Coffee: drip vs percolate vs...

[kwkarth]

Great photos!!! I do my roasting in a room that has an effective vent fan, or outside if above 60°F I enjoy the aroma of coffee roasting, so what doesn't get vented is fine.

Can't wait to get that kettle. Amazing that you can pick it up off that platform...they really went full out on designing that baby. First thing I'm gonna do is check the temps with my Fluke 189 probe just to see how close it really is.

I have verified several times that the water coming out of the Technivorm is between 199 - 204°F, but as it sits puddled in the plastic filter holder, it starts at 189°F and goes up to 197°F with lid on as plastic cone heats up. The hotplate keeps the caraffe at 170°F

Lux! Good morning!
I will have to find my temp probe and check the water temp too. The directions say they guarantee the temp +/- 5F.

When I have the kettle set to 200F and on hold, it seems to cycle at least once every minute or two to keep the water exactly where it wants it to be. Pretty cool!

My roasting area is in my workroom ( laboratory...muhahaha ) at the back of our garage. When I roast coffee, I actually just dump my exhaust into the garage from the work room. Occasionally, this results in a garage full of smoke, but my workroom remains relatively smoke free. If I have a garage door open, smoke never accumulates.

 

[tygger]

tygger,


When you taste coffee that is over extracted, it is VERY obvious.

Ah, yes, this has been a problem. I think I'll try a corser grind and pre-wetting the filter as js suggested. (I use the melitta filters) Thanks for all the suggestions everyone, I have some experiementing to do.

 

[LuxLuthor]

One other sign of those clever Dutch is they put a sliding switch on the Technivorm filter basket, allowing you to close or control opening of drain hole.

Now if they just included the babe on their opening page :kiss: with a custom home installation, I would be all set. (At least she winked at me)
I do wish there was a better way to maintain the 195-205°F water in the cone, but the flavor seems to be great despite my measurement. Only beef I do have with the TV is the little rubber stopper eventually stops making a complete shutoff seal, and if you want to get a replacement, Boyds Coffee will only sell you a complete cone for $6.08 + $9.95 shipping.

 

[js]

Lux,

I wouldn't worry about the first bit of water in the cone and the fact that your fluke measured a lower temp there.

On my TV brewer, 99 percent of the water that gets down to the pot is in the 195+ range (I measured it), and that is not a consequence of the heater plate there, as I insulted between the pot and the heater. Water has a serious specific heat, so if it starts at 195-200 at the nozzle, it will remain pretty damn close to that through the beans and into the carafe.

I have the same Fluke meter and temp probe as you, and if it gets the least bit of air in between water spurts, the temp will read lower than it really is. It reacts FAST to temperature changes, in other words, and there is some averaging built into the Fluke meter on the temp probe setting, so unless it's totally submerged for the length of your reading, you can't trust that it is really reporting the actual temperature of the water itself.

The Technivorm really does deliver water through the grounds that is at the correct temperature.

As for the rubber stopper, mine also leaked, so I just removed it. It forces me to totally remove the basket and filter and take care of it right away, BEFORE I drink my coffee--so I expect it will stay cleaner longer. And it means removing and replacing the carafe is easier due to less down pressure.

tygger,

What kwkarth said! I forgot to mention that the grind size and brewing method is critical for determining the extraction time. A coarser grind can stay in contact with the water for a lot longer before over-extracting. You definitely want to play with the grind size, the brewing time, and the amount of coffee. It always takes some tweaking, no matter how good and specific the advice (e.g. SM tip sheet for your exact setup).

 

[Diesel_Bomber]

Just tried cold brew. I'm not educated enough to describe what exactly about the flavor it is that I don't like...........but I don't like it. Well worth the experiment, but won't be brewing coffee that way again.

 

[kwkarth]

Lux! Good morning!
I will have to find my temp probe and check the water temp too. The directions say they guarantee the temp +/- 5F.

When I have the kettle set to 200F and on hold, it seems to cycle at least once every minute or two to keep the water exactly where it wants it to be. Pretty cool!

My roasting area is in my workroom ( laboratory...muhahaha ) at the back of our garage. When I roast coffee, I actually just dump my exhaust into the garage from the work room. Occasionally, this results in a garage full of smoke, but my workroom remains relatively smoke free. If I have a garage door open, smoke never accumulates.

Well folks, after living with it for the past few days, the Breville is growing on me.

Here are my observations so far;

Pro:

• It seems to be keeping water temp pretty consistent.
• It's quiet.
• Easy to fill.
• Easy to clean.
• Pretty fast to heat water.
• Nice preset temp. choices.
• Seems to have been built like a bank vault.

Con:

• Manufacturing is not flawless. (some ripples in the lathe turning)
• When you pick up the kettle and then replace it on the base, the keep warm mode needs to be reselected. (requires two button pushes)

 

[LuxLuthor]

Well folks, after living with it for the past few days, the Breville is growing on me.

Man it takes a long time to get something delivered by them. I finally got the UPS tracking Friday.

 

[prof]

Major coffee snob here. Love it. Use multiple methods depending on mood. Roast my own (of course). Sweet Marias is fantastic.


My mother occasionally uses my grandmother's old perc with lighter-roasted coffee. It's not bad but not my favorite either. Good memories however.

 

[cernobila]

Well I also picked up the Breville 820 from my local store and did not tell my wife about it till she went to make a cup of green tea........the reaction was....."what the hell is this?"....I pointed out all the features and after about two cups of tea and one cup of coffee, she said, "it actually makes a better drink, you done something right for a change and 🙂"

So now I have to get a decent glass/stainless steel French Press and a good old fashioned hand coffee grinder......then will come the bean selection and experimenting with the grinder....

 

[LuxLuthor]

Man it takes a long time to get something delivered by them. I finally got the UPS tracking Friday.

Got it today. Ya know how every once in a while you come across something that is so well made you are just taken back like seeing a work of art?
I knew I had something special when I saw a detail on one of the smallest aspects, namely the electric plug.

​

I have never seen anyone give thought to making an easier way to unplug a plug. Being able to put a finger in the hole to remove the plug is genius. The plug prongs were also covered by an accurately shaped plastic protector, vs. the generic prong covers.

The bottom of the heating plate actually has one of those cord wrap around spindles to hide unneeded lengths of cord--but this one REALLY works the way you wish they all did.

​

The next marvel was the push button to open the top lid. It is a soft push that actuates a hidden spring mechanism that has the lid FLOAT up and open like a hot knife through butter. I closed and opened it at least a dozen times just to appreciate their artful technology.

​

Even though you are only using plain water, they put a delicate metal mesh screen in the pour spout. They make it easy to remove by sliding out, and even the plastic holder that holds the screen is relatively easy to remove if you wanted to clean it.

​

First use, I filled it above the 1800 line...to 2 liters. It took exactly 9 mins to reach a full rolling boil, verified 212° F with my fluke in the spout. It beeps when reaching target button selected temp. The handle is secure, confortable, and totally insulated from the heat.

kwkarth, I can't thank you enough for this recommendation...and I haven't even used it for coffee or tea yet. Actually I can't remember the last time I drank tea, but this makes me want to try it again. This example of elegant engineering is what it must be like in heaven.

 

[NA8]

My old Krups machine. This is the famous model with the misleading "lock" labelling that caused some problems. People thought anywhere in the lock graphic area was ok. It actually needs to be all the way over. Got it cheap at Costco 😉

 

[kwkarth]

Got it today. Ya know how every once in a while you come across something that is so well made you are just taken back like seeing a work of art?
I knew I had something special when I saw a detail on one of the smallest aspects, namely the electric plug.

I have never seen anyone give thought to making an easier way to unplug a plug. Being able to put a finger in the hole to remove the plug is genius. The plug prongs were also covered by an accurately shaped plastic protector, vs. the generic prong covers.

The bottom of the heating plate actually has one of those cord wrap around spindles to hide unneeded lengths of cord--but this one REALLY works the way you wish they all did.

The next marvel was the push button to open the top lid. It is a soft push that actuates a hidden spring mechanism that has the lid FLOAT up and open like a hot knife through butter. I closed and opened it at least a dozen times just to appreciate their artful technology.

Even though you are only using plain water, they put a delicate metal mesh screen in the pour spout. They make it easy to remove by sliding out, and even the plastic holder that holds the screen is relatively easy to remove if you wanted to clean it.

First use, I filled it above the 1800 line...to 2 liters. It took exactly 9 mins to reach a full rolling boil, verified 212° F with my fluke in the spout. It beeps when reaching target button selected temp. The handle is secure, confortable, and totally insulated from the heat.

kwkarth, I can't thank you enough for this recommendation...and I haven't even used it for coffee or tea yet. Actually I can't remember the last time I drank tea, but this makes me want to try it again. This example of elegant engineering is what it must be like in heaven.

LOL! If you're anywhere near sea level, a rolling boil would be at 212F.
How does it measure at the lower temperatures?? How much temp. swing does it allow before turning itself on to reheat to the set temperature?

BTW, I'm glad you like the kettle! It's growing on me too. My wife had the same question as cernobila's wife when she first discovered the new kettle on the counter. After her initial surprise and exclaimation, she asked; "What are we going to do with the others we have?" To which I gave my standardized answer; "We'll give 'em to the kids." That always makes her happy. :tinfoil: :thumbsup:

She actually likes the kettle and has no trouble using it, though in her own way.

She has an apparent aversion to any sort of automation whether it's in the guise of a clothes dryer, automatic climate control in her car, or the new hot water kettle. Strangely enough, she does occasionally use the Nav in the car. I digress...

She sets the kettle for boil, even though she could select 200F, (for making drip coffee,) she hits the go button and stands there and watches it till it boils like mad, then snatches the kettle off it's base before the beeper, and pours. If I get to it first in the morning, which is the usual, I leave it to keep warm @ 200F so all she has to do is grab it and pour, but that makes no sense to her so she does it her way. :duck:

 

[LuxLuthor]

I enjoy your posts very much!

I'll do some more of those measurements. The booklet reports only a +/- 10° F accuracy tolerance, which I think is way too high, but we'll see.

I just did a liter at the 185° F setting, and it heated it to 184.4° F, then cycled on/off between 182.9° F back up to 184.8° F about every minute with lid open and me waving the Fluke probe in the water. It seemed to trigger heat cycle when it dropped to 183° F.

More importantly 1 Liter on the 200° F setting heated to 202.4° F in just under 5 mins, then when dropped to 198° F, triggered a heat pulse so temp stayed between 197.9° F to 202.8° F

Primo

 

[kwkarth]

I enjoy your posts very much!

I'll do some more of those measurements. The booklet reports only a +/- 10° F accuracy tolerance, which I think is way too high, but we'll see.

I just did a liter at the 185° F setting, and it heated it to 184.4° F, then cycled on/off between 182.9° F back up to 184.8° F about every minute with lid open and me waving the Fluke probe in the water. It seemed to trigger heat cycle when it dropped to 183° F.

More importantly 1 Liter on the 200° F setting heated to 202.4° F in just under 5 mins, then when dropped to 198° F, triggered a heat pulse so temp stayed between 197.9° F to 202.8° F

Primo

The booklet that came with mine said within 10 degrees, not plus or minus 10, so I interpreted that to mean +/- 5. I agree with you that +/-10 is waaaay too much lattitude. Your measurements look great. I am ecstatic with those numbers!

 

[kwkarth]

Well, I finally got around to hunting down the immersion temp probe.

When I had the kettle set to 175F, it shut off the heating element at 173.5F and then the temp coasted up to 176 or so.

When set to 185F, it shut off at 183.5F and coasted up to 186.

When set to 195F, it shut off at 193.5F and coasted up to 196.

When set to 200F, it shut off at 198F and coasted up to 199.5-200.

When set to 212, it shut off at 211 and coasted up to 212.

Can't get much better than that!
:twothumbs:

 

[LuxLuthor]

Yeah, I was very surprised that they said 10 degrees variability. I think they just want to make you feel good when you find it is more like 2-3.

I have never really bought good quality teas, but found those two samples that came with it interesting and enjoyable...enough to make me look at that www.rishi-tea.com website. I could never give up my beloved coffee, but maybe some tea would be fun.

 

[kwkarth]

Yup, I agree, tea is a nice alternative to coffee. I've been enjoying a lot of green teas for many years, but I have to admit I know almost nothing about tea, other than I like it. I haven't opened the teas that came with the kettle yet, but I'm looking forward to it! I was surprised to realize that these different teas require different brewing temperatures according to the "kettle." I guess I never picked up on that distinction before.

What kind of person sits around with a thermometer and measures water temperature and assesses quality of brews and steep times, hunts white walls with flashlights, measuring lux and run times, and... Oops!
I guess that would be us... 😀 lovecpf

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Kwkarth, well said. 😀😀

Bill

 

[LuxLuthor]

I wanted to try some of that Long John tea, but they apparently are sold out. I don't have any of the proper tea accoutrements either.

 

[DM51]

proper tea

It's the taste... lol