2024 olympics

[iacchus]

If they have the equipment, that's what counts.
Sadly, for some, it doesn't work. But they do still have it.

Bring in the doctors, and modern-day medical equipment.
Heck, hundreds of years ago there were medical exams being performed on human-beings that could settle the issue of gender.

Ye, a lot of those tests are against the rules now, though. Seems that folks were taking advantage, as people tend to do.

 

[Monocrom]

Can't beat modern-day medical equipment.

Another example is what a hospital did after finding out that a comatose patient who was under their care for years, came up pregnant. They tested all Male staff members and all transgender members who were born biological males. They did not bother testing any of the biological females who worked at the hospital, for obvious reasons.

 

[wacbzz]

If a male athlete is found to have unusually high levels of testosterone, that is considered a PED or a type of doping,
and will have their medal taken away.
>> US cyclist Floyd Landis was stripped of his 2006 Tour de France title for that exact reason.

For FULL disclosure, Floyd Landis admitted openly in 2010 that he was doping almost his entire career.

Landis admits to doping, accuses Lance, others

Nearly four years after he began waging a battle to discredit his positive test for synthetic testosterone at the 2006 Tour de France, Floyd Landis told ESPN.com Wednesday that he used performance-enhancing drugs for most of his career.

www.espn.com

 

[Fuzzywuzzies]

People with intersex conditions tend to be mostly sterile. In the case of those with XY chromosomes and androgen insensitivity syndrome, they are a bit on a spectrum with complete androgen insensitivity syndrome showing outwardly as attractive women but with internal gonads producing testosterone which all gets converted to estrogen. They do not have a uterus so cannot bear children. Treat these people with compassion and consider them as women despite them not having a womb. These people I have no problem competing in women's sports.

Those with partial androgen insensitivity syndrome can look somewhere between male and female and may or may not have their privates operated on when they are young to look more male or female. They may have an advantage in sports for women as their testosterone levels will fall somewhere between male and female ranges that may let them develop muscles larger than most women. These should be decided on a case by case basis.

Then there is mild androgen insensitivity syndrome, Kennedy disease, and mildest androgen insensitivities linked to prostate cancer. Consider these men. Kennedy's disease patients likely won't compete, or those with prostate cancer.

Then there's Klinefelter syndrome or those with XXY or other weird combination chromosomes. Let them compete in anything they want in the Special Olympics.

Women with congenital adrenal hyperplasia should not compete in women's sports because they will be producing excessive amounts of testosterone due to their condition that may give them an edge competing against other women.

There's maybe thirty or so disorders of sexual dysfunction, but these are likely the ones to deal with. You can't deal with them all with a rule for just hormones. You need to consider hormones, genitalia, chromosomes, and advantages vs. disadvantages their condition has given them compared to other competitors.

For transgender people, they need to stay out of competition or compete with other transgender people. If you changed your sex so you could beat all the women, because you lost in men's sports, you should be disqualified.

Well said, sir.

 

[Buff]

So many say that men compete in mens events women in women's events isn't fair to transgender athletes. When is it ever fair for the women? The world seems to be putting women back into the irrelevant 2nd class human beings category?
And where are all the women's rights organizations? Crickets 🦗 🦗🦗
Too bad it's probably gonna take a death of one of these women to get action yet with the way things are going that still may not be enough?

 

[raggie33]

ive heard she sisnt trans if so thats sad poor women was just botn that way

 

[Buff]

I know and that needs sorting out i was just speaking to the men that become or say they are women just to advance their mediocre athletic careers at the expense of female athletes.
I will say this debate has gone well. I have learned other possibilities other than just the trans issues and i find myself smarter for it. Y'all no matter what side you fall into or someplace in the middle the respect i see for differing opinions is reassuring. 👍🏻

 

[Chauncey Gardener]

 

[raggie33]

if she is trans i rather be nice hey i admit im a moron. but i see sadness i feel it i rather be kind. im a huge mess but if i make some onel smile it a good day

 

[iacchus]

Simone Biles with another Gold. She is unstoppable. USA got gold and bronze in the women's vault

 

[Monocrom]

if she is trans i rather be nice hey i admit im a moron. but i see sadness i feel it i rather be kind. im a huge mess but if i make some onel smile it a good day

 

[riw777]

You can have a person with XY chromosomes and complete androgen insensitivity syndrome (they are immune to the effects of testosterone so it builds up high and all converts to estrogen). Let them compete in women's sports. They will likely look like a supermodel from all the estrogen and can't build large muscles. Consider them women.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have women with CAH, or congenital adrenal hyperplasia. If they survived up to the point where they can compete, their condition is being treated and their high cortisol levels convert to testosterone. They may identify as male or female. If they identify as male, let them compete against the men. They aren't going to get hurt. However, a woman with XX chromosomes with their high testosterone that can build large muscles from having CAH, unlike an XY chromosomed female with complete androgen insensitivity syndrome who can't build muscle, should not compete against women given a clear advantage.

You cannot base qualification on levels of testosterone. In both these cases, they will have high testosterone. Only one will have an advantage in sports by it. The other may have an edge in a beauty pageant. In these cases I would consider the person with XY chromosomes female and the one with XX chromosomes possibly male. Intersex is weird.

What's odd about this is everyone keeps saying "it could be" ... and "if this is true then" ...

The facts we know on the ground:

1. The organizing body for this event did not (apparently) do any testing
2. Two organizing bodies who tested this person said they have XY chromosomes and high testosterone levels
3. This person is taller than the (male) judge, and stands head and shoulders above any of the other competitors
4. This person has body hair similar to a man's, and doesn't shave it (legs, etc.) ... most females with this kind of body hair shave to achieve a more feminine look
5. There are pictures of this person in Algeria, a Muslim country where dress codes are strictly enforced, wearing male clothing, in public
6. This person's actions before the match appear to be very masculine (adjusting body parts a female does not have, not adjusting body parts a female does have, like most of the other women competitors).
7. This person hit an experienced female boxer so hard she gave up and cried.

This is, AFAIK, what we _know_.

All the bits about their possible being born this way or that is _speculation_. No-one has said "I saw their genitals, and they are female." No-one (that I know of) has said "I have proof from a doctor this person is female," or "they have this condition." It's all "gotcha, proved you wrong."

One thing that does upset me--the people treating the woman who "gave up" as some sort of idiot, someone who'd never been in the ring before, someone who'd never been hit. She's in the Olympics. She's been hit before. She's been in the ring before. She knows how hard other women hit. Progressives want to say "believe all women," but when she says "I've never been hit that hard before," we totally disregard her testimony and speculate about how to justify this situation.

We're so busy defending this person we are forgetting there was someone else in the ring. Someone who was badly hurt. We're forgetting about the women who have been physically disfigured or disabled, permanently, in other situations (apparently) similar to this.

So I don't buy the whole "this person might be ..." Prove it, and then prove why--even if they have such a condition--they should be in the ring hitting a woman in the face.

 

[raggie33]

Simone Biles with another Gold. She is unstoppable. USA got gold and bronze in the women's vault

i like her she is why i watch so tough omg ill be sad when the games r over

 

[knucklegary]

i like her she is why i watch so tough omg ill be sad when the games r over

Sunias Lee too, came back from two illnesses to compete again. She's first generation American from Laosan immigrants parents. Strong-willed young girl well deserving of her medals.

 

[Chauncey Gardener]

Well stated, @riw777!

Welcome to CPF.

 

[Fuzzywuzzies]

Well, I have watched this scenario - and the topic in this thread - from afar, and at this point all I have to say is:

"He who answers a matter before he hears it,
It is folly and shame to him." - Proverbs 18:13

Let's wait for, or properly obtain, all the necessary information before making a fair and careful decision.
Keep it good, fellas!

 

[bykfixer]

I went to high school with a gal who could beat the crap out of any boy. I know because I saw her do it on occasion when one would call her the name that ryhmes with spike. No eye gouging or kick in the crotch. Just straight jab jab jab kapow Mike Tyson style. "Timberrrrrr"....."thud".
Her fists looked like sledge hammer heads too. Now Dolly Parton would be envious of her upper chest area if you know what I mean. Plus it was at a time before all these modern changes began to take place.

Her brothers were awesome too but they said no way they'd get in the ring with their sister. One is a decorated Army Colonal and the other a State Police Officer.

That is not to defend what did or didn't take place at the bread and circuses show but to just point out that there are some really bad@$$ gals out there.

 

[desert.snake]

The Internet has started to recall this episode quite often

 

[alpg88]

I wonder how our twerking team is doing, I heard it is a sport now, anyone follows???

 

[raggie33]

im not sure what twearking is but if its that dance where they shake thereback side and all the women are above 40 id watch it god i need a life but i like shaking backsides