Malkoff M61 / M61N as Do-it-all lights

To me, there's really not a noticeable difference between low on an M61 vs an M91, given the same voltage/number of cells.

Is it a known phenomenon that M61 219b drop-ins have a ring around the outer spill beam in the VME head? I have a couple of these that all do it. Perfectly smooth, artifact-free beams in Surefire heads, but a ring in the VME head.

I suspect it's because of the narrow opening on the VME. Does the MDX head also do this? Does this happen with the SST-20 drop-ins, or just 219b?

SST-20 in the MDX head is a perfect, artifact free beam. FWIW, I've had that LED in a VME via M61N, as well a MDC head. To my memory, they all had that perfect white wall beam pattern. All the same reflector - no?

I've never seen the Malkoff 219b.

I understand these lights use a McGizmo designed reflector. I recently received a fancy light that runs a MCR-18, and I find the spill/hot spot very similar to the Malkoff reflector.

The only advantage of the M61 over M91 that I can see is cri and that they were designed to run on 2 primaries, whereas the M91 is best on 2 li-ions or 4 primaries. M91 is also fine on one primary but 2 or 3 is a bad idea.

ledbetter said:

The only advantage of the M61 over M91 that I can see is cri and that they were designed to run on 2 primaries, whereas the M91 is best on 2 li-ions or 4 primaries. M91 is also fine on one primary but 2 or 3 is a bad idea.

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I am a little crossed up on chemistry for the m91b….

Taking one step back, I like lights that run on rechargeable batteries every day, but can run in primary cells in a pinch/emergency.

With that, I recall the M91B to have a range of 5.5-12V. Obviously, 2 fully charged li-ion lands me around 8.4, and that is close enough to the 9v rating from the specs. 2xcr123 would be my "in a pinch" option, but comment above advised against 2x123.

I also thought I've ready about this driver used w/ 1x18650 in a MD2, and 2xAA (in a MD3 body).

Again, I have the hi/lo ring installed. Are these out of spec voltages for low only?

ledbetter said:

The only advantage of the M61 over M91 that I can see is cri and that they were designed to run on 2 primaries, whereas the M91 is best on 2 li-ions or 4 primaries. M91 is also fine on one primary but 2 or 3 is a bad idea.

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Well 2 primary cells can be bad as it draws more from the cells then is recommended. 3 is fine.

Duster1671 said:

Is it a known phenomenon that M61 219b drop-ins have a ring around the outer spill beam in the VME head? I have a couple of these that all do it. Perfectly smooth, artifact-free beams in Surefire heads, but a ring in the VME head.

I suspect it's because of the narrow opening on the VME. Does the MDX head also do this? Does this happen with the SST-20 drop-ins, or just 219b?

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Yes, it is a known phenomenon, just with Nichia drop-ins. I only run Nichia drop-ins in Surefire or Surefire clone heads for that reason. The same rings appear in the 16.5mm MD(X) heads and the 22.3mm head improves on that due to the wider opening, but still has some ringy-ness.

The SST-20 drop-in beam looks as good or better than XP-G(2) drop-ins in all the Malkoff heads, and is a much better choice for high CRI in a Malkoff, IMO.

@NutSAK - Interesting, thanks for the insight. I have an SST-20 in a MDC head and it makes a very nice beam. Almost identical to the 219b (in SF head) just a little more green.

I wonder if the opening on the VME head could be widened enough to make the ring go away. It looks like there's nearly .100" of material on the diameter before reaching the gasket.

Edit: oh, well the VME head couldn't be widened more than 22.3mm, so I guess that idea is out.

Duster1671 said:

@NutSAK - Interesting, thanks for the insight. I have an SST-20 in a MDC head and it makes a very nice beam. Almost identical to the 219b (in SF head) just a little more green.

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It's green compared directly to the rosy Nichia, I suppose. I carry a M61NL SST-20 in a VME head every day, and I don't detect any green in use. It looks pretty much just like the M61NL XP-G2 I used to carry in the same host, just with noticeably higher CRI. It is possible that mine is from a different tint bin than yours, however.

Yes, these LEDs all pretty much just look white in use. The differences are exaggerated when I look at two next to each other.

My SST-20 MDC head measures a duv of 0.0018 on high and 0.0035 on medium and low. It's objectively green, but close enough to neutral to not really matter.

timbo114 said:

Buy this host and this drop in.
You'll have a complete light with lo- med- hi by pressing the switch button- without turning the head.
Don't forget to sign up for 20% discount off your 1st order.

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Ummm... I may have been a bit greedy. In addition to this (I think I opted for the N version though), I also got a MDX22.3-M91T head with high/low and a MD3 body and tailcap. 20% off had something to do with it as well. Now, what kind and how many batteries do I need to be accumulating? It sounds as though a wide variety are possible.
https://malkoffdevices.com/products/m91t-md3?_pos=1&_sid=b35172bb0&_ss=r

PoliceScannerMan said:

Here it is:

M61N, M61NL, and M61NLL Drop-in to fit Surefire and Malkoff – Malkoff Devices

This is the Malkoff Devices P60 style M61N (neutral) Drop-in LED Upgrade Conversion with solid brass heatsink construction. The LED is a Neutral White (4000K 95 CRI) Luminous SST-20. MODULE APPROX OUTPUT at 6V APPROX CURRENT DRAW at 6V APPROX DISTANCE at 6V APPROX RUNTIME on 2x CR123...

malkoffdevices.com

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If I knew he was using that emitter now in that drop in, I would have skipped the MDC head.

Just got a M61N SST-20 and compared to my XP-G2 it is no where near as bright on the same cells. I'll have to do a draw test but hotspot and spill are much less then my previous M61N.Anyone else noticed this?

My MDC 4000K 375 lumen high looks a little whiter and brighter than my 400 lumen XP-G2 M61N. Guess I'm glad I got this head after all.

thermal guy said:

Just got a M61N SST-20 and compared to my XP-G2 it is no where near as bright on the same cells. I'll have to do a draw test but hotspot and spill are much less then my previous M61N.Anyone else noticed this?

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With the SST-20, so far I only have an M61NL drop-in. When I compare that to the two XP-G2 M61NL drop-ins I have, I get the following results on a fully-charged 18650:

• M61NL XP-G2 #1 - 350mA
• M61NL XP-G2 #2 - 280mA
• M61NL SST-20 - 330mA

Visually, the SST-20 @330mA is identical in output to the XP-G2 #2 @280mA. The XP-G2 #1 @350mA is slightly brighter than both of them. It seems that the SST-20 is less efficient at these levels, but not by much. Hopefully you'll see a similar result from your current draw test.

Sst-20 is definitely a different beam from xpg2, but i only have it in m61nl and aa. I like it a lot at those levels. Upgrade over Nichia imho.

I also thought xpg2 in all the Malkoff heads was an awesome all around performer, but with the addition of M91b for higher voltages and the sst20 for the lower, it got squeezed out of contention. Nice to have choices!

ledbetter said:

Sst-20 is definitely a different beam from xpg2

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As I was comparing the XP-G2 #2 and SST-20 beams side-by-side for the comparison above, I was thinking how someone could swap the two lights around on me and I wouldn't be able to tell the difference...until I shined them both at something colorful. The beam profile and tint are nearly identical between my samples, but the SST-20 has clearly superior color rendering.

So took my old M61N and new SST-20 outside and my old one is noticeably brighter. No question. The SST is drawing 750@6 volts so close to spec but my older one is drawing 1A. Looks like maybe I have a overachiever old style.

My last suriving Malkoff Surefire module is an M61N proudly sitting in a Surefire forend on a Remington 870. Not sure if it's engraved or labelled, I'll hafta check.

I was going to say that was my only Malkoff module, but I almost forgot I have one of Gene's discontinued Maglite modules, the funky 4-NiMH D-cell unit that is happily running on a single 26650.

thermal guy said:

So took my old M61N and new SST-20 outside and my old one is noticeably brighter. No question. The SST is drawing 750@6 volts so close to spec but my older one is drawing 1A. Looks like maybe I have a overachiever old style.

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As a reference point, my M61N sst20 pulled [email protected]