didn't realize that the 1160 MC was that bright!

    How many lumens can I realistically expect to put out the front end with a Mag85 or a Mag11? I have seen people throwing around numbers, but I don't know how optimistic they are.

  11. #11
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I agree about the 1160.. that is such an awesome bangforbuck solution.

    For 2D size.. the 1111 is unbeatable... well save one trick i have coming.. using 7.2V source and a regulator to run 1160 at 800-850 lumen constant.

    besides the mica (which somebody was offering for free).. don't push the bulb in all the way.. if the glass touches it will melt the plastic very fast.


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
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  12. #12

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    If you can get 800 lumens out of a 2D body, what do you estimate run time to be?

  13. #13
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    no 'if' absolutely not a problem.. of course that is actually produced bulb lumens.. multiply by .65 for torch lumens out the front..

    the 1111 pulls 3.67A at 7.09V (what is left from 7.2 after going through the switch etc)..

    if you use CBP x 6 cells you can estimate 1.65AH / 3.67A or 27 minutes..

    if you use 17500 x 6.. that's a 3AH battery pack.. so 3AH / 3.67 = 49 minutes

    if you use 14500 x 8.. that's a 2.8AH battery pack.. so 2.8/ 3.67 = 45 minutes

    if you are CRAZY like me and put the 1111 bulb into a ONE D host with 4 14500s.. you have a light that is a full head shorter than the 2D... and maybe 20 minutes runtime. (I can't recommend repeating that.. i puts 2.6C demand on the batteries which is not recommend by me or anybody i know).

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
    I have disabled PMs.. use the 'email' link instead! • Genesis 1:3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light...

  14. #14
    Moderator js's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    AWR is throwing around bulb-lumens numbers and not torch-lumens, which is what I was talking about. To go from one to the other, multiply or divide by 65 percent (0.65).

    An 1185 run on 9 cells will put out about 750-800 torch-lumens with a good reflector. An M6 HOLA will put out just about 630.

    An 1111 run on 6 cells will put out about 500-570 torch-lumens.

    Runtime with the 1185 and good AA cells, I already quoted. Runtime of 1111 on 6 AA's is around 30 minutes or maybe a bit more.

    And yes, the MC60 really IS that bright. Here's a review I did comparing the Tiger11 and MC60. The Mag11 or MC11 configuration you are considering would be more or less the same as the Tiger11--well, actually less, due to the lower mid-point voltage under load of the AA cells compared to the A cells used in the TL.

    The Tiger11, the MC60, and some related musing

  15. #15

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Thank you JS! That was an excellent review! Of course, now I want a Tiger11...

  16. #16

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Of course, thinking about a Tiger11's benefits takes me back to the idea of an MC11 (so many abbreviations!). I'll try the MC full-length first, however.

  17. #17
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Quote Originally Posted by js
    AWR is throwing around bulb-lumens numbers and not torch-lumens, which is what I was talking about. To go from one to the other, multiply or divide by 65 percent (0.65).

    An 1185 run on 9 cells will put out about 750-800 torch-lumens with a good reflector. An M6 HOLA will put out just about 630.

    An 1111 run on 6 cells will put out about 500-570 torch-lumens.

    Runtime with the 1185 and good AA cells, I already quoted. Runtime of 1111 on 6 AA's is around 30 minutes or maybe a bit more.
    Yes.. thanks for making that point clear.. i always do my calculations in bulb lumen...I'm starting to include the torch lumen calculation now as well so people used to either can have a fair comparison..

    Hey... exciting hotdriver news.. Got the last bug out of the hotdriver circuit i'm making.. http://hotdriver.rouse.com and other than blowing up my test 1160 bulb by knocking out a rather important potentimeter from the breadboard which put 8Volts across the bulb (for about 0.5 seconds!).. it's operating absolutely perfectly as planned!

    One of the 'gems' that i'll be able to pull off now because of it..

    running the 1166 in overdrive w/o melting it.. a really neat gem.. is that it'll fit in a 2D host and run about 900 bulb lumen.. 600 torch lumen... and start to finish in regulation the entire time! (well the last 30-60 seconds i suspect it'll drop to 700/460 lumen before cut-out).

    To run that light in that host, i'll use the modamag 8AA->2D holder modded to series-parallel with 8 14500s.. since that's a 1.4AH battery.. 14.4V.. means.. about 40 minutes runtime 900/600 lumen and 'only' 1.36 to 1.46C on the batteries, not bad at all.

    I have to try the 8AA holder but the 4AA holder fits in an UNMODIFIED tube!.. this is very exciting news for somebody interested in a similar mod.

    Oh.. with NO regulation.. using the parallel version of the holder.. running the 1111 bulb is just absolutely wonderful! It's my favorite bulb for now.. I think that a lot of people would love to make the LiON mag11.. just learn all you can about LiON cells first.. do NOT over-discharge LiONs... very bad juju.

    Think about this:

    $15 for a KIU socket
    $9 for an 1111
    $18 for a modamag holder
    $15 for a 2D host
    $20 for an alum reflector
    $5 for a lens.
    $8x5 = $40 for cells
    $25 for a smart charger that'll charge the whole pack

    $147 plus shipping of course.. that is NOT BAD.. and includes the cells and charger.. without them.. $82 bucks!

    oh.. that's just an 'FYI'.. i'm not selling the parts

    I am looking into selling pre-fab KIU sockets with my driver built-in though.. pricing yet to be established.. maybe something like $50 including the socket.. have to find out if i can source the magswitch so i don't need people to send in their 'cores'..

    I will also be creating a 'copy cat me'.. DIY low-budget driver.. should cost about $5 to build.. maybe $10 'cause of low-quantities.. I'll likely buy a bunch of parts from digikey to sell kits i can mail for 50 cents.. in any event.. very low cost, high quality regulator ckt for hotwires... the thread is in bat. incl.. search for "ludicrously" pretty good chance it's the only thread in all of cpf with that word

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
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  18. #18
    Flashaholic* powernoodle's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Just so I have this straight, FM's 6AA>2D will fit a stock 2D body, and you just add the WA1111, reflector, lens, NiMH batts, etc, right? Just like making a Mag85?

    best regards

  19. #19
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    badda bing.. the recipe for the 'mag 11'.. exactly correct.

    If you stick with the PR switch, take it apart and solder 'solder wick' between the top and bottom contact around the spring it will drop the resistance from 180 to 80 miliohms.. if you have pro-gold or such to treat all the contacts it'll drop it to 50-60.. 1/3 the resistance of stock..

    641/417 is the lumen estimate with a stock PR switch..

    834/532 is the estimate with a KIU socket. 30% more light!

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
    I have disabled PMs.. use the 'email' link instead! • Genesis 1:3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light...

  20. #20

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I had not read that thread about your regulator previously, AW.

    The idea of regulation is exciting to me. Just the fact that you can get constant output from the light is huge, in my opinion.

    I think I'll need one of those regulators when you have them to sell.

    You guys have been very helpful. I really appreciate your patience in repeating yourselves and explaining this stuff to me. I know I've read it all elsewhere on the forum--but I still needed help sorting it out!
    I still don't know if I want to build a Mag85 or a Mag11--I keep hefting my 2D and 3D maglites wondering how much light I want to trade for size--and whether it's worth the hassel.

    I will start by using an 1166 in my MagCharger for a while. I believe I will take your offer for help with my reflector and charger, JS--as soon as I figure out what to build!

  21. #21
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    you mean the 1160.. the 1166 is 11.6V bulb.. but if you have a MC the 1160 is begging to be put in.. it's such a gimme of an upgrade.. at the relatively lower bulb voltage that bulb will be extremely robust to boot. I have a MC here and i use it for comparison with the mini-monster like the mini mag11.. and though it doesn't have the same amt of output it also doesn't only last 20 mninutes!

    I hope to have a 800-900 bulb lumen (500-600 torch lumen) light operational in a 2D size that has about 40 minutes runtime and i think that will be the best compromise of size vs light output and with soft-start and constant output... hard to beat.

    I will be making the 1160 in a 7.2V host and an 1166 in a 14.4V host to compare them.. in testing so far they look extremely similar so i won't know which is nicer 'til they are operational.. though it would seem that the 1160 will win in the bulb longevity department so i'm leaning that way (not to mention much easier battery solutions).

    The 1D version is just a 'show off' light... i only recommend playing on that level if you are a self-proclaimed nutbar as myself.

    One thing.. when using LiON cells.. they are like 1/2 or less the weight of alkaline.. my 2D light feels empty... and the 1D model you can barely tell is in your hand.. so the word 'heft' no longer applies.. even the 2 1/2D model is really light compared to what it used to be before the diet.

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
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  22. #22

    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Are the LiON cells the larger diameter cells that people bore out their light bodies for? Or are those just any very high capacity cell?

  23. #23
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    There u go agin, Andrewwyn. Putting ideas into other peoples heads!! Another convert to the li-ion way to the lite!! Welcome to the path of the lion lite!!! ( Hehe !! )

    Oh!! Andrewwyn, I need the reg kit for 85, 66, 60, 11, 74 another for the 83 (4.7v) if u got the kit.

    Grando, if u know nothing about li-ions or lions do a search and laern up about them b4 trying to use them. They r very tempermental with little tolerence to abuse. Just like a real lion u get into big trouble if u abuse them. They really roar with flames and goes like a bomb too if overcharged or hi-amp overdischarged !!! And I mean that literally!!

    Always go for the protected cells from Pila sold by among others J.S. Burley or the cheeper china made cells sold by AW ( not Andrewwyn ). Both members of good standing of this community.

  24. #24
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I only use LiONs in circuts that won't let me abuse them.. my driver circuits shut off at 3V/cell and my charger automatically shuts off at 4.200V.

    Nikola Tesla pointed out a possilble problem with using stacks of protected cells... at some point one cell is going to shut off.. that will shut down that stack of cells.. now say you have 3.35A coming out of the cells.. (mag 85).. when one battery shuts off.. the other two stacks will have to split that load and the draw will jump from 1.11A (1C on a 1100mA 17500).. to 1.675A (1.5C).. My bet is that this would cascade to have them all shut down but the second two columns would shut down due to over current, not under voltage.. and two things.. 1) the spike of current at end of life.. how good is that for a cell.. and 2) how reliaable is the over current as a 'shut down' mechanism?

    In any event.. for my pupsoses i'd rather use the RAW cells and protection built around them just like a real battery pack like you'd have in your cell phone or laptop.

    The main point is that with RARE exception use protection of some kind if you use LiON cells.. the are not your father's oldsmobile.. they don't take abuse like a NiCD or Lead Acid bat.

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
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  25. #25
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Couldn't agree with u more. But for a beginner nooboie that is still trying to get the hang of the lion cells, protected 1's are still the best. Say, I've got 20pcs of 14500 waiting for a host and config. Any ideas???

  26. #26
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    oh yeah there are a couple really nice places to use 14500s..

    series-parallel in 8AA->2D will get you like 40 minutes of 800+lumen with 1111 bulb in a 2D host.

    series parallel in 4AA->1A will get you 20.. but not likely to run with protected cells.

    series-parallel of 3x3 or 4x3 will get you 10.8V for running 1185 or 1331... but no benefit over using 3x3 17500s which i believe you have already.

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
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  27. #27
    *Flashaholic* PlayboyJoeShmoe's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Just for the record I have several lights with many of the bulbs talked about.

    A big 5D light with 6C NimH and an 1111, a 2D with 6AA and a MC stock bulb, a 2D with 8AA and a 1274, a 3D with 9AA and an 1185 and last but not least a MC with an 1160.

    Most have frosted bulbs, the 1185 has a LOP and the MC has a medium frosted 1160.

    A 2D with 6AA and 1111 might be better, but even the LOP doesn't tame the wild 1111. I will have a MOP coming pretty soon so we'll see.

    Of them all my favorite big light is the MC. It's bright enough and has decent runtime.

    But the very best part is it can stay in the charger and come out swinging!

    Keeping all the AAs charged is a job....
    Last edited by PlayboyJoeShmoe; 01-06-2006 at 08:46 PM.
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  28. #28
    *Flashaholic* andrewwynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    The upcoming stippled carley reflectors tame up the 1111 and the 1185 beautifully.. in a shoot-out recently.. a favoritie light of choice (not me).. was the M85 with a frosted 1185 bulb and the #5 stippled reflector... just perfectly even wash of light.

    charging AAs.. use the smartchargers from batteryspace.. do a very nice job and no loading/reloading of cells (with the hazards of tearing the labels.. very yikes!).

    MC is mega practical and once the 1160 is frosted man it's got a nice beam. I have too many other lights to choose from to end up picking that one... but my 9x17500 host for the Mag85 (nearly 1hr runtime) has been turned into a Mag85, so my favorted runtime light is gone.. down to 8-9 minutes, whew.

    I have my 'M85' which is a 2D-3bore light with 9xR123s.. about 1/2 hr runtime solid.. regulated a little lower than 10.8 to help with the lower output cells and keep it running constant.. start to finish no change in output.. very nice solution.. i'm working to put 6xGP2000 cells in.. the runtime will be about the same but those cells won't even know the light is turned on at 3.4A so i'll get a much brighter solution.

    -awr


    Regulated hotwire 'the hotdriver' also for Surefire M6 • 3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. the 'BAM!' click here
    I have disabled PMs.. use the 'email' link instead! • Genesis 1:3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light...

  29. #29
    Flashaholic wtraymond's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    I'm going to jump on the li-ion bandwagon and cast a vote for the ROP LE with LOLA. If you haven't heard of this mod you can catch up here:

    http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=95327

    This is the easiest and most powerful mod for it's size. It's also cheap and reliable. The 2C Mag host will cost about $16 at Home Depot. The UCL or borofloat is $7 from Flashlightlens. Modamag has some metal reflectors for sale now in the 'Group Buy' forum for about $25 shipped. The batteries are available from J.S. Burley's or AW in the 'Dealer' forum or from BatterySpace.com. All three of the previous mentioned retailers also carry chargers. I bought the 3854 bulb packs (each pack contains a HOLA and a LOLA) direct from Pelican for $11.95 plus shipping here:

    https://www.pelicanpro.com/AWWebStore/Store.asp

    I was thinking that you could also use the 2D Mag and four 18650s - two in parallel and two in series. This would enable you to run the HOLA without over stressing the batteries. Four 18650s should fit in an unmodified 2D Mag.
    If it doesn't move and it should, use WD-40. If it moves and shouldn't, use duct tape.

    Bill

  30. #30
    Flashaholic wtraymond's Avatar
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    Default Re: MagCharger85 in 2D length?

    Quote Originally Posted by andrewwynn
    Nikola Tesla pointed out a possilble problem with using stacks of protected cells... at some point one cell is going to shut off.. that will shut down that stack of cells.. now say you have 3.35A coming out of the cells.. (mag 85).. when one battery shuts off.. the other two stacks will have to split that load and the draw will jump from 1.11A (1C on a 1100mA 17500).. to 1.675A (1.5C).. My bet is that this would cascade to have them all shut down but the second two columns would shut down due to over current, not under voltage.. and two things.. 1) the spike of current at end of life.. how good is that for a cell.. and 2) how reliaable is the over current as a 'shut down' mechanism?

    -awr
    I don't see these as real problems. The reliability of the protection circuit is redundant with multiple protected cells. If one cell's protection circuit fails, it will only be a short time before another cell's circuit shuts that series circuit 'off.' I propose it may be possible to run a series of li-ions with just one protected cell in each series if the protection circuit is reliable.

    As long as the batteries have a balanced state-of-charge at the beginning of discharge, I don't see why a small current spike will cause any problems. The other parallel series of cells will probably shut down within seconds and well before the cells are over-discharged.

    Short of self-destruction, how does over-discharging effect the life of a li-ion cell (eg. 1C vs 2C vs 3C)? This maybe a question for SilverFox.
    If it doesn't move and it should, use WD-40. If it moves and shouldn't, use duct tape.

    Bill

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