Did the flashlight save his life?

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adamjh3

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I know some people have said that it sounds like the suspects gun went "click" when it came out the window but I think it was actually the sound of the deputy's flashlight hitting and deflecting the revolver away from his head.


http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4552337/drunk_driver_shoots_at_cop_video_fail/

No. You can hear it the hammer click before the officer even moves.

The suspect was also kicked out of a bar earlier that night after an altercation with his girlfriend, police believe he went home, got his gun, and was returning to kill her or the bouncers. I can't find the link to the news story right now, but I'm searching.

Biggest thing is someone tried to kill a Law Enforcement Officer in the line of duty. Perp's six feet under and the officer ended up going home safely at the end of his shift.
 
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Tuikku

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Interesting that nobody has commented on how many times the cop fired at the fleeing vehicle!

That has to constitute excessive/dangerous use of a firearm in a public place surely? That sort of irresponsible behaviour from a LEO would never be tolerated in Australia.

I partially agree.
That kind of spraying would cause at least some debate also in here. :whistle:


On the other hand, cops don´t get shooted at much in here...

During Finnish independence, 120 cops have died while serving public, most of them before 1950.
1997 - 2007 there was a 10 year period of 0 deaths.
 

bullettproof

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There's 2 standards here in the USA one for the Cops and one for We the People.Lets say that the cop wasn't a cop and was just a normal civilian and the driver in the SUV shot at you while right there in your vehicle.Now lets say you return fire like the Cop did. Remember your a civilian though not a Police Officer. I can assure you that you would be prosecuted for excessive force by firing your Pistol that many times at a fleeing vehicle.They would say that you were no longer in Danger of your Life and therefore Negligent.Now personally I feel it was a great shoot on the Cops part and see nothing wrong.However I did think about the scenario above which I thought I would share with you guys.
 

Bullzeyebill

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I think that we should end this thread now. Righteous comments of any sort can only lead to hard feelings. Better to continue this type of conversation in the Underground.

Bill
 

JaguarDave-in-Oz

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I think that we should end this thread now. Righteous comments of any sort can only lead to hard feelings. Better to continue this type of conversation in the Underground.

Bill
is there some reason we can't have people taking a stance on their beliefs on a forum and having a strongly worded disagreement with those who take a stance on an opposing view?
 

kaichu dento

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I have seen this replayed in slow motion. The cop shining the flashlight did not help him to see the driver had a gun at the ready. The flashlight did not stop the driver from pulling said gun, pointing it in the cops face and pulling the trigger. It went click the first time instead of bang. May have been on an empty chamber or a bad round. I have shot lots of pistol caliber cartridges that the primer was not fully seated and the first time the striker actually pushes the primer down a little further rather than indent it and make a bang. I have shot some cartridges 3 times before they went bang and I don't mean rimfires. The gun was a revolver. The the driver simply pulled the trigger again but this time the officer is swatting at it and deflecting it and it goes bang but misses.

At this point an attempted murdered is leaving the scene of the crime with a gun, he is armed and dangerous and already committed a major felony. The officer is obligated to stop him. He cannot see how well his shots are working on the perp, only that the vehicle is still moving away. He shoots until its obvious the vehicle is simply rolling uncontrolled and hits a pole.

He did the right thing. People from Australia who don't like cops taking out would be murderers here in America are more than welcome to stay in Australia and live without their gun rights down there and complain about the cops down there as well. Up here we are all cheering for the cop who took another dangerous idiot "out of service" that won't be tying up the court system for the next 20 years and blaming the police and the "system" for all his problems and wanting to be paid millions $$$$ for his pain and suffering.


on a different note, not for the originator,

Kinda ironic for some people to use the name of a paperback novel character hero who is a retired US Army Military Policemen who in the novels solves crimes and kills a lot of bad guys using lots of guns and bullets and the stories go into great details about how he does it, to turn around and complain about a real police officer using a real gun to stop a real shooter who admitted to having drunk "lots" and is out on the road with two deadly weapons, the truck and the gun and is using deadly force in an erratic, irrational and irrefutably unjustifiable manner. But hey, what do we silly Americans know . I only know that I don't know how to pronounce the word hypocrite in australian, mate.

I'd personally much prefer that people in Australia who don't believe police should use guns to shoot and kill those who try to kill them or other members of society should emigrate to some other lilly livered bleeding heart country cos I'm tired of it being "have sympathy for your local criminal week" every second week in Australia.
Two of my favorite posts in this thread.

Nice post MrGman and I'm sure I'm not the only one you speak for. Lots of other great posts here but yours really nailed it for me.

Thanks for showing us that there's still some sanity down-under Jag. :thumbsup:
 

Bullzeyebill

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is there some reason we can't have people taking a stance on their beliefs on a forum and having a strongly worded disagreement with those who take a stance on an opposing view?

The conversation is, in effect, becoming too controversial, and has drifted away from the subject of the title, "Did the flashlight save his live?". Strongly worded disagreements having nothing to do with the OP, do not belong in this thread, and can incite disrespectful behavior.

Bill
 

lightfooted

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http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4552337/drunk_driver_shoots_at_cop_video_fail/

No. You can hear it the hammer click before the officer even moves.

The suspect was also kicked out of a bar earlier that night after an altercation with his girlfriend, police believe he went home, got his gun, and was returning to kill her or the bouncers. I can't find the link to the news story right now, but I'm searching.

Biggest thing is someone tried to kill a Law Enforcement Officer in the line of duty. Perp's six feet under and the officer ended up going home safely at the end of his shift.

You're right adam...you can in that one, it was a much cleaner audio than the OP link.

Thanks ;)
 

1wrx7

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Well since we're going OT - the drunk driving charge had nothing to do with this.

He TOOK A SHOT AT A COP! That's why he GOT shot!

Really, is there ANY country where point blank shooting at police won't earn yourself some return fire?!


I meant why did this moron shoot at the cop. The cop did the right thing.
 
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There's 2 standards here in the USA one for the Cops and one for We the People.Lets say that the cop wasn't a cop and was just a normal civilian and the driver in the SUV shot at you while right there in your vehicle.Now lets say you return fire like the Cop did. Remember your a civilian though not a Police Officer. I can assure you that you would be prosecuted for excessive force by firing your Pistol that many times at a fleeing vehicle.They would say that you were no longer in Danger of your Life and therefore Negligent.Now personally I feel it was a great shoot on the Cops part and see nothing wrong.However I did think about the scenario above which I thought I would share with you guys.

I'm not sure I completely agree with your implied outcome should this happen to an ordinary citizen, however I will give you that the videotape made this a MUCH simpler case. Further irony is that early on many good hearted police officers did not want the video cameras because they were worried their every move would be scrutinized. On the contrary, many have found them to be very helpful in defending their own case.
 

prop

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Sheer luck saved that LEO's life, nothing else. The gun misfired and gave him that extra second to get out of the way.

It looks to me as if he treated it as a routine traffic stop. He had clearly forgotten that your light should always be carried in your weak hand, leaving your strong hand free to draw your sidearm. You learn that at the academy early on. Notice how he wastes precious time moving the light from his right hand hand to his left, thus freeing his right hand to draw and fire. Imagine if the gunman immediately had opened the door/jumped out of the car to finish what he started.

I'll bet he wont be forgetting that any time soon. Good thing he wasnt hurt.
 

prop

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Really, is there ANY country where point blank shooting at police won't earn yourself some return fire?!

In most countries the police are not allowed to shoot a suspect in the back. The rationale is that if he flees, he no longer presents a threat. The exception is, that if you believe the suspect will continue his criminal behaviour (ie. run somebody over, take a hostage etc.) then you're authorised to stop him.

But IMO the LEO in the vid did what he deemed necessary in the given situation. Let's not forget he had mere seconds to make a descision, a descision that lawyers/press (and internet nerds lovecpf) have weeks and months to scrutinize and comment.
 
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Illum

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is there some reason we can't have people taking a stance on their beliefs on a forum and having a strongly worded disagreement with those who take a stance on an opposing view?

it often turns the topic political...and the administration overhead renders political threads invalid upstairs, we'll have to take it downstairs where a spotlighted ring is in the center of the basement. :candle:

The conversation is, in effect, becoming too controversial, and has drifted away from the subject of the title, "Did the flashlight save his live?". Strongly worded disagreements having nothing to do with the OP, do not belong in this thread, and can incite disrespectful behavior.

Bill

I'm guessing the intention of the thread op is to identify the elements to which a light may contribute to the saving of ones life...but this inquiry apparently overlooked certain undeniable fallacies in terms of regional regulation, training methodology, and irrational behavior during a panic. Most of which one can infer certain traits but may be inconclusive to draw any specific conclusions :thinking:

I meant why did this moron shoot at the cop. The cop did the right thing.

Never expect an intoxicated individual to be rational, under panic impulse takes over reason. Hence traffic stops, especially during unusual hours, should not be taken lightly.

This also isn't the movies where cops have incredible accuracy with guns or cars blow up or flip when shot in the tires or gas tank.

Accuracy is dependent on proximity, training, and other uncontrolled externalities... also, no amount of civilian ordinance can get a car to flip or blow up, conventional physics has proven itself many times. Shooting a gas tank [assuming the liquid part and with non-incendiary ammunition] would most likely cause a leak. If a fire were to be ignited it would burn rather hot until it exhausts itself and eventually blow apart the baffle welds, but thats measly a bump on the chassis
 

UpChUcK

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There's 2 standards here in the USA one for the Cops and one for We the People.Lets say that the cop wasn't a cop and was just a normal civilian and the driver in the SUV shot at you while right there in your vehicle.Now lets say you return fire like the Cop did. Remember your a civilian though not a Police Officer. I can assure you that you would be prosecuted for excessive force by firing your Pistol that many times at a fleeing vehicle.They would say that you were no longer in Danger of your Life and therefore Negligent.Now personally I feel it was a great shoot on the Cops part and see nothing wrong.However I did think about the scenario above which I thought I would share with you guys.

A civilian is not bound by duty to protect innocent bystanders or other potential victims down the road. It is the police officer's duty to make sure this shooter can not potentially harm another post-shooting in my opinion.

Things played out like they did in an instant. No time to think there. That is why they train. In hindsight, maybe he could have grabbed the gun or knock it out of his hand with his MagLite. Or maybe he would be dead in those attempts plus anyone else afterward.
 

divine

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Did the guy hit a telephone pole near the end of the video?
 

prop

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Did the guy hit a telephone pole near the end of the video?

Yeah, you can see the flash from the poles near the end of the vid.

EDIT: looks like we posted at the same time...
 
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fyrstormer

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Interesting that nobody has commented on how many times the cop fired at the fleeing vehicle! Did he conflate himself with Steven Seagal?

That has to constitute excessive/dangerous use of a firearm in a public place surely? That sort of irresponsible behaviour from a LEO would never be tolerated in Australia.

Granted, the guy in the truck was obviously a psycho, but by spraying the area with all those rounds, the cop achieved absolutely... zilch. And only potentially endangered the lives of any other bystanders/passersby.

I'm glad I live downunder when I see this sort of stuff! :(

—Jack.
Yeah, that's the thing most people who live in gun-free countries don't realize -- cops with guns are far more dangerous than citizens with guns, because for the most part, cops don't have to worry about accounting for their behavior. They just take a couple weeks off without pay and disappear back into the system.
 
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Yeah, that's the thing most people who live in gun-free countries don't realize -- cops with guns are far more dangerous than citizens with guns, because for the most part, cops don't have to worry about accounting for their behavior. They just take a couple weeks off without pay and disappear back into the system.

Care to provide two or three specific examples that back up that very brash, sweeping statement? Please make sure you include links, again, only since you brought it up.

Edit: Should also mention, since you clearly are not aware, that there are a number of forum members (including at least one moderator) who are police officers. You should consider that before you offend and insult an entire occupation of people.
 
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