Attempting my first drop-in

[hellokitty[hk]]

Hello everyone, I think now is a good time for me to start planning to build a flashlight.
Firstly, I want to build the light myself, as much as possible. My budget is flexible, but as far as I can see, it will be <$70 USD.

Here is my rough outline:

• Solarforce L2 with tailstanding forward clicky from solarforce-sales
• UCL lens, though I've heard that KD's UCL lenses are decent and fit better, plus they have free shipping, so I would like to order from them if possible.
• Redilast protected 18650 2900mAh, I have an apache 1215 charger for LiPoly, but I'm going to assume that will work unless someone tells me otherwise.
• XM-L (more on this later).
• SB 2.8A driver.
• I already have 24 gauge wires from illumination supply.
• I also picked up a foot of 12mm copper wire from illumination supply; I assume this is for wrapping the p60 reflector.
• I have an OP reflector and brass pill from illumination supply.

Now some details...please bear with me for a moment 🙂
KD's search function (IMO) is terrible, and their site is disorganized, if someone could post an item number for the lens I'm looking for, it would be very much appreciated. Right now I'm looking at SKU S004329 and SKU S008213 , but I'm really not sure especially with KD's poor labeling and such.

I hear that neutral white XM-L's may be coming out this month, so I won't actually be buying the LED for a few weeks, but I'd like to post this thread and get things sorted out already. Also, I've heard that cutter's MCPCB's are poor, and that DX's are actually pretty decent, but I can't say I trust their LED's, so I don't know where I can get XM-L's on good 14mm stars. Maybe I won't even use a star, but that sounds like it could be troublesome. I have arctic silver thermal epoxy.

My understanding is that I need an insulation ring of sorts to prevent the aluminum reflector from shorting is that correct? I read on a thread that sticking to pieces of kapton together and cutting a hole for the emitter is a nice solution but I'll ask anyway.

Is there anything else that I am missing?
How about thermal transfer...I want it to be able to maintain as much output as possible for as long as possible, so if there is anything else I can feasibly do. One last thing, has anyone tried using the copper tape? It seems to me that you might be able to mold and fit aluminum foil or something better than that copper tape, but I am the noob here.


My warmest thanks to everyone on this forum; the people here have provided fantastic help and show the utmost dedication.

EDIT: I remember someone said they might be able to provide a copper pill for me, but I can't say who since it was lost in that mess.

 

[PCC]

First of all, you'll need a 14mm MCPCB because the 16mm ones will be too large to fit the brass pill. Secondly, the P60 kit you got from Illumination Supply will require a pill that has 26TPI threads instead of the more common 1M threads (25.4TPI). A pill with 1M threads will thread onto the reflector, but, it will not thread on easily. The brass pill that comes with the kit is threaded 26TPI.

PM me about the copper pill.

It sounds like you're on the right track to putting together a nice little light. I would caution you to use the high mode on this light sparingly because of heat issues. A good option would be one of the finned 6P heads that are offered in the classifieds section, though one of those will cause you to over run your budget.

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

First of all, you'll need a 14mm MCPCB because the 16mm ones will be too large to fit the brass pill. Secondly, the P60 kit you got from Illumination Supply will require a pill that has 26TPI threads instead of the more common 1M threads (25.4TPI). A pill with 1M threads will thread onto the reflector, but, it will not thread on easily. The brass pill that comes with the kit is threaded 26TPI.

PM me about the copper pill.

It sounds like you're on the right track to putting together a nice little light. I would caution you to use the high mode on this light sparingly because of heat issues. A good option would be one of the finned 6P heads that are offered in the classifieds section, though one of those will cause you to over run your budget.

Fixed the star size.
I will be cautious about heat. I've gathered that if the light is too hot to handle comfortably, then it should be turned off, but that sounds quite general, and will also depend on your thermal path right?
I have seen some finned heads, but yes they would be over-budget, and I think the L2 looks better aesthetically without fins.

 

[srfreddy]

Where did you hear about Cutter MCPCB;s?

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

Where did you hear about Cutter MCPCB;s?

Source for *good* MCPCBs for XM-Ls

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

It looks like I will not be using a copper pill, I'll just be using the standard copper pill.
Anyway, if there are any more suggestions/critiques.
Also, I thought that there would be 5000K or 5700K neutral XM-Ls out by now, can anyone tell me where to find them?

 

[srfreddy]

There was a preorder including 14mm MCPCB's on the marketplace from cutter-you should expect them end of marchish.

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

Another question...
What is the spring on the outside of the pill for?
I've watched videos of a p60 installed without the spring on it, and I can't think of any use for the spring.

 

[wantsusa]

Outside spring is useful especially on Solarforce L2P makes it fit nicely...don't think it would connect well without the spring. I believe Nailbender usually keeps a full spring for the L2P but for other setups it may need to be cut down or removed...I don't have a L2 so don't know how much it is needed for your setup

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

I've never done/seen this before, all I did was watch someone put a dropin into a surefire host.
In the video, there is no spring, and it looks like it wouldn't even fit if it had a spring on it, so I was wondering why there is a spring in the first place.

 

[Sgt. LED]

The space for the drop-in is bigger in some hosts. If the host has a wide or deep cavity then you have to use the spring to keep constant negative contact. Sometimes it's the *** end of the drop-in that's smaller than need be, same solution though.

 

[PCC]

On SureFire hosts the dimensions of the cavity that the drop-in sits in is a bit tighter than on, say, a Solarforce host. The Solarforce host is cut very generously in this area. The area that the reflector makes contact with the host is usually anodized so there isn't an electrical path there. On the SureFires the pill makes direct contact with the host in the throat area, most of the time, while with the Solarforce you use the spring for this purpose. If you use the spring with a SureFire host then the spring will not allow the drop-in to seat and there will be a gap between the bezel and the body. If you don't use a spring with a Solarforce host then, more than likely, you won't get negative contact and the light will not turn on. If you wrap the drop-in with copper tape to increase thermal contact then this should be sufficient electrical contact that a spring is not needed and the light will turn on.

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

Oh I see...thanks, that really was a newbie question.

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

Okay, I finally got it done.

There is a bit of a problem though, and it's annoying me a lot. Scroll to the bottom. Also, one roll of 12 inch copper tape was not enough, and (I have no affiliation, and I am not saying that illumination supply is a bad dealer) I believe that the tape is too small width wise too. IMO the 4mm copper tape that Shao has at Shaotech fits better.

Here it is:

All supplies ready.

Reflector, driver, copper heatsink, brass heatsink (unused), in order.

LED's.

Cleaned and shiny.

Nevermind, now all supplies are ready.

Stick the LED on using Arctic silver thermal epoxy.

Center LED (no, it's not centered in this picture).

Stick driver in.

Test fit leads.

Solder leads. Messy flux on the sides. It's 26 gauge 19 strand silver-plated copper wire with teflon insulation; this insulation did not melt.

Testing...didn't screw up yet.

Electrical tape to prevent shorting against the aluminum reflector.

Wrap the reflector in copper tape to keep it snug inside the body. More solid electrical connection, and much much better heat transfer to the body, and the outside air. I actually didn't have enough and wrapped it with aluminum foil too.

Stuff everything in, and the finished product compared to a standard, cheap 2D incandescent. Outdoor beamshots next.

Backyard, control shot with 2s shutter, 1600 ISO, auto white balance, Cannon T1i.

2D, 2s shutter, 1600 ISO, auto white balance, Cannon T1i.

My flashlight, same settings.

2s shutter, 800 ISO (I think).

Same settings.

1s shutter, 800 ISO (I think).

Same settings.

.5s 800 ISO (I think).

Same settings.

There's something wrong with the modes though.
It worked fine when I was testing it outside the body, but I only did that for a few minutes. It cycled right through the three modes. I noticed that the lowest mode had a slight whine, the medium mode had a strong whine, and the highest of course had no whine.
Once I put it in the light, the modes stopped working. It worked for a few minutes, then it would only output high. What's really weird is that I can still hear the whining if I cycle through, and it goes in the same order: low whine, high whine, no whine, repeat. There isn't a difference in brightness though, so I'm very confused.
I tried taking it out, it worked and cycled through the modes just fine. Memory worked too. I played with it a bit outside of the host to see if it'd mess up, but it's fine. I checked all the soldering around the stars, and they all look clean except the third one. I don't see any messed up contacts. The battery is in there tight enough. If I use a wire instead of the tail switch, it still has the problem. The head is stuck in there pretty good with the copper tape and aluminum foil, so I think it's getting solid contact. The driver is soldered to the pill nicely as well. It happens with both my batteries.
A few hours later, I dropped it from about one meter onto hard rock. A bit of a chip...🙁 But the driver started working perfectly!..?!?!
Cycled through all three modes, and I could still hear the soft whine from low, and loud whine on medium.
Worked like that for a while, but then high stopped working. It would switch to high for a split second, then step down to medium and continue cycling to low. I thought it was my batteries going low, but after a few minutes of me screwing around with switching modes, it started working again and it stayed on high for at least a good ten - fifteen minutes.
Later, it kept showing this problem intermittently. It also did this thing where it would stay on low, but flash once per second. I thought it was a connection problem at first, but it just sat there flashing regularly.
It's very sensitive to movement/bumps. Sometimes it'll bump and randomly switch modes if I set it down gently. I know it's not the battery failing to make contact because I've shaken it, and bumped it with much more force, and the battery is still connected.
At the moment, it's only staying on high right now, though I still hear the whine on medium and low.

Really confused 😕

 

[Norm]

:goodjob: Looking good

Moved to Homemade and Modified Flashlights Discussion - Norm

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

Eh, that mode thing is pissing me off though.........Sometimes it works properly if I bang it.

 

[glockxj]

Wrap the drop in with aluminum foil. Sounds like the drop in isnt getting good contact.

 

[hellokitty[hk]]

As I said, it's in there tight. I can't pull it out actually.
So, yeah, I'd rather not have to take it out, but if that will help fix the problem.

 

[Norm]

Are you using a large spring for the body contact?
Norm

 

[PCC]

Those drivers work by regulating the negative and shorting the negative gives you direct-drive, but, the driver still tries to do what it was intended on doing. Check the wire where it is soldered to the driver, it could be shorted there if the other end of the wire at the LED is fine. What might be happening is that the tail cap spring pressure is forcing the driver board forward into the back of the pill and causing the short.