Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view - New pics added!

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
This is the first image I've seen of the Acebeam W50. I believe its a frame grab from a video on their FB page. Check out the cooling fan.

My first thought is that since its huge, does this mean that instead of a larger or more powerful laser excited phosphorus emitter they just changed the optics? Is the added throw due only to a larger better focused lense like a deeper reflector with LED?



20201218-213416.jpg

1lumen
 
Last edited:

DoctorMemory

Well-known member
CPF Supporter
Joined
Jan 11, 2020
Messages
178
Location
Dayton, Ohio
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

That is the same cooling fan they use on the X70.

I don't think you'll see any LEP lights above the w30's 1,450,000 candela sold to the public. Other makers will only sell more intense lights to law enforcement. It's really at the level where you could blind someone, getting to Class 3B laser power making it to your retina.
 

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

Nice, but the W50 is not for public distribution.

I'm not sure what this means. Does it mean Acebeam will not be making it available to non-military and police departments?

Does it just mean the pics or video is private for now until it officially comes out?

That is the same cooling fan they use on the X70.

I don't think you'll see any LEP lights above the w30's 1,450,000 candela sold to the public. Other makers will only sell more intense lights to law enforcement. It's really at the level where you could blind someone, getting to Class 3B laser power making it to your retina.

Hmm. I've seen used military lights for sale in gun stores. Its not illegal to buy one.

That does not look like it is designed for military use. - not for combat operations at the very least. It doesn't look like it's weapons or vehicle mountable for starters and the handle and little fan are far too flimsy. The buttons are tiny...
 
Last edited:

PolarLi

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
418
Location
Norway
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

That is the same cooling fan they use on the X70.

I don't think you'll see any LEP lights above the w30's 1,450,000 candela sold to the public. Other makers will only sell more intense lights to law enforcement. It's really at the level where you could blind someone, getting to Class 3B laser power making it to your retina.

The candela alone isn't an issue at these levels, you for instance have the Maxabeam with 12 Mcd that has been on the open market for decades. The laser part on the other hand can be a problem many places due to mostly old regulations that hasn't been updated to allow for the LEP technology.

Edit, I would also like to remind everyone that "only available to law enforcement" (or military) has been a classic and very popular way to create buzz and market your product for when it "magically" becomes available to the public after all... :whistle:
 
Last edited:

twistedraven

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
1,749
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

My first thought is that since its huge, does this mean that instead of a larger or more powerful laser excited phosphorus emitter they just changed the optics? Is the added throw due only to a larger better focused lense or deeper reflector?

The more robust cooling solution with larger battery pack makes me think otherwise. Not too much larger optic, but substantially more powerful laser.
 

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

The more robust cooling solution with larger battery pack makes me think otherwise. Not too much larger optic, but substantially more powerful laser.

Interesting. I was thinking that it behaved like an LED - deeper reflector resulting in more lux and subsequent heat.

If it is a more powerful laser, is it possible that what other posters have mentioned is true - that the laws governing lasers haven't yet made an exception for LEP technology and so because of a stronger laser the W50 is facing regulatory hurdles?
 

Magio

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 30, 2016
Messages
240
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

Interesting. I was thinking that it behaved like an LED - deeper reflector resulting in more lux and subsequent heat.

I don't know how the W50 is made but all the other LEP lights out there do not use a reflector.
 

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

I don't know how the W50 is made but all the other LEP lights out there do not use a reflector.

More LUX, larger beam, more heat - using a reflector TIR lense or other optics. I'm asking if here its achieved via something other than a stronger laser. Mackey?
 

DoctorMemory

Well-known member
CPF Supporter
Joined
Jan 11, 2020
Messages
178
Location
Dayton, Ohio
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

Hmm. I've seen used military lights for sale in gun stores. Its not illegal to buy one.

No legalities involved. The w50 is simply intense enough to permanently blind someone when flashed into their eyes. The maker of it and two other high-powered LEP lights will only sell with a letter from a police department or the like. They basically don't want to be sued by everyone blinded by one.
 

DoctorMemory

Well-known member
CPF Supporter
Joined
Jan 11, 2020
Messages
178
Location
Dayton, Ohio
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

The candela alone isn't an issue at these levels, you for instance have the Maxabeam with 12 Mcd that has been on the open market for decades. The laser part on the other hand can be a problem many places due to mostly old regulations that hasn't been updated to allow for the LEP technology.

From https://www.peakbeam.com/resources/faq/

ANSI Risk Group 3. Warning.
Visible and infrared radiation emitted from this searchlight.
Permanent eye damage can result. Avoid direct exposure to the beam.
Do not look directly into the searchlight beam. Exposure of the eye to either the direct searchlight beam or a beam reflected from a flat mirror-like surface can cause permanent eye injury to the unprotected eye. Follow the same precaution even when an Infrared Filter is installed on the searchlight.

The Maxabeam will blind you. The W50 will blind you. They have the cajones to sell to the public, they are cruisin for a brusin.
 

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

No legalities involved. The w50 is simply intense enough to permanently blind someone when flashed into their eyes. The maker of it and two other high-powered LEP lights will only sell with a letter from a police department or the like. They basically don't want to be sued by everyone blinded by one.

Do you think this was their original plan for this model?

I'm not sure what use a police department would have for this outside of maybe long range search and rescue. As I mentioned earlier, it doesnt look like it's designed for tactical or military use. In a tactical situation like a raid the same issue - that it might accidentally blind someone, applies. Police departments are sued a lot.

It doesn't look like it would really withstand any military applications either. It's carrying function is via a shoulder strap. The smallish control buttons are located in the front towards the bezel. There is no form integrated vehicle or weapons mounting capability. The lens and bezel are probably (LEP style) fixed making replacement in the field impossible. The cooling fan would likely not withstand forcible impact. In other words it would need to be built to mil spec.

If this is indeed true that John Q Public won't have an easy way to purchase one, then who will?
 
Last edited:

PolarLi

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
418
Location
Norway
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

The Maxabeam will blind you. The W50 will blind you. They have the cajones to sell to the public, they are cruisin for a brusin.

The sun will blind you too. Doesn't come with warnings labels. Here is the thing, it all boils down to distance, and it doesn't take much distance at these levels either. A "measly" 1 Mcd light at 1 meter distance, is MORE intense (more lux) than a 12 Mcd light at 3.5 meter. To neutralize the difference between a 1 Mcd and 2 Mcd light, you only need 41 cm or 16"

Permanent eye damage can result. Avoid direct exposure to the beam.

Key words are "can" and "avoid"
 
Last edited:

DoctorMemory

Well-known member
CPF Supporter
Joined
Jan 11, 2020
Messages
178
Location
Dayton, Ohio
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

THere is the thing, it all boils down to distance,

True. There is a significant difference in degradation with distance between lights like the Maxabeam and any LEP light. They measured their 12 Mcd value by focusing the beam as tight as it goes and then measuring the candlepower right at the light. Even on the tightest beam it will quickly spread with distance. You could be blinded with it set for a tight beam and sticking your eye right at the light. But shine it on people 50' away and the intensity has dropped way off, even with a tight (for it) beam divergence.

LEP lights have very low angles of beam spread. The distance is not as big of a factor when you have a beam that diverges at 1.8°. A small distance may diverge the Maxabeam to a safe intensity, but the same is not true for an LEP. LEP lights brighter than the W30 can cause eye damage at great distance. It really starts to act like a laser's coherent beam, distance no longer provides safety.

BMW offers a single LEP high-beam headlight option, but it is heavily interlocked to only shine when the car senses their is no opposing traffic.

This is beginning to wander as threads do. ;)

The question was would the W50 be offered to the public, and if not, why? I have pointed out that the beam intensity (even at distance) has become dangerous. They and two other makers of higher intensity LEP lights I know require a letter on department letterhead requesting the purchase (just like is required for the top level OC/CS teargas purchases). And they do this because the lights can rather easily blind someone and they don't want the lawsuits. No laws against it, just lawyers.:cool: And, yes, this is the plan for these brighter LEPs, for LE sales from the three makers I know of.

Could you get one if you really wanted it? Yes. But I once purchased a 5 Watt blue laser, complete with safety glasses. I tried it out a few times, saw how far it would reach out. But I realized just how bad an idea of flashing it around outdoors was; it now sits in its case. I think you'd find the same lack of usefulness with a really bright LEP light. You really want to shine anything around in public that can blind people?

BTW, also a W40. https://1lumen.com/wp-content/uploads/acebeam-new-flashlights-2020.jpg
 
Last edited:

DoctorMemory

Well-known member
CPF Supporter
Joined
Jan 11, 2020
Messages
178
Location
Dayton, Ohio
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

This page is current:
LED & Laser Classification
An overview of the LED & Laser Classification System in EN 60825-1 and IEC 60825-1


In 2001 the standard governing the safety of laser products in Europe (EN) and Internationally (IEC), was substantially revised and the Classification system was overhauled. This resulted in the introduction of three new laser classes (1M, 2M and 3R) and the abolition of Class 3A. Below is a brief description of each of the current laser classes.

The 60825-1 standards apply equally to lasers and LEDs. In most places we have used the word “laser”, but it can be replaced by “LED”. Generally speaking LEDs would be in the lower Classes (1, 1M, 2, 2M, 3R), but very exceptionally may be Class 3B. At the time of writing we are not aware of any Class 4 LEDs*.

(more) https://www.lasermet.com/resources/...ication-system-in-en-60825-1-and-iec-60825-1/


These bright LED lights fall under the same classifications as lasers. Doesn't matter if the light is coherent, how much will get to your eyeball and pupil.

Acebeam uses this classification for the W30: FDA/CE/RoHS/EN60825-1/CLASS 2M:

If they were to determine the brighter lights actaully met the Class 3 (was 3B) laser standards then they would fall under the same restrictions that Class 3 lasers have (which are rarely enforced anymore).
 
Last edited:

Magio

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 30, 2016
Messages
240
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

True. There is a significant difference in degradation with distance between lights like the Maxabeam and any LEP light. They measured their 12 Mcd value by focusing the beam as tight as it goes and then measuring the candlepower right at the light. Even on the tightest beam it will quickly spread with distance. You could be blinded with it set for a tight beam and sticking your eye right at the light. But shine it on people 50' away and the intensity has dropped way off, even with a tight (for it) beam divergence.

LEP lights have very low angles of beam spread. The distance is not as big of a factor when you have a beam that diverges at 1.8°. A small distance may diverge the Maxabeam to a safe intensity, but the same is not true for an LEP. LEP lights brighter than the W30 can cause eye damage at great distance. It really starts to act like a laser's coherent beam, distance no longer provides safety.

BMW offers a single LEP high-beam headlight option, but it is heavily interlocked to only shine when the car senses their is no opposing traffic.

This is beginning to wander as threads do. ;)

The question was would the W50 be offered to the public, and if not, why? I have pointed out that the beam intensity (even at distance) has become dangerous. They and two other makers of higher intensity LEP lights I know require a letter on department letterhead requesting the purchase (just like is required for the top level OC/CS teargas purchases). And they do this because the lights can rather easily blind someone and they don't want the lawsuits. No laws against it, just lawyers.:cool: And, yes, this is the plan for these brighter LEPs, for LE sales from the three makers I know of.

Could you get one if you really wanted it? Yes. But I once purchased a 5 Watt blue laser, complete with safety glasses. I tried it out a few times, saw how far it would reach out. But I realized just how bad an idea of flashing it around outdoors was; it now sits in its case. I think you'd find the same lack of usefulness with a really bright LEP light. You really want to shine anything around in public that can blind people?

BTW, also a W40. https://1lumen.com/wp-content/uploads/acebeam-new-flashlights-2020.jpg

I don't know where you got your specs from but they are wrong. The Maxabeam has a minimum beam angle of 1 degree, nearly half that of the W30. On top of this the Maxabeam is about 2 to three times as bright as the brightest currently available LEPs at around 1500 lumens. So with half the beam width and 3 times the output, the chance of eye damage from accidental exposure is way way higher with the Maxabeam Vs any currently available LEP.
 

PolarLi

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
418
Location
Norway
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

There is a significant difference in degradation with distance between lights like the Maxabeam and any LEP light.
No. Lux is lux, in fact, a typical reflector light will "benefit" from distance. But that belong to the more technical aspects of the subject.

They measured their 12 Mcd value by focusing the beam as tight as it goes and then measuring the candlepower right at the light.

No, they measure it at 25 meters: https://www.peakbeam.com/resources/faq/ If they measured right at the light they would get less than 12 Mcd, but again, technical stuff.

LEP lights have very low angles of beam spread. The distance is not as big of a factor when you have a beam that diverges at 1.8°

Distance has the same effect on a 0.1 degree beam as on a 100 degree beam. Read up on the inverse square law.
 

kolchak

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
45
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

I wonder if the W40 and W50 step down like Acebeam's 'publically available' lights do (and the W30 did.) I have and use an Acebeam K30GT quite a bit - best in its size - but I asked Vinh to change the driver so I can run it in turbo for as long as I want and that makes a huge difference.
 

ScaryFatKidGT

Well-known member
Joined
May 19, 2011
Messages
906
Re: Acebeam W50 LEP flashlight first view

Nice, but the W50 is not for public distribution.
So how do we get one? ;)

That is the same cooling fan they use on the X70.

I don't think you'll see any LEP lights above the w30's 1,450,000 candela sold to the public. Other makers will only sell more intense lights to law enforcement. It's really at the level where you could blind someone, getting to Class 3B laser power making it to your retina.
Yeah reflected LED lights are hitting 2 million Lux, they are a lot larger but same thing and no warnings.

The candela alone isn't an issue at these levels, you for instance have the Maxabeam with 12 Mcd that has been on the open market for decades. The laser part on the other hand can be a problem many places due to mostly old regulations that hasn't been updated to allow for the LEP technology.

Edit, I would also like to remind everyone that "only available to law enforcement" (or military) has been a classic and very popular way to create buzz and market your product for when it "magically" becomes available to the public after all... :whistle:
Yeah I how new standards are made
 
Top