Emergency portable local radio communication

[orbital]

+

Good thread

 

[Poppy]

So, that allows text with 911, and just allows pings with other users (who also need a $1000 phone) with your location? Genuinely curious, not bashing.

scout24,
I think you got that right. If you read the link that I posted, you know as much as I about what apple is offering.

The FindMy app does work pretty well. My daughter convinced me to get an Iphone when my carrier forced me to upgrade to a 5G phone. Since she, my grandkids, and I all have Iphones, we can keep track of each's location. It is often accurate to within 100 feet. One can change his settings to be seen, or Not to each person in the group.

This doesn't meet the requirements of my original post, but is less expensive than other satellite systems.

 

[KITROBASKIN]

Based on Poppy´s link, looks like that satellite feature is really only to interface with emergency services, with Apple personnel providing a back up for those emergency folks who do not have certain capabilities to receive iPhone 14 automated communications.

 

[alpg88]

He said he needs to talk to his friends and family, a portable ham is the way to go imo. it will allow him to listen to pretty much any services that are not encrypted or digital, and have very wide range of frequencies to talk to friends and family, as a starter radio i'd get uv-5r it is most common ham radio, in open terrain it can reach up to 5 miles. and costs about 30 bucks. ham is the only one that allows him to tune to any frequency in vhf uhf range, not only preset channels like the rest.

 

[Lawman VII XIV]

When the cell towers are out, I would like to communicate with friends and family within a five to ten mile radius reliably (within hilly territory) and perhaps up to fifty miles away. I would like to be able to limit the distance so as not to hear conversations hundreds of miles away.

It would be good to hear the local police and maybe, be able to communicate with them.

First recommendation – you won't be able to talk to local police unless they monitor an alternate form of communication that you can use. There was a time in the This Here's The Duck period where police monitored Ch.9 on Citizen's Band. I don't know that's a thing anymore and maybe not for a long time.

Otherwise I think you're pretty much out of luck. Reliability and hilly terrain are practically oxymorons. Little handheld radios very likely won't do much in the circumstances you describe. More power will be needed but it will need to be hooked up to a good antenna.

Having had a Ham ticket for many years I'll say more power with a poor antenna won't fare as well as less power with a good antenna.

So for actual peer-to-peer communication you're left with a SAT phone. Most other devices aren't really suited for conversation but focus on getting help to a location.

GMRS or FRS radios might be viable if you have a plan for you and your people to seek higher ground when trying to establish communication. Aiming for line of sight would increase your odds. Range would still be an issue. Then there's still the specter of reliability. Those radio range claims are generally inflated, to use a kinder word.

So in my estimation, for reliability in hilly terrain and for up to 50 mile range there's really only Ham gear or a SAT phone. Both are expensive investments that require anyone you want to converse with to have similar gear. Good luck with that.

 

[Lawman VII XIV]

Based on Poppy´s link, looks like that satellite feature is really only to interface with emergency services, with Apple personnel providing a back up for those emergency folks who do not have certain capabilities to receive iPhone 14 automated communications.

No Apple personnel are part of this service. It's handled by Globalstar which will connect the caller to first responders. There's no voice communication. The "conversation" is handle through a series of Q&As. There may be some additional texting to first responders available but I'm not aware of any.

This is a basic SOS service designed to get help to someone in extremis. With that in mind I don't think it's fit for the OP's purpose.

 

[KITROBASKIN]

¨No Apple personnel are part of this service.¨

From the link Poppy provided:

¨relayed directly via satellite to dispatchers that accept text messages, or to relay centers staffed by Apple‑trained specialists who can call for help on the user's behalf. The transcript can also be shared with the user's emergency contacts to keep them informed.¨

I had Globalstar satellite service for a couple years. This was after many of their orbiting devices failed and they were in process of putting more up. Globalstar offered a discount but informed that there were certain times when service would not be available until restoration of the system was complete. I bought the phone used (said to have been backup, not actually used) and sold it back for $100 for their rental service.

 

[KITROBASKIN]

Apple iPhone 14 helping rescue with satellite capability:

Apple's Satellite Emergency Services Lead to Another Rescue

The iPhone 14's satellite emergency services seem to be doing their job.

gizmodo.com

 

[scalpel_ninja]

GoTenna Mesh is what I used for off grid areas and international travel where I couldn't get reliable signal without roaming fees. (Paid for a Taiwan SIM, but also had to travel to Singapore). Some have said this works really well on cruise ships too. This links with a smartphone and app to text anyone else with a module and linked smartphone and app. It can reach long distances as it anonymously uses other modules as repeaters and it does cache the message until it reaches the destination. Nice that it doesn't require any fees beyond the initial purchase.

Drawbacks: everyone who attaches the module needs to install the app to send and receive messages, so not quite ready right out of the box or with a simple handoff to another person. If there are only two modules in the area, then it depends on line of sight and proximity to relay cached messages. You'd also need to keep two devices charged: smartphone and module.

 

[Umbrosoccer]

this is a video showing different radio options.

 

[TD-Horne]

When the cell towers are out, I would like to communicate with friends and family within a five to ten mile radius reliably (within hilly territory) and perhaps up to fifty miles away. I would like to be able to limit the distance so as not to hear conversations hundreds of miles away.

It would be good to hear the local police and maybe, be able to communicate with them.

Recommendations?

The Federal Communications Commission has added a rule that forbids intentionally preparing to contact a public safety agency on frequencies assigned to that agency. Possession of a radio capable of doing so is sufficient to complete the offense. The wording of the portion of the rules that reads
"§ 97.403 Safety of life and protection of property.
No provision of these rules prevents the use by an amateur station of any means of radio communication at its disposal to provide essential communication needs in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available."
no longer protects an amateur radio operator from facing punitive action by using the assigned frequency of a public safety agency to contact them for assistance. Again possession of a radio that is capable of making such transmissions is no longer protected by section 97.403.

Tom Horne

 

[hamhanded]

The Federal Communications Commission has added a rule that forbids intentionally preparing to contact a public safety agency on frequencies assigned to that agency. Possession of a radio capable of doing so is sufficient to complete the offense. The wording of the portion of the rules that reads
"§ 97.403 Safety of life and protection of property.
No provision of these rules prevents the use by an amateur station of any means of radio communication at its disposal to provide essential communication needs in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available."
no longer protects an amateur radio operator from facing punitive action by using the assigned frequency of a public safety agency to contact them for assistance. Again possession of a radio that is capable of making such transmissions is no longer protected by section 97.403.

Tom Horne

Can you cite the new rule that negates what you quoted?

 

[alpg88]

That rule 97.403 only covered stations, not individual operators, they seem to revoke what they have not given in a first place, not to mention it is only their rules not a law, still not illegal to own a radio.

 

[TD-Horne]

Can you cite the new rule that negates what you quoted?

Not off the top of my head. It was written up in QST in the last few months.

Tom Horne

 

[bykfixer]

Years ago when I worked for the gubment, before the celphone was not in a big ole bag, we were issued walkee talkee type radios with a police specific and fire dept specific channel.

They weren't the typical channels they used but in an emergency you could switch to the channel and contact the dispatcher. We used to call it "the bat signal channel". The walkee talkesss were police and fire issues so they had really good range for the time.

My mom had a police scanner and would listen to that on weekend nights. I asked her "why the sudden interest?" Her reply still causes me to chuckle. "I listen out to hear if you or your brother get arrested so I know not to answer the phone." My parents had a "rot in jail" policy so my brother and I had a "don't get caught" policy. 👍

 

[PhotonWrangler]

"I listen out to hear if you or your brother get arrested so I know not to answer the phone."

That;s hysterical! And a clever warning.

 

[Kayaker530]

When the cell towers are out, I would like to communicate with friends and family within a five to ten mile radius reliably (within hilly territory) and perhaps up to fifty miles away. I would like to be able to limit the distance so as not to hear conversations hundreds of miles away.

It would be good to hear the local police and maybe, be able to communicate with them.

Recommendations?

I am late to the discussion but I have some information you might still find useful. For background I am a USA Licensed Amateur Radio Operator, Extra Class. I got exposed to ham radio as a wildland Firefighter in Northern California in the late 80's. I thought of ham radio as a tool for having personal emergency communication options when I was out exploring the great outdoors. Possibly more relevant is that my wife grew up living completely off-grid. No infrastructure of any kind serves her mom's home. That home is in an area that is outside of all cell phone coverage and outside of all commercial two way microwave links. Until August of 2021 she had to drive for 20 minutes to get to a high point where she could make a cell phone call. They are in a beautiful but very remote mountain canyon. They could not even receive 'local' commercial radio stations to get updates on fires near them.

I did a lot of research on Satellite Communicators available at that time and purchased two Garmin InReach Explorer Plus Communicators. I put them on the Expedition Plan and our communicator on the minimal emergency plan. We taught my mid 70's year MIL how to use the device. It can be used as a standalone device or it can connect via BT to a tablet or other device with a keyboard. We programmed her device with the phone numbers and email addresses of her friends, family, and other trusted contacts. We taught the rest of the family about the device and limitations.

As of today, she has had her Garmin InReach Explorer for just over 18 months. She has sent and received almost 21,000 messages through the system! It has been a wonderful success! She can now reach out to friends and family and trusted contacts via strict text. We can send her weather reports, fire reports, check in, just talk about anything in short texts. It has been extremely reliable with maybe a few messaged messages over the last 18 months during all types of weather. The networks is very robust and we are all incredibly impressed.

My wife and I use ours simply for emergency use. We carry it when headed to areas where we anticipate not having cell phone coverage.

These systems can communicate directly messenger to messenger through the satellite system; messenger to and from cellular phone; messenger to and from email. There are some important things to understand, but they do work exceptionally well. Honestly, I feel that the $52 per month we spend for her to have unlimited use is money well spent. The Peace of Mind my wife has with the communication with her mom is priceless.

The year prior we were talking with her about the possibility of her getting her Amateur Radio License General class and setting her up with a HF Radio and a NVIS Antenna system. It would have worked but the learning curve for her was going to be rather substantial.

If you want to talk with people with mountains, canyons, hills obstructing line of sight communications, you have limited options for reliable communications. The Garmin InReach Satellite Communicator system is the best option that I am aware of for many situations.

Garmin inReach Explorer®+ | Satellite Communicator with TOPO Maps

inReach Explorer®+ is a satellite communicator featuring TOPO maps. This device is your go-to connection for off-the-grid contact.

www.garmin.com

 

[KITROBASKIN]

Great to know! Some of the less expensive plans may be an option to others, but unlimited sounds great for your wife's mother.

 

[Poppy]

@Kayaker530 , Thanks for the response!

WOW, that looks like a great system, and Ideal for your situation. Well actually for mine too, but too costly just to be prepared for an unlikely SHTF situation.

During covid, my 92 year old dad was alone and locked in, and I was grateful that I could at least speak with him each day. Actually we did a android version of facetime and played cards. If the Garmin InReach was the only way to stay in contact, it would have been worth twice what it costs.

Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Should the SHTF I'd better get to be first in line to get it.

 

[TD-Horne]

I am late to the discussion but I have some information you might still find useful. For background I am a USA Licensed Amateur Radio Operator, Extra Class. I got exposed to ham radio as a wildland Firefighter in Northern California in the late 80's. I thought of ham radio as a tool for having personal emergency communication options when I was out exploring the great outdoors. Possibly more relevant is that my wife grew up living completely off-grid. No infrastructure of any kind serves her mom's home. That home is in an area that is outside of all cell phone coverage and outside of all commercial two way microwave links. Until August of 2021 she had to drive for 20 minutes to get to a high point where she could make a cell phone call. They are in a beautiful but very remote mountain canyon. They could not even receive 'local' commercial radio stations to get updates on fires near them.

I did a lot of research on Satellite Communicators available at that time and purchased two Garmin InReach Explorer Plus Communicators. I put them on the Expedition Plan and our communicator on the minimal emergency plan. We taught my mid 70's year MIL how to use the device. It can be used as a standalone device or it can connect via BT to a tablet or other device with a keyboard. We programmed her device with the phone numbers and email addresses of her friends, family, and other trusted contacts. We taught the rest of the family about the device and limitations.

As of today, she has had her Garmin InReach Explorer for just over 18 months. She has sent and received almost 21,000 messages through the system! It has been a wonderful success! She can now reach out to friends and family and trusted contacts via strict text. We can send her weather reports, fire reports, check in, just talk about anything in short texts. It has been extremely reliable with maybe a few messaged messages over the last 18 months during all types of weather. The networks is very robust and we are all incredibly impressed.

My wife and I use ours simply for emergency use. We carry it when headed to areas where we anticipate not having cell phone coverage.

These systems can communicate directly messenger to messenger through the satellite system; messenger to and from cellular phone; messenger to and from email. There are some important things to understand, but they do work exceptionally well. Honestly, I feel that the $52 per month we spend for her to have unlimited use is money well spent. The Peace of Mind my wife has with the communication with her mom is priceless.

The year prior we were talking with her about the possibility of her getting her Amateur Radio License General class and setting her up with a HF Radio and a NVIS Antenna system. It would have worked but the learning curve for her was going to be rather substantial.

If you want to talk with people with mountains, canyons, hills obstructing line of sight communications, you have limited options for reliable communications. The Garmin InReach Satellite Communicator system is the best option that I am aware of for many situations.

Garmin inReach Explorer®+ | Satellite Communicator with TOPO Maps

inReach Explorer®+ is a satellite communicator featuring TOPO maps. This device is your go-to connection for off-the-grid contact.

www.garmin.com

I am also an Amateur Extra Class Licensed Amateur Radio Operator. We have some folks looking into the Garmin system. We would only need to have one for each trip team. The camp program committee is looking for funds to undertake their use for this season. As you may have seen from something I shared earlier I'm also looking into the use of Automatic Packet Reporting System (APRS) automatic radio beacons as an interim measure for notifying the home camp and public safety agencies of a life or death emergency. If I had the money I would have already been on the phone to Micro Trak to request the restart of production on the Micro Trak All In One (MT-AIO). 15 MT-AIOs would equip each trip group team of counselors with a selectable signal automatic transmitter that they could use to summon help from their home camp and/or from public safety responders. Just one more thing that we are looking for money to implement.

Tom Horne