Duracell Ion Core AA & AAA

UnknownVT

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I did call Duracell today about the Ion Cores.

They confirmed that the first three digits are date code.

For example, "426. . ." indicated a battery made in the 26th week of 2014.

Thank you so much for solving that :thumbsup:

At this stage sounds like this one is pretty much identical to the Amazon Basics High-Capacity (also made in Japan). Correct?

Review:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...est-Review-of-Amazon-Basic-AA-2500mAh-(Black)


For my region the Amazon product is actually 7% cheaper and I don't have to drive to Walmart.
So thinking of simply ordering the Amazon cells, unless I am missing something important.

It does (and thanks for the link to HKJ's review)

Ion-Core AAs can still be found @ $6.50/4-pk for 2x pks on eBay (I have bought from this seller using that payment method)
 

onthebeam

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To follow up on UnknownVT's tip re Ebay pricing, as has been noted before, Toys R Us often has 40% off on second pack. If you order online where pricing is better, you can pick up in your local store for around $7.25 a pack once all discounts have been applied.

For those here in Florida or Georgia, Publix often runs 25% off Duracell sales, including this week. This works out to just over $8.00 a pack.

You can see the date code on at least one battery through the plastic, typically. If you are buying now, look for 15 and not 14 for the freshest batteries. The ones I saw in Walmart yesterday were a year and a half old, while the ones in Publix were just a few months from date of manufacture.
 

UnknownVT

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Toys R Us often has 40% off on second pack. If you order online where pricing is better, you can pick up in your local store for around $7.25 a pack once all discounts have been applied.

For those here in Florida or Georgia, Publix often runs 25% off Duracell sales, including this week. This works out to just over $8.00 a pack.

You can see the date code on at least one battery through the plastic, typically. If you are buying now, look for 15 and not 14 for the freshest batteries. The ones I saw in Walmart yesterday were a year and a half old, while the ones in Publix were just a few months from date of manufacture.

Cool! thanks for the advice :thumbsup:

That eBay listing uses ProPay - it is legit/safe payment method - supported by eBay.

But I have had problems (more than once) of the ProPay payment process failing with no ability to retry.

I have to write to the vendor each time to ask for an invoice to complete payment -
some people may not want to go through this kind of unnecessary fuss.
 

onthebeam

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For those interested, ToysRUs has them again at $8.99 less 40% on second pack, meaning $7.19 a pack. Order online and pick up in store.

Quite the deal.
 

magellan

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That does not sound right -

Has this happened more than once?
If so
Is it with the same slot on your charger?

May not be in your case, but I did have a really well spec'd charger with a faulty channel/slot -
if there is interest - links:
Summary in Post #72
Initial test of fault post #55
Confirmation of fault Post #59

Hope you resolve the issue.

Sorry, I only just saw this post.

You were right, it appears to be a problem with this slot on the charger, as this has happened more than once now.

For now I'm okay to have just 3 bays, but eventually I'm going to replace the charger.
 

roadwarrior

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Can someone please post a link for the AA Ion Core datasheet?

I tried google and could only come up with a datasheet for a Duracell 2400mAh (DX 1500 AA) rechargeable battery data sheet, however the pic in the data sheet did not look like the Ion Core batteries....:confused:

Thanks in advance.
 

UnknownVT

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Really BAD news...

6 of my regularly used Duracell Ion Core AA batteries have developed High Internal resistance -

IonC_HiIntR160629.jpg


showing High internal resistance of over 500 milli-Ohms.

I first started noticing perhaps 2-3 weeks ago when I thought I was getting less than 1/2 the capacity/duration with the Ion-Core AAs.

I used these in a digital recorder (Tascam DR-05) - which uses 2 at a time - and I rotate 6 or 3 pairs (same pairs).

I thought my routine ought prolong the life of these batteries -

Use until the recorder shuts down -
some hours after I get home -
discharge remainder in Opus BT-C3100 v2.1 at 500mA (C/5 or 20% C) (discharge remainder figure was always in the 150-300mAh - has never been 0)
leave overnight -
charge at 1500mA until full (total to charge always around ~2500-2670mAh).

Before use or when I set to carry a pair as spare - top-up charge at 1500mA until charger says Full (usually about 150-300mAh).

When I first started using these they gave well over 15 hours of use.

Then I noticed recently the recorder seemed to shutdown prematurely - getting maybe about 5 hours until shutdown....

I have only used these in this manner for about 20 times

Checking discharge and charge figures seemed to be "normal" -

Then I thought of internal resistance - as the Opus BT-C3100 (v2.1) can measure that -
as the above pic shows all 6 batteries have developed High internal resistance.

I made sure the terminals were cleaned with DeoxIT and seated firmly. Done repeated reading (since I simply couldn't believe it)

I also have some Ion-Core AAs that have been idle sitting in unused equipment -
Internal resistance is much, much better -

IonC_IntR160629.jpg


So either the 6 I have were not very durable and would last less than about 20 cycles, which is very low -
or perhaps my routine is damaging these batteries?.....

Advice, please?

Thanks,
 
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MidnightDistortions

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Those should be rebrand Eneloop Pro. They generally dont require much refreshing and may be best to use them and recharge. Wouldn't worry about discharging them all the way flat because you'll end up using more cycles that way. Still they shouldnt be so weak. If you have another, different smart analyzer charger i'd check with that. Are both sets doing the same thing? I would at the very least recharge them at the end of use, not use until they are dead.
 

UnknownVT

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Those should be rebrand Eneloop Pro. They generally dont require much refreshing and may be best to use them and recharge. Wouldn't worry about discharging them all the way flat because you'll end up using more cycles that way. Still they shouldnt be so weak. If you have another, different smart analyzer charger i'd check with that. Are both sets doing the same thing? I would at the very least recharge them at the end of use, not use until they are dead.

Thank you very much for the input.

I am the OP, so yes, I knew these were re-branded Eneloop XX AA.

So do you think discharging nearly empty batteries before recharging
can really shorten the life of these Ion-Cores to about 1/20th their rated life?

(I don't think the Opus BT-C3100 v2.1 ever over-discharged the batteries - they have shown about 150-300mAh remaining capacity)

(I have got only about 20 uses from these 6 by using my routine -
my Maha/PowerEX MH-C9000 now displays HIGH, and refuses to charge these 6 now)

Thank you
 

MidnightDistortions

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Thank you very much for the input.

I am the OP, so yes, I knew these were re-branded Eneloop XX AA.

So do you think discharging nearly empty batteries before recharging
can really shorten the life of these Ion-Cores to about 1/20th their rated life?

(I don't think the Opus BT-C3100 v2.1 ever over-discharged the batteries - they have shown about 150-300mAh remaining capacity)

(I have got only about 20 uses from these 6 by using my routine -
my Maha/PowerEX MH-C9000 now displays HIGH, and refuses to charge these 6 now)

Thank you

If you are fully discharging them id say it could lessen the cycle use. Even then they still should be ok but its hard to tell without testing. You have been using the same analyzer charger right?

When I first got the Maha C9000 I have a set of Energizer AAA's from 2006 that was at 70-80% IR but has increased to 90+% IR. They were able to function in the C9000 at first but all 7 of them has high IR now.

It may also be possible leaving them in a fully charged state can deteriorate the cells faster than if you had them at say 60% state of charge. But i'm guessing there. What charge rate are you using and do the cells heat up at the end of charge?
 

UnknownVT

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If you are fully discharging them id say it could lessen the cycle use. Even then they still should be ok but its hard to tell without testing. You have been using the same analyzer charger right?

When I first got the Maha C9000 I have a set of Energizer AAA's from 2006 that was at 70-80% IR but has increased to 90+% IR. They were able to function in the C9000 at first but all 7 of them has high IR now.

It may also be possible leaving them in a fully charged state can deteriorate the cells faster than if you had them at say 60% state of charge. But i'm guessing there. What charge rate are you using and do the cells heat up at the end of charge?

Thank you again for the input.

I understand that you might think the discharge routine may shorten the life -
but this is several magnitudes greater -
and it has happened to all 6 (3 pairs) at about the same time.

Rated life by Duracell is 400 cycles -
(Eneloop XX (Pro) are rated 500 cycles)

I've got about 20 uses (cycles?)
which is 1/20th the shorter rated life.

Perhaps my routine might be less than optimal -
but to reduce the life by 95%???

I now mainly use the Opus BT-C3100 v2.1 (link to CPF review by HKJ)

I also have the Maha/PowerEX MH-C9000.

Thanks,
 

swan

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Interesting post, i have noticed a few people have reported high ir issues with AA XX, Pros. I too had problems with a 4 pack of sanyo XX,s hardly used crap out after about 2 yrs having never being over or under discharged with not many charge cycles.

I first noticed the XX,s would send my EA4 into low battery warning flash hot off the charger in turbo mode with the light losing lux. A couple of full cycles made it worse until my charger rejected them completely.

I have 20 or so normal aa eneloops that where purchased around the same time [dated 2012] which are still as new which where charged and cared for in the same manor as the XX,s.

So for me if i require any more eneloops, i will probably stick with the standard ones.
 

ChrisGarrett

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Thank you for continuing to try to help - however already posted -



Thanks, appreciated,

So you're using this batteries in your digital recorder, when you come home, they've discharged down to the point that the machine turns off and shuts down?

You then take the batteries and further discharge them down to X, Y or Z voltage and then recharge?

i don't know why you wouldn't just charge them up when you got home, as a rule and perhaps repeatedly taking them down to .90v, or Y volts, has stressed them?

You should get more than 20 cycles out of your batteries. Heck, even my Sanyo 2700s went 2.5-3 years before they finally crapped out on me.

Chris
 

UnknownVT

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Interesting post, i have noticed a few people have reported high ir issues with AA XX, Pros. I too had problems with a 4 pack of sanyo XX,s hardly used crap out after about 2 yrs having never being over or under discharged with not many charge cycles.

I first noticed the XX,s would send my EA4 into low battery warning flash hot off the charger in turbo mode with the light losing lux. A couple of full cycles made it worse until my charger rejected them completely.

I have 20 or so normal aa eneloops that where purchased around the same time [dated 2012] which are still as new which where charged and cared for in the same manor as the XX,s.

So for me if i require any more eneloops, i will probably stick with the standard ones.

Thank you very much for this interesting input.

Hadn't heard about this problem before - so am very grateful for that input.

Do you by any chance have links to those reports, please?

Thanks.

So you're using this batteries in your digital recorder, when you come home, they've discharged down to the point that the machine turns off and shuts down?

You then take the batteries and further discharge them down to X, Y or Z voltage and then recharge?

i don't know why you wouldn't just charge them up when you got home, as a rule and perhaps repeatedly taking them down to .90v, or Y volts, has stressed them?

You should get more than 20 cycles out of your batteries. Heck, even my Sanyo 2700s went 2.5-3 years before they finally crapped out on me.

Chris

Thanks Chris.
It sounds foolish with hindsight - but I do the discharge just to see how much capacity remains - it normally is a pretty small amount - so I'm kind of reassured by that -
and didn't see much harm in it as long as the remainder is a positive amount and not zero (BTW - the voltage is 0.90V, safe, so I thought).....

If that was the cause -
then I never would have imagined that it would reduce the rated life by 95%!!

Thanks,
 
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swan

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Sorry UnknownVT, i do not have any links, just something i have read here.

How are the good ones temp during charging compared with a normal eneloop?

After i realised there was a problem with these 4 cells, i noticed how hot they got when charging even to the point where the wrappers started to lift at the seem.

Further tests revealed these cells individually struggled to drive my little jetbeam wls1 making the driver scream with a high pitched whine where the normal eneloop kept the driver silent and smooth. I tried to revive them but the charger i had at the time just rejected them as bad.

Although this is only my example and these are the only XX,s that i have owned [1 x 4 pack] its unusual to me all 4 cells died at once.
 

UnknownVT

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How are the good ones temp during charging compared with a normal eneloop?

After i realised there was a problem with these 4 cells, i noticed how hot they got when charging even to the point where the wrappers started to lift at the seem.

Further tests revealed these cells individually struggled to drive my little jetbeam wls1 making the driver scream with a high pitched whine where the normal eneloop kept the driver silent and smooth. I tried to revive them but the charger i had at the time just rejected them as bad.

Although this is only my example and these are the only XX,s that i have owned [1 x 4 pack] its unusual to me all 4 cells died at once.

Thank you again for that invaluable input.

None of these Ion-Core AA batteries got hot during charging - yes, warm to touch, but not hot -
I am reasonably careful about monitoring the charge/discharge of these batteries.

Yes, it came as a real shock to find those 6 regularly used Duracell Ion-Cores (re-badged Eneloop XX Pros) died about the same time -
they are now all HIGH (internal resistance) in the Maha/PowerEX MH-C9000 and won't even discharge in that charger.

I do understand that to some my routine may seem superfluous and might even reduce the life cycle -
but as I said never would I have imagined that they would reduce to only 5% of the rated life -
or put it another way lose 95% of their rate life cycle.

It would seem to me that what I did was minor, in comparison to the catastrophic loss of life-cycle.....

I have done more abusive things to much crappier batteries before I (thought I) knew better -

but either I have done something to cause this very drastic shortening of life (what?) -
or there was something wrong with these 6 batteries I have.

[note: I have 18 of these -
these 6 have this embossed code on the battery near the seam:
1-4 : 30648676A2
5-6 : 30528676A1 ]

Really appreciate the input, thanks,
 

MidnightDistortions

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Have you tried doing a break in?

Normally if the cell is being discharged to 0.9volts it wont harm it but if the camera is shutting off due to low battery and then attempt to discharge it with a charger the cycle life can be reduced. Also it may be possible that the cells may be older than 5 years. They may have been on the shelf for 3 or more years initially. I dont have any issues with my Duracell Ion Cores or my AAA Eneloop Pros. I noticed that when they get discharged they wont recover past 1.1volts. Regular Eneloops will recover to 1.2 volts.
 

Woods Walker

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I might....and state might be having issues with a Duraloop pro in my SC5W. Twice it was expectantly dead with drained battery. Only the very initial stages for investigation so nothing is ruled out.
 
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