Spiral Light Bulbs

[RebelRAM]

I finally bought one of those new spiral shaped light bulbs. I needed a light bulb for the lamp in my office and I was tired of standard bulbs burning out.

Anyways, I had a few questions. Are these bulbs flourescent? Also do they really last 5 years as the package indicates? On the package it also says that it's a 60W bulb, but only uses 13W. I bought the GE brand. If it's only using 13W, does that mean for a light socket that is rated for 60W bulbs, could I actually put 100W spiral in that only uses 26W and still be safe?

On the package it also lists a 825 Lumen rating, but it doesn't seem as bright as my G2. I realize this spiral bulb is more of a flood where my G2 is more of a spot. So is that lumen rating on the spiral bulb really that accurate?

--JT

[Lynx_Arc]

Yes, they are fluorescent, yes they last 5 years or more, yes you can use them in sockets at their current consumption so you could get a 150-200 watt equivelant twister and use it if it would fit. I like to use them in bathroom fixtures because you can put a 100watt equivelant twister in where it recommends 60 or 75 watt incan.

Lumen ratings on spiral bulbs are fairly accurate depending upon manufacturer, with the more prominent known manufacturers perhaps being more accurate. As for the comparison ratings they are within *ballpark* figures as I have seen them vary as much as 20-30% for lumens in comparison. Lumens are total light output as if a black hole swallowed up every photon and spit out a receipt.

I have spirals CFL lamps in most fixtures that stay on more than 10 mins at a time. For those occausional on/off lights they may not be worth trouble as they tend to take about a minute or so to *warm up* to full brightness and turning them on/off a lot reduces life as with most fluorescent lights.

[Zelandeth]

Exactly as Lynx_Arc said.

These things can get pretty big too. I have an 85W spiral here (420W equivilant!), and man, that thing is BRIGHT.

LOZ Page "SuperSpiral"

[VidPro]

i will say the opposite

""Also do they really last 5 years as the package indicates?""

in ya dreams they do, first if you turn them on and off like a yo yo , they die FAST (motion sencors) if you leave them on (for reasonable lengths) the phosphors are at about 50% in less than 9000hrs, about 1 year total run time.

""On the package it also says that it's a 60W bulb, but only uses 13W.""

total BS, the BULB is at 13W but the entire curcuit is nessisary to operate the bulb, which is more like 15W
and if that will replace a 60W, then you been using a pos 60w to begin with [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

"" I bought the GE brand. If it's only using 13W, does that mean for a light socket that is rated for 60W bulbs, could I actually put 100W spiral in that only uses 26W and still be safe? ""

TOTALLY, the heat output and actual total wattage are the issues with a socekt or lamp fixture and its parts. there is a high startup current hit , but it should not be an issue in any normal sockets.


""On the package it also lists a 825 Lumen rating, but it doesn't seem as bright as my G2. I realize this spiral bulb is more of a flood where my G2 is more of a spot. So is that lumen rating on the spiral bulb really that accurate?""

ya probably for the first 1000+ hours it really is the ratings they use, but remember the light out of a florescent when it crashes back into the tube is somewhat lost, so if the light was a long tube, with ROOM for a reflector behind it wont waste as much light as it actually generates. when you spiral it around like that, the light that goes back into the tube, does not re-trigger phosphors, and is not reflected away very well. so the spiral is not the MOST efficenet, but how else you going to put it in where a round bulb went?

ya flashlight is a SPOT, apples and oranges, the florescent can be made slightly spotty, but looses even more to do so.

also: when its cold , they will be dark (darker sometimes than a equivelent) until they heat up, or when cold they will flicker obnoxiously.
then as the ends get blackened from the incadescent filament that starts them , and the phosphors slowly fade away, . . .
THEY STILL beat the snot out of a incadescent bulb in output.

only 2 things i would not recommend them for , 1/2 wave motion sencors, and dimmers, and stuff like that. and lights that are on for less than a full minute at any time.
everything else (even outdoors in the cold) they are excelent.
and now that the prices are at more normal, who cares that they dont last as long.

also the ratings on what they can actually replace are a bit high, and have nothing to do with Halogen incadescents, and when you add up the TOTAL curcuit wattage, and get the EXACT same light as a incadescent , thier ratings might make it to 1/3rd the actual power use. which is still GREAT, its just that there is so many inacuracies (lies) used to describe and spec them.
also there is a higher wattage startup current, adding to the negativity of having them used on lights that are only on for very short times.

[RebelRAM]

OK that's the kind of info I wanted to know. Thanks!

I think I am going to buy a few more of them and experiment to see what I like best.

My wife really likes the Sylvania (Daylight) bulbs because they have a much whiter color to them, but they have a really short lifespan. She is interested in trying out the spiral bulbs though.

Ah well, all good stuff to know [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[greenLED]

Another vote for the much, much shorter lifespan. Out of 12 we bought, Only 3 of them have lasted over 2 years (2.5 years, to be exact). The others went *poof* anywhere between 8 and 14 months after we started using them.

[Lynx_Arc]

The first spiral I got lasted about 5 years, it could possibly be they are making them cheaper now which is making them last shorter. Even if they die after a year or two I am guessing the savings still is there and not having a hot bulb to compete with your air conditioner is nice also as a 100watt incan is about equivalent to a person from what I have heard.

[VidPro]

i have been having the best luck with "circle lights" they are BIG round florescents classed 32W. its like a full size tube. the tube disconnects from the high voltage curcuit thing, which means the replacement is JUST the tube.
also you can get a Blacklight tube for the same thing.

[Lynx_Arc]

My first lamp replacement was a 22 watt flourescent circle tube and it died within about 3 months. The ballast went out and I haven't bothered with them since. The tubes for those things cost as much as a CFL spiral now and many stores are not carrying them any more. I used to see CFL utube replacement bulbs but any more you don't see them except for lanterns and desklamps.

[BB]

I have changed most everything to spiral CF's and, for the most part they are OK and much cheaper to use. I have had pretty good luck with the brands Costco sells. Lights of America brands have been all over the place in terms of life/quality (early lamps lasted a very long time, newer lamps—some are OK, some not).

I have a hard time getting any consistent color temperature (almost never marked), and they are either a bit too sickly warm or too sickly white (and, in general, white CLF’s are not found in stores that often).

And, it is sometimes tough to find a fixture that they look good in.

I personally liked some of the circular tubes--but it is hard to find nice looking fixtures using them anymore. And, if you want a bright overhead light (for example, the main light in our bedrooms), the larger spiral bulbs sometimes don't fit. And the fixture just does not look very good using spirals.

My most recent search for light fixtures was for a couple of ceiling fans with integral light fixtures. I opted for the glass bowl style.

A ceiling fan using a fluorescent lamp seemed a natural--doesn't it? Should be vibration resistant (especially cold cathode versions). And low heat—Hello Fan Guys!!! I am trying to cool my house, why would I want to pump 120-400 watts of heat into a hot room in the summer????

However, I ran into several issues.

First issue, it was hard to find a glass bowel that would hold the larger 100 watt equivalent spirals (60 watts where not usually a problem). In the exposed bulb versions, the spiral bulbs hang down past the glass/shade--and my wife does not think they look very good (plus for 8' ceilings, the head room is probably not enough).

Second issue was that every remote control (and "1-hot wire" multifunction control) design always included a dimmer circuit for the lamps--something you can’t use for the standard fluorescent bulbs.

So, for a retrofit fan application, there are few options out there, and I pretty much have to use pull chain style switches to control the fan and lights.

That is my story for CFL’s.

-Bill

[James S]

I have also replaced most everything that stays on for any length of time in the house with these things. With the exception of lights I want to be able to dim (dimmable CF's are garbage, I have tried several kinds and they are very expensive and the dimming is less than useless) and the outdoor floods which I want to be able to come on to full brightness right away.

I have very good luck with 60watt and 75 watt equivalent bulbs, but somewhat less success with bigger ones, 100 150+ wattage cheap lamps just don't hold up. It seems to me that the ballasts die much faster on those larger lamps.

For me there are 2 big reasons to use them. Both more or less already mentioned. First I can put a much brighter lamp into a socket that is only rated for 60 watts. This is great as there is never enough light and I can't afford to go all LED yet [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] And secondly for the much reduced heat output. I spent several hundred dollars last year replacing light bulbs in the house and had a cut in my AC bill that summer of over 75$ in the worst months of heating. I know that some of that was from some duct work I had fixed for the AC but the rest was due to my not having to pump the heat generated by all those lamps back out again. not to mention just the comfort of using them in places like the kitchen were there are a lot of bulbs and where the AC will not keep up when the old array of 75 watt bulbs was on.

[Sub_Umbra]

Any radioheads on this thread? Do these spiral bulbs put out RFI like other types of florescent lamps? I have some appplications for them but I can't handle any more RFI.

[Lynx_Arc]

some of the off brand cheapos make RFI but I think most the major brands have a disclamer that they don't somewhere on the package.

[BB]

In the AM band, you probably will pick up some interference if you are within 10' of the lamp or so (sometimes buzz on car radio as I pull into the garage).

In the old days of CFL's (a few years ago [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] ) you could still get ones that had magnetic ballasts (pick up bulb in the package, and you will find it quite a bit heavier). Don't know if it will be quieter in your frequency range--but it may be worth a try.

With all of the different brands out there, is it probably worth your time and money to experiment with a couple different manufacturers and sizes to see how they play in your place.

It is possible that the wiring in your place may affect their emissions too (I have knob and tube wiring--so conducted radiation from the CFL lamp is probably much worse).

If you are having RFI problems in the ~30-200 MHz range, using Ferrite bead filters on the AC wires to the lamps may help too.

For energy savings, CFL's are just too good a bet to miss.

-Bill

[Sub_Umbra]

Thanks guys.

[RebelRAM]

Well I have upgraded my garage with the spiral bulbs. Got the the 23W/100W equivalent. I must say things are much brighter and whiter. I went with the Sylvania brand this time. On the package it said not to use in enclosed light fixtures. But the only drawback I could find to that is that the package indicates it could shorten bulb life. I suspect that's because it restricts heat dissapation. But these spiral bulbs have to generate much less heat than the old 60W bulbs I had in there. In any case, we'll see how long it lasts. I can finally see what I am working on in my garage now.

[evan9162]

I bought a 2-pack of GE 23W spirals. One of them was in a normal room lamp (upright), and the other, in a large recessed ceiling fixture (upside-down). The upside-down mounted one died within a few weeks of usage in the recessed fixture - it was left on for long periods of time.

The other is now outside in a photocell-controlled streetlamp. Obviously, this controller is the kind that works with CFL bulbs okay, since it's been running for over a year now. Since it's on for an average of 6 hours per night, it's got over 2000 hours on it outside, and hasn't had a problem.

I'd say it's wise to heed the warnings about enclosed/recessed/upside-down fixtures.

It seems that all of the Commercial Electric brand CFLs (sold at the Home Depot) are fine in enclosed/recessed/upside-down fixtures. I have quite a few of them, and haven't had any problems yet.

[Sub_Umbra]

This is a great thread. I think you guys have saved me some money...

Thanks

[jayflash]

True Value is/was selling the "Green Lights" brand (China) for $2 after rebate. I picked some up to compare with the GE's that I'm usually forced to use (see Biax thread). So far, so good. Although only a couple thousand hours have passed, they are outputting a very nice, white, light. I believe their color temperature is 2700 deg. Kelvin.

IMHO, just like with some LED flashlights, the regulator/drive circuitry is the weak link.

[turbodog]

I have about 40 to 60 used warm white cf bulbs f/s or f/t. They are commercial electric and/or lights of america. They are about 16 months old. If you are interested, EMAIL me. I am selling them because the light they put out is the same color as the paint inside my house. It really makes things look drab. We replaced them all with some 4100/cool white units.

I had about a 10% failure on these guys within 1 week. I bundled all the bad ones up and returned them to home depot. After that, I have only had them go bad in enclosed fixtures that stay on a lot. So there seems to be something to the "heat" issue.

[cy]

my entire house is changed over to CF. seldom do I get a CF bulb to last over 2 years. still worth the trouble to convert

[Lynx_Arc]

I like the little 13-15watt CFL lamps that are rated at 60watts equiv. They fit in almost everything and you can leave them running all night without any guilt. I have a little 3watt and a 1.6watt tube fluoros as nightlights one turns off when the sun comes up the other stays on 24/7 as my roommate isn't a flashaholic.

[RebelRAM]

That's something I don't quite understand yet. If these CFL's are using less watts, then they put out less heat than a standard bulb. So why is it they have problems when in an enclosed fixture? Mine in my garage are in enclosed fixtures. We'll see how long they last. If they don't last long enough to satisfy me, I'll change the fixtures to an open style. If anything this is definitely an interesting experiment and I am satisfied with the results so far!

[Lynx_Arc]

Most likely the problem is with the ballast circuit. They probably design it with not enough headroom to tolerate poor heat dissapation of an enclosed fixture on some of the cheaper brands. Like when you put a smaller walwart on an item expecting a bigger one and it heats up more.

[The_LED_Museum]

I had a CFL go out rather spectacularly not that many weeks ago; I believe it was a Fieldbreeze brand. It was used base-up in a ceiling fixture with no cover or shade; it went out with some very acrid-smelling smoke. I replaced it with another CFL, and that one went out within a week or two (no smoke or odour but it still went out) - now there's an incandescent light blub in that fixture. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jpshakehead.gif[/img] I do have a violet LED bulb in the other receptacle in this fixture, so it isn't a total loss. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[yuandrew]

I'm having good luck with some of the cheap Chinese brands (Top-Lite,Greenlight, and Sunpentown) as well as some more major brands like LOA, Maxlite and GE.

One of my GE bulbs however failed after a few weeks of use though but a quick tap near the base of the tube got it to light up again. Probably one of the filiment/electrodes are loose.

My lights of America bulb is already 8 years old and still running although the light output is around 3/4 of when it was new and the ends of the tubes are also turning black as well.

The chinese CFLs are about 1 or 2 years old. The Sunpentown CFL desk lamp is around 6 years old but the tube is turning black at the ends as well.

[PeLu]

I use them for a long time now and buy only Osram. Have not very good experiences with cheaper ones. The Osram seem to last forever, maybe even longer.
I usally buy the 23W which should be equivalent to 120-150W incandescent and have a built in two level switch.
They are also not harmed by switching and should last some 25-30 khours.
I also do have a few of these 85W ones, but do not use them .-)

[James S]

Craig, if you have a socket that eats CF bulbs it's almost certainly due to being corroded or loose. Have a look at the contacts in there and then get yourself a new socket from the hardware store and replace that one. I have had 2 separate lamps that ate expensive CF bulbs until I changed the socket and it has been on the same one ever since then.

The last few years I've been investing a lot of money into CF bulbs and now have just about everything that I want converted to them, running them.

I would not be in a hurry to buy a dozen of them. Buy one or 2 of several different brands and see which ones you like and which ones feel like crapola [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Use the light from them and see how you like it. The color of them varies greatly from brand to brand. In some places I like the warmer color and in other places I like the bright white (but in no place do I like the commercial electric "daylight" bulbs which might be daylight from some star, but not ours)

But it would be a shame to buy a whole box of something only' to find that you dont like the light from it.

I have had very good luck with the low wattage ones from just about anybody. the higher wattage though, 100 watt equivalent or better and you better buy a brand name or more expensive bulb as the cheap ones seem to run closer to the rated values of the ballast and for me at least tend to die much sooner. Also some brands startup VERY dim and others just pop on at a nice brightness and then get even better. So experimenting with the different brands is important.

I'm one of those who is not buying any more lights of america branded ones. Though it's been a while since I've gotten any and they might have tightened things up, their quality control has been very spotty at best with the ones I have. I have some that were in service daily for the last 6 years which only gave out in the last month or so. And I had others that died in the first week or shortly thereafter.

I've also had problems with name brand ones too, keep the packaging and return bulbs that die in the first week or so. They are defective. I have a 100 watt panasonic one here right now that in a base up setting actually ARCS internally betwteen the electrodes while warming up! And I have another 75 watt of commercial electric that has burned a channel between the 2 electrodes through the plastic from arcing as well. Let me take a pict [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]




So it's good to experiment and find the ones you like that work for you! This bulb in those pictures was buzzing and actually smoking as it arced through the plastic there. But it never went out, and still lights if I have the guts to turn it on...

[eluminator]

I've been using these things for 5 years or so. I've had good luck. It seems most have lasted at least 3 or 4 years. I also avoid the Lights of America ones. Most of the ones I'm using now are GE 60 watt equivalent bulbs that I got on sale at Walmart. 8 of them for $12.

I haven't bought an incandescent bulb in 15 years. I've used the circular fluorescents and I've used the straight tubes of various sizes. Buying incandescents just seems like a bad idea to me. I know they will burn out soon, and throw off a lot of heat in the meantime.

None of my fluorescents interfere with AM radio reception. Light dimmers and thunderstorms do that. Where's the FCC when you need it? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[PhotonWrangler]

Craig, it sounds like you either have an intermittent light socket or noisy power. Two CFLs in a row sounds like there's something external to the lamp that's causing the preemie failures.