Australian Police don't like Maglites...

James Miller · #1 10-02-2009, 07:42 PM

Hi guys, got a question for you. Any Aussies had any run-ins with the police involving maglites?

I got pulled over with some friends and had my Maglite 3D (Seoul P7 Mod) and standard 4D for comparison so I could show them the two side-by-side in the national park at night, however some police pulled us fora breath test, and called more police then started checking our car and eventually kept asking why I need a flashlight so big/so many flashlights.

My response was that I do reviews on flashlights and use them whenever I can, and that it's not possible to put a Seoul P7 into a small Energizer torch or Dolphin Torch (To my knowledge) and that Maglites are the only way, as well as having a good warrenty (Dolphin probably won't send you out a new case if it breaks)

They got pretty pissed at me having all my maglites and told me I better not have so much as one torch next time. I still never found out why they ended up searching through the car and such, they were disappointed to say the least at finding nothing by the looks of things. It must've had something to do with the people I was in the car with.

So has anyone else had to deal with them in Australia and had issues or no issues? They asked why I had a maglite in the back seat and the answer was for emergency use. I mean, why NOT have one in the backseat? It's a torch...

outersquare · #2 10-02-2009, 08:01 PM

um wow, random searches and cops giving you a hassle about flashlights?

time for you guys to revolt..

DimeRazorback · #3 10-02-2009, 08:01 PM

Hmmm... strange.

I guess the thing is, that maglites are often seen as 'impact weapons' such as baseball bats.

So, you with friends and a few maglites = suspicions.

...they wouldn't wanna search my car... Raptor, M6, E2DL, TK11, Quarks...

Can I ask what state you live in?

James Miller · #4 10-02-2009, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DimeRazorback

Hmmm... strange.

I guess the thing is, that maglites are often seen as 'impact weapons' such as baseball bats.

So, you with friends and a few maglites = suspicions.

...they wouldn't wanna search my car... Raptor, M6, E2DL, TK11, Quarks...

Can I ask what state you live in?

NSW

R@ndom · #5 10-02-2009, 08:42 PM

Hold on... Did you consent to their search? Did they find you suspicious?

curtispdx · #6 10-02-2009, 08:46 PM

Because burglars carry flashlights. (Usually cheap, crappy lights though.) Even so, it sounds like it could have been handled better.

James Miller · #7 10-02-2009, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R@ndom

Hold on... Did you consent to their search? Did they find you suspicious?

No, we didn't as far as I know. I don't really think they asked, they just told us to get out.

They must've found us suspicious, but they find everything suspicious... We had the car stopped on the side of the road near the ocean because we were resting for a few minutes and trying to think of where to drive to on our late night drive. I guess they thought we must've been doing something suspicious. Still, it just annoyed me because none of us got caught doing anything, no one was charged,

DimeRazorback · #8 10-02-2009, 09:00 PM

You sort of answered your own question mate.

A group of guys hanging out in a car late at night is a big sus pot.

Going by the manner in which they told you to get out... I think they were expecting to find weapons in the car...

Don't forget, loitering is what criminals tend to do before committing a crime.

old4570 · #9 10-02-2009, 10:03 PM

Still not against the law , is it .

Dont worry , soon you will need travel permits to leave your home .

DimeRazorback · #10 10-02-2009, 10:11 PM

They were just doing there job...

Think of the other possibilities if it was a car full of thugs.

Norm · #11 10-02-2009, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DimeRazorback

They were just doing there job...

Think of the other possibilities if it was a car full of thugs.

Agreed

James Miller · #12 10-02-2009, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DimeRazorback

They were just doing there job...

Think of the other possibilities if it was a car full of thugs.

Yeah that's fair enough, didn't have a problem with most of the cops, it was just one of them hassling me. The others were pretty chill about it.

Also, I'm curious as to whether any other aussies have had issues? I've been cited for carrying a maglite-mini and I don't see how that's a 'weapon."

Metatron · #13 10-02-2009, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Miller

Yeah that's fair enough, didn't have a problem with most of the cops, it was just one of them hassling me. The others were pretty chill about it.

Also, I'm curious as to whether any other aussies have had issues? I've been cited for carrying a maglite-mini and I don't see how that's a 'weapon."

last time i looked a maglite wasnt a weapon. some coppers are just plain unfriendly and some just dont want to be taken for a ride by youngsters. theres a time and place for everything, and u chose the wrong time and place is all, and besides, u should be arrested for carrying a mag, what the hell were u thinking;P

Th232 · #14 10-02-2009, 11:37 PM

Nope, never had any issues here.

manoloco · #15 10-03-2009, 12:37 AM

Its ok for them to look for things as some have said, they are just doing their job, and i appreciate and are thankful for it, but:

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Miller

...They got pretty pissed at me having all my maglites and told me I better not have so much as one torch next time...

This is the part i dont like, what is that?, a threat? a warning about not being able to have and carry something you have every right to?, you can carry as many torches as you like, if a cop pulls me over i will collaborate and everything but if he/she asks me why i have a flashlight, i will say because i can and because i like them, and that isnt a lie.

If they want more info i can surely talk about it with a cup of tea or something and probably point them to CPF, but with a threat like that one, i would be really tempted to ask: officer is that a threat?
and if he refuses to tell me, i would just say: well if you dont want to tell me i will ask a lawyer to see if it is.

keeping peace and security is a responsability and im thankful for the few that have the heart, courage and ability to take it, but its not a right for bullying citizens with the excuse of "authority", they should leave their ego somewhere else.

ducat · #16 10-03-2009, 01:28 AM

Sounds to me the cop was jealous of your lights!
Don't sweat it, if push comes to shove you have a perfectly legal reason to own torches and there is NOTHING a cop can do about it except try to frighten you. Next time ask him to take you to court, call his bluff and he'll back pedal so fast his eyes'll start spinning!

Monocrom · #17 10-03-2009, 02:58 AM

I'm surprised you weren't told not to have a car on you the next time you get pulled over. If those LEOs are p*$$ed about you having a perfectly legal flashlight that might be heavy enough to be used as a club, imagine how upset they would have been if they realized your car can make a much bigger impact than your Maglite.

Hmmm . . . A two ton, giant, bullet speeding towards someone at 60mph.

Oh yeah, that'll hurt quite a bit more than a metal flashlight.

I have a lot of respect for LEOs. But unfortunately, there are more than a few rotten apples who squeeze through when they should have been weeded out. What you dealt with was a Bully with a Badge. Now if you had burglary tools or a crack pipe visible on the backseat, I could understand why an LEO would be suspicious. But all you had was a flashlight. A perfectly legal flashlight that no decent LEO would ever tell you to not carry with you in your car.

You should have filed a complaint. Asked his superior officer why the LEO treated you the way he did, and if he has a history of harassing law-abiding citizens.

James Miller · #18 10-03-2009, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monocrom

I'm surprised you weren't told not to have a car on you the next time you get pulled over. If those LEOs are p*$$ed about you having a perfectly legal flashlight that might be heavy enough to be used as a club, imagine how upset they would have been if they realized your car can make a much bigger impact than your Maglite.

Hmmm . . . A two ton, giant, bullet speeding towards someone at 60mph.

Oh yeah, that'll hurt quite a bit more than a metal flashlight.

I have a lot of respect for LEOs. But unfortunately, there are more than a few rotten apples who squeeze through when they should have been weeded out. What you dealt with was a Bully with a Badge. Now if you had burglary tools or a crack pipe visible on the backseat, I could understand why an LEO would be suspicious. But all you had was a flashlight. A perfectly legal flashlight that no decent LEO would ever tell you to not carry with you in your car.

You should have filed a complaint. Asked his superior officer why the LEO treated you the way he did, and if he has a history of harassing law-abiding citizens.

This is gonna sound stupid, but I was almost worried about that. When this massive cop is staring you in the face with 3 other cops behind him (and two more rolling up), the last thing you do is ask for superior officers.

I even tried being polite. Every time they asked me a quesiton, I responded with Yes sir, No sir, or I don't know sir. That's fair enough right? He started to go on "What's with this sir bullshit, only people in the military say that." I responded with the truth "I work for the Government, that's why" and he sort of just went quiet.

Still, he wasn't easy to get on with. I treated them politely and spoke the truth and still had everything I said made fun of (even got referred to as the "Candlepower kid" at one point. I don't see why I got targeted, I did nothing wrong. They seemed concerned that the driver may be drunk/under the influence of narcotics as he is naturally loud and talks with a slight slur and a bit of a strange gaze, but he was tested on both and came back clean.

Anyway, asking for a superior officer in the dead of night, I don't deal with cops and I don't know what they're like, if stories about them taking people out to the country and smashing people up if they "talk" are true, but as I say, I don't intend to badmouth them. I don't HATE them either, I'm just confused. They were prolly doing their job, and the rough one probably had a shit night.

DimeRazorback · #19 10-03-2009, 09:14 AM

I'm not sure how much you know about the insignia of the NSW police force, but referring to this could you work out what rank the officer was?

Also, did you happen to catch his name or number on his badge?

The manner in which he was treating you wasn't very professional.

Monocrom · #20 10-03-2009, 03:16 PM

You don't ask to see his superior when he's on the scene, treating you like crap. You memorize his badge number, and listen if any of the other officers refer to him by name. Then, after he leaves, that's when you file your complaint. Get the other people in the car to go along with your complaint. Obviously, they saw the completely unprofessional and jack-@$$ manner the officer displayed.

His behavior will just continue, and only get worse unless put in check.

Lightraven · #21 10-03-2009, 05:18 PM

The story is believable enough, so. . .

Good police work
1. Investigating a car with young men at late night on the side of the road.
2. Multiple officers for safety
3. Looking for drugs, weapons, body parts, stolen loot or signs of intoxicated driver
4. Run names for warrants? License plate for stolen?

Bad police work
1. Name calling, belittling, argumentative bullying (he's got a problem with "Sir"?)
2. Implied criticism of legal, harmless, inoffensive activity--flashlight modification, collecting.
3. Order to cease legal activity--carrying flashlight in car.

Young men get scrutiny from law enforcement for obvious reasons. Appearance and demeanor (by choice or by nature) will also affect scrutiny levels. Time of day and activity will matter. The number of persons and their companions (4 16-year old males versus mom, dad, 16 year old son, 9 year old daughter and Badger, the Labrador retriever). The type of car matters (most commonly stolen or least commonly stolen?) Does the car "fit" the driver? Does the driver "fit" the area? Does the car match a reported getaway vehicle?

James Miller · #22 10-03-2009, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DimeRazorback

I'm not sure how much you know about the insignia of the NSW police force, but referring to this could you work out what rank the officer was?

Also, did you happen to catch his name or number on his badge?

The manner in which he was treating you wasn't very professional.

Didn't see, he was undercover/plainclothes. I remember his voice, appearance, sidearm, clothes and that's about it.

DimeRazorback · #23 10-03-2009, 06:49 PM

That is unfortunate... and probably why he felt he could treat you like that.

It is upsetting.

blasterman · #24 10-03-2009, 08:53 PM

The Good:

Living in a country with gun control laws so strict that cops are bored enough to consider flashlights as suspicious weapons. Here in Michigan, I can't imagine even the most disgruntled and bored county cop giving a box of modded Mags much more than a glance, and even then so only because he can't tell them from a bong or pipe-bomb

They are far more concerned at determining if you have a better/bigger firearm than they do.

The Bad:

Cops being so bored that they hassle you to death about flashlights because they looked stupid at not being able to find you doing anything illegal.

fyrstormer · #25 10-03-2009, 10:03 PM

The best way to deal with police is to not take anything they say seriously unless they start talking on the radio and/or fiddling with something on their tool belt. Other than that, pretend you're talking to a little kid, and act like what they're saying is very important even if it's gibberish.

This strategy has helped me avoid about a dozen opportunities to get myself arrested for taking cops too seriously. Sorry if this pisses off any police on this forum, but if it works it works.

fyrstormer · #26 10-03-2009, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blasterman

The Good:

Living in a country with gun control laws so strict that cops are bored enough to consider flashlights as suspicious weapons. Here in Michigan, I can't imagine even the most disgruntled and bored county cop giving a box of modded Mags much more than a glance, and even then so only because he can't tell them from a bong or pipe-bomb

They are far more concerned at determining if you have a better/bigger firearm than they do.

The Bad:

Cops being so bored that they hassle you to death about flashlights because they looked stupid at not being able to find you doing anything illegal.

Super-strict gun control laws do not qualify as "good". There are people who shouldn't have guns, and there are people who haven't done anything stupid yet.

James Miller · #27 10-03-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fyrstormer

The best way to deal with police is to not take anything they say seriously unless they start talking on the radio and/or fiddling with something on their tool belt. Other than that, pretend you're talking to a little kid, and act like what they're saying is very important even if it's gibberish.

This strategy has helped me avoid about a dozen opportunities to get myself arrested for taking cops too seriously. Sorry if this pisses off any police on this forum, but if it works it works.

The fact they unbuttoned their glock holsters got me a little worried. I mean, it's a couple of maglites, not a bunch of rifles in the backseat... I was actually quite worried something big was going to happen.

Still, I started out neutral and polite. The first police we talked to were ok, and some of them remained ok throughout the entire time, telling us to just "sit tight and we'll be out of it soon" and such. I know I shouldn't be such a huge pussy about what they call me, but it came as a bit of a shock to me since I've never encountered police before. They're a little different than how they appear on TV, and someone once told me Aussie cops are infinitely nicer than American ones.

And yeah, I don't have anything against cops generally, there's something about most of the Aussie ones I've encountered, the fact that they're straight away listening to every word you say and analyzing it to try and make some kind of criminal connection out of it, unnerves the hell out of me. My legs actually began shaking at one point when sitting on the road, (it was very cold though) and I didn't want to look suspicious by appearing scared or intimidated. They're just *so* serious. I've seen cops in america crack jokes with the people they've pulled over even but these guys were on a negative tone most of the time (I know it's not a cops job to be nice and joke and stuff, but when you're all found innocent of anything happening, I didn't think they'd maintain the tone and tell us to high-tail it out of the area and never come back ever or they'd be giving us more trouble.)

Metatron · #28 10-03-2009, 11:28 PM

mate, put it behind u, like i said before, theres a time and place for everything, let it go and the ego sting will soon disappear. these guys put their lives on the line and god help them if a shot goes off... the moment u try to take the initiative from them ur in it deep, live and learn for next time.

i recall once there was a breathalyzer bus around the corner from me and i pulled into the road just before the bus, i was chased 100 metres and was accused of trying to evade a breathalyzer, when all i did was turn into the street i lived in. i was breathalyzed, it read zero and was told i could go, all the time my wolfys on the front seat, was i going to chat with them about their crappy mags? anyway, they still wanted to push the fact that i tried to evade a test and i just said to the officer that he was standing in my driveway

DimeRazorback · #29 10-04-2009, 12:01 AM

That's it mate!

Always two sides to every story. You just have to be able to understand both sides!

fiftycalibre · #30 10-04-2009, 05:15 AM

I always have at least 3 torches in my car with me. 1 4D mag, a L0D, and an E01. I usually have my P2D as well, and sometimes a bunch of other torches.

I havent had any trouble yet. Usually when I am pulled over for whatever reason, I have my license out and its all done very quickly.

I would imagine he only did all that because of the circumstances. He probably thought you were gonna roll someones place.

Oh, and I am working on a P7 dolphin mod