Disposable 14500...

[foxtrot29]

Anyone ever use one of these? It seems to be a disposable 14500 cell, by the brand name of SAFT.

http://www.atbatt.com/product/6737.asp

I'm wondering how well it'll work in my L1D CE (old version, not the new Q5)...

 

[Patriot]

I'm wondering how well it'll work in my L1D CE (old version, not the new Q5)...

For the price I don't see how it could compare very well with the premium quality AW 14500. If you want you run your L1D on li-ion, why not just go with the proven track record of the AW for $10?
http://www.lighthound.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1296

 

[mdocod]

generally speaking, those types of lithium primary cells are designed for power backup on low drain devices. (think motherboard battery in your computer). Most of them will not tolerate "high" drain devices like a flashlight. A few mA is all they're good for.

 

[foxtrot29]

Mostly just curious. If I do go with a 14500 for that light, I'll get the AW, I'm on the fence still as I've spoken with people at Fenix about it, and they've told me the maximum voltage the circuitry will handle is 3.2v, after that it's a crapshoot as to whether or not the light will die. Although I've heard numerous people post on here as to how they've used the 14500 AW in that light... But at 4.2v off the charger, that's pushing it 1v to high.

 

[marschw]

It's lithium thionyl chloride, so it's only good for low drain purposes, as mdocod said. The datasheet for this cell in particular states only 25mA -- barely more than enough to drive a signal LED. The upside of these batteries is very low self-discharge (as low as 1% per year), and high total capacity.

They do have the LSH-series of cells based on the same chemistry, but capable of currents up to something like 1500mA, but only in larger cell sizes (C and D I think).

 

[mdocod]

Mostly just curious. If I do go with a 14500 for that light, I'll get the AW, I'm on the fence still as I've spoken with people at Fenix about it, and they've told me the maximum voltage the circuitry will handle is 3.2v, after that it's a crapshoot as to whether or not the light will die. Although I've heard numerous people post on here as to how they've used the 14500 AW in that light... But at 4.2v off the charger, that's pushing it 1v to high.

it's going to depend on the Vf of the LED in the light, 99% of the boost circuits I have seen in LED lights will just go into "direct drive" mode when the battery voltage rises above drive voltage from the regulator.

If you have a high Vf LED, then it will work fine, The 4.2V will sag under the load and meet the LED somewhere around 4.0V 1A give or take, if you have a really low Vf LED, Then the cell and the LED may meet at more like 3.8V 2.5+ amp and fry the LED pretty quick.

 

[foxtrot29]

it's going to depend on the Vf of the LED in the light, 99% of the boost circuits I have seen in LED lights will just go into "direct drive" mode when the battery voltage rises above drive voltage from the regulator.

If you have a high Vf LED, then it will work fine, The 4.2V will sag under the load and meet the LED somewhere around 4.0V 1A give or take, if you have a really low Vf LED, Then the cell and the LED may meet at more like 3.8V 2.5+ amp and fry the LED pretty quick.

Sounds safer just to stick with the the regular AA 1.5v's. <SIGH>... I suppose there is the LiFePO batteries... those are around 3.2v i think...

 

[Darkpower]

$11.69 sure is expensive. If the light goes its going to cost even more.

 

[foxtrot29]

$11.69 sure is expensive. If the light goes its going to cost even more.

Yeah, I'm sure it'll run fine on the LiFe batteries, but the AW 14500 might be pushing it too far.... Be glad to hear from anyone else that's running the older model L1D CE with an AW 14500.

 

[Al Combs]

Yeah, I'm sure it'll run fine on the LiFe batteries, but the AW 14500 might be pushing it too far.... Be glad to hear from anyone else that's running the older model L1D CE with an AW 14500.

I bought an L2D just about a year ago now. When they were selling them with P4 binned emitters. That has the same head as the L1D and the P2D. I had it running for quite a while on AW's 16340's. That's after I bought a P2D body and tail cap. Don't know about blowing it up with 4.2 volts, but you loose the lower levels using Li-Ion's. People say everything is Turbo mode but that's not quite true. With an RCR123A fresh off the charger, Turbo mode draws 735 ma. In primary mode, low, medium and high all use 431 ma. That's what they mean by loosing different modes. That's higher than high would be in primary mode off a 3 volt lithium, but not quite Turbo mode.

It's possible like mdocod said I just got lucky with my LED not frying. But here's an interesting fact. On another occasion I measured current in Turbo mode of a Li-Ion that only had about 3.8 volts in it. I didn't realize till later it was drawing slightly more than 750 ma. That's more current at a lower voltage. If it was 100% direct drive, you would expect just the opposite. There is some sort of regulation going on here.

I also used AW's LiFePO4's in this light for a while. Medium and high work in primary mode like normal but low is the same as medium. I used that as my battery indicator. Whenever I had low mode, I knew the battery was almost dead. There's no danger of an LiFePO4 venting with flames. But there is a danger of killing the battery since it has no protection circuit.

Using 2 NiMH batts in the L2D Tube, Turbo mode draws 1,409 Ma. Again using 2xNiMH in Primary mode, low draws 52 ma, medium 203 ma and high is 526 ma. I didn't measure the voltage of these batteries, but if you assume 2.4 volts is 3.38 watts. About 10% more power than the Li-Ion uses.

BTW, that 14500 Lithium battery in the first post, it's not rechargeable. Maybe that was obvious to everybody, but since no one else mentioned it...

 

[foxtrot29]

I bought an L2D just about a year ago now. When they were selling them with P4 binned emitters. That has the same head as the L1D and the P2D. I had it running for quite a while on AW's 16340's. That's after I bought a P2D body and tail cap. Don't know about blowing it up with 4.2 volts, but you loose the lower levels using Li-Ion's. People say everything is Turbo mode but that's not quite true. With an RCR123A fresh off the charger, Turbo mode draws 735 ma. In primary mode, low, medium and high all use 431 ma. That's what they mean by loosing different modes. That's higher than high would be in primary mode off a 3 volt lithium, but not quite Turbo mode.

It's possible like mdocod said I just got lucky with my LED not frying. But here's an interesting fact. On another occasion I measured current in Turbo mode of a Li-Ion that only had about 3.8 volts in it. I didn't realize till later it was drawing slightly more than 750 ma. That's more current at a lower voltage. If it was 100% direct drive, you would expect just the opposite. There is some sort of regulation going on here.

I also used AW's LiFePO4's in this light for a while. Medium and high work in primary mode like normal but low is the same as medium. I used that as my battery indicator. Whenever I had low mode, I knew the battery was almost dead. There's no danger of an LiFePO4 venting with flames. But there is a danger of killing the battery since it has no protection circuit.

Using 2 NiMH batts in the L2D Tube, Turbo mode draws 1,409 Ma. Again using 2xNiMH in Primary mode, low draws 52 ma, medium 203 ma and high is 526 ma. I didn't measure the voltage of these batteries, but if you assume 2.4 volts is 3.38 watts. About 10% more power than the Li-Ion uses.

BTW, that 14500 Lithium battery in the first post, it's not rechargeable. Maybe that was obvious to everybody, but since no one else mentioned it...

Yeah, the title of the thread was "Disposable 14500's?" lol, thanks for the info though... Sounds like I can get away with a 14500 AW in the L1D.